Dude! Big Problems: 2nd H.d. Is Missing -

[Roosh]

(Not sure if this belongs in Softwareworld or here)

:unsure: :(
http://forums.us.dell.com/supportforums/bo...essage.id=91611 (http://forums.us.dell.com/supportforums/board/message?board.id=sw_winxp&message.id=91611)

Thanks very much for any input at all.


(EDIT: Btw, [after checking out the thread] Some details: the first culprit was the E-Donkey Temp Files Folder, and what was found to be corrupt during the 30% system scan was specifically one video file within the 2gig MTV Animated Spiderman torrent found on Suprnova & downloaded to a C-Drive folder using Azureus.)

[{I}{K}{E}]

page not found

[Roosh]

Sorry 'bout that! It's been corrected.

[Roosh]

:( :mellow:

[lynx]

Is the drive listed in your bios? If your bios can't find it, then XP won't find it either. If that's the case, you need to check all the cables etc. If there's still no luck, it may be that the hd has actually failed.

[Roosh]

I entered the bios and saw that it is able to distinguish between an "IDE-HDD" & a "ARMD-HDD". I think that's a good sign, right? When I restarted, the OS still doesn't recognize the 2nd drive...

So it's there, but not recognized. What now?

[cwctv]

I entered the bios and saw that it is able to distinguish between an "IDE-HDD" & a "ARMD-HDD". I think that's a good sign, right? When I restarted, the OS still doesn't recognize the 2nd drive...

Not what you where asked if the drive cannot be seen in the bios then Windows OR any O/S won't find it. Go into the bios "del or whatever it is for your m/board" check to see if the drive is there to whatever it is Primary slave /Secondery master/slave,if you have a thing saying find harddrivers hit it to see if they (and cd's etc) can be picked up .Your real best bet is to put ALL h/drives on "auto" then you will find out as soon as you boot.
Double check that each drives jumpers are NOT the same if on the same cable.

[Roosh]

Just did another inspection in the BIOS:

IDE Controller..................[BOTH]

>Primary IDE Master.........[WDC WD75AA-75AA0 ]

>Primary IDE Slave..........[Not installed]

>Secondary IDE Master......[Maxtor RIGEL ]

>Secondary IDE Slave........[LG CD-RW CED-8080B ]


BOOT ORDER
>1st BOOT DEVICE.............[ATAPI CD-ROM]
>2nd BOOT DEVICE............[IDE-HDD]
>3rd BOOT DEVICE............[DISABLED]


BOOT CONFIG
>Plug & Play O/S...............[NO]
>Reset Config Data...........[NO]
>Numlock.........................[ON]

Does this explain anything for you?
Additional info at this thread if you feel like it:
http://www.xtremepccentral.com/forums/show...=&threadid=7615 (http://www.xtremepccentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=7615)

Thanks again. ;)

[Virtualbody1234]

Try the drive all by itself in the PC. Does the bios detect it?

Also in Windows XP try: Press Start>Control Panel>Administative tools>Computer Management>Disk Management.

Does the drive show up there? Tell us what you see.

[Roosh]

God, I've got so many different threads running on this in different forums - I forget what I've already mentioned and haven't...

In disk management, there is no sign of the C-Drive (2nd, secondary, slave, storage, 28.5gb drive, etc). A recovery program, "R-Studio" doesn't recognize it either.


Try the drive all by itself in the PC. Does the bios detect it?
Not sure what you mean. Do you mean, shut down, open the tower, unplug the master (if that's even possible), restart, get into the Bios & see if the secondary is detected?

Besides all of that, can someone explain what the inspection a couple of posts up confirms? Does the BIOS acknowledge that the 2nd drive is still there?

[zapjb]

I recently had a similar problem. You might not agree but it works on my sys. I have 2 HDD. 1 as backup only. Ghosting or cloning every 2-5wks.

What works is set both HDD to cs. On primary IDE HDD as master, 2nd HDD when needed to ghost as slave. On secondary IDE CDRW as master & CDROM as slave. That's the only way on my sys.

Try it & let us know. GL.

[Roosh]

Originally posted by zapjb@15 October 2003 - 19:37
I recently had a similar problem. You might not agree but it works on my sys. I have 2 HDD. 1 as backup only. Ghosting or cloning every 2-5wks.

What works is set both HDD to cs. On primary IDE HDD as master, 2nd HDD when needed to ghost as slave. On secondary IDE CDRW as master & CDROM as slave. That's the only way on my sys.

Try it & let us know. GL.
>"Ghosting or cloning every 2-5wks." ->?

>"set both HDD to cs. On primary IDE HDD as master, 2nd HDD when needed to ghost as slave. On secondary IDE CDRW as master & CDROM as slave. That's the only way on my sys." ->?

*Again, How can I manipulate the 2nd hd when it isn't recognized anywhere? (and if it is recognized, please identify where for me by looking at that 'inspection' a couple of posts up)

[Virtualbody1234]

Not sure what you mean. Do you mean, shut down, open the tower, unplug the master (if that's even possible), restart, get into the Bios & see if the secondary is detected?

No. What I mean is shut down, open the tower, unplug everything from the IDE and connect the "faulty" drive to the 'Primary' IDE all by itself on the end (Master) connector and set the jumper to CS (Cable Select). Then power up and go right to the CMOS setup and do a detection of drives. Does the drive show as detected?

[Roosh]

:huh:
I appreciate the consideration, but before I go into such foreign territories, I'm still convinced (eventhough admittedly a noob) that all of this is a matter of going somewhere either through the OS or BIOS & simply turning something on, re-enabling, restarting, re-acknowledging etc, the drive. The drive is there, the OS just doesn't know it.
If that sounds at all familiar or you have any inkling as to know where to start, please let me know.

[cwctv]

Ok see that you have other threads too have you tried to see if the drive can be seen in sysytem resourses under dish drives.
Did it have another O/S on it before if so is it fat32 - in above if the drive is seen and the drive had an O/S on it you will have to fdisk it to get Fat32 off before XP will see it.

[kurtsl0an]

Originally posted by cwctv@16 October 2003 - 06:56
Ok see that you have other threads too have you tried to see if the drive can be seen in sysytem resourses under dish drives.
Did it have another O/S on it before if so is it fat32 - in above if the drive is seen and the drive had an O/S on it you will have to fdisk it to get Fat32 off before XP will see it.
XP can c FAT32 or NTFS.

[zapjb]

@Roosh sounds like you never opened a case before. Parts shake loose, go bad, rust, get dirty etc. Going have open cases & deal with hardware eventually. Otherwise they're going to luv you at the local computer repair shop. But read up & or have someone show you some basics. How to avoid ESD etc. GL.

[Roosh]

Originally posted by cwctv+15 October 2003 - 23:56--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (cwctv &#064; 15 October 2003 - 23:56)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>Ok see that you have other threads too have you tried to see if the drive can be seen in sysytem resourses under dish drives.
Did it have another O/S on it before if so is it fat32 - in above if the drive is seen and the drive had an O/S on it you will have to fdisk it to get Fat32 off before XP will see it.[/b]
cwctv, I don&#39;t know where to find system resources...
Another sign that C is still alive somewhere, in Control Panel, Admin. Tools, Computer Management, Services and Applications, Indexing Service, System, Directories, there is reference to six E (primary drive) directories and one C:&#092; :-)
(Don&#39;t know what it means, but at this point I&#39;m just content to see the letter C anywhere on my computer)

My smaller E drive ( :wacko: see the Dell thread if you&#39;re wondering why the hell the primary is E and secondary is C) carries the OS&#39;s. It used to have ME before the upgrade to XP Pro. The missing drive in question used to be labeled D before the upgrade & reformat, but has never housed an OS. It has always been FAT 32, while E is now NTFS. If it turns out that all of the storage data has been wiped out, it will at least be a good excuse to finally convert it to NTFS as well. THAT&#39;S AFTER I IDENTIFY THE DAMN THING&#33; :angry:

B)


Originally posted by kurtsl0an@15 October 2003 - 23:58

Originally posted by cwctv@16 October 2003 - 06:56
Ok see that you have other threads too have you tried to see if the drive can be seen in sysytem resourses under dish drives.
Did it have another O/S on it before if so is it fat32 - in above if the drive is seen and the drive had an O/S on it you will have to fdisk it to get Fat32 off before XP will see it.
XP can c FAT32 or NTFS.
That&#39;s true.

<!--QuoteBegin-zapjb@16 October 2003 - 00:04
@Roosh sounds like you never opened a case before. Parts shake loose, go bad, rust, get dirty etc. Going have open cases & deal with hardware eventually. Otherwise they&#39;re going to luv you at the local computer repair shop. But read up & or have someone show you some basics. How to avoid ESD etc. GL.[/quote]

I have opened a case before, and did so as recently as 3 months ago when a different fiasco prompted a kill-disk & the upgrade to xp from me. I&#39;m not adverse to it, but I don&#39;t think the fact that the system crashed, preceded by that long list of errors and warnings (referenced in the xtremepc thread) just before, and then was directly followed by the drive missing is a coincidence nor think that it points to "Parts shak[ing] loose, go[ing] bad, [getting] rusty, get[ting] dirty", etc.

It all comes back to:

I&#39;m still convinced (eventhough admittedly a noob) that all of this is a matter of going somewhere either through the OS or BIOS & simply turning something on, re-enabling, restarting, re-acknowledging etc, the drive. The drive is there, the OS just doesn&#39;t know it.
If that sounds at all familiar or you have any inkling as to know where to start, please let me know.

[zapjb]

You could have a bad cable etc. But you&#39;re so adverse to the possibility of a hardware problem. To the point of totally discounting it. That&#39;s not good trouble shooting. Openmindedness comes in handy with problem solving.

I can&#39;t help but say it. It&#39;s ridiculous not to even consider this might be a hardware problem & try out the suggestions offered by myself & Virtualbody1234.

Computers are funny. Sometimes by unplugging/plugging back in & or wiggling a cable around will fix a problem.

[Virtualbody1234]

Well, if you won&#39;t do a simple test to see if the drive is faulty or not then what&#39;s the point of you asking for help? The method I was pointing out is a simple way to eliminate some variables. It&#39;s not a permanent change to your system, you can reconnect it right back to the way it is now.


Computers are funny. Sometimes by unplugging/plugging back in & or wiggling a cable around will fix a problem.
That&#39;s a very good point. Perhaps the cable is loose or faulty. That&#39;s a lot cheaper to fix than if the drive is gone. In any case... The test I offered you would let you know if it&#39;s in fact the cable or the drive.

[brotherdoobie]

Originally posted by Virtualbody1234@16 October 2003 - 06:31


Computers are funny. Sometimes by unplugging/plugging back in & or wiggling a cable around will fix a problem.
That&#39;s a very good point. Perhaps the cable is loose or faulty. That&#39;s a lot cheaper to fix than if the drive is gone. In any case... The test I offered you would let you know if it&#39;s in fact the cable or the drive.
The advice you are being offered is sound troubleshooting procedure.
I would follow it,and then we can talk after that if it does not work.

Virtual and Zapjp are knowledgeable users that are trying to help,at least give there advice a try.

I know that pc&#39;s can be frustrating but start with the simple and obvious choices first,most of the times it something as simple as a cable with hardware problems
and something as simple as a uninstall and reinstall with software.

Good luck&#33;


Peace brotherdoobie

[Roosh]

Sorry guys, I wasn&#39;t trying to seem stubborn, I just was hoping that you might have been aware of a method to search for the disk & re-enable it before opening up the tower and discerning what the problem is, something I&#39;m not experienced with. I do value the input...

Anyway, I opened it up & saw that all cables were still firmly attached (did some wiggling, unplugging & plugging, too).
Then,
unplug everything from the IDE and connect the "faulty" drive to the &#39;Primary&#39; IDE all by itself on the end (Master) connector and set the jumper to CS (Cable Select). Then power up and go right to the CMOS setup and do a detection of drives. I connected the "faulty" C-Drive(30gb) to [where the OS-carrying E-Drive(7gb) was plugged in - is that the "IDE"?] and connected the E-Drive to where the C-Drive used to plug in. I am writing this reply with that setup.
The OS still does not recognize the large drive.
->VirtualBody, are you saying that I should have only plugged in the faulty drive?
->"set the jumper to CS (Cable Select)" - I don&#39;t know what that means.
->"go right to the CMOS setup and do a detection of drives" - what is the CMOS setup & how do you get there? How do I do the detection of drives?

Thanks.

[Roosh]

brotherdoobie,
I was replying as you posted that. Those sentiments are addressed...
Thanks.

[Virtualbody1234]

VirtualBody, are you saying that I should have only plugged in the faulty drive?
->"set the jumper to CS (Cable Select)" - I don&#39;t know what that means.
->"go right to the CMOS setup and do a detection of drives" - what is the CMOS setup & how do you get there? How do I do the detection of drives?

Yes, I was saying to eliminate all other variables and possible conflicts to connect only the "faulty" drive. Unpulg all others including CD drives.

If you look at the diagrams printed on the sticker on your drives you will see CS or Cable Select and you will find matching jumpers on the drive near the power connector.

CMOS is another term used for BIOS (usually pressing [del] at bootup). In the BIOS settings you should be able to find drive detection.

[Roosh]

Ok. I&#39;ll be away from my PC until late Monday or Tuesday, so I&#39;ll try unplugging everything but the faulty drive and doing a detection of drives when I get back -- I&#39;ll give some feedback around that time.
Cheers ;)
- Roosh.

[Roosh]

Ok, I&#39;m back. ;)

I unplugged everything but the faulty drive, restarted and got a couple of invalid disk errors, one asking me to insert a boot diskette. So, apparently the C drive even on it&#39;s own doesn&#39;t show up.
I&#39;ve reattached everything in normal fashion & that&#39;s how I&#39;m writing this post.
I&#39;ll be contacting Dell to see what they can advise, but if any others have some more ideas, please let me know.
Thanks.

[Roosh]

Originally posted by Roosh@15 October 2003 - 17:13
Just did another inspection in the BIOS:

IDE Configuration

IDE Controller..................

[b]>Primary IDE Master.........[WDC WD75AA-75AA0&nbsp; ]

>Primary IDE Slave..........[Not installed]

>Secondary IDE Master......[Maxtor RIGEL&nbsp; &nbsp; ]

>Secondary IDE Slave........[LG CD-RW CED-8080B&nbsp; &nbsp; ]


BOOT ORDER
>1st BOOT DEVICE.............[ATAPI CD-ROM]
>2nd BOOT DEVICE............[IDE-HDD]
>3rd BOOT DEVICE............[DISABLED]


BOOT CONFIG
>Plug & Play O/S...............[NO]
>Reset Config Data...........[NO]
>Numlock.........................[ON]

Does this explain anything for you?
Additional info at this thread if you feel like it:
http://www.xtremepccentral.com/forums/show...=&threadid=7615 (http://www.xtremepccentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=7615)

Thanks again. ;)
I went back into the BIOS and noticed again that the "Primary IDE Slave", where the Maxtor C-Drive should appear (but shows up as the Secondary Master) is not installed (if you select it, it has "type" listed as "auto".) I still think this is where the problem lies.
Anyone know what tweaking to perform in the BIOS to show the drive as installed? (the wires are definitely securely plugged in.)

[Virtualbody1234]

I unplugged everything but the faulty drive,
When you had the drive all by itself, did you connect it as Primary Master? And did you do a drive detection in the bios?


Are all 4 IDEs set to &#39;auto&#39; on the first page of the BIOS? And do you have the drive mode set to LBA?

One other thing that I am wondering about is, did you find the other &#39;drive detection&#39; screen in your BIOS?

[Roosh]

:(

VirtualBody & others,

Just spoke to Dell and described my situatuion and the assessment wasn&#39;t good. It seems that after running a "90-90" scan with the system restore disk and not detecting the C drive that way, that the disk has &#39;bad sectors&#39; and has basically failed. The data is apparently irrecoverable. I was advised to contact the drive manufacturer (Maxtor) and to contact "Drive Savers" as well.


When you had the drive all by itself, did you connect it as Primary Master? And did you do a drive detection in the bios?

Are all 4 IDEs set to &#39;auto&#39; on the first page of the BIOS? And do you have the drive mode set to LBA?

One other thing that I am wondering about is, did you find the other &#39;drive detection&#39; screen in your BIOS?
Yes, all of those points were checked prior to the tests & scans.

If there&#39;s any other feedback or suggestions before I make some drastic decisions, please let me know. Thanks.

[Virtualbody1234]

Well based on the information so far... I believe that the drive is faulty.

Do you have another spare drive ?

[cwctv]

My my is this still going on change the drive around big in place of the small etc put cd on primary (or leave off for now)with the large drive don&#39;t connect the small one,get a bootdisk ready reason being is that the new drive might not have the "active" set on it that is why its saying put bootdisk in plus if the fdisk settings don&#39;t match the drives cos it came out of another machine it won&#39;t see it on boot.

Change the settings in the bios to boot to floppy first ide second, boot the machine with the bootdisk in go to fdisk and press 4 tell all what you see .

[Roosh]

Ok, for a conclusion:

I went to a local specialist and determined that the drive is indeed blown out :( , and there&#39;s no real way to determine what did it :mellow:.


A direct quote:
"The controller board on the hard drive is toast. Although the BIOS sees the hard drive, it reports it as "failed". Windows doesn&#39;t see it (no biggy) but when the data recovery software failed to see the drive, it was definite that the controller board was FUBAR."

So there you go. The visit wasn&#39;t a total bust as I upped my Ram from 192mb (supporting XP Pro for the past 3 months&#33;) to 384mb at a very affordable price & given some useful support apps/tips ("BigFix", "RamBooster", "Cacheman", etc.) I was also told about 40 gig "Notebook" external h.d.&#39;s (portable & as small as your hand). I&#39;ll most likely go for an external 120 gig USB hd @ Costco tomorrow (approx &#036;100) - (if anyone wants to recommend some quality sites/stores to try for good deals on new h.d.&#39;s, by all means...).

Thanks to all for going to the trouble of responding & offering suggestions.http://www.lindorez.com/fasttracker/forums/html/emoticons/thumbsup.gif


- Roosh