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RedRival
10-29-2003, 01:07 PM
I don't know whether this is true but I'm gonna voice my opinion on this anyways.
Suprnova.org has a huge group of users who are not sharing but leeching with all the might they have...

I realised that out of 209 peers and 54 seeds, that only 18 users are sharing. I don't know how and why these group leechers are able to block out their uploads and just purely download but they are certainly a horrendous bunch of people...esp those who are downloading at 100kb-612kb/sec (yes the highest I saw was 612kb/sec) but are not even sharing at all...

I had a bad opinion of BT because of being too dependant on suprnova. Now check this, I pick a more obscure torrent site and I begun downloading, almost immediately I hit a high of 15kb/sec in the first 5mins (as opposed to the max of 16kb/sec I get after 15hrs of being connected to a suprnova tracker and until then it still fluctuates to 3-4kb/sec) and I'm still going at that speed!!

And that's not all, I started another torrent on the site and I geot 13kb/sec immediately downloading both files simulatneously!! And that's on a torrent site with only 10 peers and 5-7 seeds on each file...imagine how much sharing could do...even if you download and share at a 3:1 ratio, you are still sharing...I know some ppl who don't share at all and that's getting on my nerves...

But then again, this is my view on torrents, and you guys may have another opinion but this could also prove a solution to some people...that suprnova although has a widespread variety of torrents may not always get you the best speeds becoz there are a majority of leeching going on.

NotoriousBIC
10-29-2003, 02:00 PM
What you say about BT and SuprNova is mostly true.
The problem with very popular torrents is the seeder/downloader ratio. Bittorrent will open a certain amount of connections depending on which parts it requests. Those connections may not neccessarily be with the original seeders. Indeed the more seeders and peers the less likely you connect to the original seeders.

Now why is that a problem with SuprNova and not with other sites? Well, I think because of the popularity and easy-accessibilty (sort of) of SuprNova, it attracts relatively more low-bandwidth connections than other, more 'hard-core' sites.

Of course that latter argument also supports the thought that SuprNova has more 'hit-and-run' leechers (although, technically, you can't leech with BT)

Another problem is that some trackers used can't keep up with the sheer load that such a lot of users and torrents generate.


At Fasttracker we usually get higher speeds than most SuprNova torrents, of course depending on who's seeding and such.

Gre1
10-29-2003, 04:50 PM
Exactly u just don't get a connection to everyone but they are still there if u just saw them.

Roosh
10-30-2003, 02:25 AM
Guys,
Do you know how long the site will be down? ( <link edited at request of site owner> ) Or is that link outdated?

Gre1
10-30-2003, 03:13 AM
That&#39;s the private tracker and yes they don&#39;t use that anymore if u are a member ask them to pm u with the new URL.

ang3r
10-30-2003, 03:47 AM
how to you stop uploads from bittorent ??

like ive said before, programs that dont allow you to stop your uploads are simply there to chew up your bandwidth.

for people like me that have a small download limit and need to stop sharing for at least 1 week its bad using programs like BT and EMULE.

wouldent it be so cool if isp&#39;s only had limites on people download speed and download lmit, but if upload was completly uncapped, that would be the best&#33;

Switeck
10-30-2003, 03:55 AM
Originally posted by ang3r@29 October 2003 - 22:47
wouldent it be so cool if isp&#39;s only had limites on people download speed and download lmit, but if upload was completly uncapped, that would be the best&#33;
Upload, even moreso than download, must be capped for an ISP to survive and profit. However, that cap can be in the form of low max upload bandwidth instead of say 10 GB/month.

Frater_Frag
10-31-2003, 01:20 AM
Originally posted by Switeck@30 October 2003 - 03:55
Upload, even moreso than download, must be capped for an ISP to survive and profit. However, that cap can be in the form of low max upload bandwidth instead of say 10 GB/month.


My ISP did the later, fortunatly... I have 2mb downstream and 400 kb/s upstream for ca 40 euro/month.

Im glad that COMHEM.SE didnt do what TELIA, their biggest competitor and former mothercompany did... They offer a 2mb/400 kb/s connection for the same price... but with a 10gig cap... Suckers&#33;

10gig? Hell, I shudder to think about how much traffic that goes through mine account, hehe&#33;

stoi
10-31-2003, 05:31 AM
(although, technically, you can&#39;t leech with BT)


I would love to know where ppl get this idea from, that bittorrent is unleachable.

downloading a film of suprnova earlier today, it had 1 seeder and 4 leechers when i started, and was 700meg in size.

I have just downloaded azureaus (the java client) so i thought i would see what all the fuss is about with it.

ok i started the torrent and set the upload to 20KBs (to do my bit) the max download i seen in 1 hour was 10KBs. I just thought this was normal as not many seeders/leechers, but i thought i would give something a go.

i went into the options and set the upload BW to 3KBs (globaly, always a bad sign for a client imo) went back to the download and guess what, downloading at 100KBs+ for all the rest of the file. My share ratio was abysmal after i had finished the file, but as i run my own tracker i know what leechers are doing to bittorrent, so i put it back up to 20KBs for the next 10 hours and had a share ratio of 0.500 and will reseed if the torrent needs it.

so all these ppl that say that you cant leech off bittorrent are talking rubbish, i get better download speeds when i do leech, but i always make it up to at least 0.500 share ratio in the end.

stoi

Gre1
10-31-2003, 07:15 PM
Whatup stoi haven&#39;t seen u in a while.

callum
10-31-2003, 07:33 PM
Originally posted by stoi@31 October 2003 - 04:31

(although, technically, you can&#39;t leech with BT)


I would love to know where ppl get this idea from, that bittorrent is unleachable.

downloading a film of suprnova earlier today, it had 1 seeder and 4 leechers when i started, and was 700meg in size.

I have just downloaded azureaus (the java client) so i thought i would see what all the fuss is about with it.

ok i started the torrent and set the upload to 20KBs (to do my bit) the max download i seen in 1 hour was 10KBs. I just thought this was normal as not many seeders/leechers, but i thought i would give something a go.

i went into the options and set the upload BW to 3KBs (globaly, always a bad sign for a client imo) went back to the download and guess what, downloading at 100KBs+ for all the rest of the file. My share ratio was abysmal after i had finished the file, but as i run my own tracker i know what leechers are doing to bittorrent, so i put it back up to 20KBs for the next 10 hours and had a share ratio of 0.500 and will reseed if the torrent needs it.

so all these ppl that say that you cant leech off bittorrent are talking rubbish, i get better download speeds when i do leech, but i always make it up to at least 0.500 share ratio in the end.

stoi
My max upload is about 25KB, i usually set it to about 20KB, and i usually get great download speeds as long as there is a few seeds.

james_bond_rulez
10-31-2003, 08:48 PM
hey is the bt tracker still down? i got downloads stuck at 97% and ppl are uploading from with no downloading progressing thus far...

NotoriousBIC
11-01-2003, 12:34 AM
Originally posted by stoi@31 October 2003 - 07:31

(although, technically, you can&#39;t leech with BT)


I would love to know where ppl get this idea from, that bittorrent is unleachable.

downloading a film of suprnova earlier today, it had 1 seeder and 4 leechers when i started, and was 700meg in size.

I have just downloaded azureaus (the java client) so i thought i would see what all the fuss is about with it.

ok i started the torrent and set the upload to 20KBs (to do my bit) the max download i seen in 1 hour was 10KBs. I just thought this was normal as not many seeders/leechers, but i thought i would give something a go.

i went into the options and set the upload BW to 3KBs (globaly, always a bad sign for a client imo) went back to the download and guess what, downloading at 100KBs+ for all the rest of the file. My share ratio was abysmal after i had finished the file, but as i run my own tracker i know what leechers are doing to bittorrent, so i put it back up to 20KBs for the next 10 hours and had a share ratio of 0.500 and will reseed if the torrent needs it.

so all these ppl that say that you cant leech off bittorrent are talking rubbish, i get better download speeds when i do leech, but i always make it up to at least 0.500 share ratio in the end.

stoi
Technically as in not completely.

You will always upload something with Bittorrent, as opposed to the popular Kazaa leech who doesn&#39;t share at all.

Technically ;)

Of course there are ways to be as leech as possible.

Switeck
11-01-2003, 02:41 AM
Originally posted by NotoriousBIC@31 October 2003 - 19:34
Technically as in not completely.

You will always upload something with Bittorrent, as opposed to the popular Kazaa leech who doesn&#39;t share at all.

Technically ;)

Of course there are ways to be as leech as possible.
There are firewall tricks/NetLimiter tricks which can cause your upload speed in BT to only be 1 KB/sec or less... and even I&#39;ve heard of people only uploading a few KB over a 100+ MB file.

Maybe that&#39;s not technically &#39;total leeching&#39;, but it&#39;s REALLY danged close.

NotoriousBIC
11-01-2003, 01:32 PM
True, just pointing out the difference between a BT leecher and a Kazaa leecher.

james_bond_rulez
11-01-2003, 02:44 PM
but what about ppl who have monthly bw allotments?

they have to limit their upload to a certain degree, otherwise they wouldn&#39;t survive on bittorrent at all.

ppl who live in uk in some isp give them something like 1.5GB a month, that&#39;s not a lot at all. so they have to find some way to upload 1.5GB a month without going over, otherwise isp cap their traffic so bad, it&#39;s no different than using a 56k.

they HAVE TO LEECH.

nothing they can do about that

Gre1
11-01-2003, 03:53 PM
They don&#39;t have to leech if they want something downloaded then that is the price to pay so whatever u upload is what u upload.

kazaaliterock
11-01-2003, 04:18 PM
b4 my new connection (yesturday) i would get my dl speed max out in suprnova w/ every dl (55-60kb/s) but now w/ a 3mb connection, i get less then half (145-150kb/s) becuz although there are 5 seeders they upload to me at a rate of 3kb/s. and the 18 peers im connected to give me total of 50kb/s w/ the exception of one nice person whos giving me almost 90 kb/s. ty whoever u are.

Switeck
11-01-2003, 08:40 PM
Originally posted by james_bond_rulez@1 November 2003 - 09:44
ppl who live in uk in some isp give them something like 1.5GB a month, that&#39;s not a lot at all. so they have to find some way to upload 1.5GB a month without going over, otherwise isp cap their traffic so bad, it&#39;s no different than using a 56k.

they HAVE TO LEECH.

nothing they can do about that
The upload bandwidth HAS to come from somewhere, or NO p2p file sharing system can survive&#33;

Work with local friends to get what you want. If 10 people download 10 separate things then share OFFLINE, that&#39;s a 10:1 bandwidth savings on BOTH uploads and downloads.

If you can, get a cheap back-up dial-up connection too. v.92 56k connections are not too bad compaired to the poor rates many &#39;broadband&#39; connections are getting on KL++ now&#33;

Gre1
11-01-2003, 09:43 PM
Yep, u can get a free dial-up that&#39;s the best thing to do for peeps with caps just download songs and stuff with dialup then when u want something big use the DSL

kazaaliterock
11-01-2003, 09:47 PM
whats dail-up....lol seriously after getting high speed for so long and dling things at 60 kB/s and now 150-350 kB/s i would get a rage tantrum just having to watch it go at 5kB/s top.

Switeck
11-02-2003, 06:53 AM
Originally posted by kazaaliterock@1 November 2003 - 16:47
whats dail-up....lol seriously after getting high speed for so long and dling things at 60 kB/s and now 150-350 kB/s i would get a rage tantrum just having to watch it go at 5kB/s top.
There&#39;s people on &#39;broadband&#39; who are limited to less GB/month than is theoretically (or even actually) possible on a 56k with near-constant useage over a month.

And others, who due to a mis-configured connection or outright ISP p2p blocking, that can&#39;t get 5 KB/sec download (and upload&#33;) speeds on KL++.

scribblec
11-02-2003, 07:34 AM
Originally posted by james_bond_rulez@1 November 2003 - 14:44
but what about ppl who have monthly bw allotments?

they have to limit their upload to a certain degree, otherwise they wouldn&#39;t survive on bittorrent at all.

ppl who live in uk in some isp give them something like 1.5GB a month, that&#39;s not a lot at all. so they have to find some way to upload 1.5GB a month without going over, otherwise isp cap their traffic so bad, it&#39;s no different than using a 56k.

they HAVE TO LEECH.

nothing they can do about that
wtf u talking bout
only a few cap people adn thats to only 1 gig A DAY no month

RealitY
11-02-2003, 07:43 AM
Originally posted by scribblec@1 November 2003 - 23:34
only a few cap people adn thats to only 1 gig A DAY no month
True, and if your capped at 1GB a month for &#036;40, fucking cancel and get NetZero dial up for fucking free, I see no difference. If you get bb but max out your limit in a week then its worthless...

BTW - Has anyone tried the new Shareaza BT client, seems ok, though what is the deffinition of "choked", no dl, but they areul off me...

scribblec
11-02-2003, 08:19 AM
Originally posted by REALITY+2 November 2003 - 07:43--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (REALITY @ 2 November 2003 - 07:43)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-scribblec@1 November 2003 - 23:34
only a few cap people adn thats to only 1 gig A DAY no month
True, and if your capped at 1GB a month for &#036;40, fucking cancel and get NetZero dial up for fucking free, I see no difference. If you get bb but max out your limit in a week then its worthless...

BTW - Has anyone tried the new Shareaza BT client, seems ok, though what is the deffinition of "choked", no dl, but they areul off me... [/b][/quote]
nah i use all clients seperatly bt kazaa mirc emule

all seperalty :)

nahan
11-02-2003, 08:34 AM
See Bic raises a very good point.When you download while using bittorrent it is very rare that you are uploading zero kbs.
And if you are its allmost certin that nobody need the peices you have.
There is no way to turn uploading off in bitorrent ,unlike kazaa klite and her p2p&#39;s.
So that being said bittorrent is very file sharing friendly.

Now what stoi says is true ,but it dosent work exactly like that in all cases.
The hashing system makes sure everyone is getting good/great speeds.
And in the future super seeding will only improve and prevent leaching and help insure evryone gets equal speeds.

scribblec
11-02-2003, 08:37 AM
Originally posted by nahan@2 November 2003 - 08:34
See Bic raises a very good point.When you download while using bittorrent it is very rare that you are uploading zero kbs.
And if you are its allmost certin hat nobody need the peices you have.
There is no way to turn uploading off in bitorrent ,unlike kazaa klite and her p2p&#39;s.
So that being said bittorrent is very file sharing friendly.

Now what stoi says is true ,but it dosent work exactly like that in all cases.
The hashing system makes sure everyone is getting good/great speeds.
And in the future super seeding will only improve and prevent leaching and help insure evryone gets equal speeds.
there r clients which dont let u upload.... :ph34r:


but i use shadows experimental i recoomend to everyone its the best around

nahan
11-02-2003, 08:47 AM
We all know about bt jerk and the latter such, but they dont work the same
And you just want achieve the same consistant speeds that you get using unhacked source code.
Like I said "very rare".

I use 321b and see no reason to switch even though I have tried all of the oher clients.

scribblec
11-02-2003, 08:50 AM
Originally posted by nahan@2 November 2003 - 08:47
We all know about bt jerk and the latter such, but they dont work the same
And you just want achieve the same consistant speeds that you get using unhacked source code.


I use 321b and see no reason to switch even though I have tried all of the oher clients.
but the original bt client is so optionless

it doesnt tell u if the file has any seeds and such upload setting when u r doing something and just much more advance and better overall

i went back to normal client once and it just sucked so lifeless and slow downlaods

RealitY
11-02-2003, 08:55 AM
I&#39;m sticking with the new BT client in Shareaza for now, at least that keeps my BT and eDonkey shit in one along with G1 and G2. Point is I just don&#39;t use any of these enough to want them all seperated, though I still use them...

nahan
11-02-2003, 09:02 AM
Originally posted by scribblec+2 November 2003 - 09:50--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (scribblec @ 2 November 2003 - 09:50)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-nahan@2 November 2003 - 08:47
We all know about bt jerk and the latter such, but they dont work the same
And you just want achieve the same consistant speeds that you get using unhacked source code.


I use 321b and see no reason to switch even though I have tried all of the oher clients.
but the original bt client is so optionless

it doesnt tell u if the file has any seeds and such upload setting when u r doing something and just much more advance and better overall

i went back to normal client once and it just sucked so lifeless and slow downlaods [/b][/quote]
For someone who has used it once you have quite a one sided opinion.
No it dosent have all the useless options ,but it does display the amount of seeds
peers and distributed copies.
It has an upload setting ,which you can change.
And as for slow download speeds you base this on .. ? your limited use.
You can and will max out a run of the mill average 1mbt connection using any client.

RealitY
11-02-2003, 09:41 AM
Well no matter what client I use I never get pass 50KB/s dl and about 25KB/s ul, thus I said fuck it and just stuck with Shareaza, the client that controls all my least used p2p apps in one...
:lol: :lol:

scribblec
11-02-2003, 10:55 AM
Originally posted by nahan+2 November 2003 - 09:02--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (nahan @ 2 November 2003 - 09:02)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>
Originally posted by scribblec@2 November 2003 - 09:50
<!--QuoteBegin-nahan@2 November 2003 - 08:47
We all know about bt jerk and the latter such, but they dont work the same
And you just want achieve the same consistant speeds that you get using unhacked source code.


I use 321b and see no reason to switch even though I have tried all of the oher clients.
but the original bt client is so optionless

it doesnt tell u if the file has any seeds and such upload setting when u r doing something and just much more advance and better overall

i went back to normal client once and it just sucked so lifeless and slow downlaods
For someone who has used it once you have quite a one sided opinion.
No it dosent have all the useless options ,but it does display the amount of seeds
peers and distributed copies.
It has an upload setting ,which you can change.
And as for slow download speeds you base this on .. ? your limited use.
You can and will max out a run of the mill average 1mbt connection using any client. [/b][/quote]
basically i used to use the normal client before i discovered this experimental and on the normal one i dont recall it sayin how many seed were there or anything

generally all clients get the same speed i was wrong on that and i just prefer this client

Switeck
11-02-2003, 06:11 PM
Originally posted by scribblec@2 November 2003 - 05:55
basically i used to use the normal client before i discovered this experimental and on the normal one i dont recall it sayin how many seed were there or anything

generally all clients get the same speed i was wrong on that and i just prefer this client
I&#39;ve discovered that varying the upload settings in a certain manner can (if you&#39;re not choked and/or shunned) can net a MUCH faster download speed.

For 20 KB/sec total upload speed, allowing 4 uploads at once and 20 KB/sec is &#39;good&#39;... but allowing 10 uploads at once and 20 KB/sec is often &#39;excellent&#39; on torrents with lots of peers but few seeds.

jbravo2uk
11-02-2003, 06:17 PM
im using shareaza 4 my torents and at the monent runaway jury is downloading at 256 to 300 kb/s thats what i would opt 4 ;)

Nexus UK
11-02-2003, 06:44 PM
I use Shadow Version and sorry but i get High Speeds at all settings .

i have a 256kb upload but manage to hit 30kb most of the time.

and i have played with the upload limiter BUT it seems to ignore this and just

upload at whatever it feels like.

Also after using BT/Supernova a few times and searching around there are lots of tracker sites for you to join.

I even joined fasttracker but up to now, i have not even used it (i know, they have since moved the url etc...)

all you need to do is keep your eyes open when reading some threads and you will soon find new sources

a favourite way of mine is to just search for a torrent by name on copernic

"DS9 Torrent" for example.

i used to get really pissed with leechers on klite but now at least the Majority of users on BT HAVE to share. and lets remember people out there still pay for using kazaa &#33;&#33;&#33;&#33;&#33;&#33;&#33;&#33;&#33;&#33;&#33;&#33;&#33;&#33;&#33;&#33;&#33;&#33; so not every one is of the skill/intelligence to apply knowledge into stopping their uploads.

a side note is now when i do "klite" i get some pretty spectacular speeds (for a 1mb limit)