And now, Libya?

[999969999]

Are we really going to send our military to Libya to start yet another war?

Is it any wonder that people in the Middle Eastern countries are so angry at us?

We need to start minding our own business and get the hell out of the Middle East.

[whatcdfan]

We need to start minding our own business and get the hell out of the Middle East.

That would be kind but also disastrous. The current overall situation in the moslem world is a mere consequence of their ancestors leaving the job half done and the westerns with more sincerity/dedication towards their goal can't afford take the suicidal decision.They are riding on a lion, step down and end up being eaten.

[megabyteme]

We need to start minding our own business and get the hell out of the Middle East.

I am pondering the possibility of your statement, and I don't believe it is a good choice. We are, like it or not, too dependent on their natural resources to simply cut and run, leaving destabilization. The void left would quickly be filled with either dictators, or extremists. Prices would soar, and there would not be anything- short of creating new footholds in the area- we could do about it.

Our second option is to keep things as they are. We are despised by some, tolerated by a few, and that's about it. We are there for war and trade.

The third option is to increase our efforts. This one unsettles me because Afghanistan/Iraq has been such a seemingly futile effort. However, if options 1 and 2 aren't working to our best interests, perhaps there might be some benefit to it. For a country who says it believes in freedom, and democracy, etc., we sure back a lot of regimes who are anything but democracies. Could we support democratic governments, and still meet our needs? At least the effort seems more true to what we say we believe.

Thoughts? I'm actually uncertain myself, but there seem to be only a few options (yes, I am aware of the "alternative", unrealistic options).

[bigboab]

News:

Last Monday: ' Westerners, Keep out. We do not need you'.

This Monday: 'This is not right, they are firing back at us. We need urgent help'.

I spent my 21st birthday at a place called El Adam just south of Tobruk. At that time Gadaffi was the up and coming rebel. He won. You know the rest. One time when we were driving, in convoy, from Benghazi to Tobruk. We were in open land rovers. When driving through Derna we had everything but the kitchen sink thrown at us. We were under orders not to retaliate in any way.

It is not our country. Let them sort it out themselves. There are plenty other instance where women and children have been killed and we have stood back and did nothing. IMO we should keep it that way, unless we interfere in every instance of civilians being killed,

[999969999]

We need to start minding our own business and get the hell out of the Middle East.

That would be kind but also disastrous. The current overall situation in the moslem world is a mere consequence of their ancestors leaving the job half done and the westerns with more sincerity/dedication towards their goal can't afford take the suicidal decision.They are riding on a lion, step down and end up being eaten.

I like that quote. That's a great way to describe the situation.

[999969999]

We need to start minding our own business and get the hell out of the Middle East.

I am pondering the possibility of your statement, and I don't believe it is a good choice. We are, like it or not, too dependent on their natural resources

We've been dependent of their natural resources for decades, and yet we never do anything about it. I'm afraid the only thing that's going to get us to stop being dependent on their natural resources is a crisis of monumental proportions. So severe that we are finally shocked out of our complacency.

to simply cut and run, leaving destabilization.

The void left would quickly be filled with either dictators, or extremists.

That really is up for their people to decide. If they want extremists and dictators ruling over them, then who are we to say anything about it? It is time that we stop caring about what form of government other countries have. It is none of our business.




Prices would soar, and there would not be anything- short of creating new footholds in the area- we could do about it.

Maybe this is what needs to happen to get us to finally change what we are doing? Maybe $7 per gallon gas will finally wake us up? It the short run it would be a nightmare for us, but in the long run, we would be better off if this happened to us.


Our second option is to keep things as they are.

Unfortunately, whether we like it or not, things are not going to stay as they are anymore. It is time for things to change.


We are despised by some, tolerated by a few, and that's about it. We are there for war and trade.

We are despised by most of them, and for good reason. We won't keep our nose out of other people's business. It is not a sustainable situation for us anymore.

The third option is to increase our efforts. This one unsettles me because Afghanistan/Iraq has been such a seemingly futile effort.


This would also prove to be a futile effort. I think it is time to cut our losses, and yes, cut and run.


However, if options 1 and 2 aren't working to our best interests, perhaps there might be some benefit to it. For a country who says it believes in freedom, and democracy, etc., we sure back a lot of regimes who are anything but democracies. Could we support democratic governments, and still meet our needs? At least the effort seems more true to what we say we believe.


Again, it is none of our business what form of government they choose to live under. Let them make their own decisions and live with the consequences.

Thoughts? I'm actually uncertain myself, but there seem to be only a few options (yes, I am aware of the "alternative", unrealistic options).

....

[999969999]

News:

Last Monday: ' Westerners, Keep out. We do not need you'.

This Monday: 'This is not right, they are firing back at us. We need urgent help'.


I noticed that, too.

I spent my 21st birthday at a place called El Adam just south of Tobruk. At that time Gadaffi was the up and coming rebel. He won. You know the rest. One time when we were driving, in convoy, from Benghazi to Tobruk. We were in open land rovers. When driving through Derna we had everything but the kitchen sink thrown at us. We were under orders not to retaliate in any way.

Sounds very similar to the way the current war is being fought. It is difficult to win a war when we are afraid of hurting anyone. I'm against any unnecessary wars, including World War II, but at least that war was fought to be won. Was the U.S. military worried about killing "innocent" German civilians when they carpet bombed whole German cities in World War II? Of course not. But, since we no longer seem to have the guts to fight a war to win it, it is best that we stay out of wars.

It is not our country. Let them sort it out themselves.


My thoughts exactly.

There are plenty other instance where women and children have been killed and we have stood back and did nothing. IMO we should keep it that way, unless we interfere in every instance of civilians being killed,

It's obvious we are not fighting these wars to save women and children from being killed.

[bigboab]

A lot of talk of a no fly zone over Libya because Gadaffi is retaliating and and dealing with the uprising. No talk about a no fly zone or something similar in Bahrain where Saudi Arabian troops have been called in to help quell the 'rebels'. The usual double standards by the western powers.