Paisley, A Pattern Is Emerging.

[chalice]

Breaking election results in N Ireland have shown a massive polarisation in ideology. The anti-agreement DUP is set to weild the heftiest majority in that vicious menagerie.

Read all about it. (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/northern_ireland/3245156.stm)

What do I think?
The DUP will never hold discussions with Sinn Fein and the UUP have become totally ineffective, as have the SDLP.

We are more entrenched than ever.

So much for democracy.

Devolution is devolving.

[J'Pol]

This is sad news indeed mate.

One can only hope that the people have had a long enough break from the worst of the hostilities (I know that it has been going on, but not as overtly) that they will not want to go back to it. One hopes that the politicians know this and they will just cast insult at one another rather than bombs. The Westminster Parliament would be a good model to follow, all bark and no bite.

Ironically the thing which may help is that the criminal activities jointly being carried out by the Nationalist and Unionist gangs have been quite successful. They might not want to go back to a terrorist campaign as it will cut profitability. It is up to the British Government, with the support of the Irish, not to give either side justificating to go back to the worst of the conflict.

One can only hope and pray. As we have discussed in the past, two steps forward, one step back. This is just one of the backs.

[chalice]

Yes, JP, the spirit of '72 come full circle.

Man, I find it hard to take in. It really is dramatic stuff.

Geoffrey Donaldson (UUP) is rolling up his sleeves to take an axe to whatever veneer of consensus we might have had.

Ian Paisley has never performed with such vitriol. He's like some anti-pheonix (arf)

I've never stated an affiliation before, JP, but I'm humming "A Nation Once Again" with renewed despair.

My countrymen are living up to their stereotypes.

[Rat Faced]

I have to admit to not being on top of Ulster politics however am i right in saying that the "anti" Good Friday DUP, although being the largest overall party, is still in a minority over all the "Pro" Good Friday parties (on both sides of the fence)..?

Im not sure which of all those parties are pro, and which are anti...


If the DUP dont talk to the other side, they will be selling the Unionists down the river, as the Republicans will have the largest voice, if not the largest party... or am i out on a limb here?


If anything, the results really show how to split a vote, ensuring no party can have overall power.

[chalice]

RF, you are indeed correct in saying the anti-Good Friday DUP.

The problem is that the present N Ireland parliament was founded under the GFA and the pro-GFA UUP is split between Geoffrey Donaldson, who is anti and David Trimble, who is pseudo-pro (arf). The UUP have no guarantees and the whips are schizophrenic.

The pro SDLP are waning considerably and the DUP is a mighty monster.

Sinn Fein are now huge which means the DUP vote will be vindicated.

Mark my words. Stormont will not see the new year.

[J'Pol]

Do not despair, the right thinking element must stick to the way forward, towards peace. They must not be tempted into "tit for tat". That would escalate quickly and a lot of hard work would suffer.

I genuinely believe that, if the normal people wish for the peace process to carry on then it will. Remember that in the past Mr Paisley and the like were preaching to people who wanted to hate and to follow them. I sincerely hope that this is not the case now and that this sort of vitriol and hatred is a thing of the past. They may find that when they bang their drums, there is no response from the common pawns.

Some friends and I were in the Hotel up at the Giants Causeway one night, 5 or 6 years ago now. We were drinking in the bar directly opposite (as I recall, though I have been there on several occasions) the main door. We were rather the worse for wear as it happens. Our hosts generosity being, as ever, exemplary. There was a function on, so loads of people were milling around, including those with the bulge just under the left oxter. You know whereof I speak.

Then Mr Paisley appeared, it turned out that he had been having a fund raiser. Being somewhat the worse for drink we decided that this was an ideal photo opportunity, so we decided to take it, there was myself and my two colleagues John Joseph and Francis. Joey and Frank, but you take my point. The "entourage" were not entirely encouraged by this development, however we said hello to the chaps with the slight bulges, formally introduced ourselves and it was agreed that The Hon Ian would pose with us for a photo. He is not a small chap, however he posed with the masses as agreed. This being the most sensible policy at the time.

The official photographer was not best pleased when Joey gave him the point and shoot, with the instruction to take a couple, in case the first wasn't very good.

Back on track - people have to try to get on, have to see each other as friends, realise that there really isn't that much difference between each other. So long as every member of society has the same basic civil rights and liberties.

You are now part of the European Union and the ECHR is not an optional thing. It is much more difficult for one section of society to be subjected to institutionalized sectarianism. I remain optimistic, I hope you will too.

I will happily sing the Thomas Davis anthem with you if you wish, however I would rather that the people of the North found a way to live in mutual respect and harmony. Let us look forward and not back. We do not reject the memory of our Fathers, we simply move forward in peace.

[chalice]

JP, your last was a gem and worthy of your best.

I'm grateful for that. Thank you.

It's not often we get to pose with war-mongers. One for the grandkids. Reminds me of the time I met Don King in Robinsons.

Yet each man kills the thing he loves,
By each let this be heard.
Some do it with a bitter look,
Some with a flattering word,
The coward does it with a kiss,
The brave man with a sword.

[J'Pol]

I am genuinely touched by your last mate, not normally a sensitive sort but thanks for that.

I will proudly sing with you my friend,

A Nation once again,
A Nation once again,
And lreland, long a province, be
A Nation once again!

Now let us move on, with dignity, liberty, equality and freedom for all.

I genuinely hope and pray that the process will continue.

[j2k4]

A heartfelt thread, gentlemen.

I am a know-nothing in this arena, but as J'Pol has said, perhaps the heretofore silent gallery will muster themselves and be heard.

My best hopes and wishes to all.

[chalice]

Well, I've just ventured out into this politiical wilderness and as yet I've nothing to report.

I sat with mixed company and they're confused as I am.

Watch this antithesis.

[Billy_Dean]

I've often wondered what would happen if the IRA just stood up one day and said "Right, that's it". What if they were to disband, give up all their weapons, and declare their commitment to peaceful political dialogue? It would throw world opinion firmly into their court. It would negate the main oposition's reasons for refusing to deal.

I believe Ulster is on the brink of uniting with the Republic, it's just a very long brink at the moment. It needs a major breakthrough. I think this would tip the scales.

I'd be interested to hear what Chalice thinks about it.



:)

[Lamsey]

http://info.sjc.ox.ac.uk/special/talkinghead/4/images/paisley3.gif
Ulster Says No!









Uh... What was the question?