Id Cards In Britain

[99shassan]

What do you guys think of this topic? I personally approve this. Privacy my butt, suppose you go to buy a packet of cigarrettes and they ask you for ID, you wouldn't hesitiate to show them. I think an ID card would be useful for both you or the police.

I don't support the £40 pay to buy one though.

[Nogimics]

Originally posted by 99shassan@12 January 2004 - 15:38
suppose you go to buy a packet of cigarrettes and they ask you for ID, you wouldn't hesitiate to show them.
If you want ID because of people questioning your age then that’s fine, go get some, as the authority’s already do them. But this is just big brother trying to keep a better track on us and making us pay the government more money so they can spend it on saving the world whilst our economy goes to shit along with our NHS, Un-employment problems and the average debt a British citizen is in. :angry:

Nice controversial thread tho mate :D

[Busyman]

Originally posted by 99shassan@12 January 2004 - 16:38
What do you guys think of this topic? I personally approve this. Privacy my butt, suppose you go to buy a packet of cigarrettes and they ask you for ID, you wouldn't hesitiate to show them. I think an ID card would be useful for both you or the police.

I don't support the £40 pay to buy one though.
Ya'll don't have ID's?

That's weird. :huh:

[Rat Faced]

I dont agree with 'em.

Not because i want to stay free of Big Brother etc...just coz they dont work.

Ask any other country, that has them....they get false IDs at the end of the street so they can get a drink before they are 21 (yes im talking those drunken US college students..... just like ours, but classed as underage for booze :P )

If they were secure, then i'd say go ahead...they arent.

Within a week of the 1st ones being issued, you&#39;d be able to get fake ones...probably cheaper than the government wants for legit ones <_<

Thats not security...its a money maker.

[vidcc]

Originally posted by Busyman@12 January 2004 - 15:59
Ya&#39;ll don&#39;t have ID&#39;s?

That&#39;s weird.&nbsp; :huh:
ah but you see the uk really IS the land of the free, about the only thing we have that is more free is the right to carry a gun :lol:

[chinook_apache]

lol GCHQ know everything about every 1 of us....our mobile phone calls txt messages etc.

[vidcc]

Originally posted by chinook_apache@12 January 2004 - 18:07
lol GCHQ know everything about every 1 of us....our mobile phone calls txt messages etc.
of course they do..they got all the info from the CIA :lol:

[billyfridge]

Couldn&#39;t they make ID cards with usernames and passwords? it seems to work on the net. i&#39;m not rich but i&#39;d pay £40 if it can&#39;t be copied. we arte used to being careful with credit card numbers now, why not ID cards? the big brother fixated people don&#39;t have to buy one <_<

[vidcc]

Originally posted by billyfridge@12 January 2004 - 19:00
Couldn&#39;t they make ID cards with usernames and passwords? it seems to work on the net. i&#39;m not rich but i&#39;d pay £40 if it can&#39;t be copied. we arte used to being careful with credit card numbers now, why not ID cards? the big brother fixated people don&#39;t have to buy one <_<
like a user name and password is secure :lol: :lol: :lol:
that said about the 40 gbp cost...would you be willing to pay if they made the cards compulsory ? i did read Blunketts statement (yes someone in the USA knows the name of the home secretary..or i could just be making an ass off myself) stating that people would gladly pay as they would consider it a fair price.

[billyfridge]

Originally posted by vidcc@12 January 2004 - 19:08

like a user name and password is secure :lol:&nbsp; :lol:&nbsp; :lol:
that said about the 40 gbp cost...would you be willing to pay if they made the cards compulsory ? i did read Blunketts statement (yes someone in the USA knows the name of the home secretary..or i could just be making an ass off myself) stating that people would gladly pay as they would consider it a fair price.
I know it&#39;s not 100% secure but it would make the forgers job harder, surely :blink:
what would u suggest to make them forgeproof :huh:

[vidcc]

just the point..they won&#39;t be forgeproof...of course they could make them biometric which as far as the police are concerned would make them easier to detect on their data base but then it really would be big brother (should the police have a database of your dna/fingerprints if you have comitted no crime?) however in as far as id for comercial purposes forgery will always be a problem

[Rat Faced]

Originally posted by vidcc+12 January 2004 - 18:09--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (vidcc @ 12 January 2004 - 18:09)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-chinook_apache@12 January 2004 - 18:07
lol GCHQ know everything about every 1 of us....our mobile phone calls txt messages etc.
of course they do..they got all the info from the CIA :lol: [/b][/quote]
Thats closer to the truth than sits easy..

GCHQ is not allowed to monitor the British Public (in theory), its allowed to monitor everyone elses communications though...

CIA is in the same boat with the US public i believe...(ie its external security, and someone else does the internal)

Yes, i know that everyone breaks the rules, and there are exceptions....however there is nothing wrong with information exchange (its encouraged sometimes) and there is nothing stopping the CIA monitoring the UK public and vice versa...

[Rat Faced]

Originally posted by billyfridge+12 January 2004 - 19:18--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (billyfridge &#064; 12 January 2004 - 19:18)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-vidcc@12 January 2004 - 19:08

like a user name and password is secure :lol: :lol: :lol:
that said about the 40 gbp cost...would you be willing to pay if they made the cards compulsory ? i did read Blunketts statement (yes someone in the USA knows the name of the home secretary..or i could just be making an ass off myself) stating that people would gladly pay as they would consider it a fair price.
I know it&#39;s not 100% secure but it would make the forgers job harder, surely :blink:
what would u suggest to make them forgeproof :huh: [/b][/quote]
Thats the point...

It gives the illusion of security, but is nothing of the sort... (much like fingerprinting in US airports :P)

It may make it harder for the kids down the street to give a false name, but anyone with an ounce of brains and a little cash can get one that&#39;s just as "real" to someone looking at it.

Biometric is more secure, but then you have development and associated costs going through the roof, and it can still be forged..

The only "Foolproof" way is full DNA, linked with a national DNA database...which isnt going to happen...and i bet that they could be forged too somehow (although i have no idea how :rolleyes: ) ........this is great except: Are we going to insist everyone coming into the country has a passport with full DNA details (confirmed by the country of origin...who will also have to have a full database..)?

As far as im concerned its an all or nothing proposition... I dont mind a secure ID card..but at the moment there is no such thing. Im not gonna buy one off the Government willingly...if i can get one just as good down the street for the same price (or quite possibly cheaper, if the £40 figure is legit..)


BTW: Off Topic but lnked to this...

UK is now the most watched country in the world...with 1 CCTV camera for every 14 people..officially :)

[Samurai]

Originally posted by Rat Faced@12 January 2004 - 19:13
UK is now the most watched country in the world...with 1 CCTV camera for every 14 people..officially :)
Where did you get this information from?

[Nogimics]

It was on the news today&#33;

[billyfridge]

Originally posted by Rat Faced@12 January 2004 - 20:13



BTW: Off Topic but lnked to this...

UK is now the most watched country in the world...with 1 CCTV camera for every 14 people..officially :)
As a UK citizen the cct thing doesn&#39;t bother me at all, although it must make some people uneasy, why? In fact it makes me feel more secure. ;)

[Rat Faced]

Makes me feel more secure too....when im in the city centre etc.

Its a pain in the arse in the suburbs, as it just makes the trouble move to an area not covered in cameras...like mine.

However, where there are cameras....Crime is right down. Now thats a security measure that works...although again, it wouldnt work against terrorism as much; unless the police were really lucky in catching them set it all up. Unlikely.

[billyfridge]

Originally posted by Rat Faced@13 January 2004 - 01:32
Makes me feel more secure too....when im in the city centre etc.

Its a pain in the arse in the suburbs, as it just makes the trouble move to an area not covered in cameras...like mine.

However, where there are cameras....Crime is right down. Now thats a security measure that works...although again, it wouldnt work against terrorism as much; unless the police were really lucky in catching them set it all up. Unlikely.
Cctv, as u say is good in city centres. i think they&#39;re building a database because
i&#39;m sorry to say, my grandson is a proffessional shoplifter, things got too hot for him in my area (Manchester) so he moved to Torquay as soon as he tried
the shops, the security guards started following him round the stores. so it works sometimes. or maybe the police inserted a tracer under his skin
whilst asleep on one of the many times he&#39;s been locked up :D :D

[Alex H]

Well some people are talking about ID cards in Australia as well.

My response is:
YOU WANT US TO CARRY COMPULSORY IDENTIFICATION PAPERS?

No way&#33; The western world has a long and bloodstained history of fighting totalitarian regimes, and if anyone thinks that their freedom will be ensured by an ID card you are gravely mistaken.

Eg. We have a "100 point ID check" system here, so if you are applying for a bank account, drivers licence, etc you have to have enough documnets to make up the 100 points. A driver&#39;s licence is worth 60, an electricity bill is worth 20, a birth certificate is worth 50, etc.

So if the new ID card is forge-proof, I should only have to front up with my card and I can get anything because it is secure, ie. I don&#39;t need all the others.

What happens if I loose it, or it gets stolen with the rest of my wallet?

First, I have a major problem. I am unidentifiable. I cannot prove who I am. Therefore I have to get a new ID card. I have to bring my 100 point of ID to get the card.

So if I still have to have all my other ID, why get a new one? All the other stuff can be forged easily.

It will be a minor hiccup to terrorists and a major incovenience to the rest of the 99.9999999% of the population.


So instead of carrying an ID card I can easily loose, why not just tattoo a serial number onto my forearm?

http://www.chgs.umn.edu/Histories__Narratives__Documen/Henry_Oertelt_-_An_Unbroken_Ch/Auschwitz_Tattoo/pic12t.jpg

Auschwitz Tattoo. Number of Henry Oertelt B11291.

[Alex H]

Was that the conclusive argument against ID cards? Wow, cool&#33;