This came up in another thread. This in regards to 'our' countries blunders in the past. So has anyone any suggestions?
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This came up in another thread. This in regards to 'our' countries blunders in the past. So has anyone any suggestions?
I'm totally ashamed about the fascist pig rooters who run my country.
i'd gladly see them tried as traitors, australia hasn't had decent leaders since 1975 and even then they were crooks
i fail to comprehend how you could not be embarressed at the way the english speaking world has been led into the shit house where we've been left in the bowl half flushed :flush:
Britain was as arrogant in its days of being a "superpower" as the US government is now...nothing i can do to change it, days gone by.
However what is also embaressing is the present situation....where UK still acts as if it is a superpower, when its not.
Makes us a laughing stock, and is very expensive to uphold the posture when you have nothing to back it up with.
Wrong, Rat.Quote:
Originally posted by Rat Faced@11 August 2003 - 11:05
Britain was as arrogant in its days of being a "superpower" as the US government is now...nothing i can do to change it, days gone by.
However what is also embaressing is the present situation....where UK still acts as if it is a superpower, when its not.
Makes us a laughing stock, and is very expensive to uphold the posture when you have nothing to back it up with.
France is garnering far more laughs than the U.K., these days.
The only example of Gaullist superiority extant.
In the case of the U.S., it seems to do no good (at least for puposes in this forum) to acknowledge wrong-doings past and present; we have no defenders but a small, unashamed percentage of the larger group of U.S. citizens who post here.
I, for one, am not going anywhere, nor am I going to throw over the loyalty I feel to my country.
As for the guilt aspect? Nah-
All that is required is recognition of historical fact and a willingness to acknowledge the record, which is, due to the current revisionist bent, somewhat in dispute.
So, we will all forge ahead with the debate, yes?
Rat,Quote:
Originally posted by Rat Faced@11 August 2003 - 10:05
Britain was as arrogant in its days of being a "superpower" as the US government is now...nothing i can do to change it, days gone by.
However what is also embaressing is the present situation....where UK still acts as if it is a superpower, when its not.
Makes us a laughing stock, and is very expensive to uphold the posture when you have nothing to back it up with.
I think it would be interesting if the UK were to adopt the post WW2 stance of the Japanese.
Completely drop the attempt to excel militarily and instead become an economic superpower.
They certainly managed to achieve primacy with a similar landmass/ population and lack of natural resources.
Sort of flew beneath the radar until they sprung up, full blown and undeniable.
Remember when "Made in Japan" was a term of derision?
Rat,Quote:
Originally posted by clocker+11 August 2003 - 22:32--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (clocker @ 11 August 2003 - 22:32)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-Rat Faced@11 August 2003 - 10:05
Britain was as arrogant in its days of being a "superpower" as the US government is now...nothing i can do to change it, days gone by.
However what is also embaressing is the present situation....where UK still acts as if it is a superpower, when its not.
Makes us a laughing stock, and is very expensive to uphold the posture when you have nothing to back it up with.
I think it would be interesting if the UK were to adopt the post WW2 stance of the Japanese.
Completely drop the attempt to excel militarily and instead become an economic superpower.
They certainly managed to achieve primacy with a similar landmass/ population and lack of natural resources.
Sort of flew beneath the radar until they sprung up, full blown and undeniable.
Remember when "Made in Japan" was a term of derision? [/b][/quote]
Holy shit - I can't believe I'm agreeing with clocker on a World Event topic :D Someone get a Kodak!
That, IMO, is a damn good idea. However, while it could work to an extent in the UK it won't work on a level of miracles as it did Japan for one main reason - Japan was famous for its people to be extremely loyal to their work. The Japanese were known to work like crazy in the decades of the WWII aftermath. According to history, that and other factors in their favour make Japan the power it is today.
The UK, AFAIK, hasn't had that much will since WWII, and I sure as hell think that they have no nowadays :( It's sad but should they have been able to have happened, it should be mean a long while ago. i.e. I'd bet my life savings to go against that happening, but then again the bookies were accepting bets that we wouldn't reach 100 degs F days ago :D
j2k4 - this is not a criticism of any account, but I want to ask you to do one thing - Can you name one thing that you don't like about your country? Ignore any patriotism you have for one second and speak with an non-ethnocentric head* - Is there anything you would change about your country?** I ask to see whether you can view any such weaknesses and to make a point (without trying to make some kind of intended statement) that no country is perfect - Sure as hell not the UK!
*LOL - this is coming from a strong Liverpool FC supporter who used to take & receive the piss out of the forum's resident Geordies :lol:
**or even state - I may only be a Brit but AFAIK the "states" are at a domestic level quite have considerable differences to each other. But I could be wrong :unsure:
Good call, Illuminati-Quote:
Originally posted by Illuminati@11 August 2003 - 18:13
j2k4 - this is not a criticism of any account, but I want to ask you to do one thing - Can you name one thing that you don't like about your country? Ignore any patriotism you have for one second and speak with an non-ethnocentric head* - Is there anything you would change about your country?** I ask to see whether you can view any such weaknesses and to make a point (without trying to make some kind of intended statement) that no country is perfect - Sure as hell not the UK!
*LOL - this is coming from a strong Liverpool FC supporter who used to take & receive the piss out of the forum's resident Geordies :lol:
**or even state - I may only be a Brit but AFAIK the "states" are at a domestic level quite have considerable differences to each other. But I could be wrong :unsure:
If you were a bit more familiar with me, you would be aware of the problems I have with my own country and it's policies, especially domestically.
I frankly don't have the slightest idea how we can accomplish what we do, things are in such a "state".
I gather you would like at this point for me to elaborate; I regret I haven't the time, nor you the patience, to read my list of grievances.
Know this, though-none of the above precludes my love of country.
I do NOT, however, engage in jingoism; my critics on this point merely lack the ability to discern my intent, and I have come to regard this as a failing of others, as I take pains to clarify, clarify, clarify in my posting.
I know our system is the worst-except for all the others.
I think Churchill said that, or something like it.
In any case, the slings and arrows arrive from all points on the compass-I haven't the time nor inclination anymore to discriminate for some (many) people here-that is not to say that I won't, but that I will "pick my spots".
For what it's worth, I count you among the higher-minded here-there-now you're arrogant, too. ;)
Sorry j2k4 - Truth is that I've tried to stay away from the World Events forum because of the arguments that once were getting personal :( But you're back and I've always respected your opinion, so I thought why not get back into it? :)Quote:
If you were a bit more familiar with me, you would be aware of the problems I have with my own country and it's policies, especially domestically.
I know the feeling you do, right now; three words - Lord Hutton InquiryQuote:
I frankly don't have the slightest idea how we can accomplish what we do, things are in such a "state".
I lack patience to only those who lack immaturity, patience themselves or the ability to listen to & respect others views. Last time I checked, you weren't any of them :) But I think it's more the time thing, so I won't ask any more.Quote:
I gather you would like at this point for me to elaborate; I regret I haven't the time, nor you the patience, to read my list of grievances.
Feel free to :)
Whether you love your country and whether you understand its limits/strengths/problems are IMO totally independent - A child may have the lowest IQ but in most cases that will not affect a genuine parent's love for them. Though as far as I'm concerned, anyone whose view is that shallow deserves to burn in hell anyway <_< (shame for that IMO it doesn't exist :()Quote:
Know this, though-none of the above precludes my love of country.
Sweet - I just learnt a new word :DQuote:
I do NOT, however, engage in jingoism; my critics on this point merely lack the ability to discern my intent, and I have come to regard this as a failing of others, as I take pains to clarify, clarify, clarify in my posting.
But seriously - I'll admit that I once thought of you as being a pure US-worshipper, but this view was based on the posts during the "heatwave" of the war forum when emotions did run high and the view of blind uncomprimising ethnocentrism was even higher.
Thanks for clarifying that up - I'll remember for next time :)
I think I've heard that from Churchill as well - Or was this already recited in the war forum? :blink:Quote:
I know our system is the worst-except for all the others.
I think Churchill said that, or something like it.
This true - Fact is that no matter what level you look at it, no matter whose eyes its seen in, their own group will never be the worst - But they won't be the best either ;)
Know that feeling; although I have traded verbal blows with a few people here (you know who you are ;)), I have never so far gone as too far as disregard anyone else's posts to the point of discrimination.Quote:
In any case, the slings and arrows arrive from all points on the compass-I haven't the time nor inclination anymore to discriminate for some (many) people here-that is not to say that I won't, but that I will "pick my spots".
Well, there are a couple who I cease to read the posts of now, but they're bleeding obvious who they are - How many people do you know on this forum who post abusive, pointless crap and nothing else? ;)
Uh...I'd love to respond, but I'm not sure whether that's a compliment or an insult :blink:Quote:
For what it's worth, I count you among the higher-minded here-there-now you're arrogant, too ;)
I know you won't elaborate on the whole government thing, but is there any chance you can elaborate on this? I think I had a brain fart halfway through typing this reply :blink:
I am assuming that having stated here my ongoing respect for your opinions and how they are stated will probably have the effect of creating a perception of my having co-opted your participation in this forum in order to achieve my nefarious ends:Quote:
Originally posted by Illuminati@12 August 2003 - 11:19
Uh...I'd love to respond, but I'm not sure whether that's a compliment or an insult :blink:Quote:
For what it's worth, I count you among the higher-minded here-there-now you're arrogant, too ;)
I know you won't elaborate on the whole government thing, but is there any chance you can elaborate on this? I think I had a brain fart halfway through typing this reply :blink:
I appreciate what you do here-therefore you are tainted, see?
Too many in this forum see a name and assume an opposing stance for no other reason than that.
I take great satisfaction in agreeing, on one hand, and disagreeing, on the other, with the same people, depending on what is at issue.
Variety being the spice, and all that.
Some people here can't function that way, and while I have nothing against anyone here (well, almost anyone), I abhor that attitude and the limitations it imposes.