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Thread: The Death Penalty

  1. #1
    We've had euthanasia and abortion, and the death penalty was brought up in another post so I thought it merited discussion. Sorry to the MODs for starting yet another probably emotive topic.

    Personally I think the death penalty is little more than a barbaric throwback, its effectiveness as a deterrent is limiited and if deterring people is not the aim, than the only possible alternative is that it serves is as retribution to victims and families, which is, IMO, a fairly barbaric attitude (an eye for an eye?). I think a culture which condones organised mured is keeping a small part of itself uncivilised. For me its not just the belief that the death penalty as a punishment is wrong, but also the fact that its irreversible, and the fact that u put the person under an incredible amount of stress for an extended period of time.
    I come from England and I'm quite glad that we have abolished the death penalty, (Is anyone certain that the caveat, about arson in dockyards and treason, is actually true and not another 'urban legend'? I for one sincerely hope its not true).
    NB Please don't misunderstand and think that I believe Britain to be a world leader in civilisation, compared to the laws in some other European countries I think Britain can sometimes be quite backward.

    Is there anyone who believes that the death penalty achieves something?

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  3. The Drawing Room   -   #2
    WeeMouse's Avatar Small and Squeaky
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    Hmmmm....it's still murder, y'know? the death penalty was abolished before I was born, so I don't know too much about it, if people were wrongly killed, but i imagine that there must have been a few.....and what use is a pardon if you're already dead?

  4. The Drawing Room   -   #3
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    Wow....this IS a tough subject. IMO, justice systems all over the world are terribly flawed to begin with. There seems to be a constant parade of guilty people walking free on the heels of some procedural blunder or technical miss-step. While at the same time, innocent people are imprisoned in cells in every country on earth. Also, there are simply too many different opinions world-wide on what should be punishable by death. Combine these two facts and I think you have a solid case against the death penalty. No doubt, studies have been done and comparisons made re; the relationship between the violent crime rate in countries WITH the death penalty and those WITHOUT. If anyone has those numbers handy, it may shed a different light on the subject.

  5. The Drawing Room   -   #4
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    My personal opinion:

    - Killing is wrong.

    - Two wrongs do not make a right.

    - Draw your own conclusion.

  6. The Drawing Room   -   #5
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    Originally posted by Lamsey@8 July 2003 - 02:59
    My personal opinion:

    - Killing is wrong.

    - Two wrongs do not make a right.

    - Draw your own conclusion.
    I agree L. But allow me to play devil's advocate here if you will. The farthest thing from my mind is trying to justify the taking of human life. However, let's role-play for a moment and go down the slippery road of ' what if ? '.
    Let's say you and WeeMouse get married in a few years and have a a child together. All is right with the world and your family IS your world...as it should be. Suddenly, tragically, something unimaginable occurs and your beautiful baby is taken from you as a result of the sickness and evil in some stranger's heart. Would you be able to resist the urge to bring final justice to that individual, perhaps even by your own hand ? Please forgive me L & Wee for bringing this scenario forward, but it's relevant to the discussion.

  7. The Drawing Room   -   #6
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    Originally posted by Riddler@8 July 2003 - 11:17
    Let's say you and WeeMouse get married in a few years and have a a child together. All is right with the world and your family IS your world...as it should be. Suddenly, tragically, something unimaginable occurs and your beautiful baby is taken from you as a result of the sickness and evil in some stranger's heart. Would you be able to resist the urge to bring final justice to that individual, perhaps even by your own hand ? Please forgive me L & Wee for bringing this scenario forward, but it's relevant to the discussion.
    Yes I would.

    I'd beat the crap out of him then I'd have him arrested and put into prison, where I believe the inmates would not react well to a child-murderer.


    Killing resolves nothing, except in a few exceptional circumstances.

  8. The Drawing Room   -   #7
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    Originally posted by Lamsey@8 July 2003 - 03:27





    Killing resolves nothing, except in a few exceptional circumstances.
    May I ask what those circumstances would be ?

    And btw, you are truly a man of great control of your emotions if you would resist the urge to take a life in the above scenario. I doubt if I would be able to reign in my anger and grief. Given the opportunity and the possibility that the law may allow a certain forgiveness in a case of extreme emotional duress, my gut feeling is that I would be consumed with thoughts of revenge.

  9. The Drawing Room   -   #8
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    Originally posted by Riddler@8 July 2003 - 10:46
    ...No doubt, studies have been done and comparisons made re; the relationship between the violent crime rate in countries WITH the death penalty and those WITHOUT. If anyone has those numbers handy, it may shed a different light on the subject...
    Had this discussion taken place a number of years ago, I could provide those for you. Unfortunately, it didn't, and I'm not sure if I've still got the copies. I'll look around, though.

    things are quiet until hitler decides he'd like to invade russia
    so, he does
    the russians are like "OMG WTF D00DZ, STOP TKING"
    and the germans are still like "omg ph34r n00bz"
    the russians fall back, all the way to moscow
    and then they all begin h4xing, which brings on the russian winter
    the germans are like "wtf, h4x"
    -- WW2 for the l33t

  10. The Drawing Room   -   #9
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    That would be good Wizard, if you can find them.

    I should also somewhat amend my previous reply to Lamsey and emphasize a point; in the event that " opportunity " didn't present itself soon after the fact, I'm reasonably certain that rage would lessen to the point where rational thought might begin to override it. However, my desire for the criminal's life to be extinguished by process of law would not diminish.
    A further point could be made that for those of us who already have children, the emotional despair of possibly losing them can more easily be imagined compared to those who do not. Therefore, maybe the scenario I presented was not entirely appropriate.

  11. The Drawing Room   -   #10
    The points u make Riddler seem to underline the animalness of the drive for revenge and highlight how far from a 'civilised' response killing as a punishment is. The supposed objectiveness and impartiality of the law goes straight out the window.

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