The damned swiss.

[IdolEyes787]

But from what I've seen of him on the vids, Federer is a better exponent of grass court tennis.

Federer played at a time when all but half a player had lost all game sense. Maintaining composure and playing a ball control game isn't difficult when there's no pressure. Arguably the only players that could give him a consistent run for his money were Nadal and Djokovic. He was only assumed to be a great grass player because Nadal was king of clay, but once you recognize how many matches Federer lost to Nadal on the regular (especially regardless of ground, considering Nadal himself attests to the fact that his awarding of clay grandmaster is unearned given he has more grass wins) you start to see Federer's game for what it really is.

If Federer were to play at a time with as many stars as McEnroe was subjected to throughout his career, he wouldn't have won a third of the titles he has, most probably. McEnroe had to deal with monsters like Lendl, Connors, Borg, Becker, and Wilander. Discounting all of these as well, Agassi, Sampras, Laver, and the ever-conversationally-absent Edberg and Courier - there's not a single doubt in my mind that they could all make Federer's records look childish if they could each run solo with a playing field as easy as his.

Personally I don't really care just as long as it isn't one of those serve/ (maybe) volley /point over or Agassi human backboard dickheads.

[Quarterquack]

I'll do that when I toss the rest of my lunch into the Bingham Canyon Mine.

Cursed to feel nothing but disgust at the thought of sex with me? If you think all the pity these fora have bestowed upon has been unearned in the past, that's not an issue anymore.

[Quarterquack]

Personally I don't really care just as long as it isn't one of those serve/ (maybe) volley /point over or Agassi human backboard dickheads.

As long as we keep Courier out of the pointing direction, I think we can still be friends.

[manker]

Federer played at a time when all but half a player had lost all game sense. Maintaining composure and playing a ball control game isn't difficult when there's no pressure. Arguably the only players that could give him a consistent run for his money were Nadal and Djokovic. He was only assumed to be a great grass player because Nadal was king of clay, but once you recognize how many matches Federer lost to Nadal on the regular (especially regardless of ground, considering Nadal himself attests to the fact that his awarding of clay grandmaster is unearned given he has more grass wins) you start to see Federer's game for what it really is.

If Federer were to play at a time with as many stars as McEnroe was subjected to throughout his career, he wouldn't have won a third of the titles he has, most probably. McEnroe had to deal with monsters like Lendl, Connors, Borg, Becker, and Wilander. Discounting all of these as well, Agassi, Sampras, Laver, and the ever-conversationally-absent Edberg and Courier - there's not a single doubt in my mind that they could all make Federer's records look childish if they could each run solo with a playing field as easy as his.

What the hell are you talking about. This current era of tennis is widely accepted as being of the highest standard, personnel wise, ever.

I don't know if you've noticed, but Federer is still playing. He won something recently, iirc. He's 30 and while that's not really all that old, it is when you've got younger antagonists like Djokovic and Nadal to contend with. Federer has had one of those two competing for his number one slot for at least eight years (Nadal is 26). I don't know if you missed the 2008 Wimbledon final but if you think that's playing a ball control game with no pressure, then I contend that perhaps you had inadvertently flicked onto the re-run of the ladies final that year. If there is something that Nadal applies on every surface to every opponent, it's pressure. It's what he does and what he has always done better than anyone else I've ever seen.

While the skills of the people you mention, definitely not including Courier (what? ), Lendl, Connors, Becker, Wilander (teh fook) and most certainly not Edberg, are indeed of a particularly high standard, a level of fitness to match Federer's to go with their undoubted finesse wasn't present in any of these professional sportsmen.
He'd have killed them all and bagel'd the tiny Laver.

Of course, if any of those players were around today, with the better racquets and more vigorous training regimes, maybe they would have come close to his level of play when he was at his peak in 2007. However, there is uncertainty there as perhaps none of those individuals would have been able to hone their physical condition to approach the level needed just to last three sets at today's pace.

[mjmacky]

I'll do that when I toss the rest of my lunch into the Bingham Canyon Mine.

Cursed to feel nothing but disgust at the thought of sex with me? If you think all the pity these fora have bestowed upon has been unearned in the past, that's not an issue anymore.

What? It was a mental analogy, not a response to disgust. I may boast about my size, but I feel like I don't have to fear anything if I were to pork you as I doubt my dick tissue will make contact with anything other than bowel air. Plus this is all rooted from the orgy references.

[IdolEyes787]

Personally I don't really care just as long as it isn't one of those serve/ (maybe) volley /point over or Agassi human backboard dickheads.

As long as we keep Courier out of the pointing direction, I think we can still be friends.

The fact that he will be best remembered for always wearing a hat sort of says everything necessary.

[IdolEyes787]

Also can we please stop this and move on to comparing apples and oranges.

Apples rule btw.

[mjmacky]

Also can we please stop this and move on to comparing apples and oranges.

Apples rule btw.

That's totally bananas.

[Quarterquack]

What the hell are you talking about. This current era of tennis is widely accepted as being of the highest standard, personnel wise, ever.

I don't know if you've noticed, but Federer is still playing. He won something recently, iirc. He's 30 and while that's not really all that old, it is when you've got younger antagonists like Djokovic and Nadal to contend with. Federer has had one of those two competing for his number one slot for at least eight years (Nadal is 26). I don't know if you missed the 2008 Wimbledon final but if you think that's playing a ball control game with no pressure, then I contend that perhaps you had inadvertently flicked onto the re-run of the ladies final that year. If there is something that Nadal applies on every surface to every opponent, it's pressure. It's what he does and what he has always done better than anyone else I've ever seen.

While the skills of the people you mention, definitely not including Courier (what? ), Lendl, Connors, Becker, Wilander (teh fook) and most certainly not Edberg, are indeed of a particularly high standard, a level of fitness to match Federer's to go with their undoubted finesse wasn't present in any of these professional sportsmen.
He'd have killed them all and bagel'd the tiny Laver.

Of course, if any of those players were around today, with the better racquets and more vigorous training regimes, maybe they would have come close to his level of play when he was at his peak in 2007. However, there is uncertainty there as perhaps none of those individuals would have been able to hone their physical condition to approach the level needed just to last three sets at today's pace.

It is widely regarded as such by morons. Federer doesn't have an absence of contention because he's thoroughly outclassed everyone. It's simply because the game in today's world simply won't allow for personal styles to dominate the court. It's turned everyone into a staple of the average tennis playstyle. Slice serves, net heavy play and repetitive volleys have been substituted for clinical accuracy, ungodly endurance and an annoyingly mundane positioning game - it's no surprise that the most exciting rallies are the ones where the player forgets to return to center position. It's becoming a streamlined algorithm of play.

The fact that you discount Courier from being considered a great player is one of my pet peeves. As much as I'd like to write you an essay about why he deserves his name on that list, or his successful prediction of the technical meta game, or why he secretly was successful at what few other tennis players could lay claim to when it came to adversity, I'll just ease up and say "Meh, opinions". He does hold a special place in my heart, like. Of all the players I used to try and emulate when I took tennis very seriously, it as Courier who I always found a favorite in.

Either way Idol's apples and oranges analogy is correct in one regard. Arguing about Maradona's potential dominance today's football scene is just as pointless.

[mjmacky]

Jack Dempsey would knock Courier the fuck out.