FA offers England job to Scolari

**Peerzy** · 04-30-2006, 11:40 PM

Originally Posted by What'spunk.

Look, they're fifth in the English Premier League just now. Behind Chelsea, Man Utd, Liverpool and Spurs.

There is every possibility that they will win nothing this year, again. They've never really been a force in Europe, prior to this year. Even if they do win the Champions League Wenger himself said that it was a cup competition and that anyone in it was capable of winning it (after Liverpool did it last year, sour grapes?)

How in the name of fuck can you describe them as "the best"?

They are a decent team, in England, but that's all.

Im pretty sure he meant over the past 3 years or so they have been up there. Remember only 24 months ago they were possibly the best domestic team in the world and went an entire season unbeaten, a task which no other team in any other top flight league has done as far as i know, maybe Madrid did it 4 or 5 years but im not to sure.

The same way that they've never been a force in Europe apart from this season is the same way they have for the last 8 years been a force in the Premiership. Before Wenger they were in the position Spurs, Bolton and a few others are in right now. Threatning to push up further and break into the top 4, Wenger has spent next to nothing and constantly brought through young talent. This year they have just failed slightly, the same as Man Utd's new is not exacly work class (John O'Shea anyone

). The only difference is Fergie has had £100M+ to buy some top quality players (RVN, Ferdinand, Ronaldo, and Rooney to name a few) as well as youth.

**manker** · 04-30-2006, 11:58 PM

Arsenal have been a top team for the last 100 years, they're a top team now.

Wenger has done well but Arsenal being in the top 5 teams in the land is hardly a new thing. At no point in their history could you say that their situation is comparable to Bolton's current one. That's just mad.

Arsenal used to spend just as much as United in the transfer market, right up until they started building their new stadium. It's only since then that Wenger has had to pull his head in a bit.

People tend to forget that.

**Peerzy** · 05-01-2006, 12:47 AM

Originally Posted by manker

Arsenal have been a top team for the last 100 years, they're a top team now.

Wenger has done well but Arsenal being in the top 5 teams in the land is hardly a new thing. At no point in their history could you say that their situation is comparable to Bolton's current one. That's just mad.

Arsenal used to spend just as much as United in the transfer market, right up until they started building their new stadium. It's only since then that Wenger has had to pull his head in a bit.

People tend to forget that.

Okay, maybe not Bolton

but before Wenger they were never Liverpool 80's good or Man Utd 90's good if you understand. They were a good side but never a great title winning side who every year were up there for all the domestic titles. I can't remember the exact fact but the most Wenger has spent was £5M on Walcott (Rising to £12M depending on wins and other stuff), £10M on Reyes and £9M on Henry, most of his other buys have been below £4M or so and young players. His current team right now is something like this:

Lehman - £2.4M
Eboue - 300k
Senderos 900k
Toure 240k
Flamini £1.1M compensation
Ljunberg - Unsure, £4M-£6M
Gilberto - Unsure
Fabregas - £1M compensation
Reyes - £10
Henry - £9M
Van Persie - £3M

Against a Man Utd team

VDS - £3M
GN - Free
Rio - £29M
Vidic - £6M
Can't remember your LB, Heinze's injured.
Ronaldo - £12M
Giggs - Free
O'Shea - Free
Park - £4M
Rooney - £30M
RVN - £19M

Arsenal Total - £33.94M + Gilberto (Ljunberg as £6M)
Man Utd Total - £103M + LB price

Don't make me do Chelsea

My point being that with the funds Wenger has had and the players he's had to work with he's done a fantastic job, one i don't think Mourinho or Fergie could have done. To keep Arsenal in the top 2 for the last 7 years or something (apart from this season) by using cheap players is amazing.

All amounts are off the top of my head and some maybe wrong.

**Chewie** · 05-01-2006, 02:44 AM

Wenger won his first title with Arsenal in the season he took over there. He didn't manage them for the first few months.
Mind you, when he arrived Arsenal were about thrid or fourth in the table and already had the best back four in the country (say thankya GG), Wright, Bergkamp & Merson near the top of his game (and the bottom of a bottle?).
Now, of course, they have perhaps the best forward in the world (behind Rhonhalhdhinhoh) with a very skillful support act behind him and a fairly good back line.
Arsenal were a force before Wenger went there and didn't need much to improve on what they had.
Don't get me wrong, I like the guy and think he's a great manager, but he isn't the miracle worker some will lead you to believe.

**What'spunk.** · 05-01-2006, 08:53 AM

Arsenal are a good domestic team. They are one of the top clubs in England. Let's ignore Spurs for a moment and say they (Arsenal) are in the top 4, they certainly have been over the last several years.

They are not "the best".

Money is not the issue here, that only goes to explaining why a team is in the position it is. It does not change what a team is. Currently Chelsea are the best team in England, that is a fact. How they achieved this position is irrelevant, they are simply the best.

If one wants to argue why a team is "the best" that's another story, however it does not relate to just one factor. There must be a combination of cash, used well to buy the right players, good tactical management, good man management, a good support and a load of luck. There are probably others but it's a bank holiday morning and I can't be arsed to make this a treatise.

**DorisInsinuate** · 05-01-2006, 10:23 AM

Originally Posted by Peerzy

Lehman - £2.4M
Eboue - 300k
Senderos 900k
Toure 240k
Flamini £1.1M compensation
Ljunberg - Unsure, £4M-£6M
Gilberto - Unsure
Fabregas - £1M compensation
Reyes - £10
Henry - £9M
Van Persie - £3M

Arsenal Total - £33.94M + Gilberto (Ljunberg as £6M)

My point being that with the funds Wenger has had and the players he's had to work with he's done a fantastic job, one i don't think Mourinho or Fergie could have done.

Man Utd's treble winning team (1998-1999):

Schmeichel - £500k
Irwin - £600k
Gary Neville - Youth
Stam - £10.5m ish
Ronny Johnsen - £1.5m
Giggs - Youth
Beckham - Youth
Butt - Youth
Roy Keane - £3.75m
Scholes - Youth
Andy Cole - £6m p/x
Dwight Yorke - £12.6m

Total = £35.5M

I think Sir Alex Ferguson did fairly well without spending too much.

**Peerzy** · 05-01-2006, 02:45 PM

Originally Posted by DorisInsinuate

Originally Posted by Peerzy

Lehman - £2.4M
Eboue - 300k
Senderos 900k
Toure 240k
Flamini £1.1M compensation
Ljunberg - Unsure, £4M-£6M
Gilberto - Unsure
Fabregas - £1M compensation
Reyes - £10
Henry - £9M
Van Persie - £3M

Arsenal Total - £33.94M + Gilberto (Ljunberg as £6M)

My point being that with the funds Wenger has had and the players he's had to work with he's done a fantastic job, one i don't think Mourinho or Fergie could have done.

Man Utd's treble winning team (1998-1999):

Schmeichel - £500k
Irwin - £600k
Gary Neville - Youth
Stam - £10.5m ish
Ronny Johnsen - £1.5m
Giggs - Youth
Beckham - Youth
Butt - Youth
Roy Keane - £3.75m
Scholes - Youth
Andy Cole - £6m p/x
Dwight Yorke - £12.6m

Total = £35.5M

I think Sir Alex Ferguson did fairly well without spending too much.

Fine, shit on my point

**Fromagepas** · 05-01-2006, 03:50 PM

Originally Posted by Peerzy

Originally Posted by DorisInsinuate

Man Utd's treble winning team (1998-1999):

Schmeichel - £500k
Irwin - £600k
Gary Neville - Youth
Stam - £10.5m ish
Ronny Johnsen - £1.5m
Giggs - Youth
Beckham - Youth
Butt - Youth
Roy Keane - £3.75m
Scholes - Youth
Andy Cole - £6m p/x
Dwight Yorke - £12.6m

Total = £35.5M

I think Sir Alex Ferguson did fairly well without spending too much.

Fine, shit on my point

It was well presented, if nothing else.