5,000 gallons of pure water an hour

[zapjb]

Erdlator - turns foul water into 5,000 gallons of pure water an hour

Just talked to an old friend. He served in Viet Nam. I mentioned how disgusted I am at the poor response of my US government for the victims of Katrina. He said people are dying needlessly of dehydration. I asked him to explain. He said in Viet Nam they had Erdlator(s) that are capable of purifing the nastiest water into pure water. They can be mounted easily on trucks or stationary. They purify 5,000 gallons of water an hour. Why isn't there 10-20 or more of these on the ground?

[j2k4]

Erdlator - turns foul water into 5,000 gallons of pure water an hour

Just talked to an old friend. He served in Viet Nam. I mentioned how disgusted I am at the poor response of my US government for the victims of Katrina. He said people are dying needlessly of dehydration. I asked him to explain. He said in Viet Nam they had Erdlator(s) that are capable of purifing the nastiest water into pure water. They can be mounted easily on trucks or stationary. They purify 5,000 gallons of water an hour. Why isn't there 10-20 or more of these on the ground?

Maybe the ground is too wet, and maybe the wet is too deep?

A million of the things couldn't get the water to the people.

[BigBank_Hank]

A million of the things couldn't get the water to the people.
That is the real problem.

[Everose]

Just exactly what powers these machines and where would it come from. What training does it take to run them. It is my understanding whole units were attached to these machines in Vietnam.

And if people are stranded in their attics and rooftops how would they get through the water with a machine like this to the people that really need the water?

Does it not make more sense that our government airlift in bottled water, try to rescue the people from rooftops and attics and take them to safety first, as they have been doing as quickly as humanly possible?

Household bleach would purify water enough to drink it. Why are these people not using it? Because they couldn't get to it.

I imagine these machines will be brought in. But to expect them to be brought into a disaster area like this before the waters even receded is a bit much, imo.

[zapjb]

Diesel it's easy as pie. But my government doesn't care.

Also why the f*ck don't they have an aircraft carrier in the Gulf of Mexico.With planes flying sorties 24hrs a day dropping food & water.

[HeavyMetalParkingLot]

Also why the f*ck don't they have an aircraft carrier in the Gulf of Mexico.With planes flying sorties 24hrs a day dropping food & water.

Planes dropping food and water into what? Polluted water? Yea, that makes sense...

[j2k4]

Diesel it's easy as pie. But my government doesn't care.

What in good Christ has diesel got to do with it?

Also why the f*ck don't they have an aircraft carrier in the Gulf of Mexico.With planes flying sorties 24hrs a day dropping food & water.

Yes, perhaps they could airlift one in... :dry:

[zapjb]

I can't the response here. Oh well it's just life or death :(

[HeavyMetalParkingLot]

I can't the response here. Oh well it's just life or death :(

Yea, it's easy to critize others for not doing enough while you sit back all comfy in your chair.

[BigBank_Hank]

I’m sorry if we’re not moving heaven and earth fast enough for you. We could have done it faster but our magic wand got broken.

[zapjb]

You don't know wtf I'm doing. And who tf is we? lol.

[Everose]

I can't the response here. Oh well it's just life or death :(


You are right. It is life and death. People are dying, our government is doing everything within their power to reach every last one of them. Get a friggin clue here.

[zapjb]

Nope they are dragging their feet to say the least.

[BigBank_Hank]

Well let me ask you this: what are you doing to help out? Have you donated any money, clothes food, blankets, and pillows? What exactly are you doing to help your fellow countrymen out, besides point fingers and criticize?

[SaYiaN]

Ah so far i have donated $100USD to red cross , and hopefully $500.00 more.

[lynx]

For information: Source=USAF Flight Surgeon's Guide, Ch 22. (http://wwwsam.brooks.af.mil/af/files/fsguide/HTML/Chapter_22.html)
Since the ERDLator cannot remove dissolved solids, the source must be freshwater, that is, have less than 500 ppm dissolved salts.AFAIK the water here is brackish at best, so the ERDLator is not likely to be of much use in this situation in any case.

[whypikonme]

Well let me ask you this: what are you doing to help out? Have you donated any money, clothes food, blankets, and pillows? What exactly are you doing to help your fellow countrymen out, besides point fingers and criticize?

What about you?

[JPaul]

I find it difficult to believe that the US Government is not doing everything in it's power to alleviate the situation in which it's own citizens find themselves.

I am quite sure they have experts directing the operations and if there was a better way to get water, food, medicines etc into the relevant areas then they would be using them.

Unfortunately the very factors which are causing the problems also serve to hamper the efforts of those trying to provide assistance.

My thoughts go out to the victims of this tragedy and to those who are trying to help them. I am sure they are doing their absolute best, in very difficult circumstances.

[Peerzy]

Well let me ask you this: what are you doing to help out? Have you donated any money, clothes food, blankets, and pillows? What exactly are you doing to help your fellow countrymen out, besides point fingers and criticize?


So because your born on the same land mass as someone else you're expected to stop your life and offer them things that you have worked hard from. When if anything the scale of the damage could have been toned down massive ammounts if the Government had bothered to read a report given to them in 2001?

Donations are exacly that, a donation. You shouldn't expect people to make any kinda donations, it's like a waitress getting a tip, most seem to expect it now, just because they have the job. Yet someone working in a shop doesn't get a tip. Hundreds of people die each hour in Africa from the same things the people in the effected American areas are experiencing right now. However something tells me after you get sorted you won't be giving any money to them.

[Cheese]

Donations are exacly that, a donation. You shouldn't expect people to make any kinda donations, it's like a waitress getting a tip, most seem to expect it now, just because they have the job.

I don't know if that example will work, Americans tip differently than we Brits do (in my experience).

[manker]

Donating money to those in need is a very personal thing and people should not be judged nor made to feel inferior if they do not donate to a particular charity.

It is absolutely impossible to give even a penny per month of your income to each good cause around the globe - there are simply too many of them.

I set aside a pre-determined amount of my income each month and give to various charitable bodies, this amount is not inconsiderable and I take some time reviewing each cause that I donate to.

In this case, I am not giving any money at all since I do not believe it supersedes any of the other causes I currently donate to. The people affected are part of the richest country in the world and if no-one donated a penny, sufficient finds would still be available from their government. As I understand it, funds are not the problem - getting aid to the affected is the issue here.

That is not to say I don't feel for those affected, I do and hope that the situation is alleviated soon. My thoughts are with those who have lost loved ones.

[JPaul]

I will.

[manker]

I will.But I haven't even bought your ring :o



Will what?

[zapjb]

Today on the radio I heard the mayor of New Orleans. He said the federal government is lying to the american public. That the government isn't doing enough by far.

But belief what you want. Most of you think our pres is like John Wayne. He's more like Deputy Barney Fife.

[peat moss]

Well they did get the oil flowing again , guess that was more important . :(

[JPaul]

I will.But I haven't even bought your ring :o



Will what?
Sorry, replying to an earlier post, which basically said that people would give now then stop giving.

I have a similar policy to you. I have various direct debits to specific charities which Mrs JP and I like to support. This also makes it easier for them to claim back the tax which I have already paid on the money.

To those who don't know, in the UK if you make contributions to charitable organisations they can often reclaim the tax you paid on the money when you earned it. Provided you give them your authority to do this. This can lead to substantial increases in the amounts they receive. e.g if you are paying 25p tax for every £1 you earn, then they can get that 25p back from the Government. Increasing the donation by 25% (if there are any bank clerks watching this, it's a simplified version, please feel free to elaborate)

I also make ad-hoc donations. Like manker I do not intend making a donation to this cause. I apologise if this is insensitive, but I feel the money is needed more elsewhere. Funds do not appear to be the issue, which they very much are elsewhere.

[BigBank_Hank]

Hundreds of people die each hour in Africa from the same things the people in the effected American areas are experiencing right now. However something tells me after you get sorted you won't be giving any money to them.
That damn near made me fall out of my chair. You have no idea just how much money that the federal government sends to Africa every year. Not only money but also we send food and medical supplies. You are completely clueless as to what goes on outside of your little world.

[zapjb]

Here's what the mayor of New Orleans has said.
http://www.newsday.com/news/nationworld/nation/wire/sns-ap-la-katrina-new-orleans-mayor,0,6679151,print.story?coll=sns-ap-nation-headlines

New Orleans Mayor Fumes Over Slow Reponse

By Associated Press

September 2, 2005, 8:18 AM EDT

NEW ORLEANS -- The mayor of New Orleans is seething over what he sees as the federal government's slow response to Hurricane Katrina.

Mayor Ray Nagin gave an interview to WWL Radio Thursday night and told listeners that he needs troops and hundreds of buses to get refugees out.

"They don't have a clue what's going on down there," Nagin said. "They flew down here one time two days after the doggone event was over with TV cameras, AP reporters, all kind of goddamn -- excuse my French everybody in America, but I am pissed."

Nagin accused state and federal officials of "playing games" and "spinning for the cameras." He says he keeps hearing that help is coming, but "there's no beef."

Congress is rushing through an aid package of more than $10 billion and the Pentagon is promising 1,400 National Guardsmen.
Copyright 2005 Newsday Inc.

[zapjb]

And here.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,11069-1762200,00.html

September 02, 2005

Furious mayor shouts for stricken New Orleans
By Sam Knight, Times Online


http://images.thetimes.co.uk/images/trans.gifMayor Ray C Nagin has emerged as the voice of New Orleans over the last week, first ordering the evacuation of the city in advance of Hurricane Katrina and now criticising the federal Government in a series of increasingly direct interviews.

NI_MPU('middle');Today, in an interview with CNN, Mr Nagin made his most succinct comments yet about the disaster that has plunged his city into ruin and anarchy and said: "Excuse my French everybody in America, but I am pissed."

Without pausing for thought, Mr Nagin, who was an unknown cable company executive when he ran for Mayor of New Orleans three years ago, weighed into President Bush and nearly every agency of the US federal Government.

"We authorised $8 billion to go to Iraq lickety-quick," he said. "After 9/11, we gave the President unprecedented powers lickety-quick to take care of New York and other places."

"Now, you mean to tell me that a place where most of your oil is coming through, a place that is so unique when you mention New Orleans anywhere around the world, everybody’s eyes light up -- you mean to tell me that a place where you probably have thousands of people that have died and thousands more that are dying every day, that we can’t figure out a way to authorise the resources that we need?

"Come on, man. You know, I’m not one of those drug addicts. I am thinking very clearly. And I don’t know whose problem it is. I don’t know whether it’s the governor’s problem. I don’t know whether it’s the President’s problem, but somebody need to get their ass on a plane and sit down, the two of them, and figure this out right now."

When asked what New Orleans needed now, Mr Nagin said:

"I need reinforcements, I need troops, man. I need 500 buses, man.... This is a national disaster. Get every doggone Greyhound busline in the country and get their asses moving to New Orleans. That’s -- they’re thinking small, man. And this is a major, major, major deal. And I can’t emphasise it enough, man. This is crazy."

Mr Nagin, who was voted to power in 2002 after promising to end years of cronyism and corruption in New Orleans, called on Americans to press their politicians into taking more vigorous action.

"Organise people to write letters and make calls to their congressmen, to the President, to the Governor. Flood their doggone offices with requests to do something. This is ridiculous," he said.

"I don’t want to see anybody do anymore goddamn press conferences. Put a moratorium on press conferences. Don’t do another press conference until the resources are in this city. And then come down to this city and stand with us when there are military trucks and troops that we can’t even count.

"Don’t tell me 40,000 people are coming here. They’re not here. It’s too doggone late. Now get off your asses and do something, and let’s fix the biggest goddamn crisis in the history of this country."

Mr Nagin caused a stir when he took over as Mayor of New Orleans when he threw open the records of city hall to the FBI and invited them to arrest officials for corruption. He then set about updating the city's accounts and technology and passed a range of measures and tax break attract new business to the city.

Although the murder rate in New Orleans has continued to rise under his mayoralty, Mr Nagin remains popular and with a reputation for getting things done. In one of his most celebrated initiatives, he eliminated 48,000 potholes that used to dog the city's terrible roads.

But none of that was on his mind this morning when, finally, spent, he finished his latest interview: "I’m at the point now where it don’t matter," he said. "People are dying. They don’t have homes. They don’t have jobs. The city of New Orleans will never be the same in this time."

[DanB]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/4208986.stm and here he admits it


President George Bush has conceded the initial response to Hurricane Katrina was "not acceptable" but has said every effort is being made to save lives.

Thousands of people remain stranded without food or water in New Orleans, where extra troops have been dispatched to quell lawlessness.

Fires are raging in the city after huge blasts apparently at a chemical plant.

Arriving in the area, Mr Bush said New Orleans would emerge from its "darkest days" but much work was to be done.

"My attitude is, if it's not going exactly right, we're going to make it go exactly right. If there's problems, then we'll address the problems," Mr Bush said.

The president, who is expected to go on to visit Mississippi and Louisiana - but not New Orleans itself - was briefed by emergency officials on landing in Mobile in Alabama.

He said: "The immediate priority is to save lives and get food and medicine to people so we can stabilise the situation."

Thousands are feared to have perished in the hurricane and floods, or while waiting for help.

The Senate has approved $10.5bn (£5.7bn) emergency aid, which the House of Representatives is expected to back within the next 24 hours.

But the head of the New Orleans emergency operations described the relief effort as a national disgrace.

And Mayor Ray Nagin has angrily denounced the level of outside help the city has received. "People are dying here," he said.

A large cloud of acrid, black smoke is drifting over New Orleans following Friday's blast along the Mississippi riverfront.

The incident in the already crippled city came after Louisiana's governor said 300 "battle-tested" National Guardsmen were being sent to quell the unrest.


"They have M-16s and are locked and loaded. These troops know how to shoot and kill and I expect they will," Kathleen Blanco said.

Washington pledged a further 4,200 guardsmen in coming days, and said that 3,000 army soldiers may also be sent to the city where violence has disrupted relief efforts.

The deployment came as thousands were finally taken from the Louisiana Superdome, where up to 20,000 have been corralled amid heat and squalor since Katrina struck.

The BBC's Matt Frei, in New Orleans, says conditions in the city's convention centre, where up to 20,000 more are stranded, are the most wretched he has seen anywhere, including crises in the Third World.

"You've got an entire nursing home evacuated five days ago - people in wheelchairs sitting there and slowly dying," he says.

The situation has been made worse by a lack of trust between the mainly poor, African-American population left behind in New Orleans and the predominately white police force, our correspondent adds.

Up to 60,000 people could still be stranded in the city, the US coastguard says.

Looting has swept the city as people made homeless by the flooding have grown increasingly desperate.

There have also been outbreaks of shootings and carjackings and reports of rapes.

The federal emergency agency was trying to work "under conditions of urban warfare", director Michael Brown said.

The muddy floodwaters are now toxic with fuel, battery acid, rubbish and raw sewage.

'Blame game'

Residents have expressed growing anger and frustration with the disorder on the streets and with the slow speed of relief efforts.

Governor Blanco told ABC she had "no idea" how many people had died, when asked about fatalities because of the inadequacy of the response.

"We're not into the blame game... I've been trying to save lives," she said.

The federal emergency management association has asked for patience, saying it will take time to reach people, given the magnitude of the disaster.

According to the White House, about 90,000 sq miles (234,000 sq km) has been affected by the hurricane.

[GepperRankins]

when a president says his actions are not acceptable, does that mean he resigns



anyway, lets look at the good things: more anti bush people, politically mindedness and i bet immortal technique and chuck D make something fantastical about this




oh, on-topic. can't you get water purification pills that'll work now? are they already using them?

[Rat Faced]

A million of the things couldn't get the water to the people.

Wow, the water was too deep for Helicopters and boats.. :ohmy:

However, the water purification thing wouldnt have worked, as you pointed out.

Not least due to the fact their wasnt electricity for smaller systems, and larger ones take time to build (and stable ground to build on) as well as requiring power.

I think chemicals are the last thing i'd want around the place whilst its flooded too :unsure:

[Rat Faced]

Hundreds of people die each hour in Africa from the same things the people in the effected American areas are experiencing right now. However something tells me after you get sorted you won't be giving any money to them.
That damn near made me fall out of my chair. You have no idea just how much money that the federal government sends to Africa every year. Not only money but also we send food and medical supplies. You are completely clueless as to what goes on outside of your little world.

A lot less in terms of GDP than most developed countries.

Yours = 0.2% GDP

Most = 0.5 - 0.7% GDP

But as Tesco keeps telling us: "Every Little Helps"... just dont brag about a poor record :P

[zapjb]

The water purification would work.

[Rat Faced]

So would the Helicopters..

However its a mute point, the water tankers arrived already...

[GepperRankins]

A million of the things couldn't get the water to the people.

Wow, the water was too deep for Helicopters and boats.. :ohmy:

However, the water purification thing wouldnt have worked, as you pointed out.

Not least due to the fact their wasnt electricity for smaller systems, and larger ones take time to build (and stable ground to build on) as well as requiring power.

I think chemicals are the last thing i'd want around the place whilst its flooded too :unsure:
water purifying chemicals, n00b.


the petrol/deisel thing would work too, n00b.

[Everose]

So would the Helicopters..

However its a mute point, the water tankers arrived already...

Have you actually had no news of helicopters dropping food and water....boats going in as soon as possible and rescue workers risking their own lives pulling people off roofs, out of attics, and even trees as quickly as possible? This did not just start happening today, RF. I have been watching reports of it all week.

Sixty thousand people to be evacuated out of what was at first a very unstable area. Think of it, RF.

[maebach]

What a catastrophic decade eh?

[peat moss]

So would the Helicopters..

However its a mute point, the water tankers arrived already...

Have you actually had no news of helicopters dropping food and water....boats going in as soon as possible and rescue workers risking their own lives pulling people off roofs, out of attics, and even trees as quickly as possible? This did not just start happening today, RF. I have been watching reports of it all week.

Sixty thousand people to be evacuated out of what was at first a very unstable area. Think of it, RF.


Give it up hon unless it hit them in the face or you spell it out good luck. :dry:

[zapjb]

Hey peat moss my friend. What are you saying?

[Rat Faced]

So would the Helicopters..

However its a mute point, the water tankers arrived already...

Have you actually had no news of helicopters dropping food and water....boats going in as soon as possible and rescue workers risking their own lives pulling people off roofs, out of attics, and even trees as quickly as possible? This did not just start happening today, RF. I have been watching reports of it all week.

Sixty thousand people to be evacuated out of what was at first a very unstable area. Think of it, RF.

Thats the point Everose...

1000's of people and they concentrate on stopping the looting.

Most people were concentrated in 2 areas, with 1000's stuck spread out.

Even in those 2 areas, most of the food and water that arrived, came from individuals, not the authorities.

We saw interviews with people in those areas, with kids, that had not eaten in 5 days and were drinking the water in the streets... these werent stuck in a building waiting to be rescued, they were in the stadium.

The USA has responded to disasters the other side of the world quicker than they responded to their own.

They actually started out excellent... declaring the disaster before the hurricane hit, to clear the way and ensure that the reaction was quick... what happened?

[zapjb]

I agree RF. Here's what happened imo. The people are poor so they don't count. Look at the response 911 got from the government. They moved heaven & earth to try & rescue. Here they couldn't be bothered to do even the basics (get them food & water - by air etc.) for days. Some still haven't received that. They should have commandered all the resources they needed public & private (by decree of national emergency) to help. But they didn't lift a finger for days. I'm ashamed of my government.

[tracydani]

So I guess the benefit of waiting would be all of those poor people dying. This would mean the government need not worry about rebuilding or relocating those people thereby saving the government some money that could better be spent on fighting a war in another country.

That was some pretty quick thinking on their part if you ask me.

[zapjb]

They should have been sawing through rooftops days ago. Wonder how many are dead in their attics.

[tracydani]

That would defeat the purpose of waiting. I mean after all, they were only poor people.

I had no idea why it was taking so long, but once it was pointed out that they were poor, and as others have said, mostly black, now I understand.

It's not as if waiting would come back and haunt the government or anything, so I agree, it was a calculated effort.

[GepperRankins]

I agree RF. Here's what happened imo. The people are poor so they don't count. Look at the response 911 got from the government. They moved heaven & earth to try & rescue. Here they couldn't be bothered to do even the basics (get them food & water - by air etc.) for days. Some still haven't received that. They should have commandered all the resources they needed public & private (by decree of national emergency) to help. But they didn't lift a finger for days. I'm ashamed of my government.
the twin towers was just two towers. in new orleans pretty much the whole infrastructure was destroyed. i bet out of the firemen, policemen and medics the main issue for the first couple of days was their own survival nevermind everyone else.

i'm surprised there wasn't a "little boats" reponse like dunkirk though. out of all those SUVs over the border in texas i haven't heard anything about people coming to help. i guess the stories of lawlessness might make one think twice though :unsure:

[peat moss]

I see they sent a disaster team from my home town to help . Doctors ,nurses , dogs and a 20 team of firefighters and engineers but the looters held them back. How frustrating is that.


Edit: I'd like to add they payed their own way , because of the training they would get and this is a crack team been all over the world helping . But the only way to get better as a team is to have hands on experience . :(

[maebach]

Wasn't there a bad hurricane in florida a few years ago? Nobody can blame the looter's they also must survive.

[Rat Faced]

Apparently they're only looters if they're Black..

The White ones are just trying to survive. :rolleyes:

[tracydani]

Well, you can tell they were desperately hungry..... Those people carting away tv's and such kept saying "well, we've got to eat".

Not to play down their circumstances, but I saw that on several clips and it just made me laugh :P

[GepperRankins]

i read in the metro that the cops were helping the looters and finding the best stuff.

[tracydani]

According to the news footage I saw, the cops were looking for looters, not looting. Of course they were walking through the store with a grocery cart filling it with shoes and stuff.

But I am sure that was just in case the looters they found had lost their shoes :lol:

[ferdinand]

http://www.livejournal.com/users/interdictor/ for those that havn't seen this is a pretty good reporting of whats happening. This guy works for directNIC (I think?) and is still down there doing his job.