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rolltidect
05-02-2003, 07:55 AM
First off. Let me apologize to the mods, if this topic is too racy. I'm an American. Do you want to flame us "Americans" Give it to us. Common give it to us! DO you want to debate? I'm here.

Common I want to hear it. Bring the anti American sentiment.

myfiles3000
05-02-2003, 09:10 AM
you need to get laid, cowboy.

but feel free to take issue with any of my postings from the past, which you are welcome to construe as "anti-American" to feed these SM impulses of yours.

Paul_NFFC
05-02-2003, 09:16 AM
stop creating pointless topics and stop looking for trouble you stupid yank :rolleyes:

j2k4
05-02-2003, 09:38 AM
Have you spent any time reading, yet?

While we welcome new voices (of any stripe), the American viewpoint is VERY well-defended here. ;)

As myfiles said-read the top ten threads in this section; you will find some allies, and, I fear, some enemies also. :ph34r:

Barbarossa
05-02-2003, 09:45 AM
I don't want to flame you, in fact you have my sympathies... :rolleyes:

jay973
05-02-2003, 10:15 AM
Originally posted by barbarossa@2 May 2003 - 10:45
I don't want to flame you, in fact you have my sympathies...  :rolleyes:
Me too.
Stereotyping countries is the saddest thing.

:(



Edit:Clarity



:D God Save The Queen.

N£MO
05-02-2003, 10:18 AM
Who gives a shit where you come from fool.

Wonder if this is a another member under a different name looking to start trouble.

I'm from England BTW and proud of it. :)

billyfridge
05-02-2003, 10:28 AM
Hear, Hear, Nott's Forrest, go for it.

FuNkY CaPrIcOrN
05-02-2003, 10:35 AM
:angry: Yeah....you damn yanks I will flame ya!Why in the hell can't you keep Boneless Ribeye Steak at $3.99?!I go to the store the other day and that is what it is but because it is Kentucky Derby weekend they raise the price to $7.99!Damn American Bastards!. :angry:

MagicNakor
05-02-2003, 10:46 AM
Simply because they don't have the new batch of horsemeat, FC. Just wait a few days, and it'll come back down. ;)

:ninja:

j2k4
05-02-2003, 02:33 PM
Our noobish friend will learn the vanity of 'overseriousity', yes? :lol: :lol:

*FC- I suggest a standing bid of $.49/lb. on the hoof for any horse placing outside the top ten; that should keep the grill going all summer. :D

clocker
05-02-2003, 02:51 PM
Originally posted by j2k4@2 May 2003 - 08:33


*FC- I suggest a standing bid of  $.49/lb. on the hoof for any horse placing outside the top ten; that should keep the grill going all summer. :D
I am shocked! SHOCKED!

You suggest eating My Friend Flicka?
As a more morally acceptable alternative may I recommend prairie dogs? We have billions of the little buggers out here and land developers would be very pleased to let you harvest as many as you'd like.

I hear they taste a lot like chicken... ;)

j2k4
05-02-2003, 04:43 PM
Originally posted by clocker+2 May 2003 - 09:51--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (clocker @ 2 May 2003 - 09:51)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--j2k4@2 May 2003 - 08:33


*FC- I suggest a standing bid of &#036;.49/lb. on the hoof for any horse placing outside the top ten; that should keep the grill going all summer. :D
I am shocked&#33; SHOCKED&#33;

You suggest eating My Friend Flicka?
As a more morally acceptable alternative may I recommend prairie dogs? We have billions of the little buggers out here and land developers would be very pleased to let you harvest as many as you&#39;d like.

I hear they taste a lot like chicken... ;) [/b][/quote]
If you wish to forestall the imminent equine feast, I suggest you hie yourself to Louisville, where reside the Derby and young FC&#33;*

*Bring Steaksauce and the beverage of your choice. :D

clocker
05-02-2003, 06:47 PM
Will do.

What wine goes well with horse?

j2k4
05-02-2003, 11:19 PM
Originally posted by clocker@2 May 2003 - 13:47
Will do.

What wine goes well with horse?
I dunno-something red, perhaps?

FC-any ideas (other than Colt.45)? :P

FuNkY CaPrIcOrN
05-02-2003, 11:20 PM
Originally posted by j2k4+2 May 2003 - 18:19--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (j2k4 @ 2 May 2003 - 18:19)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--clocker@2 May 2003 - 13:47
Will do.

What wine goes well with horse?
I dunno-something red, perhaps?

FC-any ideas (other than Colt.45)? :P [/b][/quote]
:huh: Ummmmmmmmm.Jim Beam or Early Times whiskey.Both made here in Louisville Kentucky. :D

j2k4
05-02-2003, 11:31 PM
Ah, yes.

Brown spirits it shall be&#33; :P

clocker
05-03-2003, 12:18 AM
Ah yes, bourbon, horsemeat and racing.

Just another typical weekend here in the chosen land.

Eat your hearts out, Brits. :P

jay973
05-03-2003, 12:23 AM
lol.Im sure hearts taste better than horsemeat&#33;
:lol: :lol:

clocker
05-03-2003, 12:30 AM
Originally posted by jay973@2 May 2003 - 18:23
lol.Im sure hearts taste better than horsemeat&#33;
:lol: :lol:
That&#39;s what the bourbon is for.

billyfridge
05-03-2003, 01:36 AM
my father fed me horse meat when i was young, tasted ok to me then, bit chewy as i recall. i recently asked him why he fed it to me, he muttered something about &#39;make you well hung&#39;, did&#39;nt work though, if it had a lot more horse meat would be eaten now. :lol:

clocker
05-03-2003, 03:10 AM
Originally posted by billyfridge@2 May 2003 - 19:36
my father fed me horse meat when i was young, tasted ok to me then, bit chewy as i recall. i recently asked him why he fed it to me, he muttered something about &#39;make you well hung&#39;, did&#39;nt work though, if it had a lot more horse meat would be eaten now. :lol:
That too is what the bourbon is for. :P

Rat Faced
05-03-2003, 05:26 PM
Originally posted by rolltidect@2 May 2003 - 07:55
First off. Let me apologize to the mods, if this topic is too racy. I&#39;m an American. Do you want to flame us "Americans" Give it to us. Common give it to us&#33; DO you want to debate? I&#39;m here.

Common I want to hear it. Bring the anti American sentiment.
I have to answer this, as ive been accused of it myself by people that dont know me

1st off, what do you mean by anti-american? Canada? Mexico? Brazil? There are 2 continents here afterall

If I take it you refer to USA, which parts am I anti? The States that your married off to your cousin at 14 or those where you cant cough without permission until your 21

You look at things too simpisticaly; The USA is a collection of 50 different cultures, so what are people anti?

They are connected by Federal Taxes, which no one in the world gives a stuff about except the US citizens paying them

They are connected by foreign policy, which people around the world do give a stuff about, but being anti government policy is not restricted to non Americans; we have a number of Americans that do this here

So please, can you explain what you mean by the term Anti American?

Thanks

RF

j2k4
05-03-2003, 07:12 PM
A noteworthy refinement of the point. :P

Rat-I know you&#39;re not Anti-U.S., you just like to be pissy on occasion :lol: as do I :lol: :lol:

Rat Faced
05-06-2003, 02:11 PM
Damn, you caught me out :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

chloe_cc2002
05-06-2003, 02:22 PM
Can anyone explain to me what American Foreign Policy is?

j2k4
05-06-2003, 02:26 PM
Originally posted by chloe_cc2002@6 May 2003 - 09:22
Can anyone explain to me what American Foreign Policy is?
Yes. :D

echidna
05-06-2003, 02:41 PM
It is to easy to pick USA cits &#39;cause they call themslves american
canadians,brazilians,bolivians,mexicans etc. do not

i think it dempnstrates what US foreign policy is
" it&#39;s all ours. (and if you think it&#39;s yours then uncle sam hasn&#39;t set you straight with the shotgun just yet)"

amrican i am not anti people of the USA i am not neccisarily anti
the USA government and the states and organisations and individuals who aid the USA government i can find no pity, empathy, sympathy or compasion for. I am anti USA not anti american :ph34r:
[i am also anti zionist isreali but not anti-semetic (palestinians and lebanese people are just as and usually more semetic than most israelis and i am definitely not anti jewish] :ph34r:

chloe_cc2002
05-06-2003, 02:42 PM
Thank you for answering :D

j2k4
05-06-2003, 04:25 PM
Originally posted by echidna@6 May 2003 - 09:41
It is to easy to pick USA cits &#39;cause they call themslves american
canadians,brazilians,bolivians,mexicans etc. do not

i think it dempnstrates what US foreign policy is
" it&#39;s all ours. (and if you think it&#39;s yours then uncle sam hasn&#39;t set you straight with the shotgun just yet)"

amrican i am not anti people of the USA i am not neccisarily anti
the USA government and the states and organisations and individuals who aid the USA government i can find no pity, empathy, sympathy or compasion for. I am anti USA not anti american :ph34r:
[i am also anti zionist isreali but not anti-semetic (palestinians and lebanese people are just as and usually more semetic than most israelis and i am definitely not anti jewish] :ph34r:
Are you at all curious as to why you are not receiving the attention you obviously seek?

Here is a hint designed to get you on track:

Instead of telling us what you hate (your &#39;anti-&#39; sentiments), tell us what YOU would do; take an IDEA, flesh it out a bit, and put some clothes on it.

You might also drop your cloak of ethnic anonymity: self-identification is not in any way a requirement here, but I fear you may find some of your rhetorical tools lacking effect should you decide to risk wading into deeper water-your angle of attack suggests you lack sufficient ballast.

echidna
05-06-2003, 05:01 PM
j2 i&#39;m not attacking i&#39;m questioning through statment, at most i am seeking to provoke.
attack is a very different posture
the discussions on this board are some of the most enlightened and insightful comments i have seen from US citizens in relation to US foreign policy. - and i have no desire to deride or inhibit that.

what would i do?
i would and i do protest loudly and often as best i can.
that is about all one can do from the outside right now.
for a start i know that an aweful lot of people in the &#39;greatest democracy on earth&#39; don&#39;t vote.
And they profess that, that is part of why the system is best or because they don&#39;t think their vote will differ the result.
this at least in part may explain how george jnr scammed in with the florida fiasco and daddies judges, and still he is &#39;the hero of the democratic world&#39; [oops i&#39;m not meaning to disparage his republican credentials - he does hold the record for lawful mass murder in texas (119 people if my memory serves)] from outside it seemed that there was little questioning of his mandate.

why does my ethnicity bear relevance here? we obviously have much in common as we are typing educated english [sans punctuation - oo a little bit of french there sorry] on active TCP/IP network connections
so i figured that non-requisite self-identification was a bit passe since i could lie and tell you that i&#39;m a Tongan Princess and that you can call me your highness or a Yakuza gun runner with seven fingers :P
so we are both educated comfortably afluent english speakers the ethnic/gender cloak is in the nature of the medium through which we meet not the method of my rhetoric [though ambiguous i am]

if i get in deep water i swim - balast is a big mistake when swimming, why would i go wading with ballast? ;)

j2k4
05-06-2003, 05:56 PM
Originally posted by echidna@6 May 2003 - 12:01
j2 i&#39;m not attacking i&#39;m questioning through statment, at most i am seeking to provoke.
attack is a very different posture
the discussions on this board are some of the most enlightened and insightful comments i have seen from US citizens in relation to US foreign policy. - and i have no desire to deride or inhibit that.

what would i do?
i would and i do protest loudly and often as best i can.
that is about all one can do from the outside right now.
for a start i know that an aweful lot of people in the &#39;greatest democracy on earth&#39; don&#39;t vote.
And they profess that, that is part of why the system is best or because they don&#39;t think their vote will differ the result.
this at least in part may explain how george jnr scammed in with the florida fiasco and daddies judges, and still he is &#39;the hero of the democratic world&#39; [oops i&#39;m not meaning to disparage his republican credentials - he does hold the record for lawful mass murder in texas (119 people if my memory serves)] from outside it seemed that there was little questioning of his mandate.

why does my ethnicity bear relevance here? we obviously have much in common as we are typing educated english [sans punctuation - oo a little bit of french there sorry] on active TCP/IP network connections
so i figured that non-requisite self-identification was a bit passe since i could lie and tell you that i&#39;m a Tongan Princess and that you can call me your highness or a Yakuza gun runner with seven fingers :P
so we are both educated comfortably afluent english speakers the ethnic/gender cloak is in the nature of the medium through which we meet not the method of my rhetoric [though ambiguous i am]

if i get in deep water i swim - balast is a big mistake when swimming, why would i go wading with ballast? ;)
Your reply begs a longer response than I can manage now as I&#39;m off shortly to work.

For now:

Most of us, for reasons other than pride, have revealed our origins (a surprising number, myself excluded, are of a somewhat "transient" origin :P )
It helps to have, as shorthand, some demographic construct to provide "general" info, i.e. the ability to infer a probable level of awareness as regards relevant subjects.

Ballast, as I intended it, is for purposes of mitigating or attenuating the bias which we ALL have to whatever extent.

I will try to revisit late tonight.

Yakuza gun-runner, huh? Hmmmm.... ;)

j2k4
05-07-2003, 04:40 AM
Originally posted by echidna@6 May 2003 - 12:01
j2 i&#39;m not attacking i&#39;m questioning through statment, at most i am seeking to provoke.
attack is a very different posture
the discussions on this board are some of the most enlightened and insightful comments i have seen from US citizens in relation to US foreign policy. - and i have no desire to deride or inhibit that.

what would i do?
i would and i do protest loudly and often as best i can.
that is about all one can do from the outside right now.
for a start i know that an aweful lot of people in the &#39;greatest democracy on earth&#39; don&#39;t vote.
And they profess that, that is part of why the system is best or because they don&#39;t think their vote will differ the result.
this at least in part may explain how george jnr scammed in with the florida fiasco and daddies judges, and still he is &#39;the hero of the democratic world&#39; [oops i&#39;m not meaning to disparage his republican credentials - he does hold the record for lawful mass murder in texas (119 people if my memory serves)] from outside it seemed that there was little questioning of his mandate.

why does my ethnicity bear relevance here? we obviously have much in common as we are typing educated english [sans punctuation - oo a little bit of french there sorry] on active TCP/IP network connections
so i figured that non-requisite self-identification was a bit passe since i could lie and tell you that i&#39;m a Tongan Princess and that you can call me your highness or a Yakuza gun runner with seven fingers :P
so we are both educated comfortably afluent english speakers the ethnic/gender cloak is in the nature of the medium through which we meet not the method of my rhetoric [though ambiguous i am]

if i get in deep water i swim - balast is a big mistake when swimming, why would i go wading with ballast? ;)
Okay-
Sorry to re-quote, but........

The tone of your last post seems a bit different, somehow.

First of all, why provoke? It usually only leads to exhibitions of this forum at it&#39;s worst.
If you seek a reasoned and reasonable discourse, post that way.

We are in total agreement as to voter apathy; those who complain the loudest usually vote the least, if at all.

If we could only extend that apathy to include the ignorant, we might find we have another alternative. :D

As regards events in Florida in 2000 (I will recount this AGAIN, for perhaps the tenth time in this forum):

1) Dubya WON the election on the pure vote count-perhaps you, like many others who are genetically anti-Bush, aren&#39;t aware that the &#39;count&#39; DID go on, but with no legal bearing. It was completed (and informally "certified") by a team of Liberal/ Democrat operatives about 8 months after the fact; they concluded (albeit on page "20" in most newspapers; I read it in probably 5 big-city papers, also in USA Today), that Bush even extended his lead, and after counting the absentee/military vote, extended his lead even further. This is FACT.

2) If you read any account of the actual legal proceedings, you would realize the Federal Supreme Court did not &#39;give&#39; the election to Bush-they merely disallowed the Florida Court&#39;s overstep.

3) Who did Dubya &#39;murder&#39;? You take great rhetorical liberties here-lawful execution=mass murder? Come now....
Texas is a historically conservative state; the death penalty was there before Dubya and is still there today-are you suggesting he has some proprietary claim to executions carried out while he was in office there?
That he is somehow deficient for not posturing as an anti-death penalty activist? Did you apply this same standard to that other mass-murderer, Bill Clinton?

Frankly, it really doesn&#39;t matter where you&#39;re from, so let me say to your regal Tongan Princess/seven-fingered Yakuza gun-running highness: You may be an educated, comfortable, affluent English-speaker, but, rest assured, you are, without any doubt whatsoever, WRONG. ;)

echidna
05-07-2003, 09:08 AM
If you are permitted under your law to take lives then you are not a mass murderer
is that what you mean j2k4?

if it is perfectly OK for bush and clinton to take lives under their legal systems
- then ipso facto
excecutions on behalf of saddam are just as valid to his supporters

you can&#39;t change the fact that USA is the only english speaking nation on earth still using the death penalty
and that you [as you reiterate] elected a champion death penaliser [more under shrubby than any previous govenor off Texas]

killing someone is murder
for a refresher try reading Exodus 20 "Thou shalt not kill." i learned it before i started school
i had heard that the USA was "one nation under God" and since this is from the old testament it counts for jews and christians
there seems to be a seam of hypocracy running to the core of the US psyche
topically for instance, why is it just fine for the USA to hold the largest stockpiles of &#39;weapons of mass destruction&#39; in the world while you invade foreign a state to &#39;stop them aquiring or using "WMD"&#39;
as the only nation on earth to actually use nuclear weapons isn&#39;t it a bit fresh to get upset about others wanting the same thing
[i&#39;m definitely not advocating that everyone ought have an atomic - but N Korea doesn&#39;t seem likely to be attacked by th US anymore]
it is because the statemments of so many from the USA don&#39;t make logical sence or seem hypocritical that i wanna provoke some responses that do.
[that isn&#39;t a dig at anyone specific - as i have said before the reason i persist is that the members of this board are able to cause me to think and not just want to leave or flame like at most boards - and diverse opinions are the true reason for democracy rather than majoritory agreement]
j2k4 you think i&#39;m wrong i think you&#39;re a hypocrit [in a nation of them], touche&#33; :P

MagicNakor
05-07-2003, 11:40 AM
If I was going to be anal, I&#39;d point out that "Thou shalt not kill" has been erroneously translated from the original Hebrew for "Thou shalt not murder."

But I&#39;m not going to be.

:ninja:

j2k4
05-07-2003, 02:10 PM
Originally posted by echidna@7 May 2003 - 04:08
If you are permitted under your law to take lives then you are not a mass murderer
is that what you mean j2k4?

if it is perfectly OK for bush and clinton to take lives under their legal systems
- then ipso facto
excecutions on behalf of saddam are just as valid to his supporters

you can&#39;t change the fact that USA is the only english speaking nation on earth still using the death penalty
and that you [as you reiterate] elected a champion death penaliser [more under shrubby than any previous govenor off Texas]

killing someone is murder
for a refresher try reading Exodus 20 "Thou shalt not kill." i learned it before i started school
i had heard that the USA was "one nation under God" and since this is from the old testament it counts for jews and christians
there seems to be a seam of hypocracy running to the core of the US psyche
topically for instance, why is it just fine for the USA to hold the largest stockpiles of &#39;weapons of mass destruction&#39; in the world while you invade foreign a state to &#39;stop them aquiring or using "WMD"&#39;
as the only nation on earth to actually use nuclear weapons isn&#39;t it a bit fresh to get upset about others wanting the same thing
[i&#39;m definitely not advocating that everyone ought have an atomic - but N Korea doesn&#39;t seem likely to be attacked by th US anymore]
it is because the statemments of so many from the USA don&#39;t make logical sence or seem hypocritical that i wanna provoke some responses that do.
[that isn&#39;t a dig at anyone specific - as i have said before the reason i persist is that the members of this board are able to cause me to think and not just want to leave or flame like at most boards - and diverse opinions are the true reason for democracy rather than majoritory agreement]
j2k4 you think i&#39;m wrong i think you&#39;re a hypocrit [in a nation of them], touche&#33; :P
You are not steeped in the old testament, then.

A society and it&#39;s laws are usually (the U.S. is no exception) an amalgam of the variety of influences which bear upon it; as the U.S. is indeed a "melting pot", I&#39;m sure you can appreciate why certain inconsistencies exist.
To compare Bush (or Clinton, for that matter) to Saddam is a refusal to split the same hairs you use to denigrate our system and charge hypocrisy.
This is true intellectual laziness on your part-if you aren&#39;t inclined to differentiate the cases, don&#39;t try to debate the point.

Saddam has murdered with his bare hands. Bush and Clinton governed states where legally (read: societally) sanctioned executions took place.
If you condemn Bush and Clinton, you likewise condemn the American people, which (guess what?) makes you anti-American. ;)

What have the death-penalty and english speech got to do with each other or anything else? Are you suggesting english speech equates to enlightenment, just not in the U.S.? That supposition SHOULD be offensive in many corners of the world; I would look both ways when expressing similar sentiments, if I were you.

"One Nation, under God...." was coined when there was, for the purposes
it was originally written, only &#39;one God&#39; to consider.
Just for you, I will petition the powers that be to amend the document to include Allah, and all other extant references to a "Supreme Being".

As regards nukes and other WMD, THAT cat got out of the bag many, many years ago (and if you&#39;ve noticed, beginning with the old USSR, there were many more "catbags" than just ours). If you can&#39;t, or won&#39;t, understand what &#39;containment&#39; means, I haven&#39;t the time or inclination to explain it to you.

If you choose thus to charge ME with hypocrisy, I must say to you, "welcome to the real world". There is no pie in my sky.

echidna
05-07-2003, 03:50 PM
i&#39;m just wanting to point out that under US law clinton and bush aren&#39;t &#39;murderers&#39; and that under saddams law he wasn&#39;t either
i don&#39;t think either are right and i only used the commandment quote to indicate that most US citizens would have been taught that killing/murder is wrong, also speaking english provides no enlightenment whatsoever, it does allow for a huge amount of diverse cross cultural reading which many languages don&#39;t

there were a lot more than one deity worshiped in north america when the &#39;one nation&#39; thing was being written
the USA was just at war with the people who worshiped them or had infected them with small pox or flu

and please get it straight the USA is not america no matter how much it would like to be
buy a map, there are 2 continents in the americas and 21 nations
i am not even anti-USA people some of them are my friends and many of them i respect greatly
i am deeply oposed to the US regime. [it is much like the US refrain that it is the regime not the Iraqi people who are the enemy] and i hope no-one would hold me responsible for the acts of the government here so in kind i don&#39;t hold you responsible [unless you voted for bush]

:: BEWARE :: EXTREME SARCASM IN THE NEXT TEXT BLOCK ::

oh and containment worked so well didn&#39;t it
it&#39;s such a safer word since the end of the cold war
especially for NYC and DC office workers

one day you might find the &#39;real world&#39; but i doubt you&#39;d like it

thanx MagicNakor i didn&#39;t know that
but what is the difference [if you know] between the hebrew definitions for murder and killing?
they sit quite close in my mind, i suppose that &#39;killing&#39; can apply to the taking of life from any species whereas &#39;murder&#39; usually means people killing people
[which would negate &#39;the smiths&#39; &#39;meat is murder&#39; unless you&#39;re a cannibal]

ilw
05-07-2003, 04:00 PM
Just like to say something I heard which i thought was a little bit amusing and that is America wouldn&#39;t be allowed into the European Union (if they ever wished to do so) because of human rights abuses. (eg death penalty, some immigration law and Camp X-Ray prisoners)

j2k4
05-07-2003, 04:13 PM
Echidna-

That was a commendable exercise in what is termed in some parts hereabout as the "Hokey Pokey".

The only response I feel obliged to make:
The death penalty was enacted via public referendum; Saddam was law unto himself.
If you fail to note the difference, I surely cannot sway you.

By the way, my PC sits on top of a map of the world (I have a LARGE desk); I know my way around the western hemisphere very well.
While we are as American as the people of, say, Chile, should we be precluded from referring to ourselves as such because we are also the &#39;United States of..."?

echidna
05-07-2003, 04:42 PM
all i mean is i have nothing against the regimes in uruguay or bolivia so saying i am anti-american is incorrect
and all the canadians i have ever met always say that they are canadian, i&#39;ve even seen some of them get upset when they&#39;re called american [which as you point out they are] same for my friends from chile, brazil, and argentina [respectively chilean, brazilian and argentinian pedantic as this might be]

i do note many myriad differences between the USA and Iraq
but laws are effected by the people living under them
and as such they are diffinitively different from on state to another
i mean if you&#39;re going to throw stones at someone you should at least attempt to try on their shoes and look at the world from their perspective - this is usually very difficult with someone you&#39;re aiming a stone at because it necesitates finding fault in yourself
in the case of the USA i think it is far more important for you to try to understand the perspective of the other because your throwing a lot more than stones these days daddio

(if we&#39;re doing the hokey-pokey aren&#39;t we meant to put hands, feet etc. in and out and then turn around and shake about, so it might just be inappropriate to sway me during this dance, maybe you can sway me during a slow waltz later on :D )
PS i&#39;m feeling a bit jealous of your desk my map&#39;s all the way over there on the wall

j2k4
05-07-2003, 04:55 PM
Originally posted by echidna@7 May 2003 - 11:42
all i mean is i have nothing against the regimes in uruguay or bolivia so saying i am anti-american is incorrect
and all the canadians i have ever met always say that they are canadian, i&#39;ve even seen some of them get upset when they&#39;re called american [which as you point out they are] same for my friends from chile, brazil, and argentina [respectively chilean, brazilian and argentinian pedantic as this might be]

i do note many myriad differences between the USA and Iraq
but laws are effected by the people living under them
and as such they are diffinitively different from on state to another
i mean if you&#39;re going to throw stones at someone you should at least attempt to try on their shoes and look at the world from their perspective - this is usually very difficult with someone you&#39;re aiming a stone at because it necesitates finding fault in yourself
in the case of the USA i think it is far more important for you to try to understand the perspective of the other because your throwing a lot more than stones these days daddio

(if we&#39;re doing the hokey-pokey aren&#39;t we meant to put hands, feet etc. in and out and then turn around and shake about, so it might just be inappropriate to sway me during this dance, maybe you can sway me during a slow waltz later on :D )
PS i&#39;m feeling a bit jealous of your desk my map&#39;s all the way over there on the wall
Alright-

I&#39;m well aware of the faults you mention; that doesn&#39;t change anything.

Wanna try my shoes on? They&#39;re made in the USA. :P

I used to dance ALOT.

I only sway occasionally these days, and often need help when I do.

Are you gonna give up your locale or not? I swear, I&#39;ll leave my targeting software disabled.

Trust me. :lol:

echidna
05-07-2003, 05:28 PM
my favorite shoes are made in the USA too
Merrell (http://www.merrellboot.com/) shoes rock :D
i don&#39;t dance enough anymore either :(
i&#39;d love to learn how to track IP locations if you know how though :ph34r:

MagicNakor
05-08-2003, 06:17 AM
Originally posted by echidna@7 May 2003 - 16:50
thanx MagicNakor i didn&#39;t know that
but what is the difference [if you know] between the hebrew definitions for murder and killing?
they sit quite close in my mind, i suppose that &#39;killing&#39; can apply to the taking of life from any species whereas &#39;murder&#39; usually means people killing people
[which would negate &#39;the smiths&#39; &#39;meat is murder&#39; unless you&#39;re a cannibal]
I just mentioned it was erroneously translated because I wasn&#39;t in the best of moods last night. ;) Some of the more militant vegetarians like to dredge that one up and apply it to animals, when it says nothing about killing, but the murder of another human being.

However, if you&#39;re going to use the Old Testament to back up your point, you ought to be well aware that the "death penalty" is encouraged in it "...life for life, eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand..." (Ex. 21:23, 24), "Whoever sheds man’s blood, by man his blood shall be shed." (Genesis 9:6), and so on. This law is known as lex talionis, or the law of retribution. Similar to letting the punishment fit the crime. The code Hammurabi (which is now lost, probably destroyed :angry: :angry: ) was the first to demand physical injury for physical injury. Before it was written, monetary compensation was accepted.

Not to mention the "death penalty" was supported for rapists, sodomy, incontinence, perjury, kidnapping, fornication, witchcraft, for striking or cursing father or mother, disobedience to parents, theft, blasphemy, sabbath desecration, propagating false doctrines, refusing to abide by the decision of court, and homosexuality. ;)

:ninja:

Edit: typo

FuNkY CaPrIcOrN
05-08-2003, 06:35 AM
:D I would just like to say that Chicken is on sell this week. :D

MagicNakor
05-08-2003, 06:46 AM
All I ever eat is chicken. Why can&#39;t steak go on sale? :(

:ninja:

Barbarossa
05-08-2003, 09:04 AM
Originally posted by MagicNakor@8 May 2003 - 06:17

Not to mention the "death penalty" is supported for rapists, sodomy, incontinence,
You can get executed for wetting your pants now? Holy cow&#33; :o

MagicNakor
05-08-2003, 09:27 AM
Well, that was a typo, I think I&#39;ll change that to was. ;) It made sense with the sentence I had beforehand, but then I deleted it.

Incontinence isn&#39;t just wetting your pants. :D It&#39;s unrestrained emotion, or, and yes it got it&#39;s own topic: lacking sexual restraint; unchaste.

:ninja:

j2k4
05-08-2003, 02:21 PM
So then, to sum up:

Cats are indeed prescient, the favorite never wins the Derby, the East is doomed (in the N.B.A., anyway), AND chicken is on sale somewhere in Louisville? :P

Bender
05-08-2003, 02:48 PM
Originally posted by j2k4@8 May 2003 - 16:21
So then, to sum up:

Cats are indeed prescient, the favorite never wins the Derby, the East is doomed (in the N.B.A., anyway), AND chicken is on sale somewhere in Louisville? :P
... and that the Euro&#39;s are against anything, AND that the French wil resist - from London? :lol:

j2k4
05-08-2003, 02:53 PM
Originally posted by Bender+8 May 2003 - 09:48--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Bender @ 8 May 2003 - 09:48)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--j2k4@8 May 2003 - 16:21
So then, to sum up:

Cats are indeed prescient, the favorite never wins the Derby, the East is doomed (in the N.B.A., anyway), AND chicken is on sale somewhere in Louisville? :P
... and that the Euro&#39;s are against anything, AND that the French wil resist - from London? :lol: [/b][/quote]
Ummm-yes...that, too. :D

hobbes
05-08-2003, 07:28 PM
Why do we call ourselves Americans?

"United States of America" is a description of a relationship and a vague locale. At the time it was coined, it was probably a sufficient description. New World (the Americas)vs Old World (Europe).

So the issue is NOT, why do we call ourselves Americans, but rather, why have we not named our country&#33;


It&#39;s so simple, it&#39;s not about attitude or swagger, but simply that "I&#39;m a United Stateser of America" sounds absolutely ridiculous. I&#39;m not saying it, no way.

If you want to make this an issue, then each and everytime someone calls themselves "American", just respond with, "Yeah, but where?, Greenland or Argentina?"

Eventually we will get so sick of clarifying this that we will finally name our country. As it is now, since we are the only country containing the continent name, "American" functions quite nicely.






(Moved from other thread)
As an aside,(I think from your other thread) you quoted the Bible in discussing the "wrongness" of the death penalty. Yeah, well God should learn to lead by example. Remember the time he DESTROYED everyone on the planet, except Noah and his homies?

Why, we misbehaved and broke his law? Hmmmm .

Do what I say, not what I do, that is a poor motivational tool.


Anyway, the United States emphasises the separation of the church and states and; therfore, we are not bound by the Bible in the creation of our laws. Any references to God on coins and in anthems are historic appendages which have not been severed. There is a certain Christian religious core in this country to whom politicians cater and it would be politcal suicide to be the "guy in favor of removing God from coins". (Hey, that should have been part of that SNL skit, "Bad Idea" jeans).

j2k4
05-08-2003, 10:26 PM
Hobbes-

You raise an excellent point.

Let&#39;s name this sucker.

How about the "United States of Testosterone"?

The "United States of Really Effective Ordnance"?

The "United States of Dubya"?

The "United States of Wildly Variant Public Opinion"?

The "United States Which are Located Latitudinally Between Canada and Mexico"?

:P :D :lol: :)

hobbes
05-08-2003, 11:07 PM
Originally posted by j2k4@8 May 2003 - 23:26
Hobbes-

You raise an excellent point.

Let&#39;s name this sucker.

How about the "United States of Testosterone"?

The "United States of Really Effective Ordinance"?

The "United States of Dubya"?

The "United States of Wildly Variant Public Opinion"?

The "United States Which are Located Latitudinally Between Canada and Mexico"?

:P&nbsp; :D&nbsp; :lol:&nbsp; :)
Would I appear

egocentric if I submitted:

1) Hobbesknobbesistan
2) Hobbesadonia


or biased by suggesting:

3) StLouisCardinalstan
4) Gatewaytowestadonia


or gratingly truthful by proposing

5) Trailerparktrashistan
6) JerrySpringerdonia

They all roll of the tongue very nicely and my chest wells with pride as I recite them all, like some sort of mantra.

j2k4
05-08-2003, 11:13 PM
Originally posted by hobbes+8 May 2003 - 18:07--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (hobbes @ 8 May 2003 - 18:07)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--j2k4@8 May 2003 - 23:26
Hobbes-

You raise an excellent point.

Let&#39;s name this sucker.

How about the "United States of Testosterone"?

The "United States of Really Effective Ordinance"?

The "United States of Dubya"?

The "United States of Wildly Variant Public Opinion"?

The "United States Which are Located Latitudinally Between Canada and Mexico"?

:P :D :lol: :)
Would I appear

egocentric if I submitted:

1) Hobbesknobbesistan
2) Hobbesadonia


or biased by suggesting:

3) StLouisCardinalstan
4) Gatewaytowestadonia


or gratingly truthful by proposing

5) Trailerparktrashistan
6) JerrySpringerdonia

They all roll of the tongue very nicely and my chest wells with pride as I recite them all, like some sort of mantra. [/b][/quote]
WE NEED HELP HERE&#33;&#33;&#33;&#33;
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Rat Faced
05-08-2003, 11:33 PM
But is the USA a country?

Or a Federation?


And, if the USA is a country...what about the parts that arent States?

Has the USA got &#39;colonies&#39;??

Such as American Somalia, Guam, US Virgin Isles......... :rolleyes:


EDIT: Those 3 places are from memory, and im getting old.... I&#39;ll look up the places i mean if they&#39;re wrong. (Or just look on the US Customs Website :lol: :lol: )

100%
05-09-2003, 12:14 AM
I was in NY

Before 911
The americans i met ruled the world and could do everything

I was in NY after 911
The americans i met where paranoid and careful

The pakistani taxi drivers where the same.

clocker
05-09-2003, 01:26 AM
I think we should rename ourselves The world.

"Oh me? Why I&#39;m a citizen of the World&#33;"

We already own everything, don&#39;t we?

echidna
05-09-2003, 06:08 AM
Originally posted by hobbes@9 May 2003 - 05:28
Anyway, the United States emphasises the separation of the church and states and; therfore, we are not bound by the Bible in the creation of our laws. Any references to God on coins and in anthems are historic appendages which have not been severed. There is a certain Christian religious core in this country to whom politicians cater and it would be politcal suicide to be the "guy in favor of removing God from coins". (Hey, that should have been part of that SNL skit, "Bad Idea" jeans).
@hobbes ::
check i&#39;m pretty sure you&#39;ll find &#39;in god we trust&#39; started being printed after the 1929 crash
PS. i like to try to ask United Staters[sic] if they&#39;re canadian &#39;are you from toronto?&#39;

@everyone ::
thanx :P :lol: :D this is the most constructive thoughts on the issue i&#39;ve heard for umm.. ever :lol: :lol: :lol:

i have heard strange things about the federation and state independence, being able to have state troopers [militias] so maybe you could all be like &#39;Illinoisonians&#39; and &#39;Connecticuticutions&#39;
US media is so saturating that you could get away with it
and it would tell us way more about where you&#39;re from.
i mean you&#39;re unlikely to hear;

protagonist 0.0 - &#39;what&#39;s that accent?&#39;
protagonist 0.1 - "european"

i mean &#39;i hate illinois nazis&#39; and i haven&#39;t even met one ;)

quite off topic [but look where we are] i&#39;ve heard a couple of times that US dollars aren&#39;t the property of the state ie. the Fed is a coalition of private bankers from back in the day :blink:
i understand this to be unique and don&#39;t fully understand the consequeces of the world economy running on private bank notes
but if anyone knows more please tell ;)

Ed.typo - i&#39;m no editor

soopaman
05-09-2003, 08:00 AM
Originally posted by j2k4@8 May 2003 - 23:26
Hobbes-

You raise an excellent point.

Let&#39;s name this sucker.

How about the "United States of Testosterone"?

The "United States of Really Effective Ordinance"?

The "United States of Dubya"?

The "United States of Wildly Variant Public Opinion"?

The "United States Which are Located Latitudinally Between Canada and Mexico"?

:P :D :lol: :)


What about:

New Britain

South Canada

North Mexico

Friendlyfiretonia

Vespuccia ( Why not use his surname instead of his christian name?)

Kaq


:lol: :P :lol:

Barbarossa
05-09-2003, 11:29 AM
When people talk about "Americans" they usually mean someone from the USA. Otherwise they would say, "Canadians", or "Mexicans", or "Brazilians", etc.

Likewise, someone from Canada will say they are Canadian, someone from Mexico will say they are Mexican, someone from Brazil will say they are Brazilian, and someone from the USA will say they are American. (Unless they&#39;re from Texas, who are of course Texan)

We&#39;ve got the same sort of thing in the UK (Another badly named "country"). Quite often people from England will say their nationality is British, however people from Wales will say their nationality is Welsh, and people from Scotland will say their nationality is Scottish.

Americans of course call everyone in the UK "English", which is clearly wrong. That&#39;s just the language we "share" (kind of.. I was in favour of renting it out to you, but by now you&#39;d have lost your deposit anyway, too much damage incurred)


:P

echidna
05-09-2003, 12:42 PM
Quite often people from England will say their nationality is British, however people from Wales will say their nationality is Welsh, and people from Scotland will say their nationality is Scottish.

that&#39;s because the irish, scotish and welsh are distinctly different cultures which have been asymilated by the british under force of arms
the languages were banned along with the cultures and nationalism, since its in the medium past the cultural identification is strong
the liberalisation of english attitudes about the threat of the welsh and scots and the establishment of the Rep. of I [and all that that entails] gives good reason for many people differentiating
i have a friend who is &#39;cornish&#39; and she gets very upset if you mistake her for english and i&#39;m sure most people in england would have thought that cornwall was in england

Barbarossa
05-09-2003, 01:54 PM
Originally posted by echidna@9 May 2003 - 12:42
i have a friend who is &#39;cornish&#39; and she gets very upset if you mistake her for english and i&#39;m sure most people in england would have thought that cornwall was in england
Cornwall is in England. Check any map. Your friend needs to chill out a bit.. ;)

j2k4
05-09-2003, 06:32 PM
Originally posted by barbarossa+9 May 2003 - 08:54--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (barbarossa @ 9 May 2003 - 08:54)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--echidna@9 May 2003 - 12:42
i have a friend who is 'cornish' and she gets very upset if you mistake her for english and i'm sure most people in england would have thought that cornwall was in england
Cornwall is in England. Check any map. Your friend needs to chill out a bit.. ;) [/b][/quote]
echidna's friend is a game hen, so her pique is understandable. :lol:

This thread has developed a distinctly nomadic flavor. :huh:

I am off to purchase the requisite portable living quarters (A tent). B)

Rat Faced
05-09-2003, 07:34 PM
Originally posted by barbarossa+9 May 2003 - 13:54--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (barbarossa @ 9 May 2003 - 13:54)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--echidna@9 May 2003 - 12:42
i have a friend who is 'cornish' and she gets very upset if you mistake her for english and i'm sure most people in england would have thought that cornwall was in england
Cornwall is in England. Check any map. Your friend needs to chill out a bit.. ;) [/b][/quote]
I agree with her, she's not...Cornwall even has its own 'official' language.

Im from Newcastle and I dont class myself as 'English'............dont think there is any 'Angle' blood in me, I have much more in common with the Scots than the English, and Im not a Scot either (although Im North of Hadrians Wall, so the Romans would have called me that)

Just because the 'map' says it doesnt mean its so..afterall the 'English' (Ordnance Survey) print the maps of Britain...ask any Basque in Spain if he's Spanish.


that's because the irish, scotish and welsh are distinctly different cultures which have been asymilated by the british under force of arms

I beg to differ....The English subjugated the rest of Britain......the peoples in Britain are all British as they live in the British Isles.

The Languages were never banned, however everyone had to be able to speak English (even if only a second language)...in fact Welsh and Scottish Gaelic is still going strong today (especially Welsh).

There are 7 'official' languages in the UK, and always have been, since the Normans.



Edit: The English did make wearing a Kilt illegal at one point....does that count?