Problem setting up simple network.

[digmen1]

HI Guys

I am try to set up a simple home network.

I have

2 PCs - fairly powerful
Windows XP on each
A Netcomm Gigabit Ethernet adaptor in each
A Cat 5 cable connect to each card green light is on on both.

My level of computer knowlege - intermediate

My level of network knowledge - complete beginner, have got some going years ago with Windows 3.11 but more by sheer luck.

I went through the setup wizard on both machines (not really knowing what I was doing)

Rebooted but

One machine - my main one does not have Network Neigbourhood showing on the Startup Menu

The other one - my workstation does have the Network Neighboughood showing and on this machine I can see the name of the network and the name of the two computers.

My problem/queries are

Do I have to go through the wizard again on the main machine ?
Do I need a cross over cable rather than Cat 5 cable ? (is there such a thing ?)
Do I need a hub or switch ?

I do have a Dynalink ADSL2+ router which I am using for my internet connection on the main machine (I can still access the net)

Why are local area networks and internet connections spoken of in the same breath and why does Windows XP treat them as very similar. To my old fashioned mind they are seperate things.

Thanks

Any help would be appreciated.

Regards

Digby

[Virtualbody1234]

What model router do you have. Does it have multiple ports?

If so then you should connect both PCs to it using Cat5 cable (not crossover).

Make sure both computers use the same workgroup name.

If you have software firewall(s) installed then be sure to permit communication or disable the firewall(s).

Run the wizard on both computers.

The My Network Places icon should then show and any shared folders that you specify will be in there.

[lynx]

There can't be too much wrong with the network if you can see both computers on the system with Network Neigbourhood (or My Network Places as it is now called) visible. I suspect it is simply a case of forcing the other system to display My Network Places.

I'll assume you are not using the classic start menu.

Right click on the task bar and select properties.
Select the Start Menu tab and click on Customize.
Select the Advanced tab, Scroll down to My Network Places and make sure it is checked.
Select OK.
Select OK again.

I can't remember how to do that on the classic start menu. If that's what you are using it is probably best to switch to the XP style start menu, make the change as described above, then switch back.

[digmen1]

There can't be too much wrong with the network if you can see both computers on the system with Network Neigbourhood (or My Network Places as it is now called) visible. I suspect it is simply a case of forcing the other system to display My Network Places.

I'll assume you are not using the classic start menu.

Right click on the task bar and select properties.
Select the Start Menu tab and click on Customize.
Select the Advanced tab, Scroll down to My Network Places and make sure it is checked.
Select OK.
Select OK again.

I can't remember how to do that on the classic start menu. If that's what you are using it is probably best to switch to the XP style start menu, make the change as described above, then switch back.

Thanks Lynx

I got the My Network Places going again thanks. I think I disabled it last year to keep my menu tidy. (you are so intuitive)

But the window comes up empty

[digmen1]

What model router do you have. Does it have multiple ports?

If so then you should connect both PCs to it using Cat5 cable (not crossover).

Make sure both computers use the same workgroup name.

If you have software firewall(s) installed then be sure to permit communication or disable the firewall(s).

Run the wizard on both computers.

The My Network Places icon should then show and any shared folders that you specify will be in there.

Thanks Virtual Body

I have a Dynalink ASDL+2 router.
I dont think it has multiple ports, it just has a DSL plug (in use), a USB plug (not in use) and an ethernet plug (in use).

I have got a Cat 5 cable (it is connected to the network card in each computer)

Is there such a thing as crossover cable ? should I have bought one of these?

I am certain I gave each computer the same workgroup name

I use Zonealarm, but I have turned it off for now.

I run the wizard on both computers. In fact I have run the wizard on the main machine 3 times now and the worksation only once.

As I say on the workstation it mentions both machines names so they must be connected or it would not know the main machine's name !

The only other think I can think of is that when you run the wizard at the end it says you must run it on the other machine and gives you 4 options. It sort of says that you must insert the XP CD into the next machine. Is this really the case ? as I have XP on both machines already.

Thanks for your help. I must be nearly there.

But still can't get it going.

Regards
Digby

[digmen1]

Hi Lynx and Virtual Body

I notice you guys are very active on this forum and often help me on my threads. Thank you very much. You must both be on this forum full time. Do you have day jobs ? or is this it !

I thought I would let you know some of the settings on my Main Machine (the one which does not show anything in My Network Places.)

As I say if I click on My Network Places the window comes up but it is empty.

If I then click on one of the network tasks eg View Work group Computers nothing happens and the machine beeps.

If I click on View Network Connections I get 3 icons come up

1 My old dial up icon
2 Local Area Connection
greyed Connected, Shared, Firewalled
3 Local rea Connection 2
greyed Connected, Firewalled
Netcomm Gigabit Ethernet Adaptor

note one of the connections is shared, the other is not.

As I say I have shut Zonelarm down till I get this sorted.

Also I have two network connections running in my system tray - should this be ?

Perhaps I need to run the Network wizard again chosing different options ?

Thanks

regards

Digby

[Virtualbody1234]

I was asking for a model number.

Is this the one?

RTA1320

http://www.dynalink.com.au/modemsadsl_cur.htm?prod=RTA1320

Or like this one?

RTA1335

http://www.dynalink.com.au/modemsadsl_cur.htm?prod=RTA1335

[digmen1]

Hi

Its a RTA1320

Regards

Digby

[chip19]

You have an ADSL modem. That converts the DSL feed into either USB or ethernet (likely not both) and can connect to one computer. I don't think there is any way to connect two computers to a standard DSL modem. The only way I can think of other than using an addition switch would be to have two network interface cards in the main PC and connect one to the modem and one of the other computer. You should then be able to share the connection on the second NIC and the second computer would both get on the internet and see the first computer in Network Neighborhood.

The easy thing would just be to get a switch or a hub. There are really simple switches that don't even require configuration. You just plug one end into your modem and two cables going to your computers in the other end.

[lynx]

If your system shows two network connections then you must have two ports.

But if you've got a router then both PCs should be connected to the router, there's no need for them to be connected in any other way and you don't need either connection to be shared, and you don't need either pc to be sharing the other PCs internet connection.

My syggestion is that each PC should be connected to the router, and any other ethernet ports should be disconnected and disabled. It will save confusion if you need to look at it later.

Run the wizard again and tell both machines that they are connected to the internet through a home gateway. Don't tell either of them that another computer shares the connection. Running the wizard may enable the unused ports so you will have to disable them again.

The reason why Microsoft seems to confuse Internet connection and Home networking is that when they are connected as I've suggested both functions are performed over the same port, and it is also the more usual method.

Home networking will use the router as a switch, but data will not be visible on the internet. Internet onnections will pass through the router to the internet. The router will take care of which goes where based on the destination.

In my job as a freelance sysadmin I see these sort of problems all the time, it is simply experience rather than being intuitive.

[Virtualbody1234]

My syggestion is that each PC should be connected to the router, and any other ethernet ports should be disconnected and disabled. It will save confusion if you need to look at it later.



That's what I said at the beginning of this thread.

The only problem is that there isn't more than one port on the router.

Adding a hub would solve that.

[digmen1]

Hi Guys

I finally did the right thing and bought a switch (as you say my modem/router) only had one ethernet port.

I set up the switch and kind of got the network going !

But I still have the same problem on my main machine in that I cannot see the other machine (my workstation) ! On the work station I can see the main machine and any shared files all OK.

What I put it down to is that when I first set up XP on the main machine 18 months ago I probably said No to Networks while installing XP. This is probably why My Network Places never showed up (it does now see the start of this thread) I followed Lynx's suggestion and edit the Start Menu. So now My Network Places shows up on the Menu, but when I click on it it is empty.

So I have decided to reinstall Xp on this machine in the hope that it fixes this glitch.

Kind Regards

Digby

[ilw]

in my experience the whole computers are connected but sometimes see each other and sometimes don't and can't share files etc.. is usually a problem with passwords and enabling "simple file sharing". windows is utter, utter shit for setting up network shared folders

my recommendation is turn on simple file sharing (google if you don't know what i'm talking about) and also either create network drives with appropriate login info or create an account on each computer which matches the main account on the other comp,
e.g.

computer 1: normal login name: john password: john1
computer 2: normal login name: chris password: chris1

then on computer 1 you should add an account name: chris password chris1 and vice versa.

[digmen1]

Hi ILW

Thanks for the suggestions, I tried "simple file sharing" but that made no difference.

I do not really want to try your second suggestion as I tend to dislike having user names and logging in as its only me that will be using the 2 computers (in different rooms).

This problem is now really annoying me and after doing a bit of googling it seems that it is a very common one. Many people offer many solutions but none of them seem to work.

So I must agree with your first statement that Windows Networking is Shit.

It seems that If it gets out of whack there is no one central place that you can look for settings.


Regards

Digby

[digmen1]

To re-state my problem

I have got my network kind of going with a switch and router.

But one (machine A) of my 2 PCs (both XP Home) will not show the other PC in the My Network Places folder. (The other one machine B does, and this one can access shared files from machine A)

If I go into the My Network Places folder (it comes up empty) if I then click on View Work Group Computers, there is a slight delay and then a beep.

I have tried every single firewall setting and disabling otpion.

The one thing that makes me wonder is the four options at the end of the Network wizard. It seems to say that you should insert your XP disk into the first machine and then fire up the second machine using the CD!

Is this required ? Has anyone ever done this ?

Because, when I run the wizard on machine A it comes up with the 4 options and I just click finish and I am then returned to XP. But on Machine B when I finished the wizard I seem to remember it saying I had to reboot.

Regards

Digby

[digmen1]

I Finally got my 2 PC XP Home home-network going ! after 2 weeks, one new hard drive, two new XP installs and great loss of time and hair.

I finally deffered to some advise from posters and Uninstalled my firewall, in this case ZoneAlarm Free. And lo and behold as soon as did that my network worked perfectly I could see all shared Folders and files !

So I cannot believe how bad Zonealarm is - as they have been going for years and SP2 has been out for a year also.

Regards

Digby

[Virtualbody1234]

Zonealarm isn't bad.

In Firewall>Zones there are settings for "Trusted" zones. Use Add IP Range and put your local IPs there.
Ex: (192.168.1.100 - 192.168.1.104) for up to 5 computers in the network.

I also think it's a good idea to add the single IP address of your router to the trusted zones.

[digmen1]

Zonealarm isn't bad.

In Firewall>Zones there are settings for "Trusted" zones. Use Add IP Range and put your local IPs there.
Ex: (192.168.1.100 - 192.168.1.104) for up to 5 computers in the network.

I also think it's a good idea to add the single IP address of your router to the trusted zones.

I accept what you say, but that is getting a bit technical for a newbie (I'm not a newbie) to enter such data. But I will have a go, because, other than that ZA did seem to work for me for 2 years.

Regards

Digby