Matrix Revolutions - Big Spoiler

[caffeineaddict]

OK.. I was too lazy to read through the rest, so this is my complete and full version on the matrix. The matrix is inside a matrix, keeping the people subdued, and the point is choice becuase he has the choice to shut the machines down if he wanted to, thus restarting the matrix (flashback of the .. umm.. chancellor ( ? ) and neo talking about choice) .... but no matter what he decides, it doesn't matter. The machines are just keeping a leash on alll humans by making them think that there's a threat to their society (which there isn't). THAT is why zion is always destroyed, because once the simulation is over, they have to start anew. Anyone see the animatrix? see the one called World Record? What if they brainwashed every human every cycle of the matrix? I mean, that's how they restart, right? How else would they have people who are so pacified and know nothing about being implanted into the matrix? But see, I think this cycle is different, because the machines found an anomaly - neo. He actually IS the one, because he was able to discern that he could stop the sentinels in the "1st level, so called real-world" matrix. That is why the Architect said that he couldn't save Trinity, because he actually thought he couldn't, but what the Architect failed to realize was the power of the human spirit, that hope, that determination. THAT is the stuff that cannot fit into the machine's equation, because there IS no easy equation for the "human element" so-to-speak. Neo will free not only the ones in the matrix, but himself as well. What happens after that, however, I don't know. THAT is why the 3rd matrix was SUPPOSED to be called unplugged, but they changed it to revolutions. Unplugged was a better name, but it gave too much away, so they had to change it. I hope you've enjoyed my side of the story as much as I have had writing about it.

[Chriscom]

I think I'm one of the very few people who doesn't believe in the matrix inside a matrix theory. But oh well. I'd just like to throw in that some people seem to say that there were 5 Neo's before him. I have never thought of the "other ones" like that. I think they are completely different people, not just 5 neo's. If Neo had picked the opposite door, then picked the 20-something people, there would be a new "one", but that doesn't mean it's neo again. If you have proof, like a quote, that it has been Neo the 5 previous times, please post it. Thanks,
Chris

[that1dude]

there were not 5 neo's just five "ones" with the same genetics to be the one that neo has. Why do people think that there is a matrix in the matrix, because its only the matrix and the real world, it just so happens that neo may be able to have powers like he would in the matrix.

[Busyman]

ggg

[Cl1mh4224rd]

Originally posted by Busyman@16 June 2003 - 06:59
Verrrry SIMPLE

How could Zion be destroyed 5 times? huh!!!!
Five different locations? With each loop, The One choses 23(?) new people to be released from the Matrix and populate the "new" Zion. Who ever said it had to be in the same location every time?

[Busyman]

ggg

[puk:))]

who ever said anything about neo being 200 yo??

personally i believe that alot of what neo was told by the Architect is lies... just another form of control.. on the other side the fact there were other anomallys (sorry about the sp!) is clearly true due to the guy holding the key maker saying (as posted before) that hes suvived the other "ones" & will suvive this one.

& as for there being a matrix inside a matrix - it would be the easiest answer to alot of questions raised in reloaded but i dont think its gonna go that way... for that very reason... too easy.

[well_butter_my_arse]

Ugh i think if i read any more of this my heads gonna explode :D . good topic

[well_butter_my_arse]

I thought that kid that neo supposedly saves is the one and neo dies in the third film

[Nevin]

Originally posted by well_butter_my_arse@16 June 2003 - 14:40
I thought that kid that neo supposedly saves is the one and neo dies in the third film
That kid will play a role in the next movie, they wouldnt' bring him in just for the hell of it.

[Busyman]

Does anyone think Zion was destroyed 5 times prior to this movie?
Do you think Neo is the one all the time or it's a different person each time?
How does the Architect know exactly how many people it takes to rebuild Zion?

[puk:))]

thats it........my heads now fryed....

[Richiemana]

:D This is my first ever post and I believe that there has been other "the one's" because the french dude says he has survided the predecesors(sorry can't spell) but I think the bit about rebuilding zion is a lie.

[tobaccogiant]

The more I think about this, the more it makes sense - although it does seem to be cheating the viewer a bit:

Warning - this may cook your noodle :blink:

How has Zion been destroyed 5 times already? Because it only exists in the Matrix - it's a program. The Zionists are plugged in, just like normal people.

Why does it exist? Because the matrix only works if there's an opportunity for each being to make a subconsious choice whether or not to accept the normal Matrix. The existence of 'Zion' means that 99.9% of subjects accept the normal Matrix.

Those who choose Zion are still plugged in (maybe still providing power for the machines?), under the ideological illusion that they have chosen to "free" their minds.

Why destroy Zion if it's a program? Hmmm... because the arrival of the One provokes an increase in people 'freeing' their minds ("more in the last six months than six years")? Perhaps the machines need to keep Zion in check for some reason - can't have too many 'free' minds about. So every few years the Zion program is deleted and recreated from scratch, using the code stored in the One. And the Matrix is reloaded and everything starts again.

This is the only explanation for how Neo destroys the sentinals and how Agent Smith can exist in the real world. It does, however, mean that "it's all a dream" which is a really cheap trick.

Can the oracle see the future? No she's just seen the exact same thing five time before - including the stuff that happens in the 'real world' (which is also in the Matrix)

HERE ARE THE QUESTIONS THOUGH!

1. Neo has taken this path five times before - what has changed in order for him to choose the other door? Each time before, he choose to recreate Zion based on an affinity with all other humans. This time he has a "specific response" of love for Trinity.
So did the five previous Neo's not meet and fall in love with Trinity? Or perhaps Smith's actions as an unplugged renegade program changed the course of events? (Although, if it's all a program, why did Smith not take this action on the last five occasions?)

2. Who is that guy being led away at the beginning of the resturant scene?

3. What is Agent Smith's agenda?

4. Neo has to do something in the "next 24 hours". What, and where did he get that timeframe from? Zion only has nine hours or so left.

Any thoughts on this lot? Or maybe you disagree completely?

TG

[Ham]

man these discussions r gonna go on until nov!! i cnt take ne more of this lol 2 many questions and even more (?!) theorys... wow.....

[that1dude]

ok. this is what it is.
When Neo speaks with the architect he clearly says that the function of the one "which is and unbalance in the matrix", is to return to the source so that the code that makes him the one can tempararely be reinsurted and after which he would be required to pick from the matrix 23 individuals, 16 females and 7 males to rebuild zion after it has been destroyed. And if he fails to comply will trigger disaster killing everyone in the matrix and also zion will be destroyed, which is the extinction of the entire human race. thats why its been destroyed 5 times.

I think that there is no matrix within a matrix. Everyone thinks that because of neo was able to stop the sentinels in the real world. But i dont think anybody has thought of this one. remember agent smith when neo jumped into him and then it was like he was reborn, well like what agent smith said he has a part of neo in him thus giving him the free will of neo to not be an agent anymore, and thus giving neo part of the machines. he felt the sentinels because he has a part of them in him. so it was a smart thing to jump into good old agent smith.

the reason why the architect said there were 5 ones before him is because there were. What makes neo the one is a code that is an unbalance or a mistake in the matrix and the architect has been trying to figure out how to get rid of it by reinsurting him back into the source.

:blink:

[enoughfakefiles]

Lol i`m gonna find the wosawski(i think that`s how you spell it)brothers email address and ask what the real story is.

[silverccrow]

Zion is not in another matrix ha ha ha
every1 who has post it in the forum is goin 2 shit the day revolutions arrive yeah I know why but why to aswer this stupid question ?

U need 2 see the first movie first ! then the second then the first again and u will know why !

The brothers know exactly where to punch! :lol:

[well_butter_my_arse]

To be fair there isnt a great deal of point trying to figure out somthing that isnt real in the first place. I dont think anyone but the two brothers and MR andersson no whats really going on. I guess ill just have to wait for the third movie to come out as i cant take ne more theories however intrestting and crazy they r.

[RClover]

Up until recently, I never bought into the rumors about Zion being a matrix within a matrix. I had thought that the reason that Neo was able to stop the machines at the end of reloaded was due to Neo and Smith's connection which should be explained in the next movie. Then I just happened to remember from the first movie when Smith was interrogating Morpheus. Smith was looking for access codes to the Zion mainframe which poses the question: Why would you need codes for something that actually exists in the real world? And here's another thing that I noticed. At the beginning of Reloaded, while in the matrix, Neo was able to sense a presence near the entrance of the building he was in, which was agent Smith. When he got to the entrance, he knew that there were agents on the other side of the door before they even busted through. At the end of the movie, in the real world, he was able to sense that the sentinels were sending a bomb to the Nebuchadnezzar and after it was blown up, he sensed the sentinels approaching him before they were even visible. However, somewhere in the middle of the movie, in Zion, he was NOT able to sense Bain sneaking up behind him with a knife. Question is why he was not able to do so being that Neo and Smith now have this connection and Smith has come into the real world through Bain. What could this mean???

[Chriscom]

For the love of god please stop saying that it's been "Neo" 6 times. The 4th "one" could have looked like my uncle Bob for all we know. They could have lead completely different lives, and maybe none of them fell in love as much as Neo has. The only thing that links them "the ones" together is that they all have the powers that Neo does in the movie (because they all carried the code) and they also met up with the machines control (Seraph, Oracle, Architect, etc.). All those people were doing was leading Neo to the "TV room" with the architect so he could make his desicion.

Where I stand, for anyone that cares :)
- No matrix inside a matrix, there would be no end to the movie. Zion is in the real world, and there is one matrix
- See above about the ones looking different
- Revolutions will end with the humans being freed after alot of fighting and some interesting s***. I'm expecting alot of twists, like neo dying, stuff like that. But overall I believe that 90% of all movies will have a pretty good ending, including the matrix.

Also, about the kid. I haven't seen him in any trailers. I think they through him in to tie it in with the Animatrix. But I'm not saying he won't be in revolutions. He'll probably get blown to bits like Mouse, they're about the same.
Oh well,
Chris

[twix]

my 2 pence
as crazy as this might sound, but i believe neo is a program, that is why he is able 2 stop the sentinels in "the real world"

the oracle said that when a program is nearing the end of its life cycle, it can either be terminated and return to the source, or it can go into exile.
Neo had the choice to either return to the code or return to the matrix(ie in exile)
Same as the key-maker, he chose exile.

he can destroy the sentinels because he is a program himself. Is that so difficult to believe?
the sentinels are robots, (in this context) robots are computer programs with mechanical parts.
Neo is also a program

might not make much sense but that is what i think

[that1dude]

Originally posted by twix@16 June 2003 - 21:13
my 2 pence
as crazy as this might sound, but i believe neo is a program, that is why he is able 2 stop the sentinels in "the real world"

the oracle said that when a program is nearing the end of its life cycle, it can either be terminated and return to the source, or it can go into exile.
Neo had the choice to either return to the code or return to the matrix(ie in exile)
Same as the key-maker, he chose exile.

he can destroy the sentinels because he is a program himself. Is that so difficult to believe?
the sentinels are robots, (in this context) robots are computer programs with mechanical parts.
Neo is also a program

might not make much sense but that is what i think
it does make some sense.
i think we all have very good points and ideas of the movie and doing that keeps us more interested on whats going to happen next.
but you did make sense, good ideas with the whole neo's a program, it would definitly be a twist and a good one at that.

[nizers]

okay.. side question. What are the twins? Remember the two henchmen that were vampires? They were said to have "come from a much older version of the matrix." Well, which version of the matrix did the twins come from and what is their purpose?? Are they just ghosts of some sort? They seem to have some very inexplicable powers compared to all of the other programs in the matrix.

[nizers]

Originally posted by miffo+15 June 2003 - 19:22--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (miffo @ 15 June 2003 - 19:22)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-Klona45@15 June 2003 - 09:51
When Neo is in the arcitechts room. on the montitors behind neo, are they all showing the reactions of the previous "ONES"? and if so why are ther so many different picture if ther was only 6 prior to that neo? am i making sence? i dont get bthe bit about when he says
""ther wer 5 ones b4 me,either no1 told me or no1 knows.""

and whys the problem choice ?
it´s not the reactions of the prior ones.
It is all the choices that neo can make considering the properties of the situation.
Simple chaos mathematics really, it is kindof easy if u imagine it: the choices made out of a human brain is very complex, there´s no telling what "the brain inside u" migth decide if put in front of a multiple choice situation.

Simple animal brains run on instinct most of the time as for some situation human do too.
BUT assume that u are put in a multiple choice situation then it is all the circumstances about the situation +your own experience (which is hell of a lot different in different brains) +other things I can´t come up with right now
This adds up to an infinite number of possibilities of the reaction of the brain.
Which also need to be interpreted by the conciounsness which add it up even more. THAT is the problem of choice. [/b][/quote]
Just to back up this &#39;theory&#39; that the screens are of Neo&#39;s choices...

1. There&#39;s hundreds of screens of Neo having all different kinds of reactions and yet there has only been 5 other "Ones." (and probably none of them were Neo).

2. When the architect tells Neo something and he has a chance to react, the screen shows the TV&#39;s in the background as a list of choices he can make but it then &#39;enters&#39; into the screen that is Neo&#39;s actual reaction.

[Chriscom]

I think you&#39;re alittle confused. The twins are the albino&#39;s with weird hair that can morph and go through things. The vampires are the meriovigian&#39;s people that do his dirty work. Persephone shoots one in the head with a silver bullet and the other runs back to tell the meriovingian. They are also in the game, the vampires. Oh yeah, and the twins might have escaped that blast at the end of the car chase, because at the last second they morph. Hope that helps,
Chris

[Chriscom]

I thought that the monitors were showing what Neo was thinking and just not saying, or just a gimmick to make us laugh and break up the long speech. I&#39;ve never thought about it in more detail.
Chris

[Busyman]

uhhh Chris he didn&#39;t have it confused read it again


What are the twins? Remember the two henchmen that were VAMPIRES? They were said to have "come from a much older version of the matrix." Well, which version of the matrix did the TWINS come from and what is their purpose?? Are they just ghosts of some sort? They seem to have some very inexplicable powers compared to all of the other programs in the matrix.

[Cl1mh4224rd]

Just to drive a point into the skulls of the people who just don&#39;t seem to get it:

Neo is the 6th "One". The fact that he has been designated as a number in a sequence means that the previous "Ones" were all different. If they were all Neo, then he would be the "One". Period. No 2nd, no 3rd, and no 6th. Not only that, but numerous times in the Architect&#39;s speech, he refers to the previous "Ones" as "the others", meaning they were not Neo.

Got it?

Now, just to bring up something that no one here has mentioned yet. Morpheus, in the first movie, makes reference to the previous "One". When he&#39;s telling Neo about Zion and the remaining humans, he says something along the lines of "There was a man born inside the Matrix who could bend the rules of the Matrix to his will. He was the one that that set the first of us free." (or something like that).

Oh, and I just had a revelation... Ever since I heard the name "Revolutions" attached to the third movie, I always assumed it&#39;s meaning was this: "A total or radical change; as, a revolution in one&#39;s circumstances or way of living." But... what if it really means: "A single complete cycle of orbital or axial motion." Everything comes full-circle, not a revolution against the machines. Hmmm....

[Ammojam]

Crazy idea:

What if Neo dies to save all the humans (the machines are all destroyed), and if the theory regarding the matrix existing within itself many times is true, the humans choose to stay plugged in because the real world is now too bleak to live in? perhaps humans will run the matrix and once again get on top of machinery and be the masters? thus teaching us we can&#39;t survive without technology now it plays such a vital role in our survival?

Crazy idea like i said&#33;

[nizers]

Originally posted by Busyman@17 June 2003 - 05:36
uhhh Chris he didn&#39;t have it confused read it again


What are the twins? Remember the two henchmen that were VAMPIRES? They were said to have "come from a much older version of the matrix." Well, which version of the matrix did the TWINS come from and what is their purpose?? Are they just ghosts of some sort? They seem to have some very inexplicable powers compared to all of the other programs in the matrix.
Yea, so.... does anybody have an answer??

[that1dude]

THey dont really go into detail about the side characters in the movie. The twins are obviously a program maybe even a virus. The Vampires are from an older version of the matrix. nobody knows which one because it doesnt say in the movie unless you want to have one made up so you could be satisfied. the twins purpose is to show a different program so you could understand the matrix more.

Download the movie if you really want to know for yourself. watch and pay attention and youll know just as much as everyone else :blink:

[ickis_haroon]

Chriscom i hate to tell u this but what the hell ....since the announcement of the game "The Matrix Online" which is about to release mid next year, it has been clearly stated that the game picks up right after the end of "Revolutions"...so v can definetly rule out the fact that Neo sets free the minds of all the people plugged into the matrix...its far too impractical anyway.

[Chriscom]

Whoa, sorry, sorry.

My bad about the vampires and twins thing, I was in a hurry and skipped over some pretty important words :) Again, sorry about that.

I also forgot about The Matrix Online. You would think that they wouldn&#39;t want to give away that info, but I guess so. But I think that ALOT of people posting have forgotten that it is a movie after all, it has to have an end, and one that people will like. I have talked to people that aren&#39;t obbsessed with the matrix and could care less about what being plugged in means. They just like the fight scenes and the sweet love story. For those people you have to actually make a movie. You can have it end with mankind being wiped out. I might be wrong, but I highly doubt it. Of course they could defeat the machines and use the matrix like the someone above said, just for fun. Everyone will have holes in their heads, so why not?? What I&#39;m saying is you can&#39;t tell me 100% that I&#39;m wrong until you see the movie. But I will agree that the game being in the matrix is an important aspect. Again, sorry about those two things,
Chris

[_John_Lennon_]

Originally posted by RClover@16 June 2003 - 14:26
Then I just happened to remember from the first movie when Smith was interrogating Morpheus. Smith was looking for access codes to the Zion mainframe which poses the question: Why would you need codes for something that actually exists in the real world?
Ahh, but why would he need codes for something that exists in an actualy matrix anyway? It seems that in this scence, he was merely asking for the codes to the zion mainframe, that like controls the ships, and security systems and such, not like a "mainframe in the matrix" that controls zion.

[Busyman]

Not in the Matrix

but a Matrix within a Matrix

[ilw]

I think one of the most important pieces of the film is right at the end where neo senses the sentinel and then appears to stop it and I thought the same as most other people that somehow neo was linked to smith and therefore permanently to the matrix and all its machines, but what if neo didn&#39;t stop it? Its a bit way out, but what if it was taken down with an EM pulse (a ship appears a little time after doesn&#39;t it?) and Neo was knocked out by the same pulse? Is neo part machine?

[esumsea]

Originally posted by Klona45@14 June 2003 - 23:37
So as soon as he walks out the door to save trinity (even tho the arcitect said it was impossible) every1 hard wired to the matrix dies? the arcitect said they could survive without the biological power. im soo confused, plus you have to remeber that Smith is inside that guy in the coma at the end of the film, was it him who set the EMP off to early?
Yes. Ofcoarse it was him. He was the only survivor. Morpheus eluded to it. :P

[awfullwaffle919]

Originally posted by Cl1mh4224rd@17 June 2003 - 10:54
Now, just to bring up something that no one here has mentioned yet. Morpheus, in the first movie, makes reference to the previous "One". When he&#39;s telling Neo about Zion and the remaining humans, he says something along the lines of "There was a man born inside the Matrix who could bend the rules of the Matrix to his will. He was the one that that set the first of us free." (or something like that).
To follow that up, from what I can remember, Morpheus also said early in the first movie that the previous "one" who set them free, died and had told Morpheus he would someday be back.

That&#39;s the real original prophecy, that the 5th "ONE" thought his own &#39;soul&#39;, or his same being on the inside, would be back to life in a new body someday. And Morpheus believed it.

So Morpheus wasn&#39;t told that there would be a brand NEW "one" someday, but was told that the SAME "one" would be back only in a different body.

That also shows that the previous "one" had made a strange choice. A choice in which the people he set free (including Morpheus) LIVED. A choice in which he had time to say goodbye to Morpheus. A choice in which he then died from. Then which door did he take? Which door allows all of that to be possible? That you die, and the real world&#39;s people survive, but before you die you see them and say bye bye to them&#33; Which door gave the 5th "one" that possibility?

[Cl1mh4224rd]

Originally posted by awfullwaffle919@2 July 2003 - 23:31
That&#39;s the real original prophecy, that the 5th "ONE" thought his own &#39;soul&#39;, or his same being on the inside, would be back to life in a new body someday. And Morpheus believed it.
I would go as far as to say the previous One knew "he" would be back. It&#39;s obvious all of the Ones had met the Architect, therefor they knew that the One was a recurring phenomenon.

The Prophecy is only a prophecy because it&#39;s happened before, and the important players know that it will happen again.

And I&#39;m not so sure Morpheus knew the previous One personally, but I might be wrong. I haven&#39;t watched the first movie in a while...

[awfullwaffle919]

Yeah, I kind of remember Morpheus acting like he knew the 5th One personally, or at least that the group of people Morpheus was part of (the released ones) were altogether told by the 5th one that he&#39;d be back. So obviously if thats true, then the 5th One had an oppurtunity to see and speak to the humans AFTER he met the architect. And at least in his mind, he himself would be back in some form, meaning he knew he wasnt going into exile to live on, he was gonna die.

[olibomb]

I jus didn&#39;t like the Matrix, it was hard to get and there was so much speakin