BitMeTV Vs. The State of Israel

[RMutt]

So I have come to know recently, in a very unfortunate way, that BitMeTV has banned all traffic from Israel.
To this i say: WTF?
I couldn't believe it at first, but it's true.
Because of some cheaters (that, mind you, work from everywhere) alot of good seeders and TV consumers are out!
I hereby voice my discontent!

[fridash]

if that is true it is a same

[Zeus]

A lot of sites are doing this on the basis that Israel seems to have a disproportionately high number of cheats compared to other countries. I don't agree with it personally, but you have to understand that staffing takes a lot of time and if the staff are spending a huge amount of time and effort banning users just from one country then it may just be easier for them to ban that entire country. Guess you will have to use a proxy.

[bblogs]

:unsure: That's risky...bitmetv picks up proxies pretty fast, apparently :mellow:

[Zeus]

Well if you can't access the site without using one then you aren't risking much :P

[fatma]

So I have come to know recently, in a very unfortunate way, that BitMeTV has banned all traffic from Israel.
To this i say: WTF?
I couldn't believe it at first, but it's true.
Because of some cheaters (that, mind you, work from everywhere) alot of good seeders and TV consumers are out!
I hereby voice my discontent!

Old news . Fuck them, just another P2L site .
Anyway, all the series I watch are on every 0day tracker .

[fridash]

cheaters= IDIOTS

[BlueLabel]

I don't like it either, many trackers banding israelis IP

[torrent man]

oh
iam sorry 4 that
that big problem:(

[Beenieman]

You can hardly blame a site for inforcing it's rules. And lets face it the stats don't lie, a large number of cheaters do come come that part of the world, no one knows why but it's true and a lot of sites are starting to fight back, I feel sorry for the genuine ones from israel but until people start playing fair then this is the only way to teach them.

[fatma]

gar3th , no one teaches, that's a collective and permanent punishment . Personally I believe that the cheating cases among israelis have significantly decreased, due to many factors (increased upload speeds, appearing of seedbox owners, the will to share etc.) , but there are very important sites, like OiNK and FSC, that don't want to punish ALL the users, and they fight cheaters in alternative ways than banning IP ranges and countries. Actually the collective bans are the solution of the stupids. Look at bitspyder, that loser banned 95% of the world, his best code probably was the "Hello World" proggy .
Anyway, the average cheater will always find a way to avoid a ban in some way (proxy etc), unlike an average honest user .

[tsnoiman]

i think that have a lot of cheaters in other country..
they see 10/2000 cheaters and ban israel but why no ban country with 200/20000????

[monk3y]

A lot of Israelis cheat because the max upload speed in Israel for home connection is 36kb/s so if you can't afford a seed box or get it in an other way your only solution is cheating, unfortunately a lot of them chose to cheat.

[fatma]

fusionz , how come my upload speed at home is 64kB/s ? Wtf are you talking about... The max upload speed for home conection in Israel is 1Mbit (128kB/s), i.e. ~8 GB upload a day .
In the university though (which is also in Israel) I maxed the upload speed up to 2.3 MB/s

[blackbird]

has anyone tried talking to bitmetv staff ??

[fatma]

has anyone tried talking to bitmetv staff ??

Yeah (not me personally). Actually they say that the policy of banning countries won't change and the banned IPs will remain banned,..... but they can unban something especially for you, if you pay..oops, donate them :D Though on the forums they say that don't accept anymoe payments for unbanning, but you know, money still have a positived value :D
I'd better say them to go fuck themselves rather than paying . There are more than enougfh trackers that have episodes , and at least 3-4 more tv-only trackers . More than that, the bitmetv site sucks, it is pretty hard to seed there , recently it has lots of glitches, and it is ALWAYS slow as hell (nah , I have a narrow range which is unbanned, it's not proxy), those greedy fucktards sell GBs and unbanned IPs , I wonder where the money goes lol .

edit: btw, that's not only Israel, they banned lots of egyptian, polish and other country's IPs . I even remember one of their mods said "whoa, many brazilians cheat and use multiple accounts, whe should ban them too" . Well, one of their admins is a brazilian, I wanna see him opens the "403-forbidden" page :D

[hatzil007]

not all the israeli ips are banned.
78.172.XX.XXX are not banned.
i think you can call your isp and ask them to make your ip static.

[direstraits]

You are blaming a site that "hosts" copyrighted material because they don't let your country torrenters to receive that content. About israeli scammers and cheaters, I don't give a sh*t about them. Two words. Fuc* you.



EDIT:

Dear direstraits, I, tralalala, am also Israeli. Fuck Israeli cheaters? For what reason? Makes ya feel mighty good to get all your grunting and ranting off at the nasty Israeli cheaters, doesn't it? Well, all I can say is I wouldn't advise you to go swearing this way too often, especially when aimed at particular people or users. It will eventually get you banned, even when you see it fit to go online. Think before you post.

Good day.

[fatma]

hatzil007 , use you brain (if you have one) and remove the IP . It is for you .

direstraits , copyrighted what ? no one will mess with site that hosts mostly tv shows that were ripped or recorded , and are downloaded AFTER they were shown on TV . Pay attention to the location of the bitmetv's server : New Jersey - Parsippany - Net Access Corporation :D
As for your two words, were are the almighty bt mods ? :D

[seppypom]

not all the israeli ips are banned.
xxx.xxx.xXX.XXX are not banned.
i think you can call your isp and ask them to make your ip static.

did you just ask for them to ban your IP range?

[TYPE R]

simlpe, fuck bitmetv they r a fucking cock sucker!

[seppypom]

simlpe, fuck bitmetv they r a fucking cock sucker!

But how do you feel about the site....really, don't hold back.

[RMutt]

I feel like shit about it!
and i never used it!
I happen to be an israeli home user an di have a nice modest 70kBs upload stream that i fully use and i am able to maintain decent to very good ratios!
it is annoying.
as mentioned above - if someone has their IRC info, i would love to catch an op of theirs for a chat...

[fatma]

#bitmetv.help @LostIRC

[Roark]

If you can get an invite from a good member and a static IP, they will unban that IP. They claim over half of all their cheaters came from Israel before they banned those IP ranges; it's hard to blame them for not wanting to deal with finding cheaters all day.

[Tokeman]

I got a one word solution for you:
Seedbox

located out of your country of course :)

[SAM]

a lot of trackers panned not just isreal but many other countries and that's actully sucks

but screw them

[RMutt]

What sucks is that now i managed to get an ip that isnt banned, and the invitation i had expired..

[Tokeman]

it may take a week or two, but your inviter will get that invite back, so just ask him for it again when it re-appears.

[tralalala]

direstraits, I have edited your post. Please read the edit. Here's the link to it: http://filesharingtalk.com/vb3/showpost.php?p=2161511&postcount=18

On topic - I was also on a partially unbanned range until about 3 days ago when my range was also banned. Am I pissed? Very. Why? I loved the content. What am I doing about it? First off - Not weeping. Second - Trying to get my single IP unbanned with the help of some people. It's the logical way to do stuff..

[SAM]

but how to get my ip unbanned i think it's so difficult but if anyone know a way other than using a proxy plz tell me.

[fatma]

but how to get my ip unbanned i think it's so difficult but if anyone know a way other than using a proxy plz tell me.
I already told, they unban for money . You need to talk to right mod, if you have some spare bucks

[necromantic]

So I have come to know recently, in a very unfortunate way, that BitMeTV has banned all traffic from Israel.
To this i say: WTF?

It's called prejudice, get used to it. It's the same reason hooters doesn't hire fat chicks, cause they don't want to.

Don't get me wrong, BitmeTV staff is shit, right up there with Oink staff. Do I agree with their decision? No. Can you do anything about it? Yes. Get a server, setup a proxy and live it up. Make sure to pick the Israel flag in your profile too :D

[TopGUN]

Fastest Proxy catcher is Bitspyder.net Just Try it
U will know

[necromantic]

Let me clarify proxy: I sign up for a server, leaseweb leeware, whatever. I setup utorrent/firefox and browse/dl torrents directly off the seedbox via vnc viewer (no way in hell they would catch this). Or I could install my own proxy software on the seedbox and access the site that way (maybe they could catch this, not sure).

Inconvenient? Sure is. Satisfying to defy BitmeTV? You better believe it.

[Fibo]

I got two words for you guys:

Learnbits and TVTorrents

It was just the fact that they banned me that I wanted it so bad, even after i got in I was disabled due to inactivity.

I think between those two sites you probably have 90% of the content. FACT

Question:

What do you do when someone says we dont want you?
Tell them youll pay money to get in? I dont think so, thats not my style.

DO NOT PAY FOR FILESHARING!!!!
It was in the handbook you all got on day one.

What do I say?

Fk'em,its not the end of the world right....

[necromantic]

Learnbits and TVTorrents

I think between those two sites you probably have 90% of the content. FACT

Good point, BitmeTV isn't the only fish in the sea

[Daniel]

Some trackers have a good cheater detection (let me just say Oink) and others don't. In order to keep their tracker free of that scum, they are even going to accept collateral damage. While that is not a welcome step either for you Israelis or other members (hey, some other country could be next, after all) it looks to be necessary.

Maybe those cheaters will learn from this and will become good members after the country bans are reversed, who knows? I can't believe that those will be lifetime bans .. and in the meantime, why don't you find out that there do exist trackers that will work as well as those you are banned from because of your nationality.

[Elit3_T3AM]

BitMeTV is great at catching proxies but not perfect, no one is perfect...If you no how proxies work then you should have no problamo...

Many people from Israel use proxies at BitMeTV and never ever get caught you just need to no how to do it correctly and not fu*king use a transparent one in other words if you use a transparent proxy your just handing your ass over to them

[KevinGarnet]

mhm it is really great tracker.. and of course they don't like cheaters.. from Israel they got many cheaters so actually they must ban all traffic from Israel... i hope this will be good for this tracker..

[direstraits]

@Tralala, I have nothing against Israel its people. I'm saying that this discussion has no plot.

[monk3y]

bitmetv staff is the worst
even more then oink :|
fu*ck'em

[Elit3_T3AM]

bitmetv staff is the worst
even more then oink :|
fu*ck'em

:yup::yup::yup::yup::yup::yup:
Very Fu*king True

[optimus_prime]

yeah, i never understood why oinkers always get the "worst staff" oscar on fst, they are angels compared to bitmetv bunch.

[phrenzy]

Never had any run ins w/ oink staff but i must say the Bitmetv bunch were good to me.. I was invited by a cheater, still have an account. I inivted someone from FST "cheater", talked w/ am admin there..Still got my account...I guess talking in a calm rational way helps a lot and not acting like a dumabass.......

[fatma]

phren, I guess such things are random on bitmetv , or you were very lucky. I'm pretty sure that if the things you've mentioned are heard by a wrong mod, you will say bye bye to your bitmetv account , and even a payment for reinstation won't be offered in this case , though it is offered on a regular basis for enabling poor ratio accounts . Again I'm wondering where does the money go, considering their poor and luggy server .

[BlueLabel]

mievmo since when israel have 10Mb connection???
for what I know 8Mb is the most, could it be I didn't hear anything about it?
or is it a private srever you'he got there?

[fatma]

here is my speed record, made in israeli university though
http://xs217.xs.to/xs217/07306/TLlshpng.png

[Mareko]

The decision to ban most ranges from Israeli ISP's wasn't an easy one but in the end it had to be done and bitmetv doesn't regret it. Over 90% of the cheats that were caught were from israel (at that time) and as its a manual process it was taking way too much of the staffs time. Users from israel who proved they were innocent i.e. could have others vouch for them on other trackers or had a good standing in the community were let thru the ban - most got a static IP while a few who weren't able to were asked to come into irc everytime their IP changed (every couple of weeks) and the range ban was adjusted.
Once this had been done to trusted members the opportunity was given to others if they could get a static IP. This didn't work out too well coz most of these others started cheating again (100+) - bitmetv then started asking for a small donation hoping that this would keep the real cheaters out and only those who took their account seriously would consider it. This only lasted a couple of days as bitmetv was accused for trying to make money out of the whole israel incident.

As for the "poor and luggy server" comment - jus read thru the announcement forum and you'll see that new servers have been bought and bitmetv has changed hosts. There were a couple of teething problems initially with the server and the new host. Currently the site lags a bit from time to time as more improvements are made to the code as well as from the occasional DDOS.

[ibslice]

It had reached 100+ israel cheats a day. We put up with it for 6 months. So thats 100 x 30 days x 6 months that makes 18 000 cheaters We had no choice and the MAIN reason was not that it was israel. It was that that all the ip's were dynamic, so they would sign up AGAIN the next day and do it all again. We do have quite a few .il users still :) Those users took the trouble and time to get a static ip :) so we could allow them through ;) and as for this

but how to get my ip unbanned i think it's so difficult but if anyone know a way other than using a proxy plz tell me.
I already told, they unban for money . You need to talk to right mod, if you have some spare bucks

Thats the biggest load of crap I have ever heard. WE DO NOT unban for money.

[fatma]

Thats the biggest load of crap I have ever heard. WE DO NOT unban for money.

I heard that you personally recently offered to unban someone's IP for "donation" . I believe my source more than you .

[ibslice]

fatma, they and you are a liar. Ask anyone around about my honesty. ANY site you like and I bet they will vouch for me. But I know what I said. Someone else saying it is purely rumour.

[seppypom]

Ask anyone around about my honesty. ANY site you like and I bet they will vouch for me.

The Line can start behind me.

[Dr. Lecter]

I'm right behind u seppypom.

Edit:
I forgot to mention: I'm Israeli.

[Roark]

Thats the biggest load of crap I have ever heard. WE DO NOT unban for money.

Erm, you would be a lot more convincing if your own mod hadn't admitted it just before your first post ...


bitmetv then started asking for a small donation hoping that this would keep the real cheaters out and only those who took their account seriously would consider it. This only lasted a couple of days as bitmetv was accused for trying to make money out of the whole israel incident.

As for reputation, I don't know about you personally (although this thread certainly isn't casting you in a good light considering the above), but let's be honest, Bitmetv staff does not have the best reputation. Take userdetails.php?id=7107 at ScT, a 10TB uploader (banned at bitmetv for supposedly trading invites) was pissed off enough to make "Bitmetv Lies" a prominent part of his profile. Somehow, I seriously doubt he would need to trade to get invited places.

[ThaSh00t3R]

Who knows which is the next country they might ban ??? Hmmm....

[fatma]

Who knows which is the next country they might ban ??? Hmmm....

I guess the one which has a relatively small number of donators :D

Unfortunately I don't remember the name of the mod that suggested to ban Brasil .

[ibslice]

What Mareko said what not what bitmetv did. It was what a couple of mods said to see how keen they actually were to get in. I should note no money changed hands and it was a purely an excercise to make people go away and to stop asking for us to unban .il. It was a bit of a mistake on their part and the 2 staff that said it .. said it for 2 days well over a year ago. So I still stand by what I said and that we DO NOT uban ip's for money and have NEVER done and I have NEVER EVER said I will.

[SAM]

i don't get it really
bitmetv staff has the right to block anyone they don't want it in
they block isreal and egypt and some countries so be it
we as users why making all this fuss about it?!
it just a tracker there are many more welcoming us

[fatma]

i don't get it really
bitmetv staff has the right to block anyone they don't want it in
they block isreal and egypt and some countries so be it
we as users why making all this fuss about it?!
it just a tracker there are many more welcoming us

I've never said that my wet dream is bitmetv wants all israelis , egyptians, eskimos etc. back . Vice versa , I always say that I will be a member of those sites that want me there , and will never be an active member of those that apply any kind of ban on the population I belong to .
But I am always glad to give my view , to discuss and to making fun of this "let's ban everyone" (and not only) policy .
Peace everyone, join other wonderful and friendly TV trackers (there are a couple of them that don't sell your bandwith :D)

[Nightmeare]

ppl should really stop bitching about it. its BitmeTV right to ban anyone they see fit. seeing as Israel has a major cheating problem i don't condemn their choice to ban out Israel. Before TiT was shutdown he also had major problem with "them" in cheating. i banned at least 5 a day bez of that. that is allot off effort and work devoted to one particular country i see no problem banning Israel when we opens our door again

[Artemis]

ppl should really stop bitching about it. its BitmeTV right to ban anyone they see fit. seeing as Israel has a major cheating problem i don't condemn their choice to ban out Israel. Before TiT was shutdown he also had major problem with "them" in cheating. i banned at least 5 a day bez of that. that is allot off effort and work devoted to one particular country i see no problem banning Israel when we opens our door again

+1 , its keeping the best interest of the site in mind, when banning a country, with the majority of ch*****s and tr****s like that.

[phrenzy]

It is a free service that they provide. Then you say it's pay to leech but no body FORCES you to donate...Yet the large majority cheat/trade for again a FREE service...It seems to be common theme in a few forums...There are good users in that country and sadly they get screwed....I choose to donate on sites that I like because I want to not because I am forced to. Being a business owner I know that my time is worth money and I see a lot of time an effort but into the site..Just move on, find another TV site and get over it...Seems like there a better things to complain about........

[fatma]

ppl should really stop bitching about it. its BitmeTV right to ban anyone they see fit. seeing as Israel has a major cheating problem i don't condemn their choice to ban out Israel. Before TiT was shutdown he also had major problem with "them" in cheating. i banned at least 5 a day bez of that. that is allot off effort and work devoted to one particular country i see no problem banning Israel when we opens our door again

Oh, I was about to stop trolling, and then I saw you , my little friend :D
AFAIK you are from Norway . zomg, from all the users I've invited to oink, 2 cheated : one is from norway (btw, he is now a VIP at norbits) , and the second one is from the uk . The only israeli I invited was banned for a poor ratio . But I still can't believe how did it happen that my norwegian invitee cheated . What a shame for a nordic country with blazing upload speeds . I think he only wanted to "fix" a little bit his ratio, since it is hard to make a good one there .
BTW, as far as I remember , you are an 31337 member of bitme . Have you ever thought about downloading any of their english grammar torrents ? I'm sure it will help you .


It is a free service that they provide. Then you say it's pay to leech but no body FORCES you to donate...Yet the large majority cheat/trade for again a FREE service...It seems to be common theme in a few forums...There are good users in that country and sadly they get screwed....I choose to donate on sites that I like because I want to not because I am forced to. Being a business owner I know that my time is worth money and I see a lot of time an effort but into the site..Just move on, find another TV site and get over it...Seems like there a better things to complain about........


As for bitmetv : I have never had a need in this tracker and its content . I only watch tv eps like x-files and lost , but I'm not that dumb to get them on bitmetv . Other trackers either offer them for free, or I have good chances to seed them back (or both of them) .
As for donations , p2l etc . Why is it a problem to discuss it ? Even on ScT there was a huge thread about that .
I'll tell you a little story about a man , who donated to bitmetv when he joined (for upload amount, yeah). I guess bitmetv loved his donation . And then , after he became a PU there , he invited someone . And then , this someone became a leech, and got banned . Lets make a little pause in the story, and recall oink and its "dreadful" staff . What happens on oink when you invite a leech ? Nothing, he gets banned, and you move on , like nothing happened . It is even good sometimes to invite leeches, since they help other members to make a ratio on trackers where too hard to seed . What happened to our man on bitmetv ? The download amount of the leech he ivited was added to his download amount , and now he has some problems with his ratio . I guess bitmetv loved his first donation, and here is the simple solution to his pain : donate again, buy the upload amount, and the problem is gone . Again, no one forces you to "donate" :D

[Nightmeare]

Oh, I was about to stop trolling, and then I saw you , my little friend :D
AFAIK you are from Norway . zomg, from all the users I've invited to oink, 2 cheated : one is from norway (btw, he is now a VIP at norbits) , and the second one is from the uk . The only israeli I invited was banned for a poor ratio . But I still can't believe how did it happen that my norwegian invitee cheated . What a shame for a nordic country with blazing upload speeds . I think he only wanted to "fix" a little bit his ratio, since it is hard to make good one there .
BTW, as far as I remember , you are an 31337 member of bitme . Have you ever though about downloading any of their english grammar torrents ? I'm sure it will help you .


It is a free service that they provide. Then you say it's pay to leech but no body FORCES you to donate...Yet the large majority cheat/trade for again a FREE service...It seems to be common theme in a few forums...There are good users in that country and sadly they get screwed....I choose to donate on sites that I like because I want to not because I am forced to. Being a business owner I know that my time is worth money and I see a lot of time an effort but into the site..Just move on, find another TV site and get over it...Seems like there a better things to complain about........


As for bitmetv : I have never had a need in this tracker and its content . I only watch tv eps like x-files and lost , but I'm not that dumb to get them on bitmetv . Other trackers either offer them for free, or I have good chances to seed them back (or both of them) .
As for donations , p2l etc . Why is it a problem to discuss it ? Even on ScT there was a huge thread about that .
I'll tell you a little story about a man , who donated to bitmetv when he joined (for upload amount, yeah). I guess bitmetv loved his donation . And then , after he became a PU there , he invited someone . And then , this someone became a leech, and got banned . Lets make a little pause in the story, and recall oink and its "dreadful" staff . What happens on oink when you invite a leech ? Nothing, he gets banned, and you move on , like nothing happened . It is even good sometimes to invite leeches, since they help other members to make a ratio on trackers where too hard to seed . What happened to our man on bitmetv ? The download amount of the leech he ivited was added to his download ammount , and now he has some problems with his ratio . I guess bitmetv loved his first donation, and here is the simple solution to his pain : donate again, buy the upload ammount, and the problem is gone . Again, no one forces you to "donate" :D


Who are you and how do u know where i come from



and Norway dont have that good upload normal is 40kb/s or so.

[fatma]

Who are you and how do u know where i come from


HIIII, my name is fatma, and I'm from the interwebz :D

I'm a peer from Israel, nothing more .



and Norway dont have that good upload normal is 40kb/s or so.

ORLY ? Then Israel pwns Norway, I have 64 KB/s upload speed at home, and it's really cheap . I bet that IL cheaters that you catch are 12-20 year old stupid brainless kiddos that don't even know that there is a connection with upload speed greater then 16 KB/s and it's cheap :D May god forgive them for their stupidity :D

[Nightmeare]

nothing is cheap in norway

[T3RR0R]

Not all isreali members are bad, but since hundreds of thousands of them have already made a bad name for the rest of the good isreali members, its easier for a site to ban the country and never worry about it again, rather then picking off dozens of cheating and trading isreali members each day. If i ran a tracker, i would probably ban Isreal without hesitation.

[fatma]

Not all isreali members are bad, but since hundreds of thousands of them have already made a bad name for the rest of the good isreali members, its easier for a site to ban the country and never worry about it again, rather then picking off dozens of cheating and trading isreali members each day. If i ran a tracker, i would probably ban Isreal without hesitation.

Do you think it's that hard to avoid the IP ban ? or even find a proxy which bitmetv has no chance to detect ? IMO , the IP ban is NOT effective on a bit experienced cheater . And if and when bitmetv find him, they don't even know that he is from israel , egypt or timbuktu . But the ip ban is much more effective on honest users .

[T3RR0R]

Not all isreali members are bad, but since hundreds of thousands of them have already made a bad name for the rest of the good isreali members, its easier for a site to ban the country and never worry about it again, rather then picking off dozens of cheating and trading isreali members each day. If i ran a tracker, i would probably ban Isreal without hesitation.

Do you think it's that hard to avoid the IP ban ? or even find a proxy which bitmetv has no chance to detect ? IMO , the IP ban is NOT effective on a little bit experienced cheater . And if and when bitmetv find him, they don't even know that he is from israel , egypt or timbuktu .

It might not catch all of them, but will filter out many of them.

[RogerRabbit]

I'll tell you a little story about a man , who donated to bitmetv when he joined (for upload amount, yeah). I guess bitmetv loved his donation . And then , after he became a PU there , he invited someone . And then , this someone became a leech, and got banned . Lets make a little pause in the story, and recall oink and its "dreadful" staff . What happens on oink when you invite a leech ? Nothing, he gets banned, and you move on , like nothing happened . It is even good sometimes to invite leeches, since they help other members to make a ratio on trackers where too hard to seed . What happened to our man on bitmetv ? The download amount of the leech he ivited was added to his download amount , and now he has some problems with his ratio . I guess bitmetv loved his first donation, and here is the simple solution to his pain : donate again, buy the upload amount, and the problem is gone . Again, no one forces you to "donate" :D

I guess he didn't read the part of the rules that says if you invite a leech, you get his download. It's a private site, if you don't like it, don't join. It's a shame .il has such a bad reputation - it's not BitMeTv that's to be blamed for the .il ban, it's the .il users who cheated that caused it. And you are right, they catch the ones that can't get around it; that is the honest ones so the ones that cheat screw the ones that don't.

[ibslice]

I am still wondering why no-one has scroll back to read my post where I said how we hadn't banned all of israel and I know quite a few israel members on bitmetv.
Kinda makes this whole thread pointless don't you think?

[Dr. Lecter]

I am still wondering why no-one has scroll back to read my post where I said how we hadn't banned all of israel and I know quite a few israel members on bitmetv.

Here's one happy representative.
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