Mathematics of torrenting...

[campodetenis]

It's been a while since I was wondering how do seed-leech ratio works on tracker level. I mean, there must be an intrinsecall unbalance between quantities, as there is at least one more leecher than a seeder right?

Lately I've heard a lot of "economics" when talking of free leech and stuff, and I'm trying to figure this term out.

At the end, how come a file can survive the whole seed/leech process?

Other thing that bothers me is the site stats. How come the seed/leech ratio is calculated? Is like "potential seed" or true seed?


P.S. I know, I know, I'm such a geek.

[campodetenis]

Will do, but then I'll come up with some "what am I doing here?" "where did I parked my car?" sort of questions...

[IceTee]

smoke some weed

:lol::lol:
LMAO



Will do, but then I'll come up with some "what am I doing here?" "where did I parked my car?" sort of questions...

:rolleyes: ahhh... how I miss those days :happy::lol:

[cubkiller89]

smoke weed everyday

[bikernin]

excellent advice. this is the best place to come for advice :lol:

[apunpktun]

I am guessing he has already smoked some to come up with questions like those.... (not tht i am saying it from experience)

[mrnobody]

It's been a while since I was wondering how do seed-leech ratio works on tracker level. I mean, there must be an intrinsecall unbalance between quantities, as there is at least one more leecher than a seeder right?


funny enough that i asked myself this question too.

Some tracker refer it as "seed:leech ratio" and some as "seed:leech ratio (%)"...but the second one makes more sense despite the fact that % goes 100+

here is how it works...

Example:

Peers14,471
Seeders14,120
Leechers351
Seeder/leecher ratio (%)4023

(Ratio) * 100%

sdsSeeder
= _______ * 100%

sdsLeecher

14,129
= ______ * 100% = (40.22792023) 100% = 4022.792023

351ssssdsssssssssssssssssssssssssssssss= 4023


and btw, there are more seeder in tracker than leecher. It makes sense in an established tracker...there are thousand of torrent alive (mainly because of seeder).

[campodetenis]

I agree, but at the end there will be someone with the file and a negative ratio (cus he's the last leecher) and nobody to pass it on. So what happen's then?


(my hypothesis is that is always the guy who smoked some weed and ends up creating "why am I disabeled" topics)

[Showtimextx]

smoke weed everyday

Or even every other :pinch:

[bikernin]

ok lets do some math..
we will start with a small sample space of 10 users and 10 torrents.
assume that 1 user is an uploader and 10 are leechers.
uploader has uploaded 10 torrents. all 9 users leech the 10 torrents
so initially, seeder/leecher ratio = (10*1)/10*9)=1/9
so yes, at a certain point of time there can be a S/L ratio <1
as the leechers start finishing the torrents the S/L ratio will keep growing till we finally reach a stage when everyone has finished downloading the file.
at this point S/L=(10*10)/(10*0)=infinite
these are ideal situations. expand the sample space to a userbase of thousands. you are always bound to have someone downloading a torrent so we never get to an infinite ratio. and on good sites the time it takes for a user to complete a torrent is very less because of high speeds and more seeders. due to this leechers are quickly converted into seeders. so at a given point in time, on a good site, there will always be more people seeding than leeching and no. of leechers will always be decreasing faster as compared to no. of seeders. (seeders reduce only if they stop seeding the file and most sites have strict policies for hit and runs ensuring that people seed long)
hence we have a very high seeder/leecher ratio
to illustrate the last few lines, lets take an example.
if i download a movie in 5 hours, ill normally seed it for atleast 2 days
so i was a leecher for 5 hours, but was a seeder for 48 hours. this is what i usually do. most people have upload speed half of download speed. so if they get a file in 5 hours they seed for atleast 10 to get a ratio of 1. which again means they were seeders for a longer time and hence according to probability theory, at any point in time, the probability of having more seeders than leechers is very high
P.S : that was some good weed ! :D

[campodetenis]

you are always bound to have someone downloading a torrent so we never get to an infinite ratio

Ahh, but that is an assumption that is not always true. I was under that impression until I joined OiNK and saw how hard is to seed old torrents in such sites. If you are the last grabber, chances are you are going to seed for months before someone get's it, so the intrinsecall unbalance is being applied to you, the last leecher.

Plus, if you smoke a lot of weed, chances are you are going to be that guy (not only for the slow reflexes and short attention spam, but also because you are the only one after that Zappa album), and sooner or later end up with a warning :P.

P.S. And yes... that was some quality material :D.

[bikernin]

you are always bound to have someone downloading a torrent so we never get to an infinite ratio

Ahh, but that is an assumption that is not always true. I was under that impression until I joined OiNK and saw how hard is to seed old torrents in such sites. If you are the last grabber, chances are you are going to seed for months before someone get's it, so the intrinsecall unbalance is being applied to you, the last leecher.

Plus, if you smoke a lot of weed, chances are you are going to be that guy (not only for the slow reflexes and short attention spam, but also because you are the only one after that Zappa album), and sooner or later end up with a warning :P.

yes on a single torrent its possible. but those stats are given for the overall site. not for individual torrents. all that i have written is for the overall stats. for an individual torrent, the demand is usually high when its new and hence more leechers. as it grows older fewer people download that site. its not smart to go for older torrents when you are new to a site. you will get a warning because no one is gonna get the file after you for months if at all. you should get a few new popular torrents and seed them for a while till you build up a decent buffer. then you go download that old album youve always wanted. its not hard to find popular music and you can download it even if you not gonna listen to it.

[campodetenis]

yes on a single torrent its possible. but those stats are given for the overall site. not for individual torrents. all that i have written is for the overall stats. for an individual torrent, the demand is usually high when its new and hence more leechers. as it grows older fewer people download that site. its not smart to go for older torrents when you are new to a site. you will get a warning because no one is gonna get the file after you for months if at all. you should get a few new popular torrents and seed them for a while till you build up a decent buffer. then you go download that old album youve always wanted. its not hard to find popular music and you can download it even if you not gonna listen to it.

So true, so true...

Now, how about the "economics"? In some trackers they talk about how free leech will hurt the site "economics" with their current seeders, leechers and number of torrents (seeded/leeched). What do you make of all that?

[trevor2000]

It's been a while since I was wondering how do seed-leech ratio works on tracker level. I mean, there must be an intrinsecall unbalance between quantities, as there is at least one more leecher than a seeder right?


funny enough that i asked myself this question too.

Some tracker refer it as "seed:leech ratio" and some as "seed:leech ratio (%)"...but the second one makes more sense despite the fact that % goes 100+

here is how it works...

Example:

Peers14,471
Seeders14,120
Leechers351
Seeder/leecher ratio (%)4023

(Ratio) * 100%

sdsSeeder
= _______ * 100%

sdsLeecher

14,129
= ______ * 100% = (40.22792023) 100% = 4022.792023

351ssssdsssssssssssssssssssssssssssssss= 4023


and btw, there are more seeder in tracker than leecher. It makes sense in an established tracker...there are thousand of torrent alive (mainly because of seeder).



FST has got the smartest squirr3l ever !:yup:

:D:D:D

[bikernin]

So true, so true...

Now, how about the "economics"? In some trackers they talk about how free leech will hurt the site "economics" with their current seeders, leechers and number of torrents (seeded/leeched). What do you make of all that?

yes freeleech does potentially hurt the sites seeder/leecher ratio. there are mainly two factors :
1) people are inclined to seed for shorter periods of time since they dont have to worry too much about making a buffer. e.g- if i download a 4 GB file, and my download stats are not counted, i may upload back 4 GB and overall by ratio still gets a 4 GB boost. in normal scenarios i wouldve had to seed back 8 GB for the same effect.
2) people will download more stuff leading to a higher number of leechers. there are some huge files which people might not download otherwise for fear of bad ratio.
so overall people seeding for shorter time and more leechers decreases the seeder leecher ratio. however the effect is not that drastic since there are a few limiting factors as well :
1) sites impose hit and run restrictions which make seeders seed for a minimum period.
2) as there are more leechers, it eventually results in more seeders after completion
so these two factors combined make sure there is not a massive dent in the S/L ratio. besides freeleech makes people visit their torrent sites more, love them more and also donate more. so overall freeleech periods have more pros than cons. this as long as they are on for limited periods of time. a site with freeleech all year long will have poorer S/L ratios
p.s : man, youve really gotten me into geek mode today. i gotta write an exam in 2 hours. so i guess it helped :lol:

[kallieb]

Here's my short version.

Seed till 1:1 or 36/72/240 hrs -- depending on the tracker. Do that and you can sit back and smoke some weed. All will be cool.

[bikernin]

Here's my short version.

Seed till 1:1 or 36/72/240 hrs -- depending on the tracker. Do that and you can sit back and smoke some weed. All will be cool.

you're a bit late. couldnt you have posted that earlier and saved me all the trouble? :cry:

[kallieb]

^^ No!! Your effort is A+, really. That was an amazing and sincere effort to relate to someone in a manner that made sense to them. The dude is a math whiz and whatever clicks with someone is what works best.

[tibob]

It's been a while since I was wondering how do seed-leech ratio works on tracker level. I mean, there must be an intrinsecall unbalance between quantities, as there is at least one more leecher than a seeder right?


funny enough that i asked myself this question too.

Some tracker refer it as "seed:leech ratio" and some as "seed:leech ratio (%)"...but the second one makes more sense despite the fact that % goes 100+

here is how it works...

Example:

Peers14,471
Seeders14,120
Leechers351
Seeder/leecher ratio (%)4023

(Ratio) * 100%

sdsSeeder
= _______ * 100%

sdsLeecher

14,129
= ______ * 100% = (40.22792023) 100% = 4022.792023

351ssssdsssssssssssssssssssssssssssssss= 4023


and btw, there are more seeder in tracker than leecher. It makes sense in an established tracker...there are thousand of torrent alive (mainly because of seeder). nice one!