McCain wins

[100%]

In relation to past experience, it is most likely he will become the president.

It would be predictably sadly absurdly a usain cliché.

I hate cliches

(as a non resident, non usain, you may thank me for giving a shit).

http://weblogs.newsday.com/news/local/longisland/politics/blog/obama_mccain.jpeg



.

[IdolEyes787]

Hopefully a Yank will comment but with the news we're getting here make it seem like Americans really want a change in direction.
Long time til the actual vote but predictions are a Democratic landslide.

[tralalala]

Can I get a brief summary of what McCain will do if he wins, and what Obama will do if he wins? :huh: Like, sincerely - What does each of them offer to the public of the US and the world in general?

[wazza100]

http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2008/06/11/1130840.aspx

quick google search because i'm interested as well- not from the US hence quite unawares about the whole democratic vs republic debate and how each party's way of thinking affects the rest of the world.

Posted this in the wrong thread initially because I'm so freaking awesome.

[Hairbautt]

I do see McCain as another Bush. I believed Hillary to be the most progressive candidate, but it looks like I'm going Barrack.

[IdolEyes787]

McCain isn't another Bush but it's going to be difficult to distance himself from that perception especially since the Obama camp will be clearly trying to show that he is.
I used to admire Hillary more but she got too desperate to win and used some very negative campaigning to try to turn the tide back in her favor.
I still like her better than Barack though .He just feels artificial to me.
They recently showed some clips comparing him to Bobby Kennedy.He paled in comparison.Kennedy spoke with real passion Obama only delivers lines well.
Still I'd take him over McCain(or most conservatives) any day of the week.

[Skiz]

Hopefully a Yank will comment but with the news we're getting here make it seem like Americans really want a change in direction.
Long time til the actual vote but predictions are a Democratic landslide.

I'm not sure where you're receiving your predictions, but we're a country divided and pretty evenly. Neither party will win by a landslide. Mark my words on that point.

As for the voting trends, it's just too bad there are people don't take the time to look at candidate records.

On social issues, he's more to the left than that many of the Democratic Senate members. That's why he's having a tough time getting the staunch Republican vote. The only things he is conservative on is defense and economics. You look at education, health care, immigration, etc... he's a liberal Democrat, without question.

As someone who lives just a few hours from the southern border, I know I've been more than upset by his stance on immigration and amnesty for illegals. by joining with Ted Kennedy who has the dubious honor of being tagged the "most liberal senator", he showed his lack of respect for the view of the strong majority of Americans who want a secure border and for illegals to respect our laws and abide by them. Amnesty has already been given twice before, ffs!

Also, his stance on 'torture' as a former pow, he should know the difference between humiliation and torture. this was upsetting to me and many others also. I don't advocate torture but humiliations is a great tool to acquire needed Intel that will and has saved hundreds of lives.

We should have learned from history that appeasement is not effective nor does it work to deter a tyrant who is bent on destroying us and others, especially those who do it in the name of "God" and view death as a reward and not a punishment or something to fear.

If elected, I hope he will respect the desires and wishes of the majority of American rather than take the Dems' attitude that they know best for us even when we don't and will do as they please rather than listen to the people.

[tralalala]

So who are you voting for, oh mighty Texan of ours?

[IdolEyes787]

I'm not sure where you're receiving your predictions, but we're a country divided and pretty evenly. Neither party will win by a landslide. Mark my words on that point.

As for the voting trends, it's just too bad there are people don't take the time to look at candidate records.

On social issues, he's more to the left than that many of the Democratic Senate members. That's why he's having a tough time getting the staunch Republican vote. The only things he is conservative on is defense and economics. You look at education, health care, immigration, etc... he's a liberal Democrat, without question.

As someone who lives just a few hours from the southern border, I know I've been more than upset by his stance on immigration and amnesty for illegals. by joining with Ted Kennedy who has the dubious honor of being tagged the "most liberal senator", he showed his lack of respect for the view of the strong majority of Americans who want a secure border and for illegals to respect our laws and abide by them. Amnesty has already been given twice before, ffs!

Also, his stance on 'torture' as a former pow, he should know the difference between humiliation and torture. this was upsetting to me and many others also. I don't advocate torture but humiliations is a great tool to acquire needed Intel that will and has saved hundreds of lives.

We should have learned from history that appeasement is not effective nor does it work to deter a tyrant who is bent on destroying us and others, especially those who do it in the name of "God" and view death as a reward and not a punishment or something to fear.

If elected, I hope he will respect the desires and wishes of the majority of American rather than take the Dems' attitude that they know best for us even when we don't and will do as they please rather than listen to the people.

Predictions of a Democrat sweep were widely reported here.Doesn't make it true though.
I agree that McCain is a very liberal Republican and that he will need the conservatives in his corner to win.
I like economic conservatism by the way I hate the liberal idea that throwing money around will fix any situation..Ted Kennedy ,with all due respect to his present situation, I could live without.
If you don't like open immigration(I'm against it myself,but hey I'm not some poor soul looking for a better life)I suggest you never move to Canada.
Got to disagree with you on the torture bit.Who knows better than McCain what is acceptable treatment of hostiles?
What they do at Gitmo is against the Geneva Convention and is stuff like waterboarding only humiliation?.Hey I'm all for finding these terrorist's and ridding the Earth of every single one but if you take prisoners certain rules must apply(I think the answer might lie in taking fewer prisoners:whistling).
Just a few of my thoughts because like it or not what happenings in American politics effects the whole world.

[The Flying Cow]

Vishnu shall be elected, with Osama as vice.

^Agreed 190% there with Idol. I don't know who you think you are, Skizo, but I'm pretty sure you haven't had more experience than McCain AFA hardcore torture. I'd presume he'll know more about torture/humiliation than yourself.
And keep in mind that the more these "humiliation" tactics as you so politically correctly call them are used, the more angered the fundamentalist muslims will become, and the more arguments the US are giving in their favour. You don't treat dirt with dirt. A cardinal rule. There have to be other methods. This is the damn 21st century goddamn it! The most robust democracy in the world condones this kind of bs? Not acceptable.

[Snee]

Hillary's site confuses me.

http://www.hillaryclinton.com/home/?splash=1

Does she want people to support Obama, or, since she still wants campaign contributions, is that a cunning ruse?

http://www.236.com/news/2008/06/06/hillary_clinton_drops_out_spee_7002.php

[lee551]

i confess i watch a lot of news. the quoted polls (http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2008/president/us/general_election_mccain_vs_obama-225.html) i see usually indicate obama ahead of mccain by ~5%. it goes up and down, but i don't think mccain has ever really been viewed as being ahead.

mccain isn't conservative enough for some republicans, but barack is also the 'most liberal senator.' it's basically a tie, and that's just the popular vote, which of course doesn't really matter.

i personally hope obama wins. mccain is old, confessed he can't use a computer, won't end iraq, and plain awkward.

[Skiz]

McCain doesn't need to be "conservative enough".

Liberal as he is, he's leaps and bounds closer to conservative views than Obama and that gets him those votes. He's the RNC nominee for crying out loud.

I'm not really making any predictions this election at all.... it's just going to be too close.

[Barbarossa]

It's interesting because whoever gets in it is perceived as a new regime, even though McCain and Bush are of the same party.

It'd be an optimistic observer this side of the Atlantic who would expect the same party to be re-elected in the current financial climate.

[Hairbautt]

Do non-Americans really keep up with American politics?

[Snee]

Not I, really, anymore. I don't think it can get any worse, realistically.

Except for sometimes reading merkins blithering on about it in forum threads, and that's to do with boredom on my part.

[wazza100]

@hairbautt- I try to keep myself slightly informed because ultimately the US still being the super powerhouse of the global economy means that their decisions have a massive flow on effect.

[clocker]

In relation to past experience, it is most likely he will become the president.

You've killed logic AND grammar in one fell swoop.
Bravo.

[100%]

I do my best,
however i do not see how i killed logic and grammar in one fell swoop.
Could you fix it so it does not kill logic and grammar, so i may see my failings.
Thank you in advance.

[cuthalion]

Impressive, a Republican woman VP? I'm not speaking of the individual, just the gender, who generally are better than men in their genuine care for others and the planet. But so too, Democrats are generally better than Republicans in their genuine care for others and the planet. Obama's pick for vice president is a much better choice than McCain's pick of Sarah Palin.

[Skiz]

On what grounds?

[BawA]

Can I get a brief summary of what McCain will do if he wins, and what Obama will do if he wins? :huh: Like, sincerely - What does each of them offer to the public of the US and the world in general?

do you really dont know :whistling
it used to be unconditional loyalty to "Israel", dont think because obama has Hossain as middle name anything would change specially when he has BARAK as 1st name.

[tralalala]

Was wondering when you'd pop in for a chat on this matter.. How you doin'? :)

Now down to business - To keep it simple - The US are loyal to Israel just as the Russians are loyal to a bunch of the Arabs.
The Russians sell ammunition to Iran, Syria and whatnot, the US sell ammunition to us.. Where's the problem? Actually, I'm not sure you'd be surfing the net with your uber-l33t PC and driving a car and working at a bank (that IS where you still work, isn't it? :) ) if it weren't for US dosh.. So quit whining about their foreign policies - Their money, their rules.. That's how it works nowadays.

[Something Else]

I Vishnu a Merry Christmas :b3ta:

[chalice]

I Vishnu a Merry Christmas :b3ta:

And a Hari new year.

:drummer:

[tralalala]

:lol: kwalitee

[BawA]

Was wondering when you'd pop in for a chat on this matter.. How you doin'? :)

Now down to business - To keep it simple - The US are loyal to Israel just as the Russians are loyal to a bunch of the Arabs.
The Russians sell ammunition to Iran, Syria and whatnot, the US sell ammunition to us.. Where's the problem? Actually, I'm not sure you'd be surfing the net with your uber-l33t PC and driving a car and working at a bank (that IS where you still work, isn't it? :) ) if it weren't for US dosh.. So quit whining about their foreign policies - Their money, their rules.. That's how it works nowadays.

except Russian have political interest in those countries and US has just Jews Lobby pressure.
US Dosh??
The only thing we may benefit from US is neutralization, as you know US has a old policy of "River side's"(either your are with me or against me), good example was IRAQ and is IRAN and Syria, their against america so US is trying all its best to screw with their economy. Unlike douchebage like Bush we have strong and visionary leaders whom made what UAE is now, Infect as i said before American people are so keen to find opportunity to fly DUBAI, just have look here how British/American are living here.

[LaPistola]

i personally hope obama wins. mccain is old, confessed he can't use a computer, won't end iraq, and plain awkward.
McCain may be old but with age comes wisdom, McCain has been in Senate for almost 30 years as opposed to Obamas 3 years in Senate. Obama only served 141 days in Senate before taking off for the campaign trail. Plus, McCain is a veteran and has proven his character after being held against his will as a POW for five long years, including 3 years of solitary confinement and withstood torture tactics. We should be embracing this sort of character instead of looking for reasons to doubt somebody that has already proven he is heads above most of us.

Obama was a pot head and that fact seems to be overlooked or even supported by many of Obamas supporters. This is a man who was off ripping a bong while McCain was being tortured. Now I ask you who has greater character and more experiece to run a country?

What political experience does Obama have? What major pushes in Seante has he helped to head up? Obama has no business in trying to run country or a war.

The supporters flocking to see Barack give his inspirational speeches would never in a million years be able to tolerate the conditions that McCain endured. If this nation is to once again be a great nation, willing to sacrifice, we will need to embrace the famous words of JFK, "Ask not what your country can do for you - ask what you can do for your country." The men and women in the armed forces over generations have done their part to do for this country. They have proven to be a cut above the rest.

[IdolEyes787]

after being held against his will as a POW

I'm assuming that's how it works.
Unless it's Hogan's Heroes of course.:whistling

[Biggles]

i personally hope obama wins. mccain is old, confessed he can't use a computer, won't end iraq, and plain awkward.
McCain may be old but with age comes wisdom, McCain has been in Senate for almost 30 years as opposed to Obamas 3 years in Senate. Obama only served 141 days in Senate before taking off for the campaign trail. Plus, McCain is a veteran and has proven his character after being held against his will as a POW for five long years, including 3 years of solitary confinement and withstood torture tactics. We should be embracing this sort of character instead of looking for reasons to doubt somebody that has already proven he is heads above most of us.

Obama was a pot head and that fact seems to be overlooked or even supported by many of Obamas supporters. This is a man who was off ripping a bong while McCain was being tortured. Now I ask you who has greater character and more experiece to run a country?

What political experience does Obama have? What major pushes in Seante has he helped to head up? Obama has no business in trying to run country or a war.

The supporters flocking to see Barack give his inspirational speeches would never in a million years be able to tolerate the conditions that McCain endured. If this nation is to once again be a great nation, willing to sacrifice, we will need to embrace the famous words of JFK, "Ask not what your country can do for you - ask what you can do for your country." The men and women in the armed forces over generations have done their part to do for this country. They have proven to be a cut above the rest.

"You can't expect to wield supreme executive power just because some watery tart threw a sword at you!!,"

[LaPistola]

"You can't expect to wield supreme executive power just because some watery tart threw a sword at you!!,"
This is true but when you look at the fact that McCain has been in Senate about 25 years longer than Obama, and Obama is a former pot head who makes light of that fact, who do you think is more qualified to be the next president?

[clocker]

McCain is a veteran and has proven his character... We should be embracing this sort of character instead of looking for reasons to doubt somebody that has already proven he is heads above most of us.



Is this the same "character" he exercised whilst ditching his first wife and three kids to chase after the much younger and far wealthier Cindy?

Yeah.
Thought so.

[chalice]

A few spliffs or even bongs for that matter does not a pothead make.

I should know, I've been monged out for about 20 years. Not saying I could be leader of the Western world, just that I get by quite well.

[clocker]

...Obama is a former pot head who makes light of that fact, who do you think is more qualified to be the next president?
Hmm...curious about your thoughts on GW Bush, who was quite the party boy himself.

[weenden]

mcCain is bush at least his beliefs and another rich son of a bitch trying to take care of the other rich son of a bitch's

[IdolEyes787]

mcCain is bush at least his beliefs and another rich son of a bitch trying to take care of the other rich son of a bitch's

Who says he's rich just because he can't remember exactly how many homes he has.

[weenden]

i can remember how many i own

[sdwillie]

McCain is a veteran and has proven his character... We should be embracing this sort of character instead of looking for reasons to doubt somebody that has already proven he is heads above most of us.



Is this the same "character" he exercised whilst ditching his first wife and three kids to chase after the much younger and far wealthier Cindy?

Yeah.
Thought so.

On that note... How many people thought it funny that while Sarah Palin was introducing herself, McCain was ogling her rack?

[IdolEyes787]

That simply shows his good judgment.

[clocker]

That simply shows his good judgment.
To quote LaPistola:
"With age comes wisdom".

[sdwillie]

That simply shows his good judgment.
To quote LaPistola:
I'll admit I didn't see it until a second viewing. But that's because I spent most of the first doing the same.

[IdolEyes787]

@clocker and rheumatism.

[brotherdoobie]

That simply shows his good judgment.
To quote LaPistola:
"With age comes Viagra".


:mellow:



-bd

[IdolEyes787]

And the aged cum with Viagra.

[LaPistola]

...Obama is a former pot head who makes light of that fact, who do you think is more qualified to be the next president?
Hmm...curious about your thoughts on GW Bush, who was quite the party boy himself.
You are totally overlooking the main part of that post, the experience is the main fact I am pushing, the nearly 25 more years of political experience over Obama is the main thing, I just do not think that the man who is a serious candidate for the presidency should joke about the fact that he was involved in recreational drugs.
"I did inhale... The point was to inhale. That was the point."
"I was feeling really tense, so I needed a joint"
Just two examples.

But to address your point, I do not like Bush, he lied to the public and started a war based on lies. Then, he mismanaged the war in Afghanistan and entered into Iraq to finish his daddy's war. Under Bushes presidency the USA has gone down the shit hole. Not saying it is all his fault, but it sure doesn't look good on him when in his 8 years the deficit has grown to nearly a half trillion and federal spending increased by nearly 40%. Plus the housing market is down and the price of food going up because of government subsidies to grow corn to make ethanol, which will never be a viable alternative energy. Then to top it off salaries are going down and the price of everything is going up, and the worth of the dollar is falling daily.

I don't vote based on party, I vote based on who would do the best job and I believe that McCain is more suited to be running the country in this time of war and economic turmoil.

[LaPistola]

mcCain is bush at least his beliefs and another rich son of a bitch trying to take care of the other rich son of a bitch's
Go read, this is a nice generalization but give some facts to back up your statements. I think you will find that McCain and Bush's beliefs are very different on many matters.

[brotherdoobie]

mcCain is bush at least his beliefs and another rich son of a bitch trying to take care of the other rich son of a bitch's
Go read, this is a nice generalization but give some facts to back up your statements. I think you will find that McCain and Bush's beliefs are very different on many matters.


Facts are tedious. Generalities based on facts - are where it's at, kid.



-bd :snooty:

[Biggles]

"You can't expect to wield supreme executive power just because some watery tart threw a sword at you!!,"
This is true but when you look at the fact that McCain has been in Senate about 25 years longer than Obama, and Obama is a former pot head who makes light of that fact, who do you think is more qualified to be the next president?

It is going to get very difficult to find candidates under the age of 50 that haven't smoked a joint or two especially as most if not all Presidents are college graduates.

What is one to do when the old codgers have all croaked?

I have nothing against McCain btw, he seems a lot more articulate than the current incumbent (but then so do Bill and Ben).

[chalice]

That's a hella lot of repeating yourself.

[LaPistola]

This is true but when you look at the fact that McCain has been in Senate about 25 years longer than Obama, and Obama is a former pot head who makes light of that fact, who do you think is more qualified to be the next president?

It is going to get very difficult to find candidates under the age of 50 that haven't smoked a joint or two especially as most if not all Presidents are college graduates.

What is one to do when the old codgers have all croaked?

I have nothing against McCain btw, he seems a lot more articulate than the current incumbent (but then so do Bill and Ben).

I will repeat myself


You are totally overlooking the main part of that post, the experience is the main fact I am pushing, the nearly 25 more years of political experience over Obama is the main thing, I just do not think that the man who is a serious candidate for the presidency should joke about the fact that he was involved in recreational drugs.
"I did inhale... The point was to inhale. That was the point."
"I was feeling really tense, so I needed a joint"
Just two examples.


Don't get me wrong I do smoke on the occasion and it may seem a bit hypocritical, but I just believe that the president of the USA should be held to a higher standard than the average citizen. The president should be the best of the best.

[Biggles]

It is going to get very difficult to find candidates under the age of 50 that haven't smoked a joint or two especially as most if not all Presidents are college graduates.

What is one to do when the old codgers have all croaked?

I have nothing against McCain btw, he seems a lot more articulate than the current incumbent (but then so do Bill and Ben).

I will repeat myself


You are totally overlooking the main part of that post, the experience is the main fact I am pushing, the nearly 25 more years of political experience over Obama is the main thing, I just do not think that the man who is a serious candidate for the presidency should joke about the fact that he was involved in recreational drugs.
"I did inhale... The point was to inhale. That was the point."
"I was feeling really tense, so I needed a joint"
Just two examples.


Don't get me wrong I do smoke on the occasion and it may seem a bit hypocritical, but I just believe that the president of the USA should be held to a higher standard than the average citizen. The president should be the best of the best.

Laudable sentiments.....so GW and Bill were the best of the best? Or is this a new principle you are putting forward

[LaPistola]

I am not saying any president has been the best of the best sometimes you just have to pick the lesser of two evils.

[clocker]

You are totally overlooking the main part of that post, the experience is the main fact I am pushing, the nearly 25 more years of political experience over Obama is the main thing
So, if "experience" is your main criteria I assume that Ted Kennedy would be your dream candidate.
It may or may not be of interest to note that of the longest serving current Senators, the vast majority are Democrats. The top Republican is Ted Stevens and he has a few issues to deal with (Federal indictment for corruption).

Essentially, I reject the whole idea that being a Senator (inexperienced or no) somehow prepares you for the Presidency.

[brotherdoobie]

^ I concur. My computer science professor has taught for 15 years. He was/is an idiot.
Experience is often over rated.


-bd

[nemrac]

Does it really make a difference?

[Defy]

Either way history is changing. We're either going to get a black male president or a woman VP. Personally, I would like it if we get the "Bush" thinkers out of office and a new fresh face in there to get our piss-poor economy back on track. I already know how McCain thinks as he's been running the state I live in for years... the only thing I really agree on is his stand on illegal immigration, but other than that... I think I'll be voting for Obama.

[LaPistola]

Does it really make a difference?
Yes, who the next president is, does believe it or not, make a difference.

[bornwithnoname]

I will be voting for the VPilf. I mean Mcain

[weenden]

my facts are fuck mccain and the the fuckin boat he and his rich fucks came in on ......................

[j2k4]

So then, "the best of the best" = "the lesser of two evils"?

[j2k4]

Either way history is changing.

Sorry, I couldn't get beyond this. :whistling

[j2k4]

my facts are fuck mccain and the the fuckin boat he and his rich fucks came in on ......................

So vote for Obama, 'cuz he's not a rich fuck?

Shirley you joust. :whistling

[Something Else]

Either way history is changing.

Sorry, I couldn't get beyond this. :whistling

:lol:


Why did zed make a thread about chips anyway. Deep.

http://www.planetnewmedia.co.uk/archive/mccain/imgs/about/straight_img.jpg

[chalice]

:lol:

Chips for Prez ftw!!!

[j2k4]

:lol:

Chips for Prez ftw!!!

You know it makes cents.

I actually have some of them in my freezer. :dabs:

[LaPistola]

So then, "the best of the best" = "the lesser of two evils"?
When there are only two serious candidates and neither are the best of the best, then the lesser of two evils is all you have.:pinch:

[Eargasm]

McBush is an old fart who has had cancer 4 times and picked a running mate of questionable character who has been governor of Alaska for just shy of 20 months. If he dies I don't want her. That said, I don't want McBush either. He's a warmonger and he's going senile, but he is a talented politician.

On the other hand, Obama isn't perfect. He's an intellectual. More and more I see that he can be tough though, and he also picked one of the toughest possible running mates. If something were to happen with Barack I'd feel that our country is safe for the duration of the term.

Additionally, Obama favors a stronger dollar. He wants to reverse Bush's policies that resulted in people making less money but everything costing more. McBush wants to continue those Bush policies and expand on them by giving the rich even more tax breaks that would benefit he powerful buddies very much. He is so out of touch with the little guy.

At least Obama knows what it means to make ends meet.

[j2k4]

At least Obama knows what it means to make ends meet.

Yes, and he's for cheap arugula, too.

[clocker]

At least Obama knows what it means to make ends meet.

Yes, and he's for cheap arugula, too.
I'm sure that McCain, our working class hero, doesn't know what "arugula" is.
It's a good thing we have all these blue collar Republicans to keep us grounded or we'd be a nation of effete pantywaists.

[j2k4]

Yes, and he's for cheap arugula, too.
I'm sure that McCain, our working class hero, doesn't know what "arugula" is.
It's a good thing we have all these blue collar Republicans to keep us grounded or we'd be a nation of effete pantywaists.

Just so.

[100%]

http://b.imagehost.org/0288/poll.png

[IdolEyes787]

He's a warmonger and he's going senile, but he is a talented politician.



It didn't seemed to hurt Ronald Raygun who, if memory serves me right,was one of American's most beloved Presidents.

Added plus McCain was a real war hero(Silver and Bronze stars. Purple cross),Regan of played one in the movies.

That said as the spawn of leftists, given the opportunity, I would have a very hard time ever voting for him.

But then again with that kind of lack of support in France I might be persuaded.:rolleyes:

[Innocence]

I just have this weird feeling McCain will win, Obamas pro abortion, all the hick states will probably vote McCain just because of that, that and they won't vote for a Black guy. Sad but true.

[Biggles]

Yes, and he's for cheap arugula, too.
I'm sure that McCain, our working class hero, doesn't know what "arugula" is.
It's a good thing we have all these blue collar Republicans to keep us grounded or we'd be a nation of effete pantywaists.

He is down to his last couple of dozen houses non?

Palin is a bit scary actually and anybody who has flirted with supporting Pat Buchanan needs the bumps on their head felt.

[j2k4]

Just who is scary depends on your point-of-view, Les.

Yours differs from that of most Americans.

[clocker]

Since McCain's campaign director has stated that this election "is not about issues", feeling "the bumps on their head" will probably be all you get.
Last night we learned- because somehow after 18 fuckin months of campaigning we apparently hadn't gotten it yet- that 40 years ago McCain was a POW and treated poorly.
What he's done since then would be "issue related", hence "not relevant".

He is however a "maverick"...Repub speak for "batshit crazy"...which should play well to the masses.

Palin has been secretly running a National Guard offensive against the Russians- who knew?- but the details are very hush-hush. Even the talking head from the campaign isn't quite sure what they are.
Since the Russkis haven't overrun the Juneau Peninsula yet however, we can only assume she's been kickin ass and takin names, so her qualifications are unquestionable.
She'll probably replace Petraeus.

Don't worry Biggles, everything is under control.

[j2k4]

Don't worry Biggles, everything is under control.

You could've left it at that. ;)

[Biggles]

Just who is scary depends on your point-of-view, Les.

Yours differs from that of most Americans.

Joan Rivers, anybody who has been a guest on Jerry Springer.

[brotherdoobie]

I'm sure that McCain, our working class hero, doesn't know what "arugula" is.
It's a good thing we have all these blue collar Republicans to keep us grounded or we'd be a nation of effete pantywaists.

He is down to his last couple of dozen houses non?

Palin is a bit scary actually and anybody who has flirted with supporting Pat Buchanan needs the bumps on their head felt.

I take it that you don't believe it's "Gods will" for America to build a natural-gas pipe line in the Alaskan National Wildlife Refuge.

-bd

[Biggles]

He is down to his last couple of dozen houses non?

Palin is a bit scary actually and anybody who has flirted with supporting Pat Buchanan needs the bumps on their head felt.

I take it that you don't believe it's "Gods will" for America to build a natural-gas pipe line in the Alaskan National Wildlife Refuge.

-bd

In gold we trust sort of thing?

[brotherdoobie]

I take it that you don't believe it's "Gods will" for America to build a natural-gas pipe line in the Alaskan National Wildlife Refuge.

-bd

In gold we trust sort of thing?

Apparently.


-bd :dabs:

[j2k4]

I take it that you don't believe it's "Gods will" for America to build a natural-gas pipe line in the Alaskan National Wildlife Refuge.

-bd

In gold we trust sort of thing?

Someone - either one of you will do - tell me exactly why a natural gas pipeline in/through ANWR is a bad idea, and/or who would it hurt.

Do it now.

I will reply by reciting a short litany of those who would benefit.

[brotherdoobie]

In gold we trust sort of thing?

Someone - either one of you will do - tell me exactly why a natural gas pipeline in/through ANWR is a bad idea, and/or who would it hurt.

Do it now.

I will reply by reciting a short litany of those who would benefit.

I rarely debate politics. It's not my cup of tea. I prefer to let my vote speak for me (talking about politics - bores me to tears, mostly).

I wasn't really questioning the idea of a pipeline in/through ANWR. However, I find it ridiculous that Palin claims it's "Gods will" to do so.


-bd

[j2k4]

Someone - either one of you will do - tell me exactly why a natural gas pipeline in/through ANWR is a bad idea, and/or who would it hurt.

Do it now.

I will reply by reciting a short litany of those who would benefit.

I rarely debate politics. It's not my cup of tea. I prefer to let my vote speak for me (talking about politics - bores me to tears, mostly).

I wasn't really questioning the idea of a pipeline in/through ANWR. However, I find it ridiculous that Palin claims it's "Gods will" to do so.


-bd

Ah.

So you object on religious grounds. :dabs:

[brotherdoobie]

I rarely debate politics. It's not my cup of tea. I prefer to let my vote speak for me (talking about politics - bores me to tears, mostly).

I wasn't really questioning the idea of a pipeline in/through ANWR. However, I find it ridiculous that Palin claims it's "Gods will" to do so.


-bd

Ah.

So you object on religious grounds. :dabs:

I don't like the fact...that she professes to know what God's will is. It's arrogant and offensive.


-bd :dabs:

[cuthalion]

This isn't original, I got it off the web.

As a military member residing in Alaska with a child old enough to enter kindergarten in most states and a wife whom has worked in education for the state of Alaska, Sarah Palin is not the candidate you wish to support if education is high on your list of priorities. Schools in her state (specifically the Fairbanks area, interior Alaska) are not in accordance with the "No Child Left Behind” Act of 2001 signed into law by President Bush. They lack Special Education teachers and tutors for special needs students and students behind the learning curve on the suggested curriculum. Alaska does not fund its schools using state taxes. Rather, it uses federal income tax to fund its schools. Alaska schools refuse to become Title I schools. Title I schools are those schools required under the “No Child Left Behind” Act of 2001 to provide supplemental instruction to students that are special needs or falling behind in their curriculum. The state of Alaska, under Governor Palin, has cut the aforementioned programs that the federal money was intended to provide for by labeling these students other than special needs in the areas stated and not classifying as Title I. In doing so the State of Alaska, under Governor Palin, deceptively has accepted federal money for services not rendered, while continuing the permanent dividend fund. She is quite a reformer indeed. This is quite a disturbing revelation considered she has mothered a special needs child.

[enoughfakefiles]

I prefer Aunt Bessie's.

[Biggles]

In gold we trust sort of thing?

Someone - either one of you will do - tell me exactly why a natural gas pipeline in/through ANWR is a bad idea, and/or who would it hurt.

Do it now.

I will reply by reciting a short litany of those who would benefit.

Generally a nature reserve is left pretty much untouched. Is it proposed that the pipeline be buried out of view or it going to be one of those cheap jobs that blight the scenery and rust and leak like anything?

Why can't the pipe go around the nature reserve if it is one of the above ground jobs?

Beneficiaries? Exxon etc., :shifty: I doubt it would make petrol cheaper.

[j2k4]

[QUOTE=j2k4;2957444]

Someone - either one of you will do - tell me exactly why a natural gas pipeline in/through ANWR is a bad idea, and/or who would it hurt.

Do it now.

I will reply by reciting a short litany of those who would benefit.


Generally a nature reserve is left pretty much untouched. Is it proposed that the pipeline be buried out of view or it going to be one of those cheap jobs that blight the scenery and rust and leak like anything?

Okay, first some perspective, and leaving aside the pipeline for a moment:

All of the United Kingdom (if Google is to be trusted) comprises just under 60 million acres.

Alaska comes in at seven times that size - 420 million acres.

ANWR is 19 million acres, or about one-third the size of the entire United Kingdom.

All of which begs a wee, tiny question - are there any pipelines anywhere in the UK that are regarded as the blight of, what...Olde Blighty?

Would anyone here seriously posit this vast track of land has been or will be blighted by (in the case of drilling in ANWR) the use of three thousand acres?

Pipelines are homely, yes.

Convince me, in light of the above information, of the overwhelming weight of opinion relative to looks.

If it bothers you, give it a coat of paint, ffs.

If we drilled for oil in ANWR, I could drop you anywhere in the preserve and you would likely not even find the pipeline for six months.


Why can't the pipe go around the nature reserve if it is one of the above ground jobs?

See above.


Beneficiaries? Exxon etc., :shifty: I doubt it would make petrol cheaper.

So?

What about the 700,000 jobs to build and run the operation?

How could gasoline not be at least slightly cheaper?

Not to mention the positive effect of providing our own oil, rather than supporting Wahabbist Saudi church-schools by purchasing from the mid-east?

Need I go on? :whistling

[clocker]

What about the 700,000 jobs to build and run the operation?
Where did this number come from?
How would you dump even a fraction of that many people into a wildlife refuge without adverse effects?

How could gasoline not be at least slightly cheaper?
Let me count the ways...
-It is unknown what kind of oil may be under the ground there. If it ain't light, sweet crude, it isn't going to be gasoline anyway.

-"The total production from ANWR would be between 0.4 and 1.2 percent of total world oil consumption in 2030. Consequently, ANWR oil production is not projected to have a large impact on world oil prices. Furthermore, the Energy Information Administration does not feel ANWR will affect the global price of oil when past behaviors of the oil market are considered. "The opening of ANWR is projected to have its largest oil price reduction impacts as follows: a reduction in low-sulfur, light crude oil prices of $0.41 per barrel (2006 dollars) in 2026 for the low oil resource case, $0.75 per barrel in 2025 for the mean oil resource case, and $1.44 per barrel in 2027 for the high oil resource case, relative to the reference case." "Assuming that world oil markets continue to work as they do today, the Organization of Petroleum Exporting Countries (OPEC) could neutralize any potential price impact of ANWR oil production by reducing its oil exports by an equal amount."(source:United States Energy Information Dept./wiki)"

Not to mention the positive effect of providing our own oil, rather than supporting Wahabbist Saudi church-schools by purchasing from the mid-east?
Our largest supplier of crude oil is Canada, so we'd better beware the beavers as well.
Until we wean ourselves from a gasoline based lifestyle, we will ALWAYS be in thrall to external suppliers...even a best-case scenario in Alaska will not make a dent in our demand.
Besides, faced with increasing demand from China and India- two economies that actually have money to spend and are much closer to the wellhead- OPEC will find it increasingly hard to maintain "favored trader" status with the US, no matter what we do.

Need I go on? :whistling
Yes, you do.

[clocker]

BTW...I find this ironic and pathetically amusing:

Claim Number One in the Kerry Campaign: John Kerry is eminently qualified to be Commander in Chief of our military and to lead the war against terrorism because of his service as a courageous young soldier in the 1960's. No one can dispute that John Kerry volunteered to go into military service and won several medals during his time in the Vietnam War. John Kerry's courage as a young man in the jungles of Vietnam will forever deserve the gratitude and admiration of our nation. However, courage as a young soldier does not automatically translate into wisdom as an older politician.
Four years ago, when neither Republican candidate had any military service to speak of, being a military hero was considered to be a non-qualification. Kerry was keelhauled- or "Swift-boated"- by the Republican right.
What is today being claimed as John McCain's greatest asset?
His military service.

[cuthalion]

Check out details of Matanuska Maid Dairy in Alaska under governor Sarah Palin, and you'll ask yourself, "Why was I thinking she could help run the country?"

http://confrontaal.blogspot.com/2008/09/sarah-palin-and-mat-maid-scandal-final.html

[clocker]

Check out details of Matanuska Maid Dairy in Alaska under governor Sarah Palin, and you'll ask yourself, "Why was I thinking she could help run the country?"

http://confrontaal.blogspot.com/2008/09/sarah-palin-and-mat-maid-scandal-final.html
Clearly just the ranting of the liberal press.
And probably sexist too.

She MUST be qualified...she has a vagina.

[brotherdoobie]

BTW...I find this ironic and pathetically amusing:

Claim Number One in the Kerry Campaign: John Kerry is eminently qualified to be Commander in Chief of our military and to lead the war against terrorism because of his service as a courageous young soldier in the 1960's. No one can dispute that John Kerry volunteered to go into military service and won several medals during his time in the Vietnam War. John Kerry's courage as a young man in the jungles of Vietnam will forever deserve the gratitude and admiration of our nation. However, courage as a young soldier does not automatically translate into wisdom as an older politician.
Four years ago, when neither Republican candidate had any military service to speak of, being a military hero was considered to be a non-qualification. Kerry was keelhauled- or "Swift-boated"- by the Republican right.
What is today being claimed as John McCain's greatest asset?
His military service.


It should be duly noted; that President Bush served with the Air National Guard - proudly defending Texas and Alabama from the Viet Cong.


-bd :mellow:

[clocker]

It should be duly noted; that President Bush served with the Air National Guard - proudly defending Texas and Alabama from the Viet Cong.

And to this very day neither state has gone Commie, so he did a hell of a job.

Did you know that McCain was a POW and Palin hunts wolves from helicopters?
Somehow, that makes me feel safer.
USA! USA! USA!

[IdolEyes787]

I thought they banned helicopter hunts?

[SpatulaGeekGirl]

http://img225.imageshack.us/my.php?image=1220642014561tg1.jpg

[enoughfakefiles]

I thought they banned helicopter hunts?

Are helicopters endangered species now :unsure:

[enoughfakefiles]

I thought they banned helicopter hunts?

Are helicopters endangered species now :unsure:

[brotherdoobie]

http://img225.imageshack.us/my.php?image=1220642014561tg1.jpg


Noice. How's it going, SGG?



-bd :happy:

[clocker]

I thought they banned helicopter hunts?
No. (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/glenn-hurowitz/sarah-palins-cruel-streak_b_123388.html)

[IdolEyes787]

I thought they banned helicopter hunts?

Are helicopters endangered species now :unsure:

No but there's enough pressure on them that the government is considering a 3 Bell limit.

[IdolEyes787]

I thought they banned helicopter hunts?
No. (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/glenn-hurowitz/sarah-palins-cruel-streak_b_123388.html)


Cunt.

[j2k4]

What about the 700,000 jobs to build and run the operation?
Where did this number come from?
How would you dump even a fraction of that many people into a wildlife refuge without adverse effects?

How could gasoline not be at least slightly cheaper?
Let me count the ways...
-It is unknown what kind of oil may be under the ground there. If it ain't light, sweet crude, it isn't going to be gasoline anyway.

-"The total production from ANWR would be between 0.4 and 1.2 percent of total world oil consumption in 2030. Consequently, ANWR oil production is not projected to have a large impact on world oil prices. Furthermore, the Energy Information Administration does not feel ANWR will affect the global price of oil when past behaviors of the oil market are considered. "The opening of ANWR is projected to have its largest oil price reduction impacts as follows: a reduction in low-sulfur, light crude oil prices of $0.41 per barrel (2006 dollars) in 2026 for the low oil resource case, $0.75 per barrel in 2025 for the mean oil resource case, and $1.44 per barrel in 2027 for the high oil resource case, relative to the reference case." "Assuming that world oil markets continue to work as they do today, the Organization of Petroleum Exporting Countries (OPEC) could neutralize any potential price impact of ANWR oil production by reducing its oil exports by an equal amount."(source:United States Energy Information Dept./wiki)"

Not to mention the positive effect of providing our own oil, rather than supporting Wahabbist Saudi church-schools by purchasing from the mid-east?
Our largest supplier of crude oil is Canada, so we'd better beware the beavers as well.
Until we wean ourselves from a gasoline based lifestyle, we will ALWAYS be in thrall to external suppliers...even a best-case scenario in Alaska will not make a dent in our demand.
Besides, faced with increasing demand from China and India- two economies that actually have money to spend and are much closer to the wellhead- OPEC will find it increasingly hard to maintain "favored trader" status with the US, no matter what we do.

Need I go on? :whistling
Yes, you do.

Then I will, but tomorrow, rather than tonight.

I'm gonna have some ice cream and kick back. :dabs:

[clocker]

I'm gonna have some ice cream and kick back. :dabs:
On this at least, we are in total agreement.
Ice cream>internet bullshit.

Did you know that Haagen Daz dropped (as in, STOPPED MAKING!!) Vanilla Fudge?
Fukkin elitist, fake Scandinavian bastards.

They've stopped responding to my calls....

[j2k4]

I'm gonna have some ice cream and kick back. :dabs:
On this at least, we are in total agreement.
Ice cream>internet bullshit.

Did you know that Haagen Daz dropped (as in, STOPPED MAKING!!) Vanilla Fudge?
Fukkin elitist, fake Scandinavian bastards.

They've stopped responding to my calls....

That's socialism for you.

Vanilla fudge shortages, ftw.

[brotherdoobie]

Ben and Jerry's > *



-bd :wub:

[clocker]

Ben and Jerry's > *



Sorry, inferior mouthfeel.

Best ice cream ever is from the University of Wisconsin's Agriculture School (Dairy division), sold in the student union hall in Madison.
Supposedly, the U. of Pennsylvania's is equally as good but I can't confirm this.

If I lived in Madison I'd be a bleedin blimp in no time.

[j2k4]

What about the 700,000 jobs to build and run the operation?
Where did this number come from?
How would you dump even a fraction of that many people into a wildlife refuge without adverse effects?

How could gasoline not be at least slightly cheaper?
Let me count the ways...
-It is unknown what kind of oil may be under the ground there. If it ain't light, sweet crude, it isn't going to be gasoline anyway.

-"The total production from ANWR would be between 0.4 and 1.2 percent of total world oil consumption in 2030. Consequently, ANWR oil production is not projected to have a large impact on world oil prices. Furthermore, the Energy Information Administration does not feel ANWR will affect the global price of oil when past behaviors of the oil market are considered. "The opening of ANWR is projected to have its largest oil price reduction impacts as follows: a reduction in low-sulfur, light crude oil prices of $0.41 per barrel (2006 dollars) in 2026 for the low oil resource case, $0.75 per barrel in 2025 for the mean oil resource case, and $1.44 per barrel in 2027 for the high oil resource case, relative to the reference case." "Assuming that world oil markets continue to work as they do today, the Organization of Petroleum Exporting Countries (OPEC) could neutralize any potential price impact of ANWR oil production by reducing its oil exports by an equal amount."(source:United States Energy Information Dept./wiki)"

Not to mention the positive effect of providing our own oil, rather than supporting Wahabbist Saudi church-schools by purchasing from the mid-east?
Our largest supplier of crude oil is Canada, so we'd better beware the beavers as well.
Until we wean ourselves from a gasoline based lifestyle, we will ALWAYS be in thrall to external suppliers...even a best-case scenario in Alaska will not make a dent in our demand.
Besides, faced with increasing demand from China and India- two economies that actually have money to spend and are much closer to the wellhead- OPEC will find it increasingly hard to maintain "favored trader" status with the US, no matter what we do.

Need I go on? :whistling
Yes, you do.

Okay, in order:

The 700K number comes from a 1997 study commissioned in response to the original decision to remove ANWR from consideration for drilling.

Currently ANWR.org estimates job generation could/would fall anywhere between 250K and 735K.

Check here, if you like:

http://www.anwr.org/topten.htm

Never mind "dumping" a fraction of those people into a wildlife refuge - dump twice that many, and they'd still be lost in an area that size.

700K divided by 3K = 230-odd people per acre.

Not many at all, considering it as an industrial site.

Besides which, what "adverse" effect do you refer to, and, on top of that, who are you (or Uncle Sam, for that matter) to tell Alaskan citizens they can't do something that is good for them and the rest of our country?

Really, now - what's it to you, as long as it's done right?

As to precisely what type of oil is under ANWR, I'm sure some forecasting can be done, but again, if whatever-it-is roughly fits the definition of "oil", it will be of benefit, even ignoring the boon of jobs.

Gasoline isn't the only consideration; we have tons of other uses for petroleum, as you know.

As to this...

-"The total production from ANWR would be between 0.4 and 1.2 percent of total world oil consumption in 2030. Consequently, ANWR oil production is not projected to have a large impact on world oil prices.

...I would ask, if you claim it cannot even be known what type of crude you will find, how can this info be treated as gospel?

Bottom line:

We know there's a shitload of oil, but we cannot know anything else to any degree of precision, apart from the fact it will have a beneficial effect on prices, and we have no further to look for evidence of that than the reaction (price-wise) to Bush's statement urging more drilling, and that's a fact.

As to the rest, China and India aside, I daresay even the Canadians might be offended at being equated with Saudi Arabia, Venezuela and the like.

The more we do for ourselves, the less we'll need done by others - fact.

I'd also like an answer to this question:

What is the point, even if we are running short of oil, and need to develop alternatives, of leaving a single drop of it in the ground?

[clocker]

We know there's a shitload of oil...
We "know" nothing of the sort.
Oil company geologists suspect there may be oil based on similar geological formations in other areas but what may be underneath the ANWR site is pure speculation.
...but we cannot know anything else to any degree of precision, apart from the fact it will have a beneficial effect on prices...
A minimal effect on prices which won't even occur for a few decades.
... and we have no further to look for evidence of that than the reaction (price-wise) to Bush's statement urging more drilling, and that's a fact.
Which just goes to show that oil prices- like every other commodity- are based more on perception than reality. In fact, oil prices- unlike say, orange futures- is almost completely untethered to actual availability.
Just look at how pump prices rise before a national holiday (July 4th, for instance) and then drop immediately after...is this because production changed?
No, the oil companies predict a rise in demand and increase prices to make more money.
Since demand is only going to increase, history shows that price will increase with it.


I'd also like an answer to this question:

What is the point, even if we are running short of oil, and need to develop alternatives, of leaving a single drop of it in the ground?
Why ask me?
Ask the oil companies.
Currently, less than a quarter of the 40 million acres of land that they already lease is under development.
Why is that?
Bush/Cheney have already overridden environmental protections, loosened licensing procedures and provided tax incentives - effectively given the land away (the average cost to the oil companies is approximately $3 per year per acre for these leases) and what have they done with it?
Absolutely nothing.

You want to drill for every last drop...fine, let's start with land that oil companies already control- land that's within the continental US (lower transportation cost) and far less challenging climate-wise.

Edit:
In addition...
You do realize that there is absolutely no prohibition against exporting oil from any of the US sites?
Given that all our refineries are privately owned by multinational corporations whose #1 priority is profit, what guarantee do we have that oil produced from ANWR will even end up in US gas stations?

[brotherdoobie]

Ben and Jerry's > *



Sorry, inferior mouthfeel.

Best ice cream ever is from the University of Wisconsin's Agriculture School (Dairy division), sold in the student union hall in Madison.
Supposedly, the U. of Pennsylvania's is equally as good but I can't confirm this.

If I lived in Madison I'd be a bleedin blimp in no time.

I'll take your word for it, Clocker. Those Badgers know their dairy.
Fact.


-bd

[clocker]

Never mind "dumping" a fraction of those people into a wildlife refuge - dump twice that many, and they'd still be lost in an area that size.

700K divided by 3K = 230-odd people per acre.

Not many at all, considering it as an industrial site.


Except we've designated it as a Federal Wildlife Preserve, which is a bit different.

Putting an oil derrick in your front yard isn't all that intrusive "considering it as an industrial site".

[brotherdoobie]

Never mind "dumping" a fraction of those people into a wildlife refuge - dump twice that many, and they'd still be lost in an area that size.

700K divided by 3K = 230-odd people per acre.

Not many at all, considering it as an industrial site.What about "dumping" 700k people in an area a quarter of that size? It's my understanding - that they (the people) will be heavily packed; into a much smaller area.


-bd

[j2k4]

Never mind "dumping" a fraction of those people into a wildlife refuge - dump twice that many, and they'd still be lost in an area that size.

700K divided by 3K = 230-odd people per acre.

Not many at all, considering it as an industrial site.


Except we've designated it as a Federal Wildlife Preserve, which is a bit different.

Putting an oil derrick in your front yard isn't all that intrusive "considering it as an industrial site".

Who's this "we"?

What about the citizens of Alaska?

If they don't mind oil derricks why should you or anyone else?

Can you see Alaska from your place?

[j2k4]

Never mind "dumping" a fraction of those people into a wildlife refuge - dump twice that many, and they'd still be lost in an area that size.

700K divided by 3K = 230-odd people per acre.

Not many at all, considering it as an industrial site.What about "dumping" 700k people in an area a quarter of that size? It's my understanding - that they (the people) will be heavily packed; into a much smaller area.


-bd

I don't follow, BD. :huh:

[clocker]

Who's this "we"?

What about the citizens of Alaska?

"We" would be the entirety of the US population.
ANWR is FEDERAL property, not state controlled.
Sarah Palin's opinion about it's use carries no more weight than mine (at least in theory).

On June 9th the BLM auctioned off 55,000 acres of the Roan Plateau in Colorado to oil/gas producers despite significant public opposition.
Since "Drill, Baby, Drill" is the new Republican mantra, presumably that deed is ok, huh?
State's rights are fine as long as they don't get in the way of energy producers?

[j2k4]

[QUOTE=j2k4;2961641]

Who's this "we"?

What about the citizens of Alaska?


"We" would be the entirety of the US population.
ANWR is FEDERAL property, not state controlled.
Sarah Palin's opinion about it's use carries no more weight than mine (at least in theory).

Then your use of the term "we" must be considered theoretical as well; I have no memory of being consulted on the matter of land use in Alaska, and I'm pretty sure you don't, either.


On June 9th the BLM auctioned off 55,000 acres of the Roan Plateau in Colorado to oil/gas producers despite significant public opposition.
Since "Drill, Baby, Drill" is the new Republican mantra, presumably that deed is ok, huh?
State's rights are fine as long as they don't get in the way of energy producers?

How does that apply, especially since there was public opposition?

BTW-

Colorado has just over 93 million acres, and you are griping over 55,000.

ANWR (once again) is, by itself, 19 million acres, and approximately 3,000 would be subject to development.

Perhaps if the Roan Plateau weren't Federal land, this deal you object to wouldn't even have taken place.

Seems to me you've forgotten that the central player in all this is supposed to be the people, not the state; after all, we are not Communists.

[clocker]

Well, too bad the point is moot...McCain opposes drilling in ANWR.

Oh wait, does he?
I guess we'll have to see what Sarah tells him to do.

[j2k4]

Well, too bad the point is moot...McCain opposes drilling in ANWR.

Oh wait, does he?
I guess we'll have to see what Sarah tells him to do.

That was my thought, too. :D

[clocker]

It's interesting, McCain seems almost irrelevant to his own campaign.

[twist off]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_TiQCJXpbKg

I LAWLD. True Story.

[j2k4]

It's interesting, McCain seems almost irrelevant to his own campaign.

True enough; between Sarah Palin and Cindy McCain, he can get kinda lost.

BTW-

Have you noticed the colors Mrs. Mac has been wearing lately.

Egad.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_TiQCJXpbKg

I LAWLD. True Story.

I am not humor-impaired, but I didn't get it.

Given the injuries McCain has suffered, we'll never know if he can boogie like Obama, much less do it with a lesbian.

Or is Barak's tremendous sex-appeal your point.

He still has those World-Cup ears, y'know. :dabs:

[TrAnCeTaSTiC]

McCain is a mini-Bush who will keep our troops in Iraq and continue to blow billions of tax payers dollars on the war. Obama offers socialized healthcare for the nation... at the cost of raising our taxes a considerable amount in an already depreciating economy. That's all I really care about at this point, getting our economy back on track. So which is going to be the lesser of two evils? :huh:

[100%]

I have a bad feeling about this election.

[chalice]

I have a bad feeling about this election.

So do 50% of Catholic priests.

No wait...

I thought 'election' was a typo.

Never mind. Carry on.

[100%]

I am grateful for this thread's uber fail.

[j2k4]

I am grateful for this thread's uber fail.

Given the vagueness of it's premise, failure is difficult to discern.

The source of your gratitude is another question altogether. :dabs: