What.cd is spying on Filesharingtalk

[Hombre]

This is one of the latest tricks. Basically what they do is set up a page which can’t be viewed by browser which is full of links the css checks to see if those links have been visited before if so it uses the content css tag to log your ip and which page you’ve viewed. Example of urls checked:


filesharingtalk.com/vb3/f-bittorrent-trades-158/t-have-and-need-404169
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/f-bittorrent-trades-158/t-have-scc-whatcd-and-hdcorea-406264
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/f-bittorrent-trades-158/t-have-whatcd-invite-404989
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/f-bittorrent-trades-158/t-i-have-397931
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/f-bittorrent-trades-158/t-need-whatcd-409732
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/f-bittorrent-trades-158/t-need-whatcd-invite-404800
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/f-bittorrent-trades-158/t-whatcd-409821
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/newreply.php?do=newreply&noquote=1&p=3265225
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/newreply.php?do=newreply&noquote=1&p=3422154
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/newthread.php?do=newthread&f=158
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/private.php?do=showpm&pmid=2452085
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/private.php?do=showpm&pmid=2452962
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/private.php?do=showpm&pmid=2454090
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/private.php?do=showpm&pmid=2456112
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/private.php?do=showpm&pmid=2456287
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/private.php?do=showpm&pmid=2456441
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/private.php?do=showpm&pmid=2456682
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/private.php?do=showpm&pmid=2456686
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/private.php?do=showpm&pmid=2456986
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/private.php?do=showpm&pmid=2456988
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/private.php?do=showpm&pmid=2461556


filesharingtalk.com/vb3/private.php?do=showpm&pmid=2461897

See the PM ids ? Admins here can easily trace who are their hunters, as they are checking who read the messages they sent.

Can sites do this to your privacy and still you support them? this is madness nad the defeat of all ur privacy.

[anon]

Old news.

[Burnsy]

Doesn't this happen quite frequently? And not just with What.cd...

[anon]

Yes, a few other sites are using the same exploit as well.

[cinephilia]

quite unfair considering that visiting those threads doesn't necessarily make you a trader or else.

[X-Files]

and i think disabled CSS Layout can prevent this?

[anon]

and i think disabled CSS Layout can prevent this?

http://www.filesharingtalk.com/vb3/showthread.php?t=388923

Edit: wait, for some reason it's been trashed. Oh well...

[TONiC]

They do this with cheat forums aswell as Anon can tell you. IMO it just adds to their bad image of already jumping to assumptions and banning without a "fair trial".

[backie]

Hombre why didn't ya just link to the pastie you got all those links from http://pastie.org/private/p8a9bemaax6md65qqrzima much more informative. You can see that searching cheater in what.cd's forums is a major major no no.

[ca_aok]

Oh look, he can copy and paste from backie's blog. To his credit though, he didn't copy the whole article as he usually does.


See the PM ids ? Admins here can easily trace who are their hunters, as they are checking who read the messages they sent.
So when What's staff does it, it's an invasion of privacy, but when FST's staff does it it's not :whistling


Can sites do this to your privacy and still you support them? this is madness nad the defeat of all ur privacy.
There's a pretty simple solution to prevent this "invasion of privacy". Don't trade. It's funny how the slower ones have a hard time comprehending that. If you don't trade you don't need to worry about proxies, scores of usernames and emails, CSS leaks, IP matches, trader hunters, or the constant worry of being caught. It's funny how some people never learn.

[Tv Controls you]

So when What's staff does it, it's an invasion of privacy, but when FST's staff does it it's not

I wasn't aware Fst banned members for trading via pm.


This is one of the latest tricks

I know you just copy and pasted everything, backie is the real idiot not you.... but this has been a topic of discussion a while ago. Even on this forum we have anti css leak scripts for Firefox.

[QPD]

I have nothing to hide! let them come and check!

[LubTheStaringCat]

Do you think they'll spy on this thread? :doctor:

[n00bz0r]

This is one of the latest tricks. Basically what they do is set up a page which can’t be viewed by browser which is full of links the css checks to see if those links have been visited before if so it uses the content css tag to log your ip and which page you’ve viewed. Example of urls checked:


filesharingtalk.com/vb3/f-bittorrent-trades-158/t-have-and-need-404169
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/f-bittorrent-trades-158/t-have-scc-whatcd-and-hdcorea-406264
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/f-bittorrent-trades-158/t-have-whatcd-invite-404989
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/f-bittorrent-trades-158/t-i-have-397931
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/f-bittorrent-trades-158/t-need-whatcd-409732
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/f-bittorrent-trades-158/t-need-whatcd-invite-404800
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/f-bittorrent-trades-158/t-whatcd-409821
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/http://filesharingtalk.com/vb3/newreply.php?do=newreply&noquote=1&p=3265225
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/http://filesharingtalk.com/vb3/newreply.php?do=newreply&noquote=1&p=3422154
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/newthread.php?do=newthread&f=158
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/private.php?do=showpm&pmid=2452085
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/private.php?do=showpm&pmid=2452962
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/private.php?do=showpm&pmid=2454090
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/private.php?do=showpm&pmid=2456112
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/private.php?do=showpm&pmid=2456287
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/private.php?do=showpm&pmid=2456441
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/private.php?do=showpm&pmid=2456682
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/private.php?do=showpm&pmid=2456686
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/private.php?do=showpm&pmid=2456986
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/private.php?do=showpm&pmid=2456988
filesharingtalk.com/vb3/private.php?do=showpm&pmid=2461556


filesharingtalk.com/vb3/private.php?do=showpm&pmid=2461897

See the PM ids ? Admins here can easily trace who are their hunters, as they are checking who read the messages they sent.

Can sites do this to your privacy and still you support them? this is madness nad the defeat of all ur privacy.


well..good morning

[ExtraDry]

Who cares if sites check these threads out their only trying to get rid of the dead wood from their sites can't blame them for that.

[kukushka]

So when What's staff does it, it's an invasion of privacy, but when FST's staff does it it's not :whistling


trying to defend one site by trying to attack the other one - it's a bit weak logic to say at least


Who cares if sites check these threads out their only trying to get rid of the dead wood from their sites can't blame them for that.
the end justifies the means? my wild guess is that cheaters use the same logic :)

[pro267]

:yawn:

I really should put Hombre on ignore. Can anyone help me find the list, I seem to have forgotten where it is.

[That1Guy]

It is kinda scary because like someone else said, viewing trade threads dont mean you trade. That being said, I have viewed a bunch of trade threads and I havent been banned at what.cd (thankfully).

What is one of the few trackers it would really suck to lose (for me at least).

[ca_aok]

trying to defend one site by trying to attack the other one - it's a bit weak logic to say at least
Wasn't really meant to attack either What or FST, more the stupidity of the double standard that when someone's invading your privacy by using their staff powers to read PMs (whatever the purpose), it's ok since it's benefiting you rather than getting you banned.

If you're going to knowingly break the rules, might as well step up rather than crying about their methods to catch you in the act.


It is kinda scary because like someone else said, viewing trade threads dont mean you trade. That being said, I have viewed a bunch of trade threads and I havent been banned at what.cd (thankfully).

What is one of the few trackers it would really suck to lose (for me at least).
I'm fairly certain they'd cross-reference it with other evidence like IP switches, or the CSS hits on the PM trade links, etc.

[Tv Controls you]

Wasn't really meant to attack either What or FST, more the stupidity of the double standard that when someone's invading your privacy by using their staff powers to read PMs (whatever the purpose), it's ok since it's benefiting you rather than getting you banned.

I don't really see the stupidity in the whole "double standard" you speak of.

Of course people will act negatively when their privacy is breached against their will, ultimately resulting in trouble/losses..
I'm not sure about anyone else around here :shifty:, but this seems like a very uncomplex idea to understand?

People react positively when benefiting, where as they act negatively when being harmed.

Personally I hate invasion of privacy, even if you insist it's helping me... The most important thing to me is my privacy.
You keep your benefits, and I'll keep my no-script and anti-css leak script running....:P

[ca_aok]

I'm sure the trader hunters would see it as a breach of their privacy against their will resulting in trouble/losses (their FST account).

Of course people react positively when benefiting, that's human nature. It's just pretty silly that they expect their "privacy" to be upheld while telling the staff here to violate someone else's privacy.

It's only a problem if you've got something to hide :whistling

[That1Guy]

It is kinda scary because like someone else said, viewing trade threads dont mean you trade. That being said, I have viewed a bunch of trade threads and I havent been banned at what.cd (thankfully).

What is one of the few trackers it would really suck to lose (for me at least).
I'm fairly certain they'd cross-reference it with other evidence like IP switches, or the CSS hits on the PM trade links, etc.

I bet you are right. Doesnt really bother me then. But I can see how it may upset some people.

[Tv Controls you]

It's only a problem if you've got something to hide

I don't like the fact that anyone can see what I'm viewing on the internet, so I try to limit all the ways possible to keep my privacy.

I'm entitled to privacy when browsing the internet, and I don't believe any site should breach that.

[ca_aok]

You're disclosing far more by giving them your IP and a non-disposable email than you are by telling them you've viewed an arbitrary page online that they have to specify, especially when it's easily circumvented in any browser.

You aren't entitled to privacy, you expect it. In fact if you take a look at the DMCA and the Patriot Act (since your flag is american) you'll see that you actually have very few rights to privacy online as far as the government is concerned.

[Tv Controls you]

You aren't entitled to privacy, you expect it. In fact if you take a look at the DMCA (since your flag is american) you'll see that you actually have very few rights to privacy online as far as the government is concerned.

I am very aware of our shitty rights given to us on the matter.
Which is why I take my privacy into my own hands as much as I can.

But let me get this straight, you support the css leak that what.cd is exploiting?
What are your feelings about me blocking this cute little exploit?


You're disclosing far more by giving them your IP and a non-disposable email than you are by telling them you've viewed an arbitrary page online that they have to specify, especially when it's easily circumvented in any browser.

Not necessarily, what if my facebook or myspace or online banking seeps through the css leak? I prize that information more than my ip address and my email address (which not to mention is untraceable and is disposable)
It's not like a virus that steals your username and password, but still the fact that they could look at my personal information on myspace/facebook or any personal site is not ok with me.

[ca_aok]

I have no problem with it personally, as I'm not receiving trade PMs or downloading cheat clients so it's completely irrelevant to me.

I don't have any sympathy for the people that are treating their accounts as commodities to trade, sell, or exploit to their maximum benefit before tossing them aside and grabbing some more. Making their lives harder isn't much of a concern for me.

If you're a trader and you're pissy about it, there's a browser fix for all the major browsers.

[Tv Controls you]

I have no problem with it personally, as I'm not receiving trade PMs or downloading cheat clients so it's completely irrelevant to me.

I don't have any sympathy for the people that are treating their accounts as commodities to trade, sell, or exploit to their maximum benefit before tossing them aside and grabbing some more. Making their lives harder isn't much of a concern for me.

If you're a trader and you're pissy about it, there's a browser fix for all the major browsers.

I'm sure you would have a problem if the IIPA or Warner was looking at your css links, Mr. double standards.

[sear]

I'm fairly certain they'd cross-reference it with other evidence like IP switches, or the CSS hits on the PM trade links, etc.

I bet you are right. Doesnt really bother me then. But I can see how it may upset some people.

No staffer is going to disable someone just for visiting a thread in a forum ... for all they know you're a trader hunter yourself. They're using it as an indication for further checks. Standard procedure really. It's the weight of evidence that convicts.

[ca_aok]

I'm sure you would have a problem if the IIPA or Warner was looking at your css links, Mr. double standards.
No more of a problem then I have with them monitoring BT swarms. It's within their power to do, and while I think their companies are full of corrupt businessmen it's up to you to protect yourself. Just like it's up to you to properly set privacy settings on a site like Facebook or Myspace. The internet really isn't that private of a place, so if you're doing something wrong and you aren't protecting yourself, you'll have to be prepared to deal with the consequences. As most of us here are probably pretty hardcore filesharers, we should be aware that in the distant future, there could be consequences based on the choices we made and the monitoring techniques they're using.

Anyway we're discussing torrent sites monitoring trade PMs and you're exaggerating it and comparing it to corporations suing people which has real life legal and monetary consequences. They aren't exactly the same thing.

[Tv Controls you]

Anyway we're discussing torrent sites monitoring trade PMs and you're exaggerating it and comparing it to corporations suing people which has real life legal and monetary consequences. They aren't exactly the same thing.

Neither is Fst and what.cd

*going to bed, got to be up early tomorrow. :sleep1:

[X-Files]

Anyway we're discussing torrent sites monitoring trade PMs and you're exaggerating it and comparing it to corporations suing people which has real life legal and monetary consequences. They aren't exactly the same thing.

Neither is Fst and what.cd

*going to bed, got to be up early tomorrow. :sleep1:

good decision :yup:

[IdolEyes787]

Oh look, he can copy and paste from backie's blog. To his credit though, he didn't copy the whole article as he usually does.


Hombre's an idiot.
Btw that's not necessarily my opinion I only copy/pasted it from somewhere else.

Also the title of the thread is wrong it should be "spying on the members of FilesharingTalk".I'm pretty sure that they aren't interested in spying on FST.

Seriously though if I was that concerned about my privacy I wouldn't be on the internet let alone dubious places like these.

[kukushka]

another thought of dual standarts... from what i know, traders hunters are getting banned here for their activities like transparent pixels or smth.. and then other sites are hunting traders here with this css trick. and staff from those sites have accounts here. :)

[cinephilia]

I have no problem with it personally, as I'm not receiving trade PMs or downloading cheat clients so it's completely irrelevant to me.
"if you have nothing to feel guilty about, then what's the problem?"
that's what uk government said about the millions cctv cameras they installed all over the country.

you just can't violate people's privacy under the pretence that traders are a nuisance to your site - it's a matter of principles.

[anon]

This is one of the latest tricks

I don't know whether you wrote this yourself or just copy & pasted it, but they started using this attack over a year ago.


Not necessarily, what if my facebook or myspace or online banking seeps through the css leak?

Currently, it works in a hit-or-miss fashion. They can't read the whole history, only check if specific links have been visited - so they'd have to know the URL to your Facebook/MySpace profile first, and then it'd be pointless to "find" it this way.

[ca_aok]

"if you have nothing to feel guilty about, then what's the problem?"
that's what uk government said about the millions cctv cameras they installed all over the country.

you just can't violate people's privacy under the pretence that traders are a nuisance to your site - it's a matter of principles.
I never saw what the big fuss was about that ordeal. Are they installing the cameras in your home? No, they aren't. Public streets are their property, it's their call what to do with them. I don't see people complain about CCTV cameras in say, banks. Well, perhaps bank robbers might have other ideas about those...


Not necessarily, what if my facebook or myspace or online banking seeps through the css leak? I prize that information more than my ip address and my email address (which not to mention is untraceable and is disposable)
It's not like a virus that steals your username and password, but still the fact that they could look at my personal information on myspace/facebook or any personal site is not ok with me.
No they can't. They can only see that you visited a specific page. They can't even prove the page you visit is your own profile. And if you have your privacy set, they won't even be able to reach that page themselves. And what exactly about online banking is going to leak? You visited their login.php page? Most links past that have hashed URLs that would be impossible to predict without serious prior knowledge, and even then what? You visited the "view stock options" page? You visited the page to make a transfer? None of the information would be particularly useful.

This isn't some magical thing that lets you see a snapshot of whatever they're viewing. It simply demonstrates whether you've visited a site, which on its own isn't proof of anything.

[backie]

"if you have nothing to feel guilty about, then what's the problem?"
that's what uk government said about the millions cctv cameras they installed all over the country.

you just can't violate people's privacy under the pretence that traders are a nuisance to your site - it's a matter of principles.
I never saw what the big fuss was about that ordeal. Are they installing the cameras in your home? No, they aren't. Public streets are their property, it's their call what to do with them. I don't see people complain about CCTV cameras in say, banks. Well, perhaps bank robbers might have other ideas about those...

Example, theres 8 or so camera's in my building alone, basically watching everyone's front door and I don't think I've ever seen the cops dealing with any crime in the row of flats I live in. Kinda pointless cameras. In the likes of the Shetland Islands there are more cameras than in the whole of San Fransico with 5.6 cameras per 1000 people. (Source wired uk 05.10) when an area that has one of the lowest crime stats in the Uk has more camera's than San Fransico something is seriously up. It's not like they catch many criminals in the act.

[Tv Controls you]

This isn't some magical thing that lets you see a snapshot of whatever they're viewing. It simply demonstrates whether you've visited a site, which on its own isn't proof of anything.

I understand the exploit completley.

Here is what they are basically exploiting.
http://blog.mozilla.com/security/files/2010/03/visitedunvisited.png

which is why this is helpful at deterring such invasions of privacy on firefox.


a:visited{
background: none !important;
background-image: none !important;
list-style-image: none !important;
}

We are stopping the link from being detected as visited or even looking like a link as we now made it have no background, list-style, or background image.
Their is no change in appearance which passes right by the css exploit.

All links look like this (before and after clicking) using the css style sheet above:
website

...So really stop trying to discredit me by acting as if I don't know the limitations of the css leak.
If I click a link to a myspace or facebook the link can be viewed by the website that is abusing the css leak, that is of course if myspace.com and facebook.com are in the list of sites being used by the attacker.
The will know I have a facebook, myspace, and I use the Bank of america for my banking.

[Ev0]

You stay in Jerviston so that's to be expected:P


Example, theres 8 or so camera's in my building alone,

[X-Files]

he dont care if u put cctv on his toilet :yup:

[ca_aok]

Example, theres 8 or so camera's in my building alone, basically watching everyone's front door and I don't think I've ever seen the cops dealing with any crime in the row of flats I live in. Kinda pointless cameras. In the likes of the Shetland Islands there are more cameras than in the whole of San Fransico with 5.6 cameras per 1000 people. (Source wired uk 05.10) when an area that has one of the lowest crime stats in the Uk has more camera's than San Fransico something is seriously up. It's not like they catch many criminals in the act.
But how many people has it inconvenienced in a concrete way? Sure it's stupid (though comparing a city in britain where the cctv thing is common to a city in the US where it's not is kind of silly), but at the end of the day, the cameras are at best, pointless in regular situations. And in the unlikely event someone commits a crime in that neighbourhood, it'll be recorded.

Likewise, if you aren't a trader, the CSS monitoring system is at best, pointless. If you trade/download cheats, it'll be recorded.


...So really stop trying to discredit me by acting as if I don't know the limitations of the css leak.
If I click a link to a myspace or facebook the link can be viewed by the website that is abusing the css leak, that is of course if myspace.com and facebook.com are in the list of sites being used by the attacker.
The will know I have a facebook, myspace, and I use the Bank of america for my banking.
Shit with that information, I could be at your doorstep by tomorrow!

I'll tell you right now I have facebook, no myspace, and don't use online baking, who am I? I also visited wikipedia earlier if that helps :o

[Cabalo]

Well, I've visited many of those links and even some others shadier than the ones listed.
What does that make me? Suppose you're a staffer from what.cd, who never heard of me, and you come cross with my profile and see I visited so many tagged links, what would you think? There lies the question.

[cinephilia]

it's not about facts, it's all about ethics and morality, dear ca_aok.

[ca_aok]

The folks this is catching aren't that concerned about ethics or morality :whistling

Re: Cabalo, I'd use it as supplemental evidence towards whatever you were being accused of doing. Visiting a link proves nothing by itself.

[Quarterquack]

The folks this is catching aren't that concerned about ethics or morality :whistling

And neither should anyone. There are no shades of gray on this matter. You're either an outstanding, upright individual lead by his morals, in which case you wouldn't torrent anything, or you are a snake that makes choices, and reaps benefits of other options. I don't think anyone involved with bittorrent has so much as a right to point out moral/ethical flaws in other people's conduct.

"Those who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones."

[Cabalo]

I don't think anyone involved with bittorrent has so much as a right to point out moral/ethical flaws in other people's conduct.

"Those who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones."
This sums up the whole story.

[cinephilia]

The folks this is catching aren't that concerned about ethics or morality :whistling

And neither should anyone. There are no shades of gray on this matter. You're either an outstanding, upright individual lead by his morals, in which case you wouldn't torrent anything, or you are a snake that makes choices, and reaps benefits of other options. I don't think anyone involved with bittorrent has so much as a right to point out moral/ethical flaws in other people's conduct.

"Those who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones."
lol at your armchair theory, especially the "I don't think anyone involved with bittorrent has so much as a right to point out blah blah" part (which has become a classic in this forum).
as if all ethical questions could be compared on the same level... :frusty:
that's just like saying "you can't embrace a moral point of view cause you once went to jail".

[Tv Controls you]

I could be at your doorstep by tomorrow!

Really? If you really want to meet me that bad, I'll be at bonnaroo.
I may even stop by the what.cd stand. lol

As for my door step... I don't even exist on a map.:ninja:

[Quarterquack]

lol at your armchair theory, especially the "I don't think anyone involved with bittorrent has so much as a right to point out blah blah" part (which has become a classic in this forum).
as if all ethical questions could be compared on the same level... :frusty:
that's just like saying "you can't embrace a moral point of view cause you once went to jail".

Clearly you and I are on different notes. We are pirates. We embrace illegal activity to get our daily fix of music, games, applications, movies, and for the insane, even TV series. That's wrong. There are no shades of gray, it's just wrong. Yet we do it, because we all can inexplicably relate to the love of free content, no matter the moral obligations to the creators and producers of said content.

Any pirate is therefore a person who sets aside moral/ethical commitments for the most part, because you find them pointless. Yet, most pirates then go on and set an ethical code of their own which they expect others to abide to.

My point is, if you are clearly unethical and unyielding of the rights or wrongs understood and followed by a respectable chunk of society, who are you to set rules or point out the flaws in other people's ethics? Maybe just as you hold the right to hold your own opinions of ethics and which lines to cross, someone else holds the same belief when it comes to trading, selling, racism etc.

Better? I'm not saying that I should disregard someone's opinion. I'm pointing out that that someone is hypocritical if he breaks (and continues to) society's rules, then creates ones of his own out of thin air expecting people to follow it.

[A]

another thought of dual standarts... from what i know, traders hunters are getting banned here for their activities like transparent pixels or smth.. and then other sites are hunting traders here with this css trick. and staff from those sites have accounts here. :)
So true.


Any pirate is therefore a person who sets aside moral/ethical commitments for the most part, because you find them pointless. Yet, most pirates then go on and set an ethical code of their own which they expect others to abide to.

Also by the looks of it caook and ringhunter wont even mind if their bank accounts get stolen or if their personal info is made public.And lol@"We are pirates so we cant talk about morality/ethics".Then lemme ask you,who are ideal candidates who can talk about morality and ethics.

[sez]

If all this is true then not all the what.cd 'I got banned for no reason' whine threads are unfounded.
And ringhunter I think you are looking at ethics from a far too general point of view.
Rename the *.doc to *.pdf

[Quarterquack]

Also by the looks of it caook and ringhunter wont even mind if their bank accounts get stolen or if their personal info is made public.And lol@"We are pirates so we cant talk about morality/ethics".Then lemme ask you,who are ideal candidates who can talk about morality and ethics.

Have you even read what I have written? I don't have a problem with you calling someone out on some moral flaw in their conduct. I have a problem with pirates setting rules amongst pirates, and tying ethics to it. The way I see it, and the way I will continue to see it is, it's hypocritical to break rules society put in place, then expect people to have a semblance of respect to rules you yourself make up of nowhere. I hate backie's attitude as much as the next guy, but he's right when it comes to people blindly listening/following to trading/cheating rules. The true "honor among pirates" is the unspoken respect and understanding for each others motives, not the fact that we should aim for an impalpable utopia.

One of the my worst gripes with the scene are all the retarded standards; attempting to set rules by which rule breakers are attempted to be contained. I'm sorry if I'm the only one in this thread who realizes how retarded that is. Would you prefer to be treated by a sick doctor or a healthy one? Would you hire a carpenter whose office door is broken? Would you listen to a university professor who is shaky when it comes to the subject at hand? Then why would you listen to a pirate's ideals when it comes to rules?


If all this is true then not all the what.cd 'I got banned for no reason' whine threads are unfounded.
And ringhunter I think you are looking at ethics from a far too general point of view.
Rename the *.doc to *.pdf

Granted I have never delved in too deep into ethics/morality books/courses, I will agree that maybe my point of view is too general, but that's how I'm arguing. I'm not saying trading is right or wrong; you can form your own opinion of my stance from what activities I indulge in around here. What I am arguing is the fact that I believe it's wrong for a pirate to set rules for other pirates to abide by, and for that I needed to "look at the bigger picture" per se.

[ca_aok]

Also by the looks of it caook and ringhunter wont even mind if their bank accounts get stolen or if their personal info is made public.And lol@"We are pirates so we cant talk about morality/ethics".Then lemme ask you,who are ideal candidates who can talk about morality and ethics.
First off, spell my name right if you're going to make useless accusations against me.

Secondly, the CSS leak can't do shit all to steal your bank account aside from telling them which bank you use (assuming they've compiled an exhaustive list of the URLs of every banking site). It has no mechanism to swipe your username or password, it simply shows that you visited a web page. This has nothing to do with accounts being stolen or people's data being released, which is generally collected by methods completely separate from the CSS leak thing (email/username + google is usually a good starting point). I'm not sure if people are misinformed about how this all works or if you're simply trying to extrapolate this "invasion of privacy" to a completely different invasion of privacy. Either way it's a useless comparison.

For the average non-paranoid member, they'll be able to get far more relevant information about you from your IP and email address. Obviously you could use a disposable email and a VPN and be more conscious about keeping your torrenting identity separate from the rest of your online activity, but many people make no effort to hide who they are elsewhere.


Have you even read what I have written? I don't have a problem with you calling someone out on some moral flaw in their conduct. I have a problem with pirates setting rules amongst pirates, and tying ethics to it. The way I see it, and the way I will continue to see it is, it's hypocritical to break rules society put in place, then expect people to have a semblance of respect to rules you yourself make up of nowhere. I hate backie's attitude as much as the next guy, but he's right when it comes to people blindly listening/following to trading/cheating rules. The true "honor among pirates" is the unspoken respect and understanding for each others motives, not the fact that we should aim for an impalpable utopia.
Not really. The rules are set up to weed out the shit from these sites, which is half the reason to use a private tracker in the first place. Weeding out the shit leads to better speeds and torrent retention in the case of cheaters, and fewer people profiting off your site in the case of traders, the most prolific of which are generally invite sellers.

You're abiding by rules to preserve the establishment you use for your benefit. If you don't like it, get the hell out as far as I'm concerned. There's always The Pirate Bay for those who want a site where you don't have to worry about anything other than snatching a .torrent.

[backie]

Not really. The rules are set up to weed out the shit from these sites, which is half the reason to use a private tracker in the first place. Weeding out the shit leads to better speeds and torrent retention in the case of cheaters, and fewer people profiting off your site in the case of traders, the most prolific of which are generally invite seller

I belive every user profits from using a torrent tracker aslong as they download stuff they don't. This whole let's not let people make money from piracy is just silly, when I was younger and there was no broadband in the UK I used to buy pirate VCDS (yea that far back) I was happy to do so and got my monies worth. Yet some people think that selling pirate DVDs is worse than downloading the stuff for your own usage or that selling invites to a tracker so someone who doesn't have the connections can download free shit too.

[Tv Controls you]

I belive every user profits from using a torrent tracker aslong as they download stuff they don't. This whole let's not let people make money from piracy is just silly, when I was younger and there was no broadband in the UK I used to buy pirate VCDS (yea that far back) I was happy to do so and got my monies worth. Yet some people think that selling pirate DVDs is worse than downloading the stuff for your own usage or that selling invites to a tracker so someone who doesn't have the connections can download free shit too.

Its also highly punishable to distribute copyright infringed material, whereas it is a lesser punishment for owning it for personal use.

The reason we don't want people to sell pirate dvd's is to defer attention towards our bittorrent sites.
The less people that get caught selling bootlegs, the less heat on BT.

The fact that you support selling invites and selling pirated dvd's is truly disturbing to me, as nearly every BT community looks down upon both acts.
But what was I expecting from the jellyfish of bittorrent?

Turning profit on Illegal torrents is a big no-no around here, doesn't matter who we are talking about. The private tracker, owner, staff, members, or anyone associated with it.

[7th]

This is so stupid... I'm a happy "non-what.cd" member :frusty:

[backie]

I belive every user profits from using a torrent tracker aslong as they download stuff they don't. This whole let's not let people make money from piracy is just silly, when I was younger and there was no broadband in the UK I used to buy pirate VCDS (yea that far back) I was happy to do so and got my monies worth. Yet some people think that selling pirate DVDs is worse than downloading the stuff for your own usage or that selling invites to a tracker so someone who doesn't have the connections can download free shit too.

Its also highly punishable to distribute copyright infringed material, whereas it is a lesser punishment for owning it for personal use.

The reason we don't want people to sell pirate dvd's is to defer attention towards our bittorrent sites.
The less people that get caught selling bootlegs, the less heat on BT.

The fact that you support selling invites and selling pirated dvd's is truly disturbing to me, as nearly every BT community looks down upon both acts.
But what was I expecting from the jellyfish of bittorrent?

Turning profit on Illegal torrents is a big no-no around here, doesn't matter who we are talking about. The private tracker, owner, staff, members, or anyone associated with it.

Ok, you had a good post, I was gonna let it ride even thou it was flawed. Then you edit it to insult me for not decent reason and then you talk some more crap.

See because the amount of ways to get bootleg/pirate movies there is usenets,xdcc,torrents,the scene. The amount of bootleggers doesn't really affect the amount of heat on torrents.

Making profit of torrents is perfectly ok, I highly suspect this site is making a profit off illegal torrent community. Sites such as xirvik and other seedbox providers are making profit off illegal torrents. Usenet companies are making a profit off piracy. It's just the trackers have decided theres a few things they don't like and people like you tow the line.

[Tv Controls you]

Making profit of torrents is perfectly ok, I highly suspect this site is making a profit off illegal torrent community. Sites such as xirvik and other seedbox providers are making profit off illegal torrents. Usenet companies are making a profit off piracy. It's just the trackers have decided theres a few things they don't like and people like you tow the line.

I would be stupid not to believe that there is alot of people using bittorrent to make gains, just take PTP for example...
If you read anything on this thread you would realize I don't "tow the line" as I openly speak up against the css attack..

This is how sites get shut down, idiots like you going out and selling dvd's then getting caught.
Being the idiot you are you rat out a private tracker, and then they are focusing on the private tracker.

If your just trying to justify your own situation for attempting to make money off Bt with your sorry ass blog, and selling some bootlegs.. I really feel sorry for you.

[backie]

Making profit of torrents is perfectly ok, I highly suspect this site is making a profit off illegal torrent community. Sites such as xirvik and other seedbox providers are making profit off illegal torrents. Usenet companies are making a profit off piracy. It's just the trackers have decided theres a few things they don't like and people like you tow the line.

I would be stupid not to believe that there is alot of people using bittorrent to make gains, just take PTP for example...
If you read anything on this thread you would realize I don't "tow the line" as I openly speak up against the css attack..

This is how sites get shut down, idiots like you going out and selling dvd's then getting caught.
Being the idiot you are you rat out a private tracker, and then they are focusing on the private tracker.

If your just trying to justify your own situation for attempting to make money off Bt with your sorry ass blog, and selling some bootlegs.. I really feel sorry for you.

Well considering your logic for no selling shit is weak and is the same crap every tracker comes up with, it's really hard for someone such as myself not to think you just tow the line. Being anti the css pirvacy invasion isn't enough to think any different.

Sites don't get shut down just because one person sells dvds and gets caught and tells them which tracker they downloaded them from. Guess what that isn't what happened to UK-T. :O Shock shock horror! To be honest I would be very surprised if they even ask with tracker once you said a torrent site. You seem to be living in denial thinking that every torrent site isn't already known and tagged and sites like this aren't followed by members of Copyright Agencies such as FACT.

Next you're gonna say I am just trying to justify my selling FSC accounts/invites! :D hehe. I like how you know you have a weak ass angle and are trying to deflect on to me, this doesn't change your weak ass angle.

[Tv Controls you]

it's really hard for someone such as myself not to think you just tow the line.

I'm banned from waffles.fm and what.cd, take that for towing the line... lol

Also... I don't ever remember referring to uk-t once.

[backie]

it's really hard for someone such as myself not to think you just tow the line.

I'm banned from waffles.fm and what.cd, take that for towing the line... lol

Also... I don't ever remember referring to uk-t once.

So you got banned at two sites, that doesn't mean anything, plenty of line towers are banned at a few sites. Happens to everyone.

You didn't need to, I thought I would slam down any attempts to bring UK-T into play using them as an example.

[Tv Controls you]

I personally just think in order to maintain the privacy of our communities that we try to contain all our files in between members.
As I said before your shit blog, and your selling invites is pathetic, get a real job. That is the real reason.

Also if you think a pro selling topic is going to prosper on fst, you must be as stupid as everyone makes you out to be....

[ca_aok]

You didn't need to, I thought I would slam down any attempts to bring UK-T into play using them as an example.
Name dropping 1337 trackers enhances your argument greatly :yup:


I belive every user profits from using a torrent tracker aslong as they download stuff they don't. This whole let's not let people make money from piracy is just silly, when I was younger and there was no broadband in the UK I used to buy pirate VCDS (yea that far back) I was happy to do so and got my monies worth. Yet some people think that selling pirate DVDs is worse than downloading the stuff for your own usage or that selling invites to a tracker so someone who doesn't have the connections can download free shit too.
I firmly believe that's much worse. There's no proof that a download equals a lost sale, I certainly wouldn't have bought everything I've downloaded. In that sense, it's a zero gain/loss situation for the media companies. They weren't getting my money in the first place, and they didn't have an actual product taken from them.

As soon as you start pirating the material that you've downloaded for free, you're now directly taking their money. Aside from the moral implications it's also a greater crime in most countries. So yes, I'd say it's worse. You're taking shit given to you for free and selling it to people that don't know any better.


Making profit of torrents is perfectly ok, I highly suspect this site is making a profit off illegal torrent community. Sites such as xirvik and other seedbox providers are making profit off illegal torrents. Usenet companies are making a profit off piracy. It's just the trackers have decided theres a few things they don't like and people like you tow the line.
This site rakes in a shitload off ads, so I'd say it's definitely making a profit, but there's really nothing we can do to change that. As for seedbox resellers, I think they're incredibly flawed as they're basically profiting off children that can't google how to set up rtorrent or WINE+utorrent. A monkey can buy a server, install a premade disk image on it, fill it with more users than is worthwhile, and rake in a huge profit. At least the usenet companies have to pay for servers and bandwidth to an extent far greater than your other examples listed (though I'm sure they're still making a killing).

Oh, and why the hell are we even discussing this with you? backie, champion of internet privacy, who has the personal details of people posted on his blog? Your pathetic response of "well all this info was already online anyway" doesn't hold much weight, since guess what, the CSS info is already online anyway. Hypocritical much?

[backie]

Oh, and why the hell are we even discussing this with you? backie, champion of internet privacy, who has the personal details of people posted on his blog? Your pathetic response of "well all this info was already online anyway" doesn't hold much weight, since guess what, the CSS info is already online anyway. Hypocritical much?

Well, I don't think you can expect your personal information to remain private when it's in a public database, such as court records or a whois database. That's just me, I know it's weird. Mabye I should live like you, expect everything to remain private if it could be damaging to me.

[ca_aok]

Well, I don't think you can expect your personal information to remain private when it's in a public database, such as court records or a whois database. That's just me, I know it's weird. Mabye I should live like you, expect everything to remain private if it could be damaging to me.
By that logic, you should have no problems with the CSS leak. Let the hypocrisy continue!

And I think if we took a quick poll about whether you'd rather have your address and phone number posted in a publicly visible place or whether you'd rather have someone realize that you've visited BTRACS, I think I know what most people would pick as the greater invasion of privacy.

[Tv Controls you]

.....This has become so hypocritical I don't even know what to post....

ca-aok you act as if you have a regard for internet privacy now.....

[ca_aok]

Not really, it's not my info posted so it's irrelevant to me, simply pointing out that he doesn't give a shit about privacy as long as he's selling his drivel.

I can certainly sympathize much more with someone that has their real life shit posted compared to some trader that loses an internet account though. There aren't any real life consequences to trading, but there are real life consequences to having the personal details of torrent site admins posted.

[backie]

Not really, it's not my info posted so it's irrelevant to me, simply pointing out that he doesn't give a shit about privacy as long as he's selling his drivel.

It's more that I don't think you can expect privacy in public. Such as if you're in the street you can't complain if someone takes your picture. If your information is in a public database you can't complain with someone mirrors it.

[Tv Controls you]

If your information is in a public database you can't complain with someone mirrors it.

I'm sure you would be complaining if you got sued for displaying pedomax's personal details without his consent in public.

*side note... 1,000 post! lol

[Quarterquack]

If your information is in a public database you can't complain with someone mirrors it.

I'm sure you would be complaining if you got sued for displaying pedomax's personal details without his consent in public.

*side note... 1,000 post! lol

You can't get sued. Why don't people understand this already? If he paid a public outlet for phishing people's information then it would be questionable. Mirroring freely available information is what makes google so rich. Backie cannot be sued for it.

[Tv Controls you]

You can't get sued. Why don't people understand this already? If he paid a public outlet for phishing people's information then it would be questionable. Mirroring freely available information is what makes google so rich. Backie cannot be sued for it.

It is very unlikely that he will, because it is a shady area that is rarely acted on.
Although, It could be classified as extortion if pedomax wanted to take it that far.

[zonta]

look here: http://filesharingtalk.com/vb3/f-everything-related-to-the-board-9/t-trying-to-contact-cabalo-405450


sickofjesus is admin from what.cd and cabalo says :
Well, I've been contacted and it was quite helpful for the board.
Thanks sickofjesus. :)

and for other trackers its the same.... use proxy or don't use fst if you dont want to lose your acc.

im already banned from 3 trackers (www.gft.org (http://www.gft.org), e****[/URL] , [URL="http://www.what.cd"]www.what.cd (http://www.ex%20i%20gomusic.org) ) Because i want to trade my accounts in FST

[Cabalo]

look here: http://filesharingtalk.com/vb3/f-everything-related-to-the-board-9/t-trying-to-contact-cabalo-405450


sickofjesus is admin from what.cd and cabalo says :
Well, I've been contacted and it was quite helpful for the board.
Thanks sickofjesus. :)

and for other trackers its the same.... use proxy or don't use fst if you dont want to lose your acc.
Idiotic opinions for the win. :rolleyes:
If you assume my conversation with sickofjesus was to catch traders, you are quite wrong. He knows very well that trading is accepted at FST, and never he asked me for information on any trader, we are both mature individuals who respect each other, despite obvious clashes of interests. But that wasn't even discussed. They have their mechanisms, as you can read on this thread, but those aren't breaking any of our rules. Ethically speaking, that's a whole different matter.
Opinions like yours are the ones who fuel fire unnecessarily, and spew hate on what.cd because I could bet you already had account(s) disabled there, and it's quite easy to blame us.
The person to blame is you, because you decided to break site's rules and didn't even know how to avoid getting caught.
Blame it on your ignorance.

[QPD]

I have QPD nick everywhere, And i never got banned! :unsure:

[7th]

I have QPD nick everywhere, And i never got banned! :unsure:

That's how it works if you have nothing to hide :)

And although I'm against tradings and account ga, I'm also against spy! :dry:

ps.: if this is really happening here :P

[BABBY]

quite unfair considering that visiting those threads doesn't necessarily make you a trader or else.
This is the reason why at times good people's account also get banned, and the real old hardcore traders get away as they all are well aware of latest spying tricks and how to safegaurd themself from them.

[ca_aok]

im already banned from 3 trackers (www.gft.org (http://www.gft.org), e**** , www.what.cd (http://www.what.cd) ) Because i want to trade my accounts in FST

As I said earlier in the thread, the perfect protection is not being a trader. Go cry us a river about your lost accounts :whistling

Blame yourself for being an idiot, not the tool that got you caught.

[kooltilldend]

im already banned from 3 trackers (www.gft.org (http://www.gft.org), e**** , www.what.cd (http://www.what.cd) ) Because i want to trade my accounts in FST[/QUOTE]
lol are you seriously expecting sympathy after telling us you got banned for trading? tch tch

[Zoness]

Hmmm well don't do dumb things on public forums I guess :P

[backie]

You can't get sued. Why don't people understand this already? If he paid a public outlet for phishing people's information then it would be questionable. Mirroring freely available information is what makes google so rich. Backie cannot be sued for it.

It is very unlikely that he will, because it is a shady area that is rarely acted on.
Although, It could be classified as extortion if pedomax wanted to take it that far.

Ok, I am gonna bit, how can it be classified as extortion?

I assume you're referring to joke saying that they should try bribing. Since this joke was made after the fact, I hardly think it classes as blackmail. Asking for money to do something someone else wants you to do is a common thing and is widely accepted.

[kukushka]

There's a pretty simple solution to prevent this "invasion of privacy". Don't trade. It's funny how the slower ones have a hard time comprehending that. If you don't trade you don't need to worry about proxies, scores of usernames and emails, CSS leaks, IP matches, trader hunters, or the constant worry of being caught. It's funny how some people never learn.

actually, turns out that bitme staff just don't give invites for users that are fst members. the thing is, nothing can protect average user against a staff stupidity or paranoia or bad mood or anything.
there's _no_ universal solution against it


No staffer is going to disable someone just for visiting a thread in a forum ... for all they know you're a trader hunter yourself. They're using it as an indication for further checks. Standard procedure really. It's the weight of evidence that convicts.
what makes you so sure to predict actions of all staffers in the world? if anyone think that all staffers always act using common sense, reason or some kind of moral, even relative, is just plain naive....
they're humans and they're all different and they all act the way they feel it so it's impossible to predict at all what the reaction will be to any user action.
and there's no universal way of how to avoid it - from one side it's better to try not to give them any information at all on which they could take some actions and from this side css leak is a no-no even for those who formally don't brake no trackers rules, from other side - not giving information, using different nicks/emails can also make you a shady user in the eyes of staffers...

ps between histories that i witnessed during my time in bt, i saw US guy being disabled on some tracker because somebody found the similar nick on some indian trading forum with 2 year old messages. just one example of how bright staff can be sometimes.

pps it's more or less common practice to ban users belonging to some countries, so punishing users because of being users of other sites may be even less "nazi" thing to do actually ;)

[Cabalo]

It's totally true that bitme won't give invites to users they know to be members of FST.

[Tv Controls you]

It's totally true that bitme won't give invites to users they know to be members of FST.

How stupid, do they even have any rhyme or reason behind this idiotic method?

[ca_aok]

actually, turns out that bitme staff just don't give invites for users that are fst members. the thing is, nothing can protect average user against a staff stupidity or paranoia or bad mood or anything.
there's _no_ universal solution against it
Nothing you said here negates the statement you quoted. There are a few trackers with a narrowminded view towards FST (BitMe and x264.me come to mind) but just because a few staff members are like that doesn't make your example the defining rule against my statement. It's more the exception to the rule.


and there's no universal way of how to avoid it - from one side it's better to try not to give them any information at all on which they could take some actions and from this side css leak is a no-no even for those who formally don't brake no trackers rules, from other side - not giving information, using different nicks/emails can also make you a shady user in the eyes of staffers...
Regarding giving them no information: this isn't possible. If you want something like that, go use a public tracker through a proxy. And using different names and emails on each site makes you appear to be a trader, or at the very least someone with something to hide, so there's definitely truth to that.


ps between histories that i witnessed during my time in bt, i saw US guy being disabled on some tracker because somebody found the similar nick on some indian trading forum with 2 year old messages. just one example of how bright staff can be sometimes.
I don't think there's a single BT user that hasn't seen a staff member somewhere make a poor decision. Shit happens sometimes. Without knowing more about that specific situation it's hard to comment further on it.


pps it's more or less common practice to ban users belonging to some countries, so punishing users because of being users of other sites may be even less "nazi" thing to do actually ;)
If you're a member of say, the big cheating forum, obviously there's going to be some scrutiny from tracker staff.

[BABBY]

It's totally true that bitme won't give invites to users they know to be members of FST.

Their is no doubt about this fact.

I have seen that when sites frame more stringent rules, they carve their own grave or they hinder their own progress or they do harm to them self one way or other.

[sez]

or at the very least someone with something to hide.
which is absolutely fine otherwise your sig should be linking the world to your linkedin and facebook profiles.And I don't think ca_aok is your real name either.Some of us are paranoid but others tend to be a little too paranoid and I think you should try and understand that.

[Funkin']

And using different names and emails on each site makes you appear to be a trader, or at the very least someone with something to hide, so there's definitely truth to that.


I don't have the same nick or email on every tracker. Do I appear to be a trader or have something to hide? I think that only closed-minded or immature people would come to this kind of conclusion. ;)

[Quarterquack]

I've been banned on trackers before based on a nickname match. Granted sometimes the odds do seem too low to warrant anymore research, however, I'm just throwing out there the fact that sometimes staff do not "weigh" all the evidence possible, at least not all the time.

[aen]

The Exploit for the <<peaceful purpose>> sounds bit strange, doesn't it? As well as for the baning purpose :p Like we use evil instrument to destruct evil... I bet sometimes people use the internet for non-torrenting related private stuff. Probably sometimes they realy want to keep it private. It's nothing about paranoia, it's just about the confidence and a bad feeling that someone raped you with sploit.
Also looks like i know where is my bitme invites gone now. I've never need any of them but I still didn't learn how to predict the future properly using neuronets or whatever.
Also life sucks.

[A]

First off, spell my name right if you're going to make useless accusations against me.

Also by the looks of it caook and ringhunter wont even mind if their bank accounts get stolen or if their personal info is made public
Accusations?:blink: and Spelled your name correctly this time.:unsure:


Secondly, the CSS leak can't do shit all to steal your bank account aside from telling them which bank you use (assuming they've compiled an exhaustive list of the URLs of every banking site). It has no mechanism to swipe your username or password, it simply shows that you visited a web page. This has nothing to do with accounts being stolen or people's data being released, which is generally collected by methods completely separate from the CSS leak thing (email/username + google is usually a good starting point). I'm not sure if people are misinformed about how this all works or if you're simply trying to extrapolate this "invasion of privacy" to a completely different invasion of privacy. Either way it's a useless comparison.
I wasnt talking to what extent CSS leaks can be used or its technicality.I am asking,what will you do if a tracker/forum goes beyond exploiting CSS leaks?Are you okay with that too?


I have a problem with pirates setting rules amongst pirates, and tying ethics to it.
This I agree.


What I am arguing is the fact that I believe it's wrong for a pirate to set rules for other pirates to abide by
This I dont agree.A group can have whatever rules they want their members to abide by.If you dont like the rules or dont want to be a member of a group you can leave it or dont join it.Who are you to say pirates shouldnt set rules? and every criminal organisations out there have very strict rules to follow.Do you find that weird as well?


One of the my worst gripes with the scene are all the retarded standards; attempting to set rules by which rule breakers are attempted to be contained.
The people in scene enjoys being in the scene and participating within it.The rules they set are for them to follow and not others outside their circle.If you think they have retarded standards,you are free to release according to your standards or be like p2p groups which has no set standards to follow or dont follow the Scene.The scene likes to have a set rules by which members in it should be following.So what?Since when did a group of "like minded individuals" cant do what they like?


Have you even read what I have written?
I always read before replying.Maybe I may have misunderstood something,that dosent mean I havent read it and is mindlessly writing something.:ermm:
And @ringhunter;Are you supporting what What.CD is doing or are you against it?Just to be clear.Thats all.

[Glitterstep]

It's totally true that bitme won't give invites to users they know to be members of FST.

true that...I have been a VIP there for like a year now,and have never received a single invite in the past.

[Quarterquack]

And @ringhunter;Are you supporting what What.CD is doing or are you against it?Just to be clear.Thats all.

At the risk of sounding like a hypocritical jerk, I actually agree and commend them for anything they can and will do.

I just don't agree with imposing their moral standards on people, but at the end of the day, they are doing their job. So is anon, so are the RIAA. Asking for any person or group to short-change themselves when it comes to doing their jobs because I don't agree with the moral side of it is egotistical.

Do I dislike traders/trading? Yes, but still, it's their choice and they're doing what they want. Just as they reserve that right, staff reserve the right to fight back against them should they choose so.

What I've disagreed with the full time is not the notion that trading is right or wrong, but it's that people seem to think it's morally wrong to trade just because some tracker staff said so.

[IdolEyes787]

What I've disagreed with the full time is not the notion that trading is right or wrong, but it's that people seem to think it's morally wrong to trade just because some tracker staff said so.

The "morally wrong" part comes in that you (presumably) gave your word ( in signing up) not to .
Trading might in and of itself not be "morally wrong" but I'm pretty sure that the majority of the planet agrees that lying is.

[Quarterquack]

The "morally wrong" part comes in that you (presumably) gave your word ( in signing up) not to .
Trading might in and of itself not be "morally wrong" but I'm pretty sure that the majority of the planet agrees that lying is.

Understood. Take this hypothetical situation. Trader comes to FST, trades his way into every tracker imaginable. RandonmPseudonym1337 comes along and says "It's amazing what people can achieve when they discard morality."

Which do you think our hypothetical person referred to? The lie, or the trading? I was under the assumption that most people that even bring the topic up to the table for discussion had a gripe with the conduct itself, not with people going back on their word.

[Cabalo]

It's totally true that bitme won't give invites to users they know to be members of FST.

true that...I have been a VIP there for like a year now,and have never received a single invite in the past.
Hence why I haven't yet donated there, and won't do so until the day they lift that petty rule (which is never). Instead buying upload credit, I seedboxed my ass off when I could, it's not the most correct thing to do, but hey, those are the rules of the game.

[cinephilia]

Asking for any person or group to short-change themselves when it comes to doing their jobs because I don't agree with the moral side of it is egotistical.
an opinion doesn't imply trying to convince people.
you know, never disagreeing with anyone just because you respect their thoughts and beliefs doesn't make you more respectable or anything :shifty:

[Cabalo]

Asking for any person or group to short-change themselves when it comes to doing their jobs because I don't agree with the moral side of it is egotistical.
an opinion doesn't imply trying to convince people.
you know, never disagreeing with anyone just because you respect their thoughts and beliefs doesn't make you more respectable or anything :shifty:
Depends on the site we're speaking of. I can think of one or two where it is an unspoken rule.

[ca_aok]

which is absolutely fine otherwise your sig should be linking the world to your linkedin and facebook profiles.And I don't think ca_aok is your real name either.Some of us are paranoid but others tend to be a little too paranoid and I think you should try and understand that.
On a side note I actually know several people who join torrenting groups on facebook and add people as friends, which I find kinda funny. Linking your real name to the torrenting world isn't necessarily a good idea, but that goes beyond what's discussed here.

Sure some people are too paranoid, and that's their call. It still can look suspicious from an outside point of view. I'm not saying that such a perception is good or valid, it's simply a statement that to tracker staff you'll appear shifty if you're using different details everywhere.


I don't have the same nick or email on every tracker. Do I appear to be a trader or have something to hide? I think that only closed-minded or immature people would come to this kind of conclusion. ;)
Trader :whistling

But seriously, if you hadn't noticed by now that description fits several staff members, so I'd probably wager they're warming up your global ban as we speak :lol:


Which do you think our hypothetical person referred to? The lie, or the trading? I was under the assumption that most people that even bring the topic up to the table for discussion had a gripe with the conduct itself, not with people going back on their word.
One of the root reasons trading is bad is because you've inherently broken an agreement you made when you signed up for your own personal profit. It's hard to differentiate the two in this context, people might have an issue with the conduct, but part of the conduct is being dishonest and deceitful.

[Tokeman]

Its kind of hard to expect people to follow all the rules, when you make a rule that you can only download the files you have the legal rights to. I believe I've seen that rule on the majority of trackers I frequent. Obviously they don't expect you to follow all the rules, or they wouldn't be in 'business'.

[Funkin']

At the risk of sounding like a hypocritical jerk, I actually agree and commend them for anything they can and will do.


That's surprising. Even I installed this css script to prevent them from seeing my browsing. I think it's a real shitty thing that they're doing this. And eventhough I have nothing to hide, it's the fact that they're taking such measure just to catch a trader or cheater. Some people take this whole BT thing entirely too seriously.



Trader :whistling

But seriously, if you hadn't noticed by now that description fits several staff members, so I'd probably wager they're warming up your global ban as we speak :lol:


Yeah. And the funny thing is, I wouldn't be a bit surprised if one of the numerous questionable staffers throughout the bt community were to try and initiate a "global" ban for such a stupid reason. :rolleyes: