Case Design

[clocker]

I made the casual statement a while ago that perhaps it was time to design my own PC case.
Although that was a off the cuff remark, since then I've done quite a bit of thinking about it.
Right now I'm not particularly concerned with the materials/construction aspect, but rather, the desired features and layout.

It seems to me that there are number of inherent flaws in the standard case layout.
For instance, the PSU and CPU/HSF are typically very close together, creating an area of intense heat concentration, which necessitates more extreme cooling methods to deal with.

Think outside of the box if you will ( the final product doesn't have to be box shaped, after all), and tell me what you would like to see in a computer set up.

Any little obervation will do....

To start, my case has an absurdly sized "reset" button. Even my little finger is too big to press it in past the bezel. Not that I use it much, but if it's going to be there, it should work properly.

Okay, anyone?

[Virtualbody1234]

How about no case?

Find a way to support all the parts without an enclosure.

[clocker]

Well, that's a start, but dust and general vulnerability become an issue.

I know that you have personally assembled many PCs. Thinking back, isn't there something ( or somethings) that makes you say " Damn I wish they would do .... instead"?

[Virtualbody1234]

Dust is an issue anyway you look at it. It always gets in.

I think the most important thing to consider with a case design is easy access to each part. I mean to be able to remove and replace any part without having to dismantle a whole bunch of things.

[Evil Gemini]

I have always wanted to make a pc case out of scratch. Just starting of with the motherboard plate and drive bays :)

It would be very cool to have a case you have made your self.

Maybe you could use one of those mini PSU's like this one

http://www.tomshardware.com/howto/20020815/images/netzteil.jpg

Not sure if their is any above 200 watt.

Hey it might be fun to make your own PSU from the parts of an existing one :)

[clocker]

Originally posted by Virtualbody1234@28 November 2003 - 20:29
Dust is an issue anyway you look at it. It always gets in.


So true.

My initial thoughts center around a modular case design.
One enclosure for the PSU, one for the mainboard and chip and the third for the drives/controls.
This could be as easy as just subdividing a standard sized PC box shape, or as complex as three separate enclosures.
Each area/component has specific and different heat issues to deal with and the separate enclosures would allow me to deal with airflow introduction/extraction as needed.
I have been studying sound baffling techniques as applied to studio design and constructing anechoic chambers. Very interesting and not too difficult to apply if implemented in the design phase rather than grafted on later.

[bigdawgfoxx]

I would say put the PSU in a very separate area...like have a little nook for it..and have a fan blowing on it. Then have everything else away from it and organized cables...and have like 3 or 4 fans to keep the whole thing cool...The no case idea is good for coolling..just put a huge floor fan on it haha but you could get electric shock, and damage parts easily.

[3rd gen noob]

i wish that the main components of my pc were more spread out
more space between the components should mean less heat inside therefore less wear and tear on the parts
plus, of course, repair work would then be easier too

[clocker]

Originally posted by bigdawgfoxx@28 November 2003 - 20:48
Then have everything else away from it and organized cables
Organizing cables is a particular fetish of mine...no probs there. In fact I'm lucky in that I have access to a custom cable fabrication company right here in Denver, so if I need custom cables for the drives it's not a big deal.

I think that water cooling for the CPU is a definite option for this project. It solves several problems and reduces the airflow requirements in the motherboard enclosure. The pump/reservoir/radiator can all be in a separate space, thus reducing the risk to the electronics.

As far as drives go, I think that two optical and space for two HDDs should be plenty. This is probably the easiest of all areas to deal with as heat is not so much of an issue. Probably the most difficult aspect here is the neat routing of cables....

[_John_Lennon_]

Btw, about the PSU so close to the HS/F thing, just put the PSU on the bottom of the base, like, on the floor of it in the back.........

[clocker]

I was thinking somewhat along those lines, John.

A feat not possible in a normal case due to the PCI slots.

[Duffman]

What about something long and flat like a tower on its side so that each part could lay far enough away from each other that a particular part couldn't give off heat to another, your only problem would be long wires, and oh oh a suck and blow fan on each side respectivaley to keep the cross ventilation going

i have no expertise, expierence or even the slightest knowledge of computer case but in my head it seems to work, go easy on me

[_John_Lennon_]

Originally posted by clocker@29 November 2003 - 00:03
I was thinking somewhat along those lines, John.

A feat not possible in a normal case due to the PCI slots.
I know I dont use my bottom 3 PCI slots so it would fit on mine.

[clocker]

No Duffman, that is a good concept.
In a horizontal layout one part's heat wouldn't rise to interact with another part.

It could get a bit ungainly maybe, but still, a thought.

[boyzeee]

just a few thoughts..........

quick locking for pci+graphics cards would be great, ie no screws!

universal mobo headers and plugs, just a one for all plug would be great!

maybe front of case a jack for svideo/tv

front of case game port

custom psu, exact amount of cables req and to the right length with ports on psu to add extra cables if req (not hardwired)

i can dream :wacko:

[clocker]

Originally posted by _John_Lennon_@28 November 2003 - 22:09

I know I dont use my bottom 3 PCI slots so it would fit on mine.
Yes, but then any heat ( and it can be substantial) rising from the PSU goes directly onto the video card, does it not?

from boyzee...

maybe front of case a jack for svideo/tv

front of case game port

custom psu, exact amount of cables req and to the right length with ports on psu to add extra cables if req (not hardwired)
All doable, I should think.

Keep em comin, folks....

[_John_Lennon_]

Originally posted by clocker+29 November 2003 - 00:16--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (clocker @ 29 November 2003 - 00:16)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-_John_Lennon_@28 November 2003 - 22:09

I know I dont use my bottom 3 PCI slots so it would fit on mine.
Yes, but then any heat ( and it can be substantial) rising from the PSU goes directly onto the video card, does it not?
[/b][/quote]
Ahh, but is the top of your case above your powersupply very hot?

Exactly......... Of course, i have an aluminum case, but I still cant feel it even though its nearly flush against the top.

[clocker]

Well, my case is aluminum and yes, that dead air space got warm.
Not hot certainly, but warm.
Typically,3-5 degC above ambient case temp.

Last night and this AM, I flipped my PSU on it&#39;s back, inverted it&#39;s intake fan to exhaust, and cut a vent hole in the case roof above.
It now vents directly out of the case.

In fact, it was that project that really coalesced this topic.
I have been doing so much modding to my case that it seemed like it might be easier to just build one from scratch rather than forcing this one to morph into what I want...

[bob_the_alien]

I&#39;m not completely sure if this work reduce heat too much, but since you mentioned building a new case.
something I&#39;ve been thinking of,
you know how you can buy the fan plates, you use attached on the bottom of a laptop, to cool it.

Have a grail instead of plate behind the mobo, and behind the grail, several fans, blowing directly on the bottom of the mobo.

[Terminal Boredom]

Hmm, maybe instead of one box, you could try two stacked? A box on top with the PSU, radiator and pump for the cooling system. This way it can be open front and back (grilled) for maximum airflow.

The box on bottom would have a gasketed hole to the upper to pass cables, etc. If you go water cooling the bottom box could be sealed to prevent dust accumulation, etc.

[clocker]

Bob,

It has never occured to me to check...do you think that the back of the mainboard gets hot as well?

Terminal,

Exactly along the lines that I&#39;ve been thinking...modular.Isolate and deal with each heat source separately.


Does anyone know if the length of the IDE cables makes a significant impact on the performance of the component? Is there a practical limit to how far my HDD/CD/DVD can be from the motherboard?

[SciManAl]

the back of the mobo should only be hot near areas that are hot on top... (like the cpu)

other wise you are looking at ok temps...

as for distance clocker i give you 2 feet before you start lsing enough spped that it becomes noticable...

[clocker]

Originally posted by SciManAl@29 November 2003 - 08:47


as for distance clocker i give you 2 feet before you start lsing enough spped that it becomes noticable...
That&#39;s very generous of you Al, thanks.

Is that a guess?

[SciManAl]

nope :P
that is facts

[SciManAl]

if you want to be exact though to not have any speed decreasements no longer than 21 inches... but up to 24 will be ok... that is a latency issue, i had a run in with that problem and i researched it and fixed it so i know what i am saying is pretty acurate...

also look at the G5 case... it looks kinda like what you may be wanting to go for... it has temperate zones and it blows out the front... cray stuff..

http://a176.g.akamai.net/7/176/51/a0ab6783c646d9/www.apple.com/r/store/powermacinfoblock/images/indexopensideanim06232003.gif

[SciManAl]

also for easy access if you mader a desktop (or flat computer for you younger poeple) :P you could make the top simply lay on top , and get an air seal by running rubberaroiund the edges, and then gravity could replace screws.... and opening up da case could be easy as hell... things cpould just "fall into place" vie ridges and slots, and so removale/moding is easy to do... just an idea to throw your way...

[lynx]

How about putting hard drives on the other side of the mobo backplane?

You could have very short cables from the mobo to a connector on the backplane, and on the other side have a fixed hd power and data connection, or again have very short connectors.

Also, completely isolate the optical drives etc from the mobo area, using the ps fan to cool these devices (and possibly the hard drives). Similar short connectors through the bulkhead as described for hd. And because you already know (within reason) the distance from the bulkhead to the drive&#39;s data socket, you could have custom length cables for each drive bay.

The main bay now just has mobo and cards. No drives at the front so it can be shortened by quite a bit too. This may give some loss of stability, but you would gain this back because the case would be slightly wider.

Btw, the trick of screwless card mounting has already been done (by HP/Compaq and possibly others) but I don&#39;t see it as such a big issue. How often do you add/remove cards in real life (unless you are doing one of clocker&#39;s case modding experiments).

[SciManAl]

well i open my case about 4 times a day while i am messing with that and this etc... i think it IS sn issue or at least to make it easy to get into etc...

[bob_the_alien]

Originally posted by clocker@29 November 2003 - 09:23
Bob,

It has never occured to me to check...do you think that the back of the mainboard gets hot as well?
I&#39;ve never checked either, but I just thought if your going to build your own, it
can&#39;t hurt.

I think the cpu is located on the bottom of a laptop though, now that i think of it, so it would cool those allot better.

[SciManAl]

try to make it quiet, in my mind clocker i am thinking of every thing that doesn&#39;t require high performance cooling, ie normally just has a heatsink on it... should be cooled by a system of heatpipes(quiet self sustaining, and get pretty good performance...) and the rest to be cooled by water, that way less case fans=quiet qand high performance... also try to make more effective passive cooling systems... that could go idle, or things like net surfing with out any fans running at all, just have vents at the top for heat to migrate out of... (or 120 mm fans at very very low rpm) i think that would put a smile on a llot of poeples faces...

[SciManAl]

also (i am not spamming these ideas just "come out of nowhere") i am thinking that if there was a circut that would moniter each (qaudrent of space) and run fans based on the temps of the componets, not ambient temps... (just an idead)

gotta go eat so be back in a few hours

[clocker]

Excellent everyone&#33;

Thanks for the input.

I think water cooling for sure on the CPU ( and maybe the chipset, also). The pump, reservoir and radiator housed separate from everything else. I saw a very interesting radiator the other day ( but forgot to bookmark the site, so I&#39;ll have to hunt it up again :( ), it used no fans at all and was much larger than you might typically see. Instead of finning it had extruded aluminum heatsink kinda shapes and worked much like a heatpipe....very interesting and quite beautiful to boot.

I already use heatpipe coolers on my HDD and video card and am impressed with the efficiency. So they will stay also.

What are your thoughts on controls?
Besides the normal on/off and reset buttons I am in love with my "clear CMOS" button- makes recovering from a clocking booboo sooo easy.
Let&#39;s see...fan/zone control of some sort and temp displays for each area.

I think I&#39;ll incorporate the base station for my wireless mouse into this beast also...

Now, what about materials?

Right off the bat, I think wood and glass.

Wood is so easy to work with and it is also a very good sound dampener.
Glass (and probably some Plexi/Lexan for the bits that need cutouts) to show off the pretty parts.

Maybe, no promises, but just maybe, a light or two for Abu.

[adamp2p]

Originally posted by clocker@30 November 2003 - 04:19


Maybe, no promises, but just maybe, a light or two for Abu.
:lol: :lol:

Edit: I wish I could participate more in these great threads, but I am trying to finish my college transfer applications&#33; They are due tommorrow&#33;

[clocker]

Good luck with that, Adam.

[Virtualbody1234]

Maybe, no promises, but just maybe, a light or two for Abu.
A light? :o

[bob_the_alien]

I agree with the wood, would be the easiest.

But I think I&#39;d go with just plexi, instead of glass at all.
I mean, you&#39;re not going to be moving the system around much, but if you do move it, and hit something or drop it, (Accidents happen) and opps glass everywhere.

Something that woild be cool to use though, Diamond Plate, or maybe stamped plastic, of course this would start to get expensive.

[lynx]

Originally posted by clocker@30 November 2003 - 02:19
Maybe, no promises, but just maybe, a light or two for Abu.
And a plasma ball?

Can we? Can we? :lol:

[clocker]

Van der Graff generator?

A waterfall?

[_John_Lennon_]

Hmm, a CMOS button would rock, but how could you hook that up? Make the small circuit going right from the two CMOS clear pins, and pushing the button completes the circuit? Interesting. Would like to hear more on that.

Oh and btw, they make the Reset switch so small so that you dont easily hit it, and reset your comp.


Also, careful with the wood, rather heavy unless you get a very light kind, like a beach would, which you would have to get special. I mean, are you just going to go Lowes and get some of their wood? Ack, not what I would suggest for a nice beautiful case.

[clocker]

John, this is essentially the switch that I used...
http://www.radioshack.com/images/ProductCatalog/ProductImage/275/275-692.jpg
Connect the center terminal to the center pin of your CMOS header ( a fan connector will work perfectly here) and each end terminal to one of the other two pins.

We have plenty of exotic wood suppliers here in Denver, so Loew&#39;s is not an option.
I was thinking of padauk or claro walnut, but that is still to be decided.

[SciManAl]

yeah wood can be heavy, but you have lots of wood in colarado so no worry (just hope some lady doesn&#39;t get mad reading a letter from her boyfriend again :flame: :P )

i agree with plexi... cheap a little stronger (hell my case is made entirely out of plexi) and there are rumored "plexi bits" that make perfect holes, and cuts in plexi... staus lights are good i use them for at a glance diagnostic, while to the casual person they are just there for decore...

you do cars, what kind of tools/milling/metal working equip do you have, you could make a rival lian li (sp???) case of your own... :D

yeah and probably a way for all the switched to be in front and easy access, and not entending past the frame, so that if ipick it up i am not pressing any buttons/potentailly ripping one off...

and if it is at all a Lan Party comp, then it needs to be transportable, if the cooling unit is seperate then make it disconnecablte, or more simply put an in and out port in the back to hook up the h20 lines to...

[clocker]

Al, I don&#39;t even know what a "LAN party" is, so I probably won&#39;t be attending any soon.
I have a mill, 3 lathes and various and assorted matal/wood working tools of my own and access to almost anything else.

I may just cobble a prototype up out of plywood or something equally cheap and easy.
Seeing as how often I change stuff it might be a good idea...

[SciManAl]

Al, I don&#39;t even know what a "LAN party" is, so I probably won&#39;t be attending any soon.
lan party involves carieying ones computer around allot, (the reason for minis...)

umm yeah proto version should be wood... you can patch holes you don&#39;t want etc... but if you really went the distence, you could machine an aluminum case after you have the temperate zones etc how you want them... that would be kickass ya know... and if you keep it thin, then you should have no problems modding if you HAD too... (i imagine you will be moving fans and stuff, but at the point of making a metal one you would feel confident that air intakes are going to be the same place etc... along with the other elements of design... )


also, if you made a metal case, i am just now wondering about it, what if you used the metal of the case as a heatsink... don&#39;t know how... but ya know huge peece of metal... COULD be used...

Also in regard to the heatpipes, i was thinking that if applied right one could heatpipe things like the PSU, and northbridge as well, possibly to the point at wich the case no longer requires fans, or at least a much more passive heat dissapation plan... that also would make it quiter... i am currently working on a completly passive case cooling set up... the heat pipe will be the top of the case, just a huge grill... and then all compenets will be hooked up to it that don&#39;t require the performance cooling of the likes of the CPU, Video card... That is my goal, the only things that are making noise, are hard drives, optical drives, and the water pump... this will also be focussing on performance of course...

[_John_Lennon_]

Originally posted by SciManAl@30 November 2003 - 03:15

also, if you made a metal case, i am just now wondering about it, what if you used the metal of the case as a heatsink... don&#39;t know how... but ya know huge peece of metal... COULD be used...
That seems like it would work.......

Oh and Clocker, that switch looks like it would work perfectly, one to each of the 3 pins, excellant planning.

[lynx]

I like the idea of your cmos switch, but I would prefer to see a "momentary contact" type so it can&#39;t accidentally be left in the wrong position - I&#39;ve seen motherbards blown by leaving the jumper in the "clear" position and then switched on.

I realise that power/reset type switches don&#39;t meet the requirements, but there are a few "double throw" push button switches around. I think I would probably fit it into the back panel, so that it is away from prying fingers.

[clocker]

Originally posted by _John_Lennon_+30 November 2003 - 03:08--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (_John_Lennon_ &#064; 30 November 2003 - 03:08)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteBegin-SciManAl@30 November 2003 - 03:15

also, if you made a metal case, i am just now wondering about it, what if you used the metal of the case as a heatsink...&nbsp; don&#39;t know how... but ya know huge peece of metal...&nbsp; COULD be used...
That seems like it would work.......

[/b][/quote]
Of course it would work, guys. Zalman has already done it. (http://www.enscape.net/?id=140)
http://www.enscape.net/140/001.jpg

[SciManAl]

wow :o :huh: :P great&#33;&#33;&#33;

[clocker]

This (http://www.overclockers.com/tips1093/)
looks like it would be right up your alley, SciMan.

And this (http://www.highspeedpc.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=CTGY&Store_Code=HSPC&Category_Code=InnovaKonvect) is the convection radiator that I found. Looks real nice, but I have been unable to find any performance specs or reviews of it yet.

[racer II]

Clocker if you realy want to get water cooling be sure to check out this cpu block :
http://www.highspeedpc.com/Merchant2/merch...egory_Code=Rev3 (http://www.highspeedpc.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=CTGY&Store_Code=HSPC&Category_Code=Rev3) ive read alot of good things about it

[clocker]

Thanks Racer, I&#39;ve seen that block and the reviews are very good.
Plus, it has a very cool mounting system.

Unfortunately, the mounting makes the use of Peltier plates impossible and that is something that I want to leave open for future experiments.

Sigh.

[Virtualbody1234]

http://www.overclockers.com/tips1093/CPUairduct.jpg
That&#39;s interesting, clocker. Thanks.

[SciManAl]

clocker i have also seen the InnovaKonvekt-o-Matic Passive Radiator and i think it will work ok, but if you love leaving your computer on forever yhan this might not be for you... over time it will gain heat... however that is an example of what it will take fo a passive cooler, of course you could always tuck this cooler in the fridge... :P (i don&#39;t know if mini fridges are worth the cost, but you could snugg that right next to your comp...)

[SciManAl]

ewww i just thought, what if you take the InnovaKonvekt-o-Matic Passive Radiator and put it in a tank of something, like liqaud oxigen... that would give you extreme cooling potential, the case might not need any fans, simply because all the really hot stuff ie CPu north briodge, hdds, PSU, vid card, are having thier heat removed from the case... just an idead that has been done before...

[clocker]

Originally posted by Virtualbody1234@30 November 2003 - 09:08
http://www.overclockers.com/tips1093/CPUairduct.jpg
That&#39;s interesting, clocker. Thanks.
What struck me about that pic, VB, is that with all his interest in maximizing/ directing airflow, he doesn&#39;t appear to have taken even the most rudimentary steps towards clearing his case of obstructions.
The wiring is a mess.

I suppose that if you&#39;re willing to run your case wide open then that&#39;s no big deal, but even so... :(

I also think that his 90mm fan on the case back is ludicrous. It is so blocked by his duct that I don&#39;t see how it could be very effective.
It should be on the roof...

[Kunal]

clock you seem to have endless amounts of time, so test it for yourself :) ;)

[clocker]

Originally posted by Kunal@30 November 2003 - 10:07
clock you seem to have endless amounts of time, so test it for yourself :) ;)
Actually I have another idea.

And it doesn&#39;t involve cardboard and duct tape...

[Kunal]

Originally posted by clocker@30 November 2003 - 18:10
Actually I have another idea.

And it doesn&#39;t involve cardboard and duct tape..
which is? (sorry trying to get 1000 posts&#33; number 999 and counting....)

Edit: Well Got Me 1000 Posts&#33; :D :D :D

[clocker]

Originally posted by Kunal+30 November 2003 - 10:13--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Kunal @ 30 November 2003 - 10:13)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-clocker@30 November 2003 - 18:10
Actually I have another idea.

And it doesn&#39;t involve cardboard and duct tape..
which is? (sorry trying to get 1000 posts&#33; number 999 and counting....)

Edit: Well Got Me 1000 Posts&#33; :D :D :D [/b][/quote]
Post whore.

I&#39;m working on my idea.
Pics will follow if results are good.

If they aren&#39;t, then just forget I said anything...

[Kunal]

Originally posted by clocker@30 November 2003 - 18:20
Post whore.
look who&#39;s talking :rolleyes:

[Virtualbody1234]

Originally posted by clocker@30 November 2003 - 11:59
What struck me about that pic, VB, is that with all his interest in maximizing/ directing airflow, he doesn&#39;t appear to have taken even the most rudimentary steps towards clearing his case of obstructions.
The wiring is a mess.
Yeah I know. The nerve of him to even put a picture of it like that on the internet. :angry:

[clocker]

He&#39;s Canadian, isn&#39;t he?

Perhaps you should have a word with him.

[_John_Lennon_]

Originally posted by clocker@30 November 2003 - 12:29
He&#39;s Canadian, isn&#39;t he?

Perhaps you should have a word with him.
Over some beer&#39;s and a hockey game...... :rolleyes:

Just poking. :)

[bigdawgfoxx]

Originally posted by _John_Lennon_+29 November 2003 - 05:09--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (_John_Lennon_ @ 29 November 2003 - 05:09)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-clocker@29 November 2003 - 00:03
I was thinking somewhat along those lines, John.

A feat not possible in a normal case due to the PCI slots.
I know I dont use my bottom 3 PCI slots so it would fit on mine. [/b][/quote]
Yeah, but then your PSU would be so close to your graphics card...not good

[Virtualbody1234]

Hey clocker... Just for you&#33; http://www.personal.psu.edu/users/k/l/klh340/

[lynx]

Following up on the idea of heat disposal in a different area, I suppose the next step would be to use some sort of refrigeration unit. A small household freezer would be ideal, with a couple of holes drilled through the side for pipework and the radiator placed inside.

The drawback to this is the low temps involved in the freezer. Using water as the transfer medium would not be practical, even with antifreeze, and I personally think that alcohol is too flamable to be a safe alternative.

So I was thinking along the lines of using silicone based oil instead. Although it can be a little messy if spilt (to say the least), it has a relatively high flashpoint and a high heat capacity. More importantly it is non-conductive. A drawback is it&#39;s higher viscosity, so it is essential that a centrifugal type pump is used, rather than a gear pump. A household central heating pump would be ideal.

I&#39;ve been wondering where I could put such a freezer, and it has just struck me that the loft space immediately above would be ideal. There&#39;s already power up there, all I need is a small hole in the ceiling for the pipework. Better still, these sort of units are best unpressurised, so some sort of open bath is necessary. Obviously this is best at the top of the system, so a small tank sitting on top of the freezer would fit the bill.

All this is going to take a while, and I&#39;ll have to find out where we used to get silicone oil, so any results are likely to be some time away even if it is feasible.

[lynx]

Originally posted by Virtualbody1234@30 November 2003 - 20:58
Hey clocker... Just for you&#33; http://www.personal.psu.edu/users/k/l/klh340/
Did someone say "Finding Nemo"? :lol:

[racer II]

Lol @ http://www.personal.psu.edu/users/k/l/klh340/images/fishmobaby/fish1.jpg

[SciManAl]

actually if you are going to get a mini fridge, (or freezer or whatever) probably the best thing to do is simply put it all in there, minus the case of course.. just put it all inside.... a stylish Bawls cooler with a comp in it... hehehehe

but if you just want to put the radiater in it, then might i remind you that you gett to choose the temps in those things via a dial somewhere in the back... so you don&#39;t have to have subzero temps, just really cold temps... as cold as you want temps... lol

[Livy]

some nice ideas places, i was thinking about my own case to, but its alot of work involved,

another idea kind of on the lines as lynx.

if u are putting it up in the attic, why not dip the radiator in the water tank if u have one, as this will be pretty cool, and no need for extra noise etc. since the tank gets water through it quite quick, toilets, using water, showers baths etc and since it fed staright fromt he mains pipe.

[clocker]

lynx,
Look into aircraft brake fluid, it has some very interesting properties and may fit the bill.

VB,
An interesting effort, but I wonder why the fish tank is purely decorative instead of doing some work?

SciMan & Lynx,

I&#39;ve been looking into "dorm refridgerators" ( basically just very small units) as a method of cooling the radiator. Might work, and they are cheap.

[Virtualbody1234]

It&#39;s doing some work. Look at the CPU in this pic:

http://www.personal.psu.edu/users/k/l/klh340/images/fishmobaby/open_back.jpg

[clocker]

Yes, but he(?) says in the text that the aquarium water and the cooling water never mix. The aquarium doesn&#39;t even help cool the radiator. It&#39;s purely a deception.

[Virtualbody1234]

It&#39;s a she:

http://www.personal.psu.edu/users/k/l/klh340/images/fishmobaby/me.jpg

I&#39;ll read into it further. I found this in a magazine contest. She was the winner.

[clocker]

How come she doesn&#39;t post in here?

[Virtualbody1234]

Originally posted by clocker@30 November 2003 - 19:40
How come she doesn&#39;t post in here?
I don&#39;t know?

Maybe we have to invite her. :)

[lynx]

Well, she&#39;s certainly not using silicone. :D

clocker,
I suspect any brake fluid may fit the bill with regards to most of the required properties (I don&#39;t know about it&#39;s thermal capacity but I imagine it would be similar). I suspect it (and particularly aircraft bf) may be relatively expensive though, since it has to withstand extremes of temperature which wouldn&#39;t be required for this sort of project.

I would hesitate to use standard brake fluid because of it&#39;s property of absorbing water, as I&#39;m not sure what effect this would have on it&#39;s thermal properties, but it certainly has very low viscosity so it is worth investigating. The use of a brake fluid reservoir would certainly be a good idea for the header tank.

[SciManAl]

not a bad she to invite... hehehehe :P

yeah "dorm" fridges.. or just the coling units inside i think could be well worth looking into...

[Livy]

Originally posted by lynx@1 December 2003 - 02:33
Well, she&#39;s certainly not using silicone. :D

clocker,
I suspect any brake fluid may fit the bill with regards to most of the required properties (I don&#39;t know about it&#39;s thermal capacity but I imagine it would be similar). I suspect it (and particularly aircraft bf) may be relatively expensive though, since it has to withstand extremes of temperature which wouldn&#39;t be required for this sort of project.

I would hesitate to use standard brake fluid because of it&#39;s property of absorbing water, as I&#39;m not sure what effect this would have on it&#39;s thermal properties, but it certainly has very low viscosity so it is worth investigating. The use of a brake fluid reservoir would certainly be a good idea for the header tank.
what about the oil the put in the small radiators u can buy in the shops, i wouldnt have thought that would have been hard to come by,
and it will be doing the same thing, getting heated by the cpu, and transferring the heat outside.

[lynx]

The "dorm" fridge is the sort of thing I was thinking about earlier. Or alternatively a very small freezer, if you want lower temps. I think it would be important to keep the integrity of the unit, so that it could be filled with water bottles (for a fridge) or ice packs (for a freezer) in order to absorb temperature fluctuations. The alternative would be to put the cooling coil into an oil (or other fluid) reservoir, but this would then mean a much larger quantity of expensive fluid, and a bigger header tank.

Livy, your idea of putting the radiator into a loft water tank is a good idea, except for the fact that I&#39;ve just ripped mine out in favour of instant water heating. :lol:

The oil for oil-filled radiators is quite heavy and realtively viscous. Since it is used for heating only I&#39;m not sure it would be too good at low temps, and certainly isn&#39;t designed to be pumped around.

[Livy]

Originally posted by lynx@1 December 2003 - 03:02
Livy, your idea of putting the radiator into a loft water tank is a good idea, except for the fact that I&#39;ve just ripped mine out in favour of instant water heating. :lol:

The oil for oil-filled radiators is quite heavy and realtively viscous. Since it is used for heating only I&#39;m not sure it would be too good at low temps, and certainly isn&#39;t designed to be pumped around.
oh well, worth a go. i thought you would still have a tank for cold water. as thats what mines is for, the only tap that runs of the actual mains pipe directly is the kitchen tap.

and it would keep it cool, and its would be easy to do.

[SciManAl]

Did anyone ever invite her???