How Far Does The Whole Universe Go? [Archive]

Spider_dude

12-18-2003, 03:39 AM

Originally posted by I.am+18 December 2003 - 03:34--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (I.am @ 18 December 2003 - 03:34)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-abu_has_the_power@17 December 2003 - 22:10
is the universe a endless thing of emptiness and aliens and porno astonauts? or it is like how they portrayed it in men in black, where every galaxy is a marble. hmm.... could use some opinions here.
Ok. I had to come out and tell you this. Tsk tsk, dont let anyone here us. There is no universe. All this was just a TV Show! Havent you seen the movie Truman show
All these people are watching you every minute what you do and laughing at the dumb things you do.
So hey they might take me somewhere now. So better watch out. [/b][/quote]
shit i better stop wanking then!!!!!!!!!11111111111

100%

12-18-2003, 03:40 AM

http://acd.ucar.edu/models/SOCRATES/socrates/eq44.gif

abu_has_the_power

12-18-2003, 03:49 AM

Originally posted by Zedaxax@17 December 2003 - 22:40
http://acd.ucar.edu/models/SOCRATES/socrates/eq44.gif
u post the weirdest things. and yea, wat's on the ohter side of that wall? now u c my dilemma

Virtualbody1234

12-18-2003, 05:35 AM

It's big.

Keikan

12-18-2003, 05:49 AM

Originally posted by abu_has_the_power@17 December 2003 - 20:10
is the universe a endless thing of emptiness and aliens and porno astonauts? or it is like how they portrayed it in men in black, where every galaxy is a marble. hmm.... could use some opinions here.
I say its like men in black, never ends.

Adster

12-18-2003, 05:53 AM

Originally posted by abu_has_the_power@18 December 2003 - 13:10
is the universe a endless thing of emptiness and aliens and porno astonauts? or it is like how they portrayed it in men in black, where every galaxy is a marble. hmm.... could use some opinions here.
where aliens

lynx

12-18-2003, 10:32 AM

How Far Does The Whole Universe Go?
Right up to the edges. :P

3rd gen noob

12-18-2003, 10:39 AM

i'd say that it does end and that after ends there is literally nothing
you can't see or detect the end though

muchspl2

12-18-2003, 10:45 AM

http://www.damtp.cam.ac.uk/user/gr/public/images/mtheory.gif

seems you have to look extremely small to learn the extremely big

3rd gen noob

12-18-2003, 10:50 AM

Originally posted by muchspl2@18 December 2003 - 09:45
http://www.damtp.cam.ac.uk/user/gr/public/images/mtheory.gif

seems you have to look extremely small to learn the extremely big
planet != universe :P

Alucard1475

12-18-2003, 12:48 PM

How Far Does The Whole Universe Go?, does it ever end?

No it doesn't. If you could come to an end, there would be just nothing. Close your eyes, that's how it would look like. :bag:

J'Pol

12-18-2003, 01:43 PM

Which universe are we talking about here and exactly how many dimensions do you feel we should be using.

If you are sticking to 3 or 4 then the question is pretty much pointless.

lynx

12-18-2003, 02:10 PM

Originally posted by J'Pol@18 December 2003 - 12:43
Which universe are we talking about here and exactly how many dimensions do you feel we should be using.

If you are sticking to 3 or 4 then the question is pretty much pointless.
Although I admit that there may be more than 4 dimensions, since our senses can only detect 4 it seems that exploring the possibilities using these 4 dimensions is very relevant.

Any other solutions are merely theoretical and would remain so.

J'Pol

12-18-2003, 02:13 PM

Originally posted by lynx+18 December 2003 - 15:10--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (lynx @ 18 December 2003 - 15:10)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-J'Pol@18 December 2003 - 12:43
Which universe are we talking about here and exactly how many dimensions do you feel we should be using.

If you are sticking to 3 or 4 then the question is pretty much pointless.
Although I admit that there may be more than 4 dimensions, since our senses can only detect 4 it seems that exploring the possibilities using these 4 dimensions is very relevant.

Any other solutions are merely theoretical and would remain so. [/b][/quote]
Absolute, unadulterated drivel.

Which of your senses do you use to detect the 4 you accept as being more than "merely theoretical".

Your last is like saying discuss a cube, but only in 2 dimensions. That would be a square.

lynx

12-18-2003, 02:36 PM

Originally posted by J'Pol+18 December 2003 - 13:13--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (J'Pol @ 18 December 2003 - 13:13)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>
Originally posted by lynx@18 December 2003 - 15:10
<!--QuoteBegin-J'Pol@18 December 2003 - 12:43
Which universe are we talking about here and exactly how many dimensions do you feel we should be using.

If you are sticking to 3 or 4 then the question is pretty much pointless.
Although I admit that there may be more than 4 dimensions, since our senses can only detect 4 it seems that exploring the possibilities using these 4 dimensions is very relevant.

Any other solutions are merely theoretical and would remain so.
Absolute, unadulterated drivel.

Which of your senses do you use to detect the 4 you accept as being more than "merely theoretical".

Your last is like saying discuss a cube, but only in 2 dimensions. That would be a square. [/b][/quote]
Personally, I can detect width, length height and time.

If you can detect more, please astound the scientific world with your achievements.
Otherwise stop talking such utter crap.

J'Pol

12-18-2003, 02:38 PM

Originally posted by lynx+18 December 2003 - 15:36--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (lynx @ 18 December 2003 - 15:36)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>
Originally posted by J'Pol@18 December 2003 - 13:13

Originally posted by lynx@18 December 2003 - 15:10
<!--QuoteBegin-J'Pol@18 December 2003 - 12:43
Which universe are we talking about here and exactly how many dimensions do you feel we should be using.

If you are sticking to 3 or 4 then the question is pretty much pointless.
Although I admit that there may be more than 4 dimensions, since our senses can only detect 4 it seems that exploring the possibilities using these 4 dimensions is very relevant.

Any other solutions are merely theoretical and would remain so.
Absolute, unadulterated drivel.

Which of your senses do you use to detect the 4 you accept as being more than "merely theoretical".

Your last is like saying discuss a cube, but only in 2 dimensions. That would be a square.
Personally, I can detect width, length height and time.

If you can detect more, please astound the scientific world with your achievements.
Otherwise stop talking such utter crap. [/b][/quote]
Which sense do you use to detect time, smartarse

bigboab

12-18-2003, 02:46 PM

Abu just dont think about it. ;) The human mind cannot understand infinity. :unsure: Go and watch a movie, then come out and get a drink and a take away. :rolleyes: Leave all that rubbish to people who think they know. :)

DanB

12-18-2003, 02:47 PM

Sound advice BB

RGX

12-18-2003, 02:48 PM

Ah but it is fun to try :)

This stuff used to blow my mind when i was ten, it still does today, but you've just got to accept that the human brain is limited in what it can calculate or perceive

Doesnt stop it being an incredible organ though ;)

J'Pol

12-18-2003, 02:48 PM

Originally posted by bigboab@18 December 2003 - 15:46
Abu just dont think about it. ;) The human mind cannot understand infinity. :unsure: Go and watch a movie, then come out and get a drink and a take away. :rolleyes: Leave all that rubbish to people who think they know. :)
I would have loved for you to have been my lecturer when you were plying your trade boab. :lol: :lol: :lol:

Feck it, we can't be arsed, let's go for a beer. :D :D :D

lynx

12-18-2003, 02:52 PM

Originally posted by J'Pol+18 December 2003 - 13:38--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (J'Pol @ 18 December 2003 - 13:38)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>
Originally posted by lynx@18 December 2003 - 15:36

Originally posted by J'Pol@18 December 2003 - 13:13

Originally posted by lynx@18 December 2003 - 15:10
<!--QuoteBegin-J'Pol@18 December 2003 - 12:43
Which universe are we talking about here and exactly how many dimensions do you feel we should be using.

If you are sticking to 3 or 4 then the question is pretty much pointless.
Although I admit that there may be more than 4 dimensions, since our senses can only detect 4 it seems that exploring the possibilities using these 4 dimensions is very relevant.

Any other solutions are merely theoretical and would remain so.
Absolute, unadulterated drivel.

Which of your senses do you use to detect the 4 you accept as being more than "merely theoretical".

Your last is like saying discuss a cube, but only in 2 dimensions. That would be a square.
Personally, I can detect width, length height and time.

If you can detect more, please astound the scientific world with your achievements.
Otherwise stop talking such utter crap.
Which sense do you use to detect time, smartarse [/b][/quote]
I wouldn't know how to begin to describe it, but I can assure you I do.

What's the first of your extra dimensions? The bottom of a beer glass?

bigboab

12-18-2003, 02:54 PM

Originally posted by J'Pol@18 December 2003 - 14:48
Feck it, we can't be arsed, let's go for a beer. :D  :D  :D
I've done it JP? :lol: Called it field studies.

I've also stopped a lecture because no one was grasping the concept. Started teaching a completely new subject. Not one of them bloody noticed. :lol: :lol:

J'Pol

12-18-2003, 02:56 PM

Originally posted by lynx@18 December 2003 - 15:52

You then sir are the marvel of nature, for you can detect time using one (or more)of your senses.

Here's the options

Taste It
Touch It
See It
Smell It
Hear It.

You don't have to give me a complex explanation, just pick one (or more).

DanB

12-18-2003, 02:56 PM

Originally posted by bigboab@18 December 2003 - 15:54
I've also stopped a lecture because no one was grasping the concept. Started teaching a completely new subject. Not one of them bloody noticed. :lol: :lol:
:lol: :lol:

What subject did you use to teach?

Gemby!

12-18-2003, 02:57 PM

why does anyone even bother to try and discover how big the universe is - the fact is we may never know so why try !?

or who cares - we aint gonna go there !

J'Pol

12-18-2003, 02:57 PM

Originally posted by bigboab+18 December 2003 - 15:54--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (bigboab @ 18 December 2003 - 15:54)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-J'Pol@18 December 2003 - 14:48
Feck it, we can't be arsed, let's go for a beer. :D :D :D
I've done it JP? :lol: Called it field studies.

I've also stopped a lecture because no one was grasping the concept. Started teaching a completely new subject. Not one of them bloody noticed. :lol: :lol: [/b][/quote]
Speaks volumes for someone - not sure who though :blink: :lol: ;)

3rd gen noob

12-18-2003, 02:58 PM

Originally posted by bigboab@18 December 2003 - 13:54
I've also stopped a lecture because no one was grasping the concept. Started teaching a completely new subject. Not one of them bloody noticed. :lol: :lol:
what do you lecture in?

bigboab

12-18-2003, 02:58 PM

Originally posted by danb+18 December 2003 - 14:56--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (danb @ 18 December 2003 - 14:56)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-bigboab@18 December 2003 - 15:54
I've also stopped a lecture because no one was grasping the concept. Started teaching a completely new subject. Not one of them bloody noticed. :lol:  :lol:
:lol: :lol:

What subject did you use to teach? [/b][/quote]
Computer Programming and Basic Systems Analysis and Design were the main ones.

J'Pol

12-18-2003, 02:58 PM

Originally posted by 3rd gen noob+18 December 2003 - 15:58--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (3rd gen noob @ 18 December 2003 - 15:58)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-bigboab@18 December 2003 - 13:54
I've also stopped a lecture because no one was grasping the concept. Started teaching a completely new subject. Not one of them bloody noticed. :lol:  :lol:
what do you lecture in? [/b][/quote]
Fear :ph34r:

J'Pol

12-18-2003, 02:59 PM

Originally posted by bigboab+18 December 2003 - 15:58--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (bigboab @ 18 December 2003 - 15:58)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>
Originally posted by danb@18 December 2003 - 14:56
<!--QuoteBegin-bigboab@18 December 2003 - 15:54
I've also stopped a lecture because no one was grasping the concept. Started teaching a completely new subject. Not one of them bloody noticed. :lol: :lol:
:lol: :lol:

What subject did you use to teach?
Computer Programming and Basic Systems Analysis and Design were the main ones. [/b][/quote]
The latter also described as - Be SAD

bigboab

12-18-2003, 03:00 PM

Originally posted by J'Pol@18 December 2003 - 14:59
The latter also described as - Be SAD
That is what it was called JP. ;)

DanB

12-18-2003, 03:01 PM

Originally posted by bigboab+18 December 2003 - 16:00--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (bigboab @ 18 December 2003 - 16:00)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-J'Pol@18 December 2003 - 14:59
The latter also described as  - Be SAD
That is what it was called JP. ;) [/b][/quote]
Its a tad unfortunate :lol: :lol: :lol:

lynx

12-18-2003, 03:04 PM

Originally posted by J'Pol+18 December 2003 - 13:56--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (J'Pol @ 18 December 2003 - 13:56)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-lynx@18 December 2003 - 15:52

You then sir are the marvel of nature, for you can detect time using one (or more)of your senses.

Here's the options

Taste It
Touch It
See It
Smell It
Hear It.

You don't have to give me a complex explanation, just pick one (or more). [/b][/quote]
If you can't detect time without using one of those senses, then I pity you.

However, it would explain quite a lot.

bigboab

12-18-2003, 03:06 PM

Originally posted by J'Pol+18 December 2003 - 14:57--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (J'Pol @ 18 December 2003 - 14:57)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>
Originally posted by bigboab@18 December 2003 - 15:54
<!--QuoteBegin-J'Pol@18 December 2003 - 14:48
Feck it, we can't be arsed, let's go for a beer. :D :D :D
I've done it JP? :lol: Called it field studies.

I've also stopped a lecture because no one was grasping the concept. Started teaching a completely new subject. Not one of them bloody noticed. :lol: :lol:
Speaks volumes for someone - not sure who though :blink: :lol: ;) [/b][/quote]
These were the subjects that thinned out the classes after the last Grant Cheque. :lol:

J'Pol

12-18-2003, 03:09 PM

Lynx

You said

Although I admit that there may be more than 4 dimensions, since our senses can only detect 4 it seems that exploring the possibilities using these 4 dimensions is very relevant.

Unless you have a sense in addition to the five I mentioned, then your posts contradict each other.

Either you can detect time using one of the five, or you can't.

Gemby!

12-18-2003, 03:10 PM

Originally posted by lynx@18 December 2003 - 15:04

If you can't detect time without using one of those senses, then I pity you.

However, it would explain quite a lot.
i have not ever tried so i dont know .... how do you taste time ?? lick your watch ? :lol:

DanB

12-18-2003, 03:13 PM

But you can sense the passage of time.

Don't ask me how but you can :unsure:

Gemby!

12-18-2003, 03:14 PM

oo like when you sit in the dark and you know that time is going by but you dont do any of them things above :)

lynx

12-18-2003, 03:18 PM

Originally posted by J'Pol@18 December 2003 - 14:09
Lynx

You said

Although I admit that there may be more than 4 dimensions, since our senses can only detect 4 it seems that exploring the possibilities using these 4 dimensions is very relevant.

Unless you have a sense in addition to the five I mentioned, then your posts contradict each other.

Either you can detect time using one of the five, or you can't.
Could it be that your definition of senses is lacking?

The senses you've mentioned apply only to things in a three dimensional universe. Ie in general they have width, length and height.

Edit: I notice you aren't enlightening us about your extra dimensions.

mrlessk

12-18-2003, 03:50 PM

Originally posted by RGX@18 December 2003 - 05:48

Doesnt stop it being an incredible organ though ;)
Yeah! I've got one of those myself.... :)

But for the human mind to try and comprehend infinity and space is the same as it trying to deal with eternity. Our little minds demand that there be a starting and stopping point. Logic tells us that there should be but us humans were not given minds capable of comprehending such existence.

So, we continue to theorize and debate...... ^_^ .....it's the only way we can deal with it.

mrlessk

abu_has_the_power

12-18-2003, 11:55 PM

well, this is certainly breaking off topic. so it goes on forever? hmm... do u guys believe in multiverses?

Monkster

12-19-2003, 12:39 AM

what about the 6th sense? :o

do u guys believe in multiverses? i dunno, maybe...it would be cool though...have u seen "Time Line?"

J'Pol

12-19-2003, 12:42 AM

Originally posted by abu_has_the_power@19 December 2003 - 00:55
do u guys believe in multiverses?
I've heard some really long songs. Mostly Bob Dylan.

abu_has_the_power

12-19-2003, 04:03 AM

Originally posted by J'Pol+18 December 2003 - 19:42--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (J'Pol @ 18 December 2003 - 19:42)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-abu_has_the_power@19 December 2003 - 00:55
do u guys believe in multiverses?
I've heard some really long songs. Mostly Bob Dylan. [/b][/quote]
lol. no, like in Jet Li's The One, a multiverse is a system of many universes

colt45joe

12-19-2003, 06:32 AM

i have been wondering forever how they did this:

http://micro.magnet.fsu.edu/primer/java/sc...of10/index.html (http://micro.magnet.fsu.edu/primer/java/scienceopticsu/powersof10/index.html)

kAb

12-19-2003, 07:06 AM

It begins getting scary when you think about it.

I do believe the most popular theory is the universe bends and is in an infinite loop.

but whats outside the loop? :huh:

another scary thought: what if our solar system approached a black hole. everything would cease to exist in a billionth of a billionth of a billionth of a second.

mrlessk

12-19-2003, 09:31 AM

Originally posted by kAb@18 December 2003 - 22:06
everything would cease to exist in a billionth of a billionth of a billionth of a second.
Personally, I would prefer the end to come much more quickly than this, to avoid the inevitable pain and suffering that would undoubtedly be associated with this final period of man's existence. :-"

http://www.badastronomy.com/pix/bhbathbig.jpg

bigboab

12-19-2003, 09:35 AM

Originally posted by kAb@19 December 2003 - 07:06
It begins getting scary when you think about it.

I do believe the most popular theory is the universe bends and is in an infinite loop.

but whats outside the loop? :huh:

another scary thought: what if our solar system approached a black hole. everything would cease to exist in a billionth of a billionth of a billionth of a second.
Who measured this. :unsure:

lynx

12-19-2003, 11:02 AM

Originally posted by bigboab+19 December 2003 - 08:35--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (bigboab @ 19 December 2003 - 08:35)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-kAb@19 December 2003 - 07:06
It begins getting scary when you think about it.

I do believe the most popular theory is the universe bends and is in an infinite loop.

but whats outside the loop?  :huh:

another scary thought: what if our solar system approached a black hole. everything would cease to exist in a billionth of a billionth of a billionth of a second.
Who measured this. :unsure: [/b][/quote]
Don't know.

But I want one of those watches.

james_bond_rulez

12-19-2003, 11:13 AM

there is a limitation to universe, OUR universe anyway

the big bang theory stated that the universe was created under a supernova mater-antimatter/darkmatter super fucking explosion and the instant the explosion occured, space is created. And as this explosion expanded, so is this space we call universe.

Scientists have observed that the universe is getting smaller using doppler effect in relation to the positions of the galaxies and the stars.

so i guess billions of eons later another explosion will occur and create another universe....

Barbarossa

12-19-2003, 11:35 AM

Originally posted by james_bond_rulez@19 December 2003 - 10:13

Scientists have observed that the universe is getting smaller using doppler effect in relation to the positions of the galaxies and the stars.

No they haven't!! The universe has been observed to be expanding and will continue to expand unless there is enough dark matter to bring it all back together again.. current observations suggest there isn't.

I like the "Men Behaving Badly" theory of the universe, which suggests that after the end of space, you find milk, and milk is actually the final frontier, and goes on forever...

Barbarossa

12-19-2003, 11:37 AM

Originally posted by gemby!@18 December 2003 - 14:14
oo like when you sit in the dark and you know that time is going by but you dont do any of them things above :)
Time is there to stop everything happening all at once.. :blink:

james_bond_rulez

12-19-2003, 11:39 AM

Originally posted by barbarossa+19 December 2003 - 02:35--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (barbarossa @ 19 December 2003 - 02:35)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-james_bond_rulez@19 December 2003 - 10:13

Scientists have observed that the universe is getting smaller using doppler effect in relation to the positions of the galaxies and the stars.

No they haven't!! The universe has been observed to be expanding and will continue to expand unless there is enough dark matter to bring it all back together again.. current observations suggest there isn't.

I like the "Men Behaving Badly" theory of the universe, which suggests that after the end of space, you find milk, and milk is actually the final frontier, and goes on forever... [/b][/quote]
then how do you explain the constellations getting closer together? i dont think there is a black hole strong enough to pull ALL these stars into it at the same time :blink:

Barbarossa

12-19-2003, 11:40 AM

Originally posted by kAb@19 December 2003 - 06:06
It begins getting scary when you think about it.

I do believe the most popular theory is the universe bends and is in an infinite loop.

but whats outside the loop? :huh:

another scary thought: what if our solar system approached a black hole. everything would cease to exist in a billionth of a billionth of a billionth of a second.
It doesn't matter anyway, because our universe isn't real, it's just a VR simulation (Horizon, 9:00 pm 18th December 2003, BBC2)

Barbarossa

12-19-2003, 11:50 AM

Originally posted by james_bond_rulez@19 December 2003 - 10:39

then how do you explain the constellations getting closer together? i dont think there is a black hole strong enough to pull ALL these stars into it at the same time  :blink:
What are you talking about??

A constellation is nothing other than the pattern of stars as viewed from Earth, the stars in a constellation are:

a. All separate stars in our own galaxy (the milky way)
b. Hundreds of light years from each other
c. A small infinitessimal fraction of the entire universe

And I haven't heard of any evidence that suggests they are getting closer together, please post a source...

EDIT: Unintentional smiley caused by b ) B)

james_bond_rulez

12-19-2003, 11:54 AM

i dont need a source it's a proven fact

using doppler effect (the light spectrum) scientists were able to determine the light emitted from the stars are getting from violet to red (far to near)

i guess you dont watch nova channels or discovery channel they've got some wonder documentaries on this topic <_<

Barbarossa

12-19-2003, 12:07 PM

Originally posted by james_bond_rulez@19 December 2003 - 10:54
i dont need a source it's a proven fact

using doppler effect (the light spectrum) scientists were able to determine the light emitted from the stars are getting from violet to red (far to near)

i guess you dont watch nova channels or discovery channel they've got some wonder documentaries on this topic <_<
I realise I'm getting a bit high-brow for the lounge, but here's a couple more points for you to duck under as they fly straight over your head.. <_<

1. The doppler effect is produced when objects are seen (or heard) to be moving with respect to the frame of reference of the observer (i.e. you or me). When objects are moving towards the observer then the spectrum is "blueshifted", i.e. observed at a shorter wavelength. When objects are moving away from the observer then the spectrum is "redshifted", i.e. observed at a longer wavelength. This effect can be observed every day by listening to police sirens, when the police car is moving towards you the sound is of a higher pitch than when it is moving away from you. :geek:

With respect to the light of stars and galaxies, the light has been observed to be all redshifted, which means the objects in question are moving away from us, implying that the universe is expanding. :alien:

2. No, I don't watch those channels, I read books, and studied astronomy at university, it might have been over a decade ago now but I hope I've remembered enough to explain this to you adequately. :smartass:

Of course, the universe may have done a u-turn within the last 10 years which I'm not aware of, but then again, I don't think so... :unsure:

james_bond_rulez

12-19-2003, 12:09 PM

http://www.angelfire.com/ca6/aliou/expanduniverse.htm

http://www.astro.queensu.ca/~hanes/p014/No....html#why%20not (http://www.astro.queensu.ca/~hanes/p014/Notes/Topic_074.html#why%20not)

there are conflicting views on this so i am not sure if the universe is expanding or shrinking

the big bang is called in question and there are proof that the redshift is not explaining why the universe is not expanding either.

so i dunno :(

james_bond_rulez

12-19-2003, 12:17 PM

barbarossa wow you have an astronomy degree? how is that working out for ya?

u work in an observatory? can i visit? :lol:

Barbarossa

12-19-2003, 12:26 PM

http://www.angelfire.com/ca6/aliou/expanduniverse.htm

Personally, I think there needs to be more explanation of the following statements:

Most astronomer agree that the Universe is not a Euclidean

Almost all astronomy agrees that the Universe is not Euclidean space

From the evident we have so far most agree it is not a Euclidean space

F. CONCLUSION

In my opinion, "LIOU'S STRETCH EFFECT" in the Hyperbolic Universe with curvature is more reasonable than the DOPPLER EFFECT in the Euclidean Universe

Also..

If there is no expansion of the Universe, there is no Big Bang.

..without a big bang it's kind of hard to explain the 3 degree background radiation (observed) and the presence of deuterium in the centre of stars (big bang is the only known natural source of deuterium) <_<

Barbarossa

12-19-2003, 12:27 PM

Originally posted by james_bond_rulez@19 December 2003 - 11:17
barbarossa wow you have an astronomy degree? how is that working out for ya?

u work in an observatory? can i visit? :lol:
I said I studied astronomy, I didn't say I passed..... :lol:

james_bond_rulez

12-19-2003, 12:32 PM

hmm fasinating, deuterium...

Deuterium
Deuterium, stable, nonradioactive isotope of hydrogen with atomic weight 2.01363 and symbol D, or 2H. It is commonly called heavy hydrogen because its atomic weight is approximately double that of ordinary hydrogen, but it has identical chemical properties. Deuterium has about twice the atomic weight of normal hydrogen because its nucleus contains a proton and a neutron, instead of just a proton.Hydrogen as it occurs in nature contains approximately 0.02 percent of deuterium. The boiling point of deuterium is -249.49° C (-417.08° F), or 3.28° C (5.90° F) higher than that of ordinary hydrogen. Heavy water (deuterium oxide, D2O) boils at 101.42° C (214.56° F) as compared to 100° C (212° F), the boiling point of ordinary water. It freezes at 3.81° C (38.86° F) as compared to 0° C (32° F) for ordinary water. Its density at room temperature is 10.79 percent greater than that of ordinary water.

Deuterium, which was discovered by the American chemist Harold Urey and his associates in 1932, was the first isotope to be separated in a pure form from an element. Several methods have been used to separate the isotope from natural hydrogen. The two processes that have been most successful have been fractional distillation of water and a catalytic exchange process between hydrogen and water. In the latter system, when water and hydrogen are brought together in the presence of a suitable catalyst, about three times as much deuterium appears in the water as in hydrogen. Deuterium has also been concentrated by electrolysis, centrifuging, and fractional distillation of liquid hydrogen.

The nuclei of deuterium atoms, called deuterons, are much used in research in physics because they can be readily accelerated by cyclotrons and similar machines and used as “atomic bullets” to transform an atom of one element into another element. Deuterium also has important uses in biological research as a tracer element for studying problems of metabolism (see Isotopic Tracer).

Regular hydrogen and deuterium are not normally metallic, meaning they are not shiny or malleable. Scientists have used pressure and heat, however, to force deuterium to act like a metal, making it shinier and easier to compress. In 1998, scientists announced that they had used lasers to shock a sample of deuterium, compressing it and heating it enough that it behaved like a metal. Studying deuterium in these conditions can help scientists understand how hydrogen behaves in the hot, heavily pressurized interiors of planets such as Jupiter and Saturn and in the interiors of stars such as our Sun.

The use of heavy water as a moderator in atomic piles was suggested during World War II but in the first U.S. piles, graphite was employed instead (see Nuclear Energy). Deuterium, either in deuterium oxide or in lithium deuteride (LiD), and tritium are essential components of nuclear fusion weapons, or hydrogen bombs (see Nuclear Weapons).

Microsoft ® Encarta ® Reference Library 2004. © 1993-2003 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.

Barbarossa

12-19-2003, 12:36 PM

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deuterium

The existence of deuterium in stars is one of the arguments in favour of the big bang theory over the steady state theory. Stellar fusion destroys deuterium and there are no known processes other than the big bang itself which produce deuterium.

:blink:

james_bond_rulez

12-19-2003, 12:36 PM

ok wtf i went into the forum to check on a few thing why am i hooked in this topic?

damn u barbarossa i was reading porn..... :lol:

now back to business :lol:

Snee

12-19-2003, 03:28 PM

Originally posted by muchspl2@18 December 2003 - 11:45
http://www.damtp.cam.ac.uk/user/gr/public/images/mtheory.gif

Also, according to M-Theory (http://www.damtp.cam.ac.uk/user/gr/public/qg_ss.html), M-space would be a type of Makroverse, containing a large or infinite number of parallel universes (http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?articleID=000F1EDD-B48A-1E90-8EA5809EC5880000&pageNumber=1&catID=2), it's been said that anything that could possibly happen, happens somewhere.

According to that theory, forces that are comparably weak in this universe, are actually derived from other universes (http://www.bbc.co.uk/science/horizon/2001/parallelunitrans.shtml). In the instance of gravity, for example, it is believed that we "leech" it off from another universe we are connected to (through a quantuum-tunnel?). A concept, derived from, I think, the Earlier "Super-Gravity" theory, which also accounts for an extra dimension.

And like I've written before, our universe is believed to be a sort of membrane- the former superstrings have now become this membrane- models I've seen have shown this membrane in a globular or spherical shape, giving me the impression of a curved universe.

It's been said that M-theory is the closest yet to a "theory of everything".

However, there's also the matter of the holographic universe (http://www.crystalinks.com/holographic.html), I believe it is Hawking that has said that no information is ever lost in the universe. For this to be true, black holes have to be holographic (http://www.damtp.cam.ac.uk/user/gr/public/holo/), but for black holes to be holographic alone makes no sense.

Since there is a limit to the degree of compression possible on the surface of a black hole, as all information absorbed by the black hole has to be stored on the surface (Information here meaning the structure and composition of everything absorbed, I believe, this is however unclear to mean as I've only just become aware of the theory). Therefore it has been put forth that the entire universe is, holographic, and in essence a projection of something flat where all information the universe contains is constant, or something. :blink:

There may be more edges to the universe than we think.

There are of course other ways (http://www.leaderu.com/real/ri9403/evidence.html) to look at the universe as well, though some seem less likely to me.

:)