What's With The Riaa?

[spong]

I sent a mail to the RIAA along similar lines to this, but they're to busy to respond to me.

I guess they keep an eye on this site, so maybe someone would care to respond to this here?

When the RIAA accuse p2p network users of theft, they are more or less correct. But on the other hand, is the music indusrty doing anything positive to combat the problem?

Nope. They're doing (or threatening) plenty of negative actions. 'We'll sue you', 'all your favourite bands will starve', etc etc.

So, a couple of questions;

1. If I want to PAY for my music (and as an expat living in the ass of the world, I can't always get it locally), what do I do? I checked out the suggested paysites on RIAA. They are lame to say the least. I'm not bashing religion, but if a 'christian music' paysite is supposed to quench my thirst for current stuff, I'd suggest they get my Grandmother in as webamster.

I'm not saying that everybody has this view, but in my case, I am genuinely prepared to pay, but nothing is on offer.

2. The music companies also make a lot of noise about this. Likewise, they offer NOTHING online. It's all hard copies. I'd never receive it (I have tried).

3. So reconcile this. For a band to be successful (profitable), they need to get their music out the door. The fantastic distribution systems that the RIAA tell us add so much to the cost don;t extend to half the world. They can't deliver, we can't collect, so in fact they are saying 'we'd rather you didn't hear it than steal it'.

That's bullshit. I can tell you, someone mailed me an MP3 of Avril Levigne, and as soon as I could, I bought the CD. The mailing of the MP3 was illegal, but becuase of it, I bought the CD. I wouldn't have done it if I hadn't heard the MP3.

And I can also tell you, I have around 500 CD's - that's 300 gigs of music - 6 - 7000 tracks? I have maybe 60 - 70 illegal MP3's. Am I so unusual? I doubt it.

So, my advice to the RIAA - if you're gonna bust me, don't bust me for doing something that YOU have totally failed to remedy. If I'm stealing something that YOU are selling, OK. But I'm not.

Think of it as simple economics. There is demand, but no supply. p2p has filled the supply gap. If you want to change that, get off your asses.

[Benno]

Originally posted by spong@18 February 2003 - 17:11
And I can also tell you, I have around 500 CD's - that's 300 gigs of music - 6 - 7000 tracks? I have maybe 60 - 70 illegal MP3's. Am I so unusual? I doubt it.
I think people have it the other way round. :rolleyes:

500 mp3s and 70 cds

btw I dont think that 500 cds are 300 gigs. :huh:

[spong]

Originally posted by Benno+18 February 2003 - 19:10--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Benno @ 18 February 2003 - 19:10)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--spong@18 February 2003 - 17:11
And I can also tell you, I have around 500 CD&#39;s - that&#39;s 300 gigs of music - 6 - 7000 tracks? I have maybe 60 - 70 illegal MP3&#39;s. Am I so unusual? I doubt it.
I think people have it the other way round. :rolleyes:

500 mp3s and 70 cds

btw I dont think that 500 cds are 300 gigs. :huh: [/b][/quote]
No?

How many is it then?

Thanks for the, er, input.

[FuNkY CaPrIcOrN]

Originally posted by spong+18 February 2003 - 13:14--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (spong @ 18 February 2003 - 13:14)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>
Originally posted by -Benno@18 February 2003 - 19:10
<!--QuoteBegin--spong@18 February 2003 - 17:11
And I can also tell you, I have around 500 CD&#39;s - that&#39;s 300 gigs of music - 6 - 7000 tracks? I have maybe 60 - 70 illegal MP3&#39;s. Am I so unusual? I doubt it.
I think people have it the other way round. :rolleyes:

500 mp3s and 70 cds

btw I dont think that 500 cds are 300 gigs. :huh:
No?

How many is it then?

Thanks for the, er, input. [/b][/quote]
;) It depends on what you ripped them at.


:D And please register as a member of this board spong. :D

[Benno]

When you think of 10 MB per song it would be 70 gigs. :D
But 10 MB is pretty large.

[Guest]

Originally posted by FuNkY CaPrIcOrN+18 February 2003 - 19:32--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (FuNkY CaPrIcOrN @ 18 February 2003 - 19:32)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>
Originally posted by -spong@18 February 2003 - 13:14

Originally posted by -Benno@18 February 2003 - 19:10
<!--QuoteBegin--spong@18 February 2003 - 17:11
And I can also tell you, I have around 500 CD&#39;s - that&#39;s 300 gigs of music - 6 - 7000 tracks? I have maybe 60 - 70 illegal MP3&#39;s. Am I so unusual? I doubt it.
I think people have it the other way round. :rolleyes:

500 mp3s and 70 cds

btw I dont think that 500 cds are 300 gigs. :huh:
No?

How many is it then?

Thanks for the, er, input.
;) It depends on what you ripped them at.


:D And please register as a member of this board spong. :D [/b][/quote]
These are &#39;store bought&#39; cd&#39;s. I&#39;d assume 650 - 700 mb each, x 500

Vs MP3&#39;s, using the same conversion (about 32 megs for a full cd audio track), I&#39;d guess I&#39;ve got 2gb equivlent of rip offs, or about .6%

I&#39;d be interested to know what other have as a proportion though, as in fact I&#39;m clueless. Let&#39;s say everyone else is 10 x as naughty as me, it&#39;s still only 6%. Assuming a whopping 25% of music buyers use Kazaa (would it realy be that much?), we&#39;re talking 1.5% of all music that people own is &#39;stolen&#39;.

That&#39;s gotta be a high side estimate too. Can&#39;t equate this to us &#39;killing&#39; music.

I&#39;m just not in favour of swallowing an argument without thinking about it. I&#39;d really be interested to know what others &#39;stats&#39; are.

Will register now.

[SuperJude™]

The MPAA , following the RIAA closely, said last year was a "banner year" for the industry.

One would think they are not suffering that much.

Besides, how is this any different than getting a 10 pack of tapes in the 80&#39;s and taping albums I my friends had? I mean it sure seems the same to me.

-SJ™

[FuNkY CaPrIcOrN]

Originally posted by SuperJude™@18 February 2003 - 14:09
The MPAA , following the RIAA closely, said last year was a "banner year" for the industry.

One would think they are not suffering that much.

Besides, how is this any different than getting a 10 pack of tapes in the 80&#39;s and taping albums I my friends had? I mean it sure seems the same to me.

-SJ™
:o In the 80&#39;s?Man I was still useing tapes in the mid to late 90&#39;s and taping albums from my friends.I still know people who do. :o

[SuperJude™]

I had more money in the 90&#39;s and bought my own tapes lmao, but yeah I only stopped using tapes well....

Okay I still have some that I still listen to especially at work.

It just sounds so.........90&#39;s (hehehehe)

:D :D :D

:o <-------- this smilie looks like it is giving a blowie, btw, so that is for the RIAA blow me beotches&#33;&#33;&#33;

-SJ™

[spong (waiting for reg confirmat]

Originally posted by SuperJude™@18 February 2003 - 20:09
The MPAA , following the RIAA closely, said last year was a "banner year" for the industry.

One would think they are not suffering that much.

Besides, how is this any different than getting a 10 pack of tapes in the 80&#39;s and taping albums I my friends had? I mean it sure seems the same to me.

-SJ™
I agree.

I think the difference is probably a) quality, although a better comparison is CDs/burner nowadays which makes that redundant, but more importantly B) accessibility - with p2p you hear (or just thunk of) a song, and go get it. You don&#39;t need a friend with a CD to copy it from.

I think what worries them is that it&#39;s SO easy.

Besides, they always moaned about us making tapes too&#33; I remember the skull and crossbones signs in record shops saying &#39;home taping is killing music&#39;.

Metalicca probably have the same thing as a bumper sticker on their Ferraris. :P

[SuperJude™]

Originally posted by spong (waiting for reg confirmat@18 February 2003 - 20:18
Metalicca probably have the same thing as a bumper sticker on their Ferraris. :P
I will never ever buy any of their products again. We, the loyal fans, bought their albums, tapes and cd&#39;s, vids, went to the concerts, bought t-shirts, they got rich and we even suffered their "we&#39;re too cool to make vids" phaze.

Then they go and get in on the napster thing and for that I have no respect for them.

I do however download their shit for free, of course, and burn them to cd. Thanks Lars, Kirk and the boys&#33;

-SJ™

[FuNkY CaPrIcOrN]

Originally posted by SuperJude™+18 February 2003 - 14:20--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (SuperJude™ @ 18 February 2003 - 14:20)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--spong (waiting for reg confirmat@18 February 2003 - 20:18
Metalicca probably have the same thing as a bumper sticker on their Ferraris. :P
I will never ever buy any of their products again. We, the loyal fans, bought their albums, tapes and cd&#39;s, vids, went to the concerts, bought t-shirts, they got rich and we even suffered their "we&#39;re too cool to make vids" phaze.

Then they go and get in on the napster thing and for that I have no respect for them.

I do however download their shit for free, of course, and burn them to cd. Thanks Lars, Kirk and the boys&#33;

-SJ™ [/b][/quote]
;) If a band does not want people trading their Music post it on your website or send it to your fanclub through snail mail.That is the reason SoulSeek got shut down there for awhile...a certain band just got signed to a record deal and asked them to take the files down.Did they sue their fans like Metallica did....hell no.Find a way to make the new technology work for the bands starting out...but these bands like Metallica doing what they did was a joke.

[Benno]

Originally posted by SuperJude™@18 February 2003 - 20:20
We, the loyal fans, bought their albums, tapes and cd&#39;s, vids, went to the concerts, bought t-shirts, they got rich and we even suffered their "we&#39;re too cool to make vids" phaze.

i never was at a concert from them :P

but thats because they havent played in vienna for a looong time now (at least I havent noticed it). <_<

[spong still waiting]

Originally posted by FuNkY CaPrIcOrN@18 February 2003 - 20:25
;) If a band does not want people trading their Music post it on your website or send it to your fanclub through snail mail.That is the reason SoulSeek got shut down there for awhile...a certain band just got signed to a record deal and asked them to take the files down.Did they sue their fans like Metallica did....hell no.Find a way to make the new technology work for the bands starting out...but these bands like Metallica doing what they did was a joke.
Definitely, but personally I&#39;d like the bands / distributors to get off their butts and find a way to do it that we can all be happy with.

Like I said, if I could buy it legally, maybe I would.

I&#39;m not dumb enough to think everybody would do the same, and I&#39;m not passing judgement. It&#39;s just frustrating to have it dangling in front of me (Kazaa), having no alternative (distribution), and to be told &#39;don&#39;t do that&#39;.

Ha - what am I saying. Frustrating hell&#33; I click download . . . :ph34r:

[natural]

Howdy all. New here - first post, actually. I just want to say that P2P has opened my eyes to a whole load of music that I probably wouldn&#39;t have given a chance. For instance, right now I&#39;m listening to Turbonegro ("Rock Against Ass" kills) and loving them. If I&#39;d seen their album in the record store (given the complete lack of mass-exposure they deserve) I would have passed it by.

The thing is - I couldn&#39;t find all of their songs for download so I&#39;m going to go out and buy their albums to fill the void. If they ever play in my town, I&#39;m there.

The recording industry is afraid because they know they try to sell us crap. If more people get on P2P, then people will realize that Avril Lavigne (I&#39;m sorry to whoever said they like her) and other forms of pablum are just pre-packaged shit spoon-fed to the world.

Once people realize this, the people who tell us what to listen to are out of jobs because they never had an ear for music to begin with. I would do the same thing if I was in their shoes but I&#39;m not, so fuck them.

[daveyjones]

Arrrg well i don&#39;t know about you mateys but most of MY music collection is in the form of CD&#39;s ...... thou they be burned CD&#39;s of music taken off of the interent har har har. The last time i payed for a CD was ummm when i didnt have a CD burner about 4 years ago , since then everything has been free .Also to the person above me who hates popular music , thats fine but there&#39;s no need to bash it , arrrg we who listen to popular music hate your crappy indpenant bands with their ass ugly poor arists... everyone has their own different tastes in music so while you&#39;ve found your GREAT new band many of us like what&#39;s on the radio now , yes some of you will say that you don&#39;t and you HATE it and that&#39;s fine because as i said before different people have different tastes (some things you just have to say twice so they sink in , arrrg some people be thick like de plank ).As for the Riaa they best get their arses in grear before they no longer have an industry to speak of.

And for the person who started this thread the reason they RIAA threathens alot is because its alot easier to threathen then it is to actually sue which can take months and months and months and run into the hundreds of thousands of dollars. a threat is free legal action is not.

[puremindmatters]

You might find this article interesting:

George Ziemann article (http://www.azoz.com/music/features/0008.html)

It&#39;s a bit dry reading but he certainly manages to make his point (it&#39;s from last year though)

[daveyjones]

please , what is he smoking , cause it must either be very very pure or really really really impure. I think all of us pirates here know JUST how badly the industsry is hurting .
arrrg polly says his brain be bigger than george&#39;s

oh and one more thing that REALLY pisses me off , i can&#39;t even get to the RIAA web cite to get their side of the story , i assume its down because as i read a news article people hack attack it all the time . Thats just not cool thou , just because someone doesn&#39;t like what another is saying doesn&#39;t give them the right to completely mute their voice . And for those of you who are now going to say bla bla bla "well man the RIAA mutes our voice&#33;" please remeber that the riaa has to act within the laws , they cannot arbitraily shut down a web cite .

[puremindmatters]

Originally posted by daveyjones@27 February 2003 - 06:17
please , what is he smoking , cause it must either be very very pure or really really really impure. I think all of us pirates here know JUST how badly the industsry is hurting .
arrrg polly says his brain be bigger than george&#39;s

oh and one more thing that REALLY pisses me off , i can&#39;t even get to the RIAA web cite to get their side of the story , i assume its down because as i read a news article people hack attack it all the time . Thats just not cool thou , just because someone doesn&#39;t like what another is saying doesn&#39;t give them the right to completely mute their voice . And for those of you who are now going to say bla bla bla "well man the RIAA mutes our voice&#33;" please remeber that the riaa has to act within the laws , they cannot arbitraily shut down a web cite .
Are you referring to me? Well, I&#39;m smoking "Golden Virginia" with no additives. You might or might not have noticed, I didn&#39;t write the article, nor did I publish my opinion about the content. Do you have trouble understanding the figures? Maybe it helps removing the eye-patch (...hoooo a pirate...). Don&#39;t speak for groups which haven&#39;t elected you as their spokesman. B)

[daveyjones]

arrg no i was talking about george , and i should have you know it is CAPTAIN davey jones to you .

Do you use kazza enough? because if you belive that the industry isn&#39;t being effected then perhaps you need to use kazza more .In my state ALONE a company called the warehouse which sells just music CD&#39;s is having to close 12 stores in the state , i doubt that they ever had more than 20 total to begin with. Another thing i&#39;ve noticed the giant retailer FRYs which is a store that sells everything electronic (games music movies hard ware , EVERYTHING AND EVERYTHING) no longer carries software adds in their sunday advertisments , i&#39;ve read those add&#39;s for the last 5 or 6 years and there has always been a new CD section and a new GAME section , but no more , the logical conclsion would be , why waste the space with something that no longer makes money . It&#39;s little sings here and there but i&#39;m starting to see the picture , there is hurt going on . George there would have you belive that the fat lady isn&#39;t even in the building but arrrg i can hear her wreatched voice in the distance.

[FuNkY CaPrIcOrN]

The Future Of Music (http://www.boston.com/dailyglobe2/054/living/_Five_years_from_now_you_ll_see_virtually_no_CD_stores_+.shtml)


Read this,it is long but it is a good story from lasst sunday.I have been saying this for awhile now.....we will not be buying CDs in the future.....hell I have Ripped all my collection and threw the real CDs in a box.....told a freind he can have them if he wants.....I don&#39;t need them no more.


Maybe this should be put in our new room the MusicWorld. :blink:

[puremindmatters]

I believe the point his was trying to make is that piracy isn&#39;t the only factor to consider when looking at the broader picture.
If I analyze my own behaviour/habits over the past 25 years, I can&#39;t say there is a significant difference between now and then - I used to tape records and CDs I liked, and now I&#39;m downloading or ripping them. If I needed a perfect copy for mixing I&#39;d buy the CD or the Vinyl.

edit: o captain, my captain?

[daveyjones]

i read that article but who ever wrote it still doesn&#39;t understand p2p file sharing and people today , i don&#39;t care if the song costs a dollar or even 20 cents , i&#39;m simply not going to pay for it . Why ,why in the whole wide world would i pay for something that i can find for free?

[puremindmatters]

Convenience, impatience, moral issues, whatever...
I haven&#39;t heard xxx-paysites complaining about filesharing.

We might also still need at least one person who is actually buying the stuff, ripping it and putting it on the net. So please don&#39;t discourage him/her.

My CD-writer doesn&#39;t burn vinyl.

I don&#39;t always know beforehand what I want. I would feel silly going to a recordshop just to write down what I liked and look for it on the net afterwards. At least 65% of what I do like, I wouldn&#39;t find here anyway. 50% of the stuff I buy, is from very small record labels. I don&#39;t mind putting "Tower records" out of business with my filesharing habits, they suck anyway. But I would mind effecting small independent labels.
That is the point I was trying to make earlier: Not all of us feel the same way, nor should they.

The future of filesharing is by no means certain. It seems to work now, so let&#39;s enjoy the benefits. And to all the prophets of doom out there: Radio survived the launch of TV, vinyl survived the advent of CDs, cinema survived the DVD-age, for there will always be good reasons to have a choice, and choice is exactly what makes our lives interesting.

[Wizzandabe]

they are simple in a way. ppl who will shut down you fav p2p apps, we sites and software withch could result in illagel use. or witch could produce illagle use (cd copying softwae)

[puremindmatters]

I think their current tactics are threefold:

1. They try to get ISPs to support them in order to actively discourage people from filesharing. This seems to be a short-term tactic in order to prevent people from believing they are just exploring some legal limbo, or that there is no realistic chance whatsoever to get caught.

2. They are trying to get hardware manufacturers to support them (Fritz chip).

3. They are trying to get software giants like Microsoft to support them (Palladium, which has a new name now I can&#39;t remember).

The latter two are certainly long-term tactics, and how successful they are going to be - only time will tell.

I think they noticed by now that going after the developers/distributors of filesharing programs is ineffective. They might manage to close one network, and two others enter the stage. Even if they manage to make filesharing more difficult I don&#39;t think they will be able to stop as long as there are people out there with the intent, the ability and the courage to make it happen.

[Adster]

yes there winning little bitches