You Still Must Know This Man

[Peace]

You Must Know Him
You may be an atheist or an agnostic or you may belong to any of the religious denominations that exist in the world today. You may have been a Communist or a believer in democracy and freedom. No matter what you are, and no matter what your religious and political beliefs, personal and social habits happen to be— YOU STILL MUST KNOW THIS MAN!

He was by far the most remarkable man that ever set foot on this earth. He preached a religion, founded a state, built a nation, laid down a moral code, initiated numberless social and political reforms, established a dynamic and powerful society to practice and represent his teachings, and he revolutionized the worlds of human thought and human action for all time.

His name was Muhammad (peace and blessings of Almighty Creator be upon him)—and he accomplished all these wonders in the unbelievably short span of twenty-three years.

Muhammad (pbuh) was born in Arabia in 570 CE, and when he died at the age of 63, the whole of the Arabian Peninsula had changes from paganism and idol worship to the worship of One God; from tribal quarrels and wars to national solidarity and cohesion; from drunkenness and debauchery to sobriety and piety; from lawlessness and anarchy to disciplined living; from utter moral bankruptcy to the highest standards of moral excellence. Human history has never known such a complete transformation of a people or a place before or since.

The Encyclopedia Britannica calls him "the most successful of all religious personalities of the world." Bernard Shaw said, "if Muhammad (pbuh) were alive today, he would succeed in solving all those problems which threaten to destroy human civilization in our times." Thomas Carlysle was amazed as to how one man, single-handedly, could weld warring tribes and wandering Bedouins into a most powerful and civilized nation in less than two decades. Napoleon and Gandhi never tired of dreaming of a society along the lines established by this man in Arabia fourteen centuries ago.

Indeed no other human being ever accomplished so much, in such diverse fields of human thought and behavior, in so limited a space of time, as did Muhammad (pbuh). He was a religious teacher, a social reformer, a moral guide, a political thinker, a military genius, an administrative colossus, a faithful friend, a wonderful companion, a devoted husband, a loving father—all in one. No other man in history ever excelled or equaled him in any of these difficult departments of life.

The world has had its share of great personalities. But these were one-sided figures who distinguished themselves in but one or two fields, such as religious thought or military leadership. None of the other great leaders of the world ever combined within himself so many different qualities to such an amazing level of perfection as did Muhammad (pbuh).

The lives and teachings of other great personalities of the world are shrouded in the mist of time. There is so much speculation about the time and the place of their birth, the mode and style of their life, the nature and detail of their teachings and the degree and measure of their success or failure that it is impossible for humanity today to reconstruct accurately and precisely the lives and teachings of those men.

Not so this man Muhammad (pbuh). Not only was he born in the fullest blaze of recorded history, but every detail of his private and public life, of his actions and utterances, has been accurately documented and faithfully preserved to our day. The authenticity of the information so preserved is vouched for not only by faithful followers but also by unbiased critics and open-minded scholars.

At the level of ideas there is no system of thought and belief—secular or religious, social or political —which could surpass or equal ISLAM—the system which Muhammad (pbuh) propounded. In a fast-changing world, while other systems have undergone profound transformations, Islam alone has remained above all change and mutation, and retained its original form for the past 1400 years. What is more, the positive changes that are taking place in the world of human thought and behavior truly and consistently reflect the healthy influence of Islam in these areas.

It is not given to the best of thinkers to put their ideas completely into practice, and to see the seeds of their labors grow and bear fruit in their own lifetime. Except of course, Muhammad (pbuh), who not only preached the most wonderful ideas but also successfully translated each one of them into practice. At the time of his death his teachings were not mere precepts and ideas straining for fulfillment. They had become the very core of the life of tens of thousands of perfectly trained individuals. At what other time or place and in relation to what other political, social, religious system, philosophy or ideology—did the world ever witness such a perfectly amazing phenomenon? Except of course, ISLAM, which was established as a complete way of life by Muhammad (pbuh)himself. History bears testimony to this fact and the greatest skeptics have no option but to concede this point.

In spite of the phenomenal success which crowned his efforts, he did not for a moment claim to be God or God's incarnation or Son —but only a human being who was chosen and ordained by the Creator to be a teacher of truth to mankind and a complete model and pattern for their actions.

He was a man with a noble and exalted mission —and his unique mission was to unite humanity in the worship of the One and only God and to teach them the way to honest and upright living in accordance with the laws and commands of God. He always described himself as a Messenger and servant of God, as indeed every single action and movement of his proclaimed him to be.

A world which has not hesitated to raise to Divinity individuals whose very lives and missions have been lost in legend and who, historically speaking, did not accomplish half as much—or even one tenth—as was accomplished by Muhammad (pbuh), should stop to take serious note of this remarkable man's claim to be God's messenger to mankind.

Today, after the lapse of some 1400 years, the life and teachings of Prophet Muhammad (pbuh), have survived without the slightest loss, alteration or interpolation. Today they offer the same undying hope for treating mankind's many ills which they did when Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) was alive. This is our honest claim and this is the inescapable conclusion forced upon us by a critical and unbiased study of history.

The least YOU should do as a thinking, sensitive, concerned human being is to stop for one brief moment and ask yourself: Could it be that these statements, extraordinary and revolutionary as they sound, are really true? Supposing they really are true, and you did not know this man Muhammad (pbuh) or hear about his teachings? Or did not know him well and intimately enough to be able to benefit from his guidance and example? Is it not time you responded to this tremendous challenge and made some effort to know him? It will not cost you anything but it may well prove to be the beginning of a completely new era in your life.

Come, let us make a new discovery, the life of this wonderful man Muhammad (pbuh), the like of whom never walked on this earth, and whose example and teachings can change YOUR life and OUR world for the better. May God shower His choicest blessings upon him!
Written by S. H. Pasha


http://muhammad.net/intro/must_Muhammad.html

[Rat Faced]

I love Muhammad (http://www.welovetheiraqiinformationminister.com/) too....

[Alex H]

Good for Muhammad. Sounds like a good bloke. Not sure I like his fan club though.

Or Jesus' fan club come to that...

[4play]

Muhammad was not as fantastic as you make him out to be.

nice plug for your site as well :rolleyes:

[Samurai]

I killed him. He refused to share his M&M's :angry:

[cpt_azad]

Originally posted by Samurai@29 March 2004 - 17:02
I killed him. He refused to share his M&M's :angry:
:o oh my god, u killed mohammed, you Bastard! wait, i shouldn't be making fun of him, my bad.

[Peace]

Thanks guys

for "Rat Faced"... :D the one that you refered to was named after muhammed the one i am telling you about...any one i like this guy too :D
For 4play iam not claiming that .. he really is ... I am quoting what the whole universe is saying ...Britannica documented that ... I am not defending any body... thats the truth ... the truth will defined it self.

As I read that Muhammad never mentioned Jesus but preceding his name with “my brother” I discovered that every one knows that you can see what the bible say about him http://www.muhammad.net/biblelp/index.htm i really I was amazed when i read it :o …this is just for sack of the truth… and only the truth. Because I believe that there are many many people who care about the truth

For the people who said that he killed him …. “NO COMMENTS”… irrespectively who I am but … I respect decency …and I respect the TRUTH.

And for the people who think that I am laying… why should I lay?… I will not gain any thing … I think this forum is a respected forum, and I sew that the people here appreciate the truth that’s why I submitted that to share something good


I never saw a man whose COMPLETE life is documented …yah the complete life…everything starting from the way he use to walk, what he use to say … every thing ..how he use to eat and what he said before and after eating, how he rided a hours and what he said, how he sleep what he use to say when going to sleep, what did he said for a certain person latterly, EVERY THING....and the Weirdest thing that every is still Available since 1452 years …yah the number is right

looking forward to hearing from you decent people
thanks

[sArA]

Why were the teachings of such a great man interpreted to result in the oppression of women?

Why are the teachings of such a great man interpreted by extremists to mean death to those who do not follow him?

Why have the teachings of such a great man been interpreted to mean that suicide bombers believe that they are going to heaven to consort with a multitude of virgins?

Why have the teachings of such a great man led to so much baying for blood?

Why have the teachings of such a gerat man been adulterated by those seeking personal power, glory and martydom?

His teachings it seems have been appropriated by the bad guys to justify any act of atrocity....I feel saddened for those who follow the teachings of this great man with dignity and faith.. whilst their extremist bretheren grow in numbers and we all live in fear...that great man must be turning in his grave.

[Biggles]

Peace

It is clear that you are both impressed and moved by the life and work of this man. Do you think you will embrace Islam as a result of this?

[ilw]

Don't you get the vague feeling he already has... :unsure: :P

[Biggles]

:-"

Perhaps

[Samurai]

Originally posted by sara5564@1 April 2004 - 20:56
Why were the teachings of such a great man interpreted to result in the oppression of women?

Why are the teachings of such a great man interpreted by extremists to mean death to those who do not follow him?

Why have the teachings of such a great man been interpreted to mean that suicide bombers believe that they are going to heaven to consort with a multitude of virgins?

Why have the teachings of such a great man led to so much baying for blood?

Why have the teachings of such a gerat man been adulterated by those seeking personal power, glory and martydom?

His teachings it seems have been appropriated by the bad guys to justify any act of atrocity....I feel saddened for those who follow the teachings of this great man with dignity and faith.. whilst their extremist bretheren grow in numbers and we all live in fear...that great man must be turning in his grave.
Very well spoken.

[j2k4]

Originally posted by Samurai+2 April 2004 - 20:31--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Samurai @ 2 April 2004 - 20:31)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-sara5564@1 April 2004 - 20:56
Why were the teachings of such a great man interpreted to result in the oppression of women?

Why are the teachings of such a great man interpreted by extremists to mean death to those who do not follow him?

Why have the teachings of such a great man been interpreted to mean that suicide bombers believe that they are going to heaven to consort with a multitude of virgins?

Why have the teachings of such a great man led to so much baying for blood?

Why have the teachings of such a gerat man been adulterated by those seeking personal power, glory and martydom?

His teachings it seems have been appropriated by the bad guys to justify any act of atrocity....I feel saddened for those who follow the teachings of this great man with dignity and faith.. whilst their extremist bretheren grow in numbers and we all live in fear...that great man must be turning in his grave.
Very well spoken. [/b][/quote]
Agreed.

Excellent summation, Sara. ;)

[J'Pol]

Originally posted by sara5564@1 April 2004 - 22:56
Why were the teachings of such a great man interpreted to result in the oppression of women?

Why are the teachings of such a great man interpreted by extremists to mean death to those who do not follow him?

Why have the teachings of such a great man been interpreted to mean that suicide bombers believe that they are going to heaven to consort with a multitude of virgins?

Why have the teachings of such a great man led to so much baying for blood?

Why have the teachings of such a gerat man been adulterated by those seeking personal power, glory and martydom?

His teachings it seems have been appropriated by the bad guys to justify any act of atrocity....I feel saddened for those who follow the teachings of this great man with dignity and faith.. whilst their extremist bretheren grow in numbers and we all live in fear...that great man must be turning in his grave.
Just another - Excellent post, post.

[Biggles]

It would seem, given the delay, that the answers to Sara&#39;s questions, are going to particularly profound.


:unsure:


I&#39;m off to see if they have any anti-sarcasm pills at the chemists.

[sArA]

Originally posted by ilw@2 April 2004 - 00:08
Don&#39;t you get the vague feeling he already has... :unsure: :P
If you are refering to me...she is prepared to debate and discuss but will not place herself in any particular corner.....

[ilw]

If you are refering to me...
http://members.shaw.ca/wenpigsfly/smileys/no3.gif i was talking about peace in response to biggles suggestion that perhaps he might like to embrace Islam.

[Biggles]

Originally posted by ilw@3 April 2004 - 19:46

If you are refering to me...
http://members.shaw.ca/wenpigsfly/smileys/no3.gif i was talking about peace in response to biggles suggestion that perhaps he might like to embrace Islam.
Was certainly my understandng of ilw&#39;s response. :rolleyes:

Although your views would, nevertheless, be interesting to an old cynic like me.

I suspect Peace&#39;s piece was lifted straight from a "use this to proslytise" and he/she may struggle to answer your questions.

[Illuminati]

Originally posted by sara5564@1 April 2004 - 22:56
Why were the teachings of such a great man interpreted to result in the oppression of women?

Why are the teachings of such a great man interpreted by extremists to mean death to those who do not follow him?

Why have the teachings of such a great man been interpreted to mean that suicide bombers believe that they are going to heaven to consort with a multitude of virgins?

Why have the teachings of such a great man led to so much baying for blood?

Why have the teachings of such a gerat man been adulterated by those seeking personal power, glory and martydom?

His teachings it seems have been appropriated by the bad guys to justify any act of atrocity....I feel saddened for those who follow the teachings of this great man with dignity and faith.. whilst their extremist bretheren grow in numbers and we all live in fear...that great man must be turning in his grave.
A bit late to come in due to the fact that I rarely like to get involved in discussions about religion, but Agreed.

But is anyone else seeing a similarity between this and...
http://www.mcbriens.net/liam/img/whosthecat.jpg

:huh:

[Biggles]

Illuminati

:lol:

Oh yes indeedy&#33;

As I believe I said in another thread on religion, the sales pitch is the same it is just the religions that vary.

[J'Pol]

Originally posted by Illuminati+4 April 2004 - 13:08--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Illuminati @ 4 April 2004 - 13:08)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-sara5564@1 April 2004 - 22:56
Why were the teachings of such a great man interpreted to result in the oppression of women?

Why are the teachings of such a great man interpreted by extremists to mean death to those who do not follow him?

Why have the teachings of such a great man been interpreted to mean that suicide bombers believe that they are going to heaven to consort with a multitude of virgins?

Why have the teachings of such a great man led to so much baying for blood?

Why have the teachings of such a gerat man been adulterated by those seeking personal power, glory and martydom?

His teachings it seems have been appropriated by the bad guys to justify any act of atrocity....I feel saddened for those who follow the teachings of this great man with dignity and faith.. whilst their extremist bretheren grow in numbers and we all live in fear...that great man must be turning in his grave.
A bit late to come in due to the fact that I rarely like to get involved in discussions about religion, but Agreed.

But is anyone else seeing a similarity between this and...
http://www.mcbriens.net/liam/img/whosthecat.jpg

:huh: [/b][/quote]
The diffference is He is the Son of God.

The other chap wasn&#39;t and indeed didn&#39;t claim to be.

Biggles,

The sales pitches can be entirely different. There are those who believe that to commit suicide, whilst murdering your enemy, will guarantee you a place in heaven.

In my belief this will have exactly the opposite effect.

There are those who believe that one should despise those who believe in different things from your own Dogma.

In my mind this is wrong.

Sorry, but I have to disagree. All religion is not the same. Some are based on love and some on hate.

[Biggles]

J&#39;Pol

I am perhaps more jaundiced than I should be.

My view is that most if not all religions have the potential to be about either love or hate.

The sales pitch for the gentler side of each is similar; as indeed is the sales pitch for the hateful side.

Torquemada would have little difficulty in understanding the rhetoric of Bin Laden whereas Martin Luther King had nothing but respect for Ghandi (apologies to the Indian gentleman who taught us the correct spelling - I have forgotten already).

I am not anti-religion, I think they all have a little to offer us as we come to terms with our mortality. In some ways I guess that makes me worse in the eyes of believers than the outright atheist, as I understand but don&#39;t buy in. It is my responsibility and to myself I must be true.

[J'Pol]

Biggles,

The difference is whether the religion teaches hate, or it&#39;s members use the religion as an excuse for it.

There is no doubt that much evil has been caused in the name of Christianity, however that had nothing to do with the teachings of the religion. It was evil men using it as a justification for their own ends.

All societies or organizations can have bad members. Just because there are corrupt Policemen does not make the concept of a body to protect the innocent and to punish the guilty a bad one.

There are however, as I understand it, religions which teach that hate and murder are good things, in the name of that religion. In fact they teach that people who do these things will actually be rewarded for them. This to my mind is a bad thing.

Christianity teaches that we will be punished for the same things. I cannot accept that there is no difference between them. In fact I think there is a stygian gulf.

[sArA]

Originally posted by Biggles+4 April 2004 - 12:26--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Biggles @ 4 April 2004 - 12:26)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-ilw@3 April 2004 - 19:46

If you are refering to me...
http://members.shaw.ca/wenpigsfly/smileys/no3.gif i was talking about peace in response to biggles suggestion that perhaps he might like to embrace Islam.
Was certainly my understandng of ilw&#39;s response. :rolleyes:

Although your views would, nevertheless, be interesting to an old cynic like me.

I suspect Peace&#39;s piece was lifted straight from a "use this to proslytise" and he/she may struggle to answer your questions. [/b][/quote]
Must have been half asleep.... <_<

appols for missing the whole point of your posts :lol:

[Biggles]

:lol:

Sara

You certainly had ilw and myself baffled.

J&#39;Pol

I agree, although my knowledge of the Koran is limited and I cannot say for certain that such teachings are part and parcel of the core beliefs.

I think that most religions would claim that peace and love were central to their faiths. The holy war was a medieval invention (popular in Christendom as much as anywhere) and sadly there are still elements in Islam that would appear to cling to that medieval mentality.

My own own view is that for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. These people will ultimately push the Islamic world into the secular, much as we are now; the exact opposite of their aims. God speed the day, I would add (with only the smallest amount of irony)

[J'Pol]

Biggles

Like you I am not familiar with that work, or the central teaching. Or indeed the central Holy Book of any religion. Other than Christianity (or at least my version of it).

However we can say what their leaders / clerics preach. We can listen to them spouting their bile, or we can look at how they treat women.

The organization is not only the words in the books, it is how it is interpreted by its religious leaders. It is what they tell people God wants them to do. What they say is good and evil.

[Biggles]

J&#39;Pol

That is a fair point. Interpretation is everything.

In the Old Testament it is taught that one should take an eye for an eye. This has been interpretated as a command by some advocating harsh penalties and is often used as supporting scripture to commend the death penalty.

It was in fact an early statute of limitation. Prior to this one could take an arm, leg, eye and other essential bits for an eye. The ruling was you could only take an eye for an eye; less would in fact be quite acceptable. This was further emphasised by Jesus expanding on this theme to suggesting we turn the other cheek. He was not contradicting the earlier passage but rather demonstrating its deeper meaning.

Strangely, it is not something talked about much. A point rather well put by the opening lines of the REM song New Test Leper imho.

However, it is not my place to expound another&#39;s religion. :ph34r:

[J'Pol]

Biggles

After all this time The Pagans and The Catholics have reached accord. We are reconciled and we can move on.

It is to your credit, you old Druid.

Live long in Possil

[Alex H]

Originally posted by J&#39;Pol@4 April 2004 - 13:28
Like you I am not familiar with that work, or the central teaching. Or indeed the central Holy Book of any religion. Other than Christianity (or at least my version of it).
Y&#39;all see how the world would be a better place if more people just sat down with a good book?

[Peace]

sara5564 Posted: 1 April 2004 - 21:56


Why were the teachings of such a great man interpreted to result in the oppression of women?

Why are the teachings of such a great man interpreted by extremists to mean death to those who do not follow him?

Why have the teachings of such a great man been interpreted to mean that suicide bombers believe that they are going to heaven to consort with a multitude of virgins?

Why have the teachings of such a great man led to so much baying for blood?

Why have the teachings of such a gerat man been adulterated by those seeking personal power, glory and martydom?

His teachings it seems have been appropriated by the bad guys to justify any act of atrocity....I feel saddened for those who follow the teachings of this great man with dignity and faith.. whilst their extremist bretheren grow in numbers and we all live in fear...that great man must be turning in his grave.


First of all I am not a Muslim … the truth should be appreciated as I think.
You have ALL THE RIGHT to ask about this (because I asked the same thing in the beginning :huh: ), but can I ask one thing…and I will answer it by my self after your permission.

May I ask who told you what you have explained about?
Answer: TV, Movies, Newspapers. we i mentioned that they are washing our brains .. i mean it, see this http://filesharingtalk.com/index.php?showtopic=106960&st=0

The scientific way that was approved by all standard to study any phenomena irrespectively is it good or bad is to go to its home and start doing the observations and talking notices abstractly ...without giving any personal opinion about it, then to give a judgment (mind judgment … not the TV’s Judgment) about it.

I will give you complete answers about what you have asked about, I red about it from the book that he believed in which they called Koran, and from the history books around which I hope I will be able to find. As I said it doesn’t matter what religion he is or you are… but it’s the TRUTH.

and forgive me if i made a mistake
thanks all

[chalice]

Originally posted by Peace@7 April 2004 - 10:06

sara5564 Posted: 1 April 2004 - 21:56


Why were the teachings of such a great man interpreted to result in the oppression of women?

Why are the teachings of such a great man interpreted by extremists to mean death to those who do not follow him?

Why have the teachings of such a great man been interpreted to mean that suicide bombers believe that they are going to heaven to consort with a multitude of virgins?

Why have the teachings of such a great man led to so much baying for blood?

Why have the teachings of such a gerat man been adulterated by those seeking personal power, glory and martydom?

His teachings it seems have been appropriated by the bad guys to justify any act of atrocity....I feel saddened for those who follow the teachings of this great man with dignity and faith.. whilst their extremist bretheren grow in numbers and we all live in fear...that great man must be turning in his grave.


First of all I am not a Muslim ? the truth should be appreciated as I think.
You have ALL THE RIGHT to ask about this (because I asked the same thing in the beginning :huh: ), but can I ask one thing?and I will answer it by my self after your permission.

May I ask who told you what you have explained about?
Answer: TV, Movies, Newspapers. we i mentioned that they are washing our brains .. i mean it, see this http://filesharingtalk.com/index.php?showtopic=106960&st=0

The scientific way that was approved by all standard to study any phenomena irrespectively is it good or bad is to go to its home and start doing the observations and talking notices abstractly ...without giving any personal opinion about it, then to give a judgment (mind judgment ? not the TV?s Judgment) about it.

I will give you complete answers about what you have asked about, I red about it from the book that he believed in which they called Koran, and from the history books around which I hope I will be able to find. As I said it doesn?t matter what religion he is or you are? but it?s the TRUTH.

and forgive me if i made a mistake
thanks all


The TRUTH, as you like to call it, is a matter for exploration.

Merely dismissing the western world as brainwashed takes us no closer to any understanding of the truth.

Most of Sara&#39;s questions were, as statements of fact, rhetorical.

Whether or not God exists is a matter of faith not fact.

Whether or not women should be subjugated and human beings should be mutilated in the name of religion is a matter of civilization.

There can be no doubt as to the media&#39;s influence on society but it&#39;s infinitely more difficult to slip the bonds religious brainwashing imposes upon a person.

Convincing a person that if he straps explosives to himself and takes out a bus queue, he will gain glory in heaven takes more than tv propaganda.

[Peace]

Here is some thing that you might find intresting:

the Koran that they have is written there since 1400 without any diff. untill now.and the same for what Muhammad said letterly in In a complete chain of people who have been certified and authenticated completely who had Transferred from muhammad up to now (more than 1400) and every tiny detail about him… its what they call in Islam "Haddith" ..or something like that. this some thing that i just found (i will try to find more details):

Allah says:

‘O mankind&#33; We have created you from a male and a female, and made you into nations and tribes, That you may know one another. Verily, the most honourable among you in the sight of Allah is that (believer) who has piety and righteousness.’

(Surat-al-Hujuraat (49), ayah 13)

Prophet Muhammad (may the peace and blessing of Allah be upon him) says in his famous sermon during the farewell pilgrimage:

‘Allah has relieved you from the burden of ignorance with its pride in the fathers and the ancestors. You are all from Adam, and Adam is from dust. There is no difference between an Arab and a non-Arab, nor between a black man and a red man except in piety"

He also says:

‘He who calls to tribalism is not one of us, nor is he who fought for it, nor is he who died for it.’ (Abu Dawood).

and here what isalm says about the women:

http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/humanrelations/womeninislam/

By the way, the Koran has a complete chapter about the women and I found out that it’s the third or the fourth biggest chapter there.
and i met many of them...it turn out not what i was thinking about. At least they have the right to get divorce the time they want and with their share of the Inheritance, this is what the showed me in there holy book Koran :P


and see this its about the main concepts of every thing (including war):

http://saif_w.tripod.com/questions/violenc...ce_in_islam.htm (http://saif_w.tripod.com/questions/violence/concept_of_peace_in_islam.htm)

sorry guys ..but those days i am so busy , i will try to drop by from a time to time ...but i will try to find what reveals the truth

[Rat Faced]

Every religion has their Pharisee&#39;s J&#39;Paul.....

That is what the fundamental Islamic&#39;s are... they interpret to suit themselves.


Think of the Traditional Beduin Arab...

They were devout Islamic observers, with a reputation of being very hospitable and friendly, a far cry from what certain quarters claim the religion of Islam is.

Certain Jewish sects do not even consider non-Jews human, and wont even give the time of day to other Jew&#39;s if they arent Ultra-Orthodox... This is not what the vast majority of Jewish people believe, they interpret to suit themselves.

Like wise those that attacked The Pope when he kissed The Koran in 1999.


Just thank whatever God you believe in, that it is the Minorities of the Religions that feel this way.

[Peace]

chalice&nbsp; Posted: 7 April 2004 - 10:21&nbsp;
Convincing a person that if he straps explosives to himself and takes out a bus queue, he will gain glory in heaven takes more than tv propaganda

would you please Clarify this point

[Peace]

That is what the fundamental Islamic&#39;s are... they interpret to suit themselves
they dont interpret... its written in their holy book, we have to
Differentiate between the cultural habits and the religion. I am trying to be accurate. And I mentioned that They have a complete chapter in Koran called “the Women”. And every thing you have red is mentioned latterly in the book. In their religion they cant bring something out unless it has some roots in the holy book and SONNAH. I leaved between them for more than 11 years. and there is nothing called in islam "fundamental islamic" this is a ploitical Expression :D. try to check a true Muslim and feel it your self :)





The TRUTH, as you like to call it, is a matter for exploration

By some how yes, but what I meant is “the naked truth” … not what some one wants you to think that “THIS IS THE TRUTH”.

You have to examine what you have,foe example: if some one told me that the moon is green, I can’t believe until I see that the moon is GREEN :D .

They are making use of the fact that the people don’t know any thing of that part of the world but what they are broadcast to them.

[chalice]

Originally posted by Peace@7 April 2004 - 16:45


chalice Posted: 7 April 2004 - 10:21
Convincing a person that if he straps explosives to himself and takes out a bus queue, he will gain glory in heaven takes more than tv propaganda

would you please Clarify this point
My point is that there are many forms of social constraint. Television is one form, legislation is another and religion is another still.

By far the most compelling of these is religion because children, in many societies cannot avoid it. They are conditioned from birth.

You can turn off your television and go out and buy a book about whatever interests you. You can draw from various sources. Given the variety of perspective, no single concept can be deemed to be the truth. You simply have to decide for yourself what sounds most plausible to you.

I don&#39;t believe that there are any solid, unshakeable truths. Its all subjective.

[Rat Faced]

Originally posted by Peace@7 April 2004 - 16:53

That is what the fundamental Islamic&#39;s are... they interpret to suit themselves
they dont interpret... its written in their holy book, we have to
Differentiate between the cultural habits and the religion. I am trying to be accurate. And I mentioned that They have a complete chapter in Koran called “the Women”. And every thing you have red is mentioned latterly in the book. In their religion they cant bring something out unless it has some roots in the holy book and SONNAH. I leaved between them for more than 11 years. and there is nothing called in islam "fundamental islamic" this is a ploitical Expression :D. try to check a true Muslim and feel it your self :)



I was replying to J&#39;Pol&#39;s comment about suicide bombers, not the rights/treatment of women, which is more cultural in nature than Religious. This being the case you may wish to withdraw your comment that it is not an interpretation and is written into the Koran, as you then paint all Islamic people as terrorists, something that is plainly not the case.

The Koran says that women should be revered and protected, not treated like 2nd class citizens.

The interpretation of the words in the Koran can be seen to have many forms in regard to this. Women in Afganistan are not treated the same way as those in Turkey for example, both are Islamic countries however they are culturaly very different.

[J'Pol]

Originally posted by Rat Faced@7 April 2004 - 16:52
Every religion has their Pharisee&#39;s J&#39;Paul.....

That is what the fundamental Islamic&#39;s are... they interpret to suit themselves.


Think of the Traditional Beduin Arab...

They were devout Islamic observers, with a reputation of being very hospitable and friendly, a far cry from what certain quarters claim the religion of Islam is.

Certain Jewish sects do not even consider non-Jews human, and wont even give the time of day to other Jew&#39;s if they arent Ultra-Orthodox... This is not what the vast majority of Jewish people believe, they interpret to suit themselves.

Like wise those that attacked The Pope when he kissed The Koran in 1999.


Just thank whatever God you believe in, that it is the Minorities of the Religions that feel this way.
I agree.

That is why I have not, as I recall spoken of any specific religion in this thread.

I speak of the people who use religion as an excuse to commit violent acts. Of the religions which teach hate instead of love and of the clerics who spout their vitriolic bile, who encourage their followers to commit these acts. The religions which promise reward to their followers for murder or who teach that they will be punished if they accept others, or give equal rights to everyone in their society.

Whichever "religion" it makes no difference to me. If they teach intolerance and hate, either in their Holy Book, or in the interpretations of their leaders and clerics, then they do not speak in the name of God. At least not the God that I believe in.

[Peace]

chalice&nbsp; Posted: 7 April 2004 - 17:11&nbsp;
You can turn off your television and go out and buy a book about whatever interests you. You can draw from various sources. Given the variety of perspective, no single concept can be deemed to be the truth. You simply have to decide for yourself what sounds most plausible to you

I felt from the beginning that this form has some rational and logical people. Thanks ALL for the Gentle and rational talk.