Suicide

[Chevvy]

I have always been against suicide as it tends to be a permanent action in responce to temporary problems. I have known in my previous career many people people who have attempted suicide and then sorted out their problems to live happy lives.

I do however see that if life is unbearable (when it's known for certain it'll stay that way or that the subject must change in an undesirable way to cope) it is worth scrappping and starting on the unknownn stage (an agnostic btw).

In this logic (non-religious), at what point would it be deemed "right" to attempt it if life was set to be permanently crap in a certain way?

I'm not talking about exam problems or left girlfriends etc., but family dying or being uncontactable etc...

At what point in general is life not worth it any more? Depression can be dealt with by meds and stuff but acrtualy life shit is either worth carrying on with or leaving.

This isn't a loaded question but I'm interested to see what people think - Is there a cut off point or should we all bare whatever happens? (please try to leave religion out of this)

(I'm new here but asked this question elsewhere to get no answers so am interested in what the fst people think)

[Arm]

Arm supports suicide. B) Also all the cliche bullshit like Suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem is quite stereotypical as you may be suffering from a permanent problem. You could be terminally ill, suffering from uncurable depression or had so much trauma in your life that you cannot live out a normal life.

And no children, life doesnt always get better. And even if it does there still exists no point in living.

Besides the religious ones, who cant think for themself to begin with, I see it as people are just brainwashed with a little catchphrase like "Suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem" and that phrase becomes their method of thinking. :01:

I believe this Maddox phrase should be used in place.

"Suicide isn't so bad, give it a chance."

[Rip The Jacker]

Originally posted by Josef Stalin
Death solves all problems - no man, no problem.
Though I'm sure many, like me, can disagree.

EDIT: Eh, many websites have it spelled Joseph, and not Josef. Well I'm sure you guys know who I'm talking about.

[MalaDzen]

I think the point at which life is no longer worth living is different for all people. Some individuals are stronger than others when it comes to losing family members while others can't seem to live without them. It really depends on the person and what thet consider to be important and vital in our lives.

I would probably kill myself if i had absolutley NO ONE on this earth to talk to and if i was just completley alone. Being lonely is by far the worst thing i think...

I think if i was a quadriplegic i would like to end my life...

[Arm]

Originally posted by Rip The Jacker+21 April 2004 - 21:09--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Rip The Jacker @ 21 April 2004 - 21:09)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-Joseph Stalin
Death solves all problems - no man, no problem.
Though I&#39;m sure many, like me, can disagree. [/b][/quote]
Thats Josef not Joseph. :rolleyes: And if you look like it from a really fucked up viewpoint, then yes death does solve all problems. :ph34r:

[zapjb]

I guess if one is inprisoned/enslaved & forced to act against one&#39;s spiritual (not religous) beliefs.

Or commonly put here in the USA. Give me liberty or give me death. Though that famous phrase is refering to fighting possibly resulting in death. Isn&#39;t it quite similar to suicide, if fighting against someone(s) results in ones own death? Suicide by cop is not uncommon here.

[Rip The Jacker]

Originally posted by Arm+21 April 2004 - 18:11--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Arm @ 21 April 2004 - 18:11)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>
Originally posted by Rip The Jacker@21 April 2004 - 21:09
<!--QuoteBegin-Joseph Stalin
Death solves all problems - no man, no problem.
Though I&#39;m sure many, like me, can disagree.
Thats Josef not Joseph. :rolleyes: And if you look like it from a really fucked up viewpoint, then yes death does solve all problems. :ph34r: [/b][/quote]
Well, yes. Death does solve all problems. But, unlike death, there are better solutions.

[Arm]

Not always. Like the examples I listed, death is the only real solution in some cases. :01:

[MalaDzen]

yes suicide is acceptable/necessary in those and many other situations, but should always be the last option used....

[MalaDzen]

Just an example:

One of my fathers friends was badly in debt to banks and other &#39;people&#39;. He decided to kill himself rather than finding avenues by which this problem could be solved.

I was so angry at him because not only did he leave his kids without a dad, he also left the debt to his wife. I find this very cowardly. I think in this case the phrase "suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem" applies well..

[Darth Sushi]

Well, Chevvy, your perspective is a very Western point of view. But in some cultures, it&#39;s viewed as an honorable exit and it&#39;s not viewed with a negative stigma. Culture, religion, economics and logic will all conflict concerning suicide, yet all exerts tremendous passions. To some, suicide will never be logical, but neither is love.

"Unbearable" circumstances is not the only motivating force for suicide. A suicide bomber may seek riches in the next life, while a terminally ill patient may wish to die with dignity while he or she is able. Yet, I don&#39;t consider a soldier who dives on a grenade to protect friends, suicidal. Cultural norms shape us all as well as expedience of the moment.

[kAb]

Committing suicide as a parent is very selfish. No matter how bad your life is, it isn&#39;t fair to your child/children to leave them on their own.

[Alex H]

Originally posted by MalaDzen@22 April 2004 - 02:37
yes suicide is acceptable/necessary in those and many other situations, but should always be the last option used....
It is ALWAYS the last option used.

In the same way that people say "Why is the thing I&#39;ve lost always in the last place I look?"

Well, you could keep looking after you find it if you like...

[Virtualbody1234]

Originally posted by Alex H+21 April 2004 - 23:03--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Alex H @ 21 April 2004 - 23:03)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-MalaDzen@22 April 2004 - 02:37
yes suicide is acceptable/necessary in those and many other situations, but should always be the last option used....
It is ALWAYS the last option used.

In the same way that people say "Why is the thing I&#39;ve lost always in the last place I look?"

Well, you could keep looking after you find it if you like... [/b][/quote]
Very good point&#33;

[mikenmike0001]

yea.....talking about suicides.....i don&#39;t know if i&#39;d ever have the guts to have a gun next to my head and pull that trigger....i&#39;ve seen it happen before to other people......but i don&#39;t know.....they claim that since the bullet travels faster than the sound, you technically don&#39;t hear it if you were to shoot yourself, cuz it would ahve gone through your brain already.....but i dont&#39; know........suicides...what else can i say......the suicides over in iraq right now are all just a bunch of bullshit, if you want to die, kill yourself, don&#39;t go off on a bus and take out innocent lives, most of whom are just doing their usual market shopping and all that..or going to work...... some people suicide for public attention, ......(like bud dwyer, of course everyone&#39;s seen that....... the napster guy created suicide i think too)...