Happy Pollution Day :01:

[Jon L. Obscene]

It's November 5th :D

What does this mean? :01:

Everyone in the uk goes out and lights a massive bonfire all at once :01:

Damn we're clever :D
Also as long as you're over 16 you can go buy some serious explosive devices (also known as fireworks) from many local shops and go round fireing them into peoples cars and houses and people :D

Also a chance for lil kiddies to make up a doll resembling some Guy to put on top of a bonfire and watch him burn..... while cheering :01:

Just think, all this to celebrate some geezer who ages ago fucked up a crap plot to blow up the houses of parliment :rolleyes: Oh if only they had blue peter back then, he would have known that if he used Plain Flour instead of gun powder, he would have got away with it :frusty:
A small explosive device on one of the barrels would have been enough to ignite the lot and.....Kaboom!! , what a muppet :frusty:

So anyway, we're celebrating this cock up by giving the ozone layer some serious shit tonight :01:

Happy Watch the bloke burn ontop of the fire then explode some stuff day :D

Jonno :cool:

[{I}{K}{E}]

:huh:

You like smilies huh? :P

[manker]

I'm not sure that we're allowed to talk about burning folk :unsure:

/lock/delete/ban

[DanB]

I'm not sure that we're allowed to talk about burning folk :unsure:

/lock/delete/ban

:lol:


:ph34r:

[Jon L. Obscene]

@Ike........Yes you annoying barsteward :angry: 8 images indeed :dry:

@Manky......Yes, it's a national celebration, I'm gonna go buy some explosives in a lil while, might chuck em all in a tin and make a big one :frusty:

I'm sorry but we live in one seriously fucked up country, where else in the civilised world can you buy explosives at 16? :frusty:

Jonno :cool:

[Cheese]

I'm sorry but we live in one seriously fucked up country, where else in the civilised world can you buy explosives at 16? :frusty:

Jonno :cool:

I think it's great. Thins out the herd a bit. Natural selection and all that, gets rid of the stupid ones.

Though you do have to be 18 these days to buy them or even possess them.

[Cheese]

http://www.dti.gov.uk/ccp/topics1/facts/fireworks.htm

[Jon L. Obscene]

Ah yes, it's good to see lil kiddies all burnt up, scarred faces, lost limbs cos an air bomb repeater went off in their pocket, they love it :01:

Jonno :cool:

Edit : I stand corrected, acording to that link you must be 18 :) That's ok then cos everyone is grown up and responsible enough to handle explosives at 18 :) phew, and I thought we were gonna be in trouble :frusty:

[DanB]

If you feel that strongly right to your MP

[manker]

Ah yes, it's good to see lil kiddies all burnt up, scarred faces, lost limbs cos an air bomb repeater went off in their pocket, they love it :01:

Jonno :cool:
18 year old kiddies in Norfolk, are there :blink:

[Jon L. Obscene]

Did you ever buy anything when you were under age?

Jonno :cool:

[manker]

Did you ever buy anything when you were under age?

Jonno :cool:
Under what age, and what things?

I think I bought my first thing in Ossie's Sweet shop when I was about 4 with some money my Gran gave me. It was a big step for me but hardly on topic.

Stop spamming :dry:

[Cheese]

Did you ever buy anything when you were under age?

Jonno :cool:

Sure. And occasionally I would get stopped.

Setting the age to 18 means less young people will get fireworks. Some still will, of course, but the undeniable fact is that less young people will have fireworks this year.

Personally I think fireworks are a waste of time. Light fuse, rocket goes in the air, BANG! Repeat.

Having said that I live in Plymouth and they put on some of the best professional firework displays in the country. Truly spectacular to go down by the sea and watch some awesome displays.

My advice to any youngsters reading this is to save your money for white cider and go to a professional show.

[Jon L. Obscene]

Spamming? :lol: I'm making a point here :P

Seriously tho, it's a bit stupid, the whole thing, we know the ozone is pretty fucked right? and our cars have to give off low emmisions etc right? But the entire country will have what? 70,000? 150,000 bonfires tonight?
Also the sale of fireworks to the public is a stupid idea, I can't buy proper weed killer, yet I can buy as many fireworks as I want, whats to stop me loading them all into a car or van or just a paint pot and planting it somewhere busy?
With the last few years of the terrorist war it just seems a bit daft :unsure:

Besides, even on the organized displays there are gonna be no end of injuries, and people will have their own displays who know nothing about how to handle fireworks.

How many kids and adults alike will be seriously injured tonight? How much will it cost the tax payer in A&E costs?

Can anyone dissagree with anything I've said so far? :)

Jonno :cool:

Edit @ Cheese.......Yes that's true, but the fact still remains that anyone above that age can buy explosives, yes the pro displays are great, but the sale of fireworks should not be public.

[DanB]

I disagree. I think you are just being a moany spoilsport


Oh my, think of the children :handwringing:

[Jon L. Obscene]

:rolleyes: You just like dissagreeing with me for fun :dry:

I'm sorry but there's nothing right about todays festivities, the reason is sick, the fact that kids make a doll of a human to burn is sick, the sale of explosives is sick, the amount of pollution is sick.
This is 2004, bout time we recognised the amount of injuries and harm to the planet is not worth a few pretty flashes and bangs.

Jonno :cool:

[DanB]

:rolleyes: You just like dissagreeing with me for fun :dry:

I'm sorry but there's nothing right about todays festivities, the reason is sick, the fact that kids make a doll of a human to burn is sick, the sale of explosives is sick, the amount of pollution is sick.
This is 2004, bout time we recognised the amount of injuries and harm to the planet is not worth a few pretty flashes and bangs.

Jonno :cool:


Instead of bitching about a bit of bonfire smoke why don't you moan about how America hasnt signned the Kyoto agreement to kerb industrial pollution, which is far worse :unsure:

[Jon L. Obscene]

Cos everyone is moaning about that, and besides I know nothing about it, I don't do politics :)
And I'm english, not American, I'm afraid I don't worship the US enough to worry about their way of life or their laws :)

Jonno :cool:

[DanB]

Guy Fawkes Day: Bonfire Night

On November 4, 1605, Guy Fawkes was caught red-handed in the basement of the British Parliament. He was trying to blow up the Houses of Parliament with gunpowder. Ever since then, on November 5, the British have celebrated his capture and execution by burning an effigy (model) of him on bonfires around the nation. Learn more about why he wanted to blow up Parliament, how he was caught and the celebrations.

Although the plot involved blowing up the Houses of Parliament, it was mainly intended to Kill King James I. James had actually started out as King James VI of Scotland. When Queen Elizabeth I died, he was her nearest living relative, and so he became King of England.
Why?

At the time, England was divided on religious grounds. Elizabeth was a protestant, and Head of the Church of England. She persecuted the Catholics and had many priests and important Catholics executed. Needless to say, the Catholics weren't very happy about this. When she died they danced in the streets and celebrated her death. James had given the Catholics a private promise that he would stop the persecutions, if he became King.

As the Catholics were soon to learn, people will say anything to get power. James may have really intended helping the Catholics, but Parliament was against them, and he continued on where Elizabeth had left off.

The whole problem had begun with Henry VIII, Elizabeth's father. England had been Catholic and the Church had had a lot power. Henry had fallen out with the Pope because he couldn't get divorced. He had then formed the Church of England, declaring himself its Head, and given himself a divorce. The Catholics were determined to restore their Church to power and get rid of the Church of England. Unfortunately members of the Church of England felt exactly the same way. A group of English Catholics was fighting with the Spanish Army. They hoped that if they managed to get rid of James, the Spanish could come in and conquer England. Then they could restore the Catholic Church to its powerful position.
Who and How?

Some of these Catholics got together, recruited Guy Fawkes to do the dirty work, and hatched their plot. First, they rented a house with a basement that lay under the House of Lords (part of the Houses of Parliament). Then, they moved barrels of gunpowder into the basement, hiding it under piles of wood. They needed to blow up the building when King James, his family and all of the non-Catholic members of Parliament were in it. This had to be the day Parliament opened for a new session. That year, due to fear of plague, the opening of the Houses of Parliament was delayed for over 8 months. The delay meant the plot failed.

Too many people got to hear about the plot. Someone who knew about it had a relative who was a Member of Parliament. Not wanting his relative killed, he sent him a message telling him about the plot. The relative, Lord Monteagle, sent the letter to the King. The plotters knew that someone had told about the plot, but were determined to carry on anyway. Guy Fawkes, under the alias of John Johnson, was arrested in the basement, just a few hours before he was due to light the fuse.

He was taken to the Tower of London, tortured until he signed a confession, and publicly executed on January 31, 1606. The other plotters were hunted down and shot or executed.

Celebrations


The tradition of lighting bonfires on November 5, started the same year as the plot itself. People, happy that the King had been saved, lit bonfires in the streets. Over the years the celebrations became more elaborate, and effigies of Guy Fawkes and even the Pope were added to the top of the fires. Fireworks came a little later. All towns and villages used to have a fire, then the tradition became for people to have private fires and firework displays.

Children make their effigies (or dummies) and parade them in the streets before bonfire night. They ask for "a penny for the Guy" and use the money collected to buy fireworks. Because of increased safety regulations most towns and villages have begun having public bonfires again. These days private bonfires are few and there are not many "Guys" on display in the streets.
Nursery Rhyme

Most British children learn the nursery rhyme about the plot when they are very young. This is how it goes:

Remember, remember the fifth of November,
Gunpowder, treason and plot.
We see no reason
Why Gunpowder treason
Should ever be forgot.

Important Note

Fireworks and bonfires are always a lot of fun, but they can also be very dangerous.

..


Well you should worry Jonno, every other country involved hs signed the agreement to limit and reduce the amount of industrial polluttion they produce, America which produces over half if I remember rightly told them where they could stick it.

Thats going to do a lot more more harm than a few thousand bonfires once a year :dry:

[Cheese]

:rolleyes: You just like dissagreeing with me for fun :dry:
Jonno :cool:

I think you'll find people disagree with you because you take on a very superior, almost smug, air that you know best. And stop using that fucking smilie when you make a point. :)

On-topic: The damage to the environment is far outweighed by the industries of countries like the US. It's a few nights every year ffs.


In recent years approximately 1,000 people per year have required treatment at hospital casualty departments with 5% of these being classed as "serious accidents" requiring a stay of one or more nights in hospital. With the new regulations it is hoped that this level of injuries will be reduced.

It's sad that people get injured but I wonder what percentage were acting like idiots? I'd say it was pretty high.

I'd probably agree on a ban on the sale of fireworks but the continuation of professional displays. After all they are entertaining to a lot of people.

You'd have to be a pretty joyless person to deny people the right to watch a "few pretty flashes and bangs" in a controlled environment.

[manker]

:lol:

I seriously couldn't give a shit about fireworks being on sale to the general public.

There are other things to worry about. Fireworks aren't for me but they do provide some with entertainment.

Jonno, your argument that they should be illegal to sell to people because of the damage to the environment, the injuries they cause and the cost of medical treatment to the Treasury is rubbish.

You're a smoker, ffs :rolleyes:

Priorities, priorities, priorites.

[Jon L. Obscene]

:) I'll use whatever smilies I want thankyou :)

You got me a bit wrong here, you say I'm smug yet you agree?
Ok I'll break it down

1: The US pollution thing has nothing to do with this, we are in England, we have no say what the US does.
Also just because they are doing that it makes it right for England to litter the sky with thick smog from thousands of bonfires?
Are we really that childish? "Well they do it, so why can't we?" :frusty:

2: Yes the sale of fireworks should be banned for a number of reasons.

3: Yes a high percentage of those injured are messing about being stupid, that's exactly my point of the sale of explosives.

4: No I never said I wanted firework displays to finish, I enjoy them, but done profeesionally. Not in a back garden by drunk dad.

Jonno :cool:

@ Manker.....I wonder if (god forbid) an accident which caused serious harm to a loved one thru a firework in the hands of a twat would allow you to keep the same opinion?

[manker]

@ Manker.....I wonder if (god forbid) an accident which caused serious harm to a loved one thru a firework in the hands of a twat would allow you to keep the same opinion?
Of course it would.

I know people who've died when they've been drunk but I don't want to ban alcohol. I know people who've dies through smoking, yet I don't want that banned either. I have my priorities straight.

Also, we may be in a different country to those in the US but, correct me if I'm wrong here, we're all under the same ozone layer.

[bigboab]

I disagree. I think you are just being a moany spoilsport


Oh my, think of the children :handwringing:
How can the children ring hands Dan. Unless they have Bells Palsy or is that face ringing?:unsure:

[DanB]

1) The US pollution point I rasied because you were having a paddy about the damage to the ozone from the bonfire smoke, I just wanted to put things in perspective for you.

2) Firework sales shouldn't be banned, I think the age of 18 is a fair enough limit but if you were to ban them then that should only be to the general public not to proffesionals

3) So dicks being dicks with firerworks should get them all banned? Thats like banning cars cos people have crashes while driving drunk or showing off

4) You said you wanted them banned, ra ra pollution, that gives the idea you want ALL fireworks banned

[Jon L. Obscene]

:Manker......you agree with the sale of explosives to ANYone over the age of 18?

:Dan...No I don't want fireworks banned because of pollution, I want the general sale of them banned, I'll put something into perspective for you.

I'm 27, I cannot buy good weed killer because of it's explosive content.
I cannot carry a penknife even tho I use it for work.
I cannot buy any kind of bird scarring explosive device without a liscence.
I cannot buy creosote due to it's chemical content (even thjo thined down)

there's a shitload of stuff I can't do and buy, but!........

I CAN buy as many explosives as I want, from a toy shop.

You're telling me that's right?

And like I said, just cos the US are doing that and I'm not moaning about it does'nt mean we have to follow does it? Are we not an independant country?
I'm talking about what WE (the UK) are doing today, the US thing is a totally different issue.

Jonno :cool:

[Cheese]

:) I'll use whatever smilies I want thankyou :)

You got me a bit wrong here, you say I'm smug yet you agree?


You don't want to discuss things. You just want to rant at us.

On-topic: Why should the vast majority of people who use fireworks safely be made to suffer because of a tiny minority of stupid people?

More people will get injured this weekend because of drinking than due to fireworks. We don't ban that either because the vast majority of people do things safely.

I only said I may be on the side of a ban. I haven't given it a huge deal of thought. Setting off a few fireworks on New Year's eve is always fun and I'd hate to have that right taken away from me for a very minor gain.

So answer the question Jonno. Why should the majority of people suffer for a very small minority of idiots?

[DanB]

So you agree with the sale of explosives to ANYone over the age of 18?

Jonno :cool:


Not explosives Jonno, fireworks, I don't think a 19 year old lad should be able to buy C4 from Mr Patel's

[bigboab]

firework in the hands of a twat

Now there is a thought to ponder with for the rest of the day. Must admit i've seen a few old bangers in my day.:cool:


@Jonno!. What is the point of laws. Some people honestly think that laws dont apply to them. They are supposed to apply to everyone else.:wacko:

[Cheese]

4) You said you wanted them banned, ra ra pollution, that gives the idea you want ALL fireworks banned

That's a good point dan. If the pollution card is being played then I'd say professional shows probably do cause more pollution (which I still think is negilible when compared to even our own industry/automobile pollution) than people from their back gardens.

So if you're using pollution as an argument you have to be for a total ban of fireworks.

[Jon L. Obscene]

Not explosives Jonno, fireworks, I don't think a 19 year old lad should be able to buy C4 from Mr Patel's

Go buy £100's worth of fireworks and empty them into a paint can, then stick a fuse in the top and light it, would you stand anywhere near it?

No, because it will explode, firewoks are pretty explosives, they explode, they contain variants of gunpwder, they are mini bombs, simple :)

@Cheese........Don't play that card, I'm not ranting at all, I'm making a point.you dissagree, thats fine, but all the arguments so far against it have been weak, avoiding the point that explosives are readily available. And that thousands of bonfires will be lit when they are banned the rest of the year.

Jonno :cool:

[Cheese]

@Cheese........Don't play that card, I'm not ranting at all, I'm making a point.you dissagree, thats fine, but all the arguments so far against it have been weak, avoiding the point that explosives are readily available. And that thousands of bonfires will be lit when they are banned the rest of the year.

Jonno :cool:

Your arguments are weak Jonno not mine. You didn't answer my question, perhaps you don't have an answer?

Why should the majority suffer because of a stupid and very small minority?

Btw You can make a bomb out of a lot of stuff that is freely available.

[DanB]

:Manker......you agree with the sale of explosives to ANYone over the age of 18?

:Dan...No I don't want fireworks banned because of pollution, I want the general sale of them banned, I'll put something into perspective for you.

I'm 27, I cannot buy good weed killer because of it's explosive content.
I cannot carry a penknife even tho I use it for work.
I cannot buy any kind of bird scarring explosive device without a liscence.
I cannot buy creosote due to it's chemical content (even thjo thined down)

there's a shitload of stuff I can't do and buy, but!........

I CAN buy as many explosives as I want, from a toy shop.

You're telling me that's right?

And like I said, just cos the US are doing that and I'm not moaning about it does'nt mean we have to follow does it? Are we not an independant country?
I'm talking about what WE (the UK) are doing today, the US thing is a totally different issue.

Jonno :cool:


Thats a pretty hefty edit 6 minutes later when no one will see it :dry:

Since when has been it illegal to have a bonfire any other time than this weekend? :blink:

The arguements haven't been weak you melt, what are you arguments for banning them? Cos some poeple are nobs and injure themselves with it?

Well fuck me, why don't we ban cars on that strength, and alchol, oh and Xmas fairy lights cos they can catch fire

Jonno, if you want some creosote let me know, I'll pop down the place wherre I went for an interview last week, they pointed it out to me on my tour of the warehouse

[Jon L. Obscene]

Actually cheese making a bomb now is'nt that easy from household stuff, why do you think things like Sodium Clorate don't work very well anymore? and creosote is now off the market?

I apologise, I did'nt see your question, my answer is simple.

Because there will be thousand of Children!!! badly burned tonight thru stupidity, you compared to drunk people, they are adults, most people injured are plastered and doing stupid things, but the majority of kids (and adults) injured and possibly killed today will be thru other people, throwing exploding devices, planting them, stuffing them thru letter boxes etc, you don't seem to understand my point, whatever you think the bare fact is these are Explosives, no different to a bomb, just prettier, the insides are the same.
You would'nt agree with anyone who wanted to looking for landmines along our beachses and exploding them themselfs would you? Same thing, cept these fireworks are projectile bombs.

Jonno :cool:

@ Dan........there are restrictions on houshold bonfires now, go down your local council and ask for details as it varies from county to county.
As for the rest, see above.And creosote is illegal to seel since April this year :) I should know.

[DanB]

For starters fireworks are nowhere near as powerful as landmines :rolleyes:

Did you see the link cheese posted? 1000 injuries at A&E, not thouhsands of badly scarred little children, stop exaggerating.

You haven't said what you thaought about abnning the other items I suggested that can cause injury

You should know? Do you sell creosote in the newsagents then? :ermm:

[bigboab]

I see your point Jonno.:( But no way are you going to stop it. Unless you lock up every kid(Including big kids) in the country for a couple of weeks.Just keep sober tonight Jonno.:) Remember, Remember the 5th of November. Then you wont go flying out to sea every time you see a flare go up.:)

[manker]

:lol:

That's the first time I'd seen that edit too!

Jonno, your arguments have all been dealt with:

- The pollution one, cause it's insignificant c.f other pollutants.

- The cost to the Treasury because of injuries, you're a smoker and ya can't have it both ways.

- The dangerousity of explosives being on sale, they are no more dangerous to the general public than petrol - they are also much more expensive, this is why a molotov cocktail isn't made out of fireworks.


Did you like my new word :)

[DanB]

dan...No I don't want fireworks banned because of pollution, I want the general sale of them banned, I'll put something into perspective for you.

For not wanting them banned cos of pollution you sure mentioned it enough :huh:


Seriously tho, it's a bit stupid, the whole thing, we know the ozone is pretty fucked right? and our cars have to give off low emmisions etc right? But the entire country will have what? 70,000? 150,000 bonfires tonight?


I'm sorry but there's nothing right about todays festivities, the reason is sick, the fact that kids make a doll of a human to burn is sick, the sale of explosives is sick, the amount of pollution is sick.


Also just because they are doing that it makes it right for England to litter the sky with thick smog from thousands of bonfires?

[Cheese]

Actually cheese making a bomb now is'nt that easy from household stuff, why do you think things like Sodium Clorate don't work very well anymore? and creosote is now off the market?

I apologise, I did'nt see your question, my answer is simple.

Because there will be thousand of Children!!! badly burned tonight thru stupidity, you compared to drunk people, they are adults, most people injured are plastered and doing stupid things, but the majority of kids (and adults) injured and possibly killed today will be thru other people, throwing exploding devices, planting them, stuffing them thru letter boxes etc, you don't seem to understand my point, whatever you think the bare fact is these are Explosives, no different to a bomb, just prettier, the insides are the same.
You would'nt agree with anyone who wanted to looking for landmines along our beachses and exploding them themselfs would you? Same thing, cept these fireworks are projectile bombs.

Jonno


That doesn't really answer my question really does it?

I accept the fact that there will be injuries at this time of year. Unfortunately, for the most, this will be down to stupidity. In fact you've listed the ways that these injuries could occur.

However you offer no answer to the crux of my question which is why should the vast majority of responsible adults be made to suffer because of an irresponsible minority?

It seems to me that the tightening of the laws regarding fireworks is the best way.

I fail to see the significance of landmines in this discussion. These are not devices that if used correctly will not cause harm to anyone. Pure and simply they are designed to injure and kill.

Also your rhetoric is too emotional here, you are implying that a 1000 children will be badly burned tonight. That simply is not true.

The figure would be nearer 50, with perhaps around 1000 minor injuries.

However this is also questionable with the new restrictions. I would hazard we will see far fewer injuries this year.

There is a happy medium. That of tighter restrictions and better education. Children with fireworks should have them confiscated and the adult who supplied them fined heavily. That would be a start. I'm sure we can all come up with other ideas.

I think with this approach you'd see a heft drop.

Will there still be injuries? Yes. But for the joy and entertainment that is to be had it's more than worth it. Everything comes at some price. Like smoking for instance.

[Jon L. Obscene]

@Mnker....-
The pollution one, cause it's insignificant c.f other pollutants.
So that makes it right for us to do it? Korea are brutal to animals, does that mean because they do it , it makes it ok for us to?


The cost to the Treasury because of injuries, you're a smoker and ya can't have it both ways.

Thats a fiar comment, I can't really argue that.


The dangerousity of explosives being on sale, they are no more dangerous to the general public than petrol - they are also much more expensive, this is why a molotov cocktail isn't made out of fireworks

(This answer also applies to cheese)

Why ban guns and knives etc? If it's ok to have fireworks just cos the few spoil it, what about guns? I used to love going on fields shooting targets (never animals).
I also collect knives but my current collection is ilegal and should have been handed in.
I suffered because of stupid people , was that fair?
Before you answer that, just tell me if a firework can kill?

@Dan ...... Dude nowhere in those quotes does it say fireworks should be banned due to pollution, it says bonfires. Big piles of tyres, polystirene and various other shit that gives off black smoke.

As for creosote, no mate, I worked in a hardware store that sold it, I was also a builder when it was banned, thats why I should know, because I've bought 100's of gallons of it and worked with it for years, I can no longer buy it.
If you can prove me wrong I will apologise, but prove me wrong you wont :)

Jonno :cool:

Edit about the injuries...... Last year 3 people died in East Anglia due to fireworks, I don't care what the count is, the FACT is thousands of people will get hurt, be it minor and unreported or serious. And the majority will be at private displays or just on the street.

[DanB]

@Dan ...... Dude nowhere in those quotes does it say fireworks should be banned due to pollution, it says bonfires. Big piles of tyres, polystirene and various other shit that gives off black smoke.



I honestly don't thoink anyone with half a braincell would put tyres on thier bonfire :lol:

You can still have air rifles Jonno, those shoot targets just as well ;)

I really don't see how you can compare knives and guns with fireworks though :huh:

[Afronaut]

Here in Norway, because of the sales success last year,
theyr planning to but extra taxes on the Fireworks.

So ppl wouldnt buy so much, some sorta security-tax or whatnot.

It would probably mean less accidents also.

I dont mind, since I dont buy that stuff.
Most of my money goes on Booze and Hotel and such expences at New Year Party.
...priorities, its all about priorities...

:D

[Cheese]

So why ban guns and knives etc? If it's ok to have fireworks just cos the few spoil it, what about guns? I used to love going on fields shooting targets (never animals).
I also collect knives but my current collection is ilegal and should have been handed in.
I suffered because of stupid people , was that fair?
Before you answer that, just tell me if a firework can kill?

Pretty much like the landmines these items have no place in this discussion. But since you bring it up.

These objects are designed to kill.

Fireworks aren't designed to kill people.

[Cheese]

Here in Norway, because of the sales success last year,
theyr planning to but extra taxes on the Fireworks.

So ppl wouldnt buy so much, some sorta security-tax or whatnot.

It would probably mean less accidents also.

I dont mind, since I dont buy that stuff.
Most of my money goes on Booze and Hotel and such expences at New Year Party.
...priorities, its all about priorities...

:D

I hadn't thought of that.

A higher tax on fireworks. Brilliant.

This would fund any injuries, maybe put off idiots from buying them and reduce the questionable pollution.

[Jon L. Obscene]

Erm excuse me, I own several knive designed for working, a fish knife, survival knife, pen knives for cutting rope etc, these were not designed to kill, they are tools of trades, yet you are still not allowed to carry them.
As for you saying guns and kives have no place in this thread, surely that applies to cars, petrol and various other things mentioned?
My point is, you say cars and drink etc is dangerous, I say fireworks are worse, like guns (used on farms, designed to control pests, as is ilegal poisons you need a liscence for) they can kill and DO maim/kill , I'm sorry but even a billion people's enjoyment is not worth a human life.

Jonno :cool:

[DanB]

So we ban everything that could kill/injure someone? Is that what you're saying? :huh:

[Cheese]

I'm sorry but even a billion people's enjoyment is not worth a human life.

It doesn't work like that.

No-one's saying that you can have fireworks but people have to die because of it.

No-one wants people to die but unfortunately it happens in very rare cases. I can accept it, we pay this price for everything in our lives. I truly hope that no-one does get hurt but if they do then so be it. It all boils down to my question that you have yet to answer satisfactorily.


Off-topic: With regards to your knives. Is it not possible to get a licence for them? If not then that is unfair (though nothing to do with this discussion) as like you say they are tools of a trade.

[Jon L. Obscene]

@ dan .... :blink: No, jesus I don't see whats so difficult to grasp here, the general sale of firworks is wrong.
Read back, this thread is about fireworks, not cars, not guns, not drinking or smoking or any pollution in other countries, this thread is about fireworks and bonfires.

Nothing more, nothing less :)

@ Cheese.... I'm sorry I will simply dissagree, a human life is worth more than any kind of pleasure, like I said to Manker (god forbid) but think if it was someone you loved got badly maimed or worse?

As for the knives, no, no liscence is available to my knowledge, all knives with over a 3" blade were to be handed in unless work tools and kept at the workplace.

Jonno :cool:

[manker]

a billion people's enjoyment is not worth a human life.
Until I read that statement I thought Jonno was just having a laugh and being obstinate for the sake of it, cause the problems that fireworks cause in society is akin to that of ballpoint pens.

Now It's clear that if he truly believes that then he sincerely believes he is right.

Ban everything!!!11111

[Cheese]

:blink: No, jesus I don't see whats so difficult to grasp here, the general sale of firworks is wrong.
Read back, this thread is about fireworks, not cars, not guns, not drinking or smoking or any pollution in other countries, this thread is about fireworks and bonfires.

Nothing more, nothing less :)

Jonno :cool:

Or guns or knives. Godamnit DanB how dare you cloud the issue with other things. :angry:

[DanB]

:blink: No, jesus I don't see whats so difficult to grasp here, the general sale of firworks is wrong.
Read back, this thread is about fireworks, not cars, not guns, not drinking or smoking or any pollution in other countries, this thread is about fireworks and bonfires.

Nothing more, nothing less :)

Jonno :cool:


I don't see whats so difficult for you to grasp that we don't think it is .

Nothing more, nothing less :)

[bigboab]

You just cant go around putting a ban on everything.

Look what happened on the passengers on the Titanic when they put a banned on ship.:wacko:

OK I know its siesta time.:lol:

[Jon L. Obscene]

Bob , that was a Band :lol:

@Manker......No I'm sorry, you guys are generalising things, if kinves can be banned and creosote can be banned, then why should'nt firworks? They banned the rest of the year.....Why is that?

How can you say "Right no one is allowed to sell or posses fireworks.....cept November" :blink:

@ Cheese......I mentioned guns and knives, try reading first :)

@dan..... Fair enough, we'll see the results 2morrow morning.

Anyhoo, I'm off out, gotta stock up on beer and fireworks for my party tonight :01:
I'm having my own display and wanna get some big un's :01:

Jonno :cool:

[DanB]

You can't have heard the news then Jono. Apparently Tony Blair read your thread and they just rushed through an emergency law in parlament banning their sale in Norfolk for the sake of the children :(

[Cheese]

@ Cheese......I mentioned guns and knives, try reading first

I know. I was taking the piss.

[Jon L. Obscene]

You can't have heard the news then Jono. Apparently Tony Blair read your thread and they just rushed through an emergency law in parlament banning their sale in Norfolk for the sake of the children :(

Shit :( That's buggered my night up, damn Blair and his anti fireworks :angry:

@Cheese ......Nothing new there

@MJPF...... But this thread is about fireworks, not cars or smoking, altho smoking is being banned in public, thousands of pubs now don't allow it, and within the next 3 years there will be a total public ban.

Jonno :cool:

[DanB]

Let me get this straight, you have spent the last 3 hours bitching about fireworks and now you are off to buy some for later on? :blink: :frusty:

[Jon L. Obscene]

Well yeah, I like big bangs and thought I would aim some at my miserable neighbour :01:

It's an ironic joke Dan :rolleyes: I would'nt waste my money

Jonno :cool:

[manker]

Let me get this straight, you have spent the last 3 hours bitching about fireworks and now you are off to buy some for later on? :blink: :frusty:
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

[Jon L. Obscene]

Do you for example smoke in pubs or other public places.

No, not round here, no smoking in pubs, hav'nt got any clubs :)
Besides, my ciggerette will not burn someones face off.

Right, I's going :01:

Jonno :cool:

[Yogi]

I will light a fart tonight for you, Joncey!!

http://www.funnyboneshirts.com/pages/shirts/fart_lighting/fire-farter-box2.gif

YoFartFireNight

[tesco]

My mommy told me about this day on the weekend.

I wish we had it here, sounds fun. :(

[DanB]

:rolleyes: You just like dissagreeing with me for fun :dry:

I'm sorry but there's nothing right about todays festivities, the reason is sick, the fact that kids make a doll of a human to burn is sick, the sale of explosives is sick, the amount of pollution is sick.
This is 2004, bout time we recognised the amount of injuries and harm to the planet is not worth a few pretty flashes and bangs.

Jonno :cool:


If the reason is so sick why do you have a special Guy Fawkes banner on your forum? :unsure:

[manker]

If the reason is so sick why do you have a special Guy Fawkes banner on your forum? :unsure:
That is a cool banner.

Jonno might be the biggest hypocrite since flip flop McJock from aside loch McContradict but at least he's stylish :coolio:

[Rat Faced]

Looking out the window there are, atm, 5 Bonfires within 50m in peoples gardens.

The big one on the field hasnt been lit yet :ph34r:

Some serious fireworks going off all over :lol:

[Biggles]

Jonno

Prior to the abortive attempt to blow up the houses of Parliament the fire festival of Samhein was held throughout the country with lots and lots of bonfires. The whole Guy Fawkes thing has just been superimposed on an ancient tradition and moved sideways a couple of days. Likewise the burning effigy harks back to the somewhat scary Wickerman. The fireworks are the new bit to include the gunpowder plot.

It is celebrated in Scotland, we didn't even merge Parliaments until a hundred years after Guy Fawkes. However, records of the bonfires at this time pre-date Fawkes by hundreds of years.

Go out and enjoy - you are celebrating much more than the failure of a simple bomb plot. :)

[Jon L. Obscene]

Ok you're all right :)

I apologise :)

Selling bombs to anyone off the street is a good idea, shame our fire engine has just gone out tho, someone set light to the common, many animals and plant life will die, but it's worth it for a fun night :)

And I did'nt make that banner, nor did I put it up :P

Besides, it's a forum for many people, I'm just 1 person with an opinion, if it's wrong to have views on something then cast me down :)

Jonno :cool:

[DanB]

Selling bombs to anyone off the street is a good idea, shame our fire engine has just gone out tho, someone set light to the common, many animals and plant life will die, but it's worth it for a fun night :)


There will always be nobs that go too far Jonno, banning bonfires cos someone set fire to the common won't work, you'll have to ban matches and lighters too :)

And its not just anyone, its anyone over 18

[Lilmiss]

I hate to be a killjoy, but I don't think fireworks should be sold to the general public either. I see nothing wrong with people who know how to handle them properly holding shows, as they take the proper precautions.

But I don't agree with Joe Public walking into a shop to buy these things to play with in their gardens. I'm a big coward though, and am even scared of sparklers. Thats what people are missing though, fear. I have friends and family who get plastered, then set them off all over the place. My Uncle set his wig on fire with one, although it did amuse us all.

[Jon L. Obscene]

But I don't agree with Joe Public walking into a shop to buy these things to play with in their gardens. I'm a big coward though, and am even scared of sparklers. Thats what people are missing though, fear. I have friends and family who get plastered, then set them off all over the place. My Uncle set his wig on fire with one, although it did amuse us all.

Exactly my point, those who think their wonderful usually have never seen bad things first hand.

I used the "Posting thru letter box" line having remembered last year when you had a spout of it lilmiss.

Yes it's fun, I do like fireworks, especially the big ones :01:
But not in the hands of anyone who wants them :(
Which brings me to answer Dans point of only available to over 18's, so is alcohol, but I was drinking at 12, so do many others, how? People buying it for them. Yes you can say that should'nt happen and is ileagle, but the fact is, it does happen, it's a sad fact. Punishment does'nt work, we know that from alcohol etc, prevention is the only cure, and the only way to prevent it is a ban on public sales.

That is fact. Not an opinion.

Jonno :cool:

[Biggles]

Ok you're all right :)

I apologise :)

Selling bombs to anyone off the street is a good idea, shame our fire engine has just gone out tho, someone set light to the common, many animals and plant life will die, but it's worth it for a fun night :)

And I did'nt make that banner, nor did I put it up :P

Besides, it's a forum for many people, I'm just 1 person with an opinion, if it's wrong to have views on something then cast me down :)

Jonno :cool:

Oh! I thought you were complaining about the bonfires.

I totally agree - it is like bloody Beirut out there and has been for the last couple of weeks.

But who says punishment doesn't work. :devil:

[Jon L. Obscene]

I am Bigs, the fireworks thing was kinda side topic :lol:

Nah I just think the bonfire thing is ott, the air tonight will be horrendous, anyone with Asthma will recognise that statement, and somewhere earlier Dan said no one chucks tires on, sorry mate, yes they do, you should have a look round all the private ones, this is a chance for everyone to burn their crap rather than take it to the dump :rolleyes:

Jonno :cool:

[DanB]

But back to the original question put to you by Cheese over 6 hours ago why should the majority of people who are sensible and don't abuse the fireworks be punished for the small mindless minority?

[Biggles]

I am Bigs, the fireworks thing was kinda side topic :lol:

Nah I just think the bonfire thing is ott, the air tonight will be horrendous, anyone with Asthma will recognise that statement, and somewhere earlier Dan said no one chucks tires on, sorry mate, yes they do, you should have a look round all the private ones, this is a chance for everyone to burn their crap rather than take it to the dump :rolleyes:

Jonno :cool:

:lol:

Land fill or bonfire?

Neither are really clear winners in the environment stakes are they?

At least charcol is really good for the soil. (Not tyres though - smelly, nasty, evil)

[Cheese]

That is fact. Not an opinion.

Jonno :cool:

No, that's still an opinion.

Even if fireworks were banned for public sale they would make their way into this country.

Less people would have them, of course, but then those that were here may not be as safe as those that were previously allowed here.

Someone blows themselves up with an illegal firework because they could no longer buy safer legal ones?

Or perhaps someone would make their own firework and kill themselves.

Or, more probably, they just injure themselves through stupidity from illegal fireworks.

So you see there is no way to prevent injuries at this time of year.

That's only my opinion. I wouldn't so silly as to say it was a fact.

[Lilmiss]

charcol

Wow!!! :w00t:

Even Biggles makes spelling mistakes.
I'm impressed. :cool:

[Lilmiss]

Bonfire night is fantastic. :D
The big fire, the sparkly lights, the toffee apples.
It's all good and now part of tradition.



But it is all controlled.
Fair enough kids will go and devise things that will explode and make noises, but I'd say the majority of injuries are from bought fireworks, which are so easily aquired. Stricter age restrictions should be inforced, more policemen should be on the beat, and more information on the handling of such things should all happen. But it won't.

[Jon L. Obscene]

But back to the original question put to you by Cheese over 6 hours ago why should the majority of people who are sensible and don't abuse the fireworks be punished for the small mindless minority?

You could turn that round tho, why should you have at the expense of someone else's life?

@Cheese.......No, what I said was fact, not an opinion, that IS what happens.
As for the smuggling market, that's such a crap argument :lol: So now they have banned guns it makes the problem worse?

@Biggle....Yeah, see I think the thing is that a lot of you live in cities where stuff like this can't be hidden that well, out here in the sticks people will be burning anything that burns, litterally, piles of crap, paint tins, tyres, anything thats is hard to get rid of........Bodies? :ph34r: :lol:

Jonno :cool:

[DanB]

@Cheese.......No, what I said was fact, not an opinion, that IS what happens.
As for the smuggling market, that's such a crap argument :lol: So now they have banned guns it makes the problem worse?



Well banning guns doesn't have any effect on the blackmarket ones does it?

I mean drugs are illegal but you don't have much trouble getting hold of them do you?

[Cheese]

You could turn that round tho, why should you have at the expense of someone else's life?

@Cheese.......No, what I said was fact, not an opinion, that IS what happens.
As for the smuggling market, that's such a crap argument :lol: So now they have banned guns it makes the problem worse?

@Biggle....Yeah, see I think the thing is that a lot of you live in cities where stuff like this can't be hidden that well, out here in the sticks people will be burning anything that burns, litterally, piles of crap, paint tins, tyres, anything thats is hard to get rid of........Bodies? :ph34r: :lol:

Jonno :cool:


You said that banning fireworks would be a prevention. I pointed out that it wasn't. People would still get hold of fireworks people would still get injured. I fail to see how that is a crap argument, I never said that the problem would get worse either. And what the hell have guns got to do with it?

So banning fireworks would, perhaps, be a way to reduce things but there is no such thing as prevention in this matter. You can flip-flop all you want but you know I'm right.

Now that's a fact. :)

[DanB]

Take that to the bank and cash it :01:

[DanB]

:huh:

[Jon L. Obscene]

Banning fireworks from public would be a prevention, it would mean any going off anywhere cept an organized event would be illegal and therefore responded to, if you could'nt hold your display, you would'nt buy them would you?

@Dan........What? :blink:

Jonno :cool:

[Lilmiss]

Oooh....it's the bottom of the page bit that no-ones reads. :shifty:




Blah de blah de blah...... :whistling

[Cheese]

Banning fireworks from public would be a prevention, it would mean any going off anywhere cept an organized event would be illegal and therefore responded to, if you could'nt hold your display, you would'nt buy them would you?

@Dan........What? :blink:

Jonno :cool:

It would only be a prevention if it worked. Unless you're Mystic Meg you have no idea whatsoever.

So how can you say that it working is a fact?

[Jon L. Obscene]

Yes, like I said, any being let off which are not in an organized event would be responded to by police and dealt with acordingly. Provided the penalty was stiff enough I would say that it would work, yes :)

Jonno :cool:

[DanB]

Yes, like I said, any being let off which are not in an organized event would be responded to by police and dealt with acordingly. Provided the penalty was stiff enough I would say that it would work, yes :)

Jonno :cool:


Just like burglarys are responded to?

a couple of days later :lol:


Do you not think the Police have more important things to do?

[Jon L. Obscene]

Not if there's revenue involved, bugulars cost money, things like this MAKE money (providing the fine is high enough)

:01: It's why the gov will never ban smoking, too much revenue :01:

England rules!!! :lol:

Jonno :cool:


Edit: Having thought about it, yeah the above is a pretty crap arguement :lol:

[DanB]

Edit: Having thought about it, yeah the above is a pretty crap arguement :lol:


Yay, finally :clap:

[Jon L. Obscene]

:01: :lol:

See, at least I know when I'm wrong :lol:

Ah fuck it, next door neighbours had some fireworks, scared the shit outta the cat but I thought they were cool :01:

Jonno :cool:

[DanB]

:01: :lol:

See, at least I know when I'm wrong :lol:

Ah fuck it, next door neighbours had some fireworks, scared the shit outta the cat but I thought they were cool :01:

Jonno :cool:


hee hee :stuart:

I saw a few cool displays out of various windows too. Some even made things shake :lol:

[Cheese]

Fuck fireworks!

It was like a fucking warzone on my way to the pub tonight.

Ban them is all I can say.

[Jon L. Obscene]

Don't be a kiljoy cheese, it's not nice, just cos you don't like them does'nt mean we have to go without :01:

And I strongly advise against fucking a firework, that could seriosuly damage your......well, just don't do it :ph34r:

Jonno :cool:

[Cheese]

Don't be a kiljoy cheese, it's not nice, just cos you don't like them does'nt mean we have to go without :01:

And I strongly advise against fucking a firework, that could seriosuly damage your......well, just don't do it :ph34r:

Jonno :cool:

This reminds me of a this one time I was having sex with a girl and afterwards, and this is true, fireworks went off outside. Did I feel like teh greatsest?

Yes. Yes I did.

Edit: I think, in the future, I may employ someone to set off fireworks after I have sex. Cushy job though, like once or twice a year work. :( ;)

[DanB]

lovely story :lol:

[enoughfakefiles]

This reminds me of a this one time I was having sex with a girl and afterwards, and this is true, fireworks went off outside. Did I feel like teh greatsest?


Yeah i think it`s great if your firework goes of outside as well. :01: :lol:

[Jon L. Obscene]

Yeah i think it`s great if your firework goes of outside as well. :01: :lol:

Are you trying to tell us you have a premeture ejaculation problem? :unsure:

@ Cheese...I'll do that, I got some foreign fireworks cheap, says "Keep away from naked flames" so fuck knows how you light them :unsure:

Jonno :cool:

[DanB]

Are you trying to tell us you have a premeture ejaculation problem? :unsure:

@ Cheese...I'll do that, I got some foreign fireworks cheap, says "Keep away from naked flames" so fuck knows how you light them :unsure:

Jonno :cool:


Put the flame in a dress first :frusty:

[Cheese]

Yeah i think it`s great if your firework goes of outside as well. :01: :lol:

You are a dirty minded person. :D

[namzuf9]

Bollocks! I just read through 11 pages of serious debate and it turnt silly at the end (in the lounge as wellhttp://www.filesharingtalk.com/vb3/images/smilies/ohmy.gif)

Anyways a few points I come up with while reading.
Guns are not banned at all. Handguns are after the Dunblaine incident but rifles/shotguns are legal to own if you hold a FAC (Fire Arms Certificate)
It is legal to possess a knife with a non fixed blade of less than 3".
It is legal to possess a fishermans knife (fillet knife)
Bleach and salt subsitute can be used as a extremly dangerous explosive.
As can paint and dry ice.
As can match heads and a tube.

Fireworks are dangerous if not used propelry.
A knife is dangerous if not used properly.
A car is dangerous if not used properly.

Look at the big picture, you can hurt yourself on anything if not used in the manner it was designed for and you cant punish the entire population for a few idiots.

[Jon L. Obscene]

Thankyou for your opinion, very inciteful and you have every right to be wrong :01: :lol:

Look guys it's simple really, I'm right cos I'm great, you're all wrong cos you're not great therefore the world would be a safer place if monkeys did not have mobile phones :)

Jonno :cool:

[namzuf9]

Blow me ginger beardhttp://www.filesharingtalk.com/vb3/images/smilies/bb.gif

[Cheese]

Thankyou for your opinion, very inciteful and you have every right to be wrong :01: :lol:

Look guys it's simple really, I'm right cos I'm great, you're all wrong cos you're not great therefore the world would be a safer place if monkeys did not have mobile phones :)

Jonno :cool:

It is interesting to note that you stated that "pleasure is not worth one human life" (I paraphrase but if you want to go back that is basically what you said).

Smoking is a pleasure.

Drinking is a pleasure.

And to those of us that do: Drugs are a pleasure.

Are you equally against these forms of pleasure? Or are we dividing pleasure into acceptable pleasure and the unacceptable?

Remember each one kills.

[bujub22]

:01: ...........