Dragons den

[Robert00000]

Who watches it? (on tuesdays bbc2?

Its a great series :)

[Barbarossa]

Who watches it? (on tuesdays bbc2?

Its a great series :)


I'm waiting to see you on it ... :shifty:

[TheRealDave]

Is it still on? I like it :P

[Barbarossa]

I think they're still filming the second series ... :unsure:

[JPaul]

The bird lost her company, Red Letter Day or whatever it was.

So she can STFU right away.

[Barbarossa]

The bird lost her company, Red Letter Day or whatever it was.

So she can STFU right away.


I know... :lol:

I'm waiting for the sarky comments from Duncan Bannatyne most of all ... hehehehe

[Gemby!]

is it about dragons ?

[Barbarossa]

No, entrepreneurs.. :unsure:

The "dragons" are the rich successful people (except the red-letter lady :P ) who rip them off and steal their ideas ... :01:


Sorry, did I say "rip them off"? I meant of course, "invest in their ideas" ... :dry:

[Robert00000]

This thread getting a new lease of life :D

The world of business should get a better profile on this board.

[tesco]

Wow what an old thread. :huh:

[peat moss]

Wow what an old thread. :huh:


Really ,I have seen worse on this forum .

[JPaul]

The world of business should get a better profile on this board.
What the feck do you know about the World of business.

[Gemby!]

No, entrepreneurs.. :unsure:

The "dragons" are the rich successful people (except the red-letter lady :P ) who rip them off and steal their ideas ... :01:


Sorry, did I say "rip them off"? I meant of course, "invest in their ideas" ... :dry:

so it is about dragons :01:

[brotherdoobie]

The world of business should get a better profile on this board.
What the feck do you know about the World of business.

She, was once hairdresser...to Donald Trump.:snooty:

Peace bd

[peat moss]

What the feck do you know about the World of business.

She, was once hairdresser...to Donald Trump.:snooty:

Peace bd



Whats that old saying ? You'll tell your barber anything . :)

[Robert00000]

Wow what an old thread. :huh:

Yep, I received a reply 7 months after i made the original post. :unsure:

[Robert00000]

She, was once hairdresser...to Donald Trump.:snooty:

Peace bd

Nope, I own my own business and making some serious dosh :D

[JPaul]

She, was once hairdresser...to Donald Trump.:snooty:

Peace bd

Nope, I own my own business and making some serious dosh :D
That would be quite nice if;

a, It was true

b, You weren't a complete wanker.

c, Could post a coherent sentence.

[Robert00000]

Nope, I own my own business and making some serious dosh :D
That would be quite nice if;

a, It was true

b, You weren't a complete wanker.

c, Could post a coherent sentence.

Not interested in your opinions so take it elsewhere. You dont know me and i dont wish to acquaint myself any better with yourself.

[Robert00000]

No, entrepreneurs.. :unsure:

The "dragons" are the rich successful people (except the red-letter lady :P ) who rip them off and steal their ideas ... :01:


Sorry, did I say "rip them off"? I meant of course, "invest in their ideas" ... :dry:

I don't think this is as outlandish as it may sound because it makes me wonder if one of my previous concepts was stolen, not by a VC firm but by someone who was supposed to be a business mentor. Because the nature of the service we intended to provide, the prices and marketing strategy were exactly the same as a competitor who appeared months later, before we even launched the service.

It couldnt be just coincidence as the type of service we were offering was quite unique. But in the end i discovered a more profitable path and decided to pursue that.

It's always a good idea to approach a well know VC firm, and only after you have the business up and running (where possible), that way they wont use your plan to pinch ideas for some similar business they may be dealing with.

[JPaul]

That would be quite nice if;

a, It was true

b, You weren't a complete wanker.

c, Could post a coherent sentence.

Not interested in your opinions so take it elsewhere. You dont know me and i dont wish to acquaint myself any better with yourself.
Oh please, let me get to know you better. There aren't enough semi-literate interweb fantacysts in my life just now.

[Cheese]

I made my first million by optimizing dot-com methodologies which secured me the ability to generate viral applications, I'm now looking into incentivize frictionless platforms which deliver open-source convergence to leverage ubiquitous web services.

[manker]

i dont wish to acquaint myself any better with yourself.That's just clumsy :pinch:

In other news:

My vocation as a bank clerk enables me to meet and chat with many people who have just started up in business, the ones who think they know it all are invariably men younger than myself and any advice I offer is summarily ignored.

Which seems rather strange as that is primarily what they pay me for.

Point is that these hot-headed young 'entrepreneurs' rarely have two brass ha'pennies to rub together :schnauz:

[Barbarossa]

It couldnt be just coincidence as the type of service we were offering was quite unique. But in the end i discovered a more profitable path and decided to pursue that.


Yeah, you might be making "good money" now, but you're going to get such a nasty rash, and you won't be able to poo properly, and don't come whingeing back round here when that happens. :snooty:

[manker]

:lol: :pinch:

[Robert00000]

i dont wish to acquaint myself any better with yourself.That's just clumsy :pinch:

In other news:

My vocation as a bank clerk enables me to meet and chat with many people who have just started up in business, the ones who think they know it all are invariably men younger than myself and any advice I offer is summarily ignored.

Which seems rather strange as that is primarily what they pay me for.

Point is that these hot-headed young 'entrepreneurs' rarely have two brass ha'pennies to rub together :schnauz:

The business has been trading for over a year, so it can be considered established. But i still never say no to quality business advice from people who know what they are talking about. Unfortunately, Mr Jpaul isn't one of these people.

@ Withcheese. Damn, i wish i had come up with that concept first. :lol:

@ Barbarossa. I'll remember to notify my doctor in advance. ;)

[JPaul]

That's just clumsy :pinch:

In other news:

My vocation as a bank clerk enables me to meet and chat with many people who have just started up in business, the ones who think they know it all are invariably men younger than myself and any advice I offer is summarily ignored.

Which seems rather strange as that is primarily what they pay me for.

Point is that these hot-headed young 'entrepreneurs' rarely have two brass ha'pennies to rub together :schnauz:

But i still never say no to quality business advice from people who know what they are talking about. Unfortunately, Mr Jpaul isn't one of these people.

Absolutely spot on, I would never offer business advice to a cretin. It's a waste of my time and theirs.

The best bit of business advice I ever gave someone was to close the business down and to get full time employment as they were not suited to running their own small business.

Thankfully he took this advice and thanked me for it later. He, his wife and family were much happier and less stressed out. I think he probably knew deep down it was something he should do, he just needed it explained to him. I also managed to get him a shed load of money (which he was actually due) to pay off a lot of debts. Which was nice.

[DanB]

I ran my own business for 2.5/3 years, apparently I had circa £30k profit a year (police accountants), which isnt too bad for a part time/weekend effort :ph34r:

[JPaul]

I ran my own business for 2.5/3 years, apparently I had circa £30k profit a year (police accountants), which isnt too bad for a part time/weekend effort :ph34r:
:lol:

[sparsely]

I ran my own business for 2.5/3 years, apparently I had circa £30k profit a year (police accountants), which isnt too bad for a part time/weekend effort :ph34r:

gigolo? :ermm:

[JPaul]

I ran my own business for 2.5/3 years, apparently I had circa £30k profit a year (police accountants), which isnt too bad for a part time/weekend effort :ph34r:

gigolo? :ermm:
Part-time Police Accountant, the chap told you that.

[Robert00000]

But i still never say no to quality business advice from people who know what they are talking about. Unfortunately, Mr Jpaul isn't one of these people.

Absolutely spot on, I would never offer business advice to a cretin. It's a waste of my time and theirs.

The best bit of business advice I ever gave someone was to close the business down and to get full time employment as they were not suited to running their own small business.

Thankfully he took this advice and thanked me for it later. He, his wife and family were much happier and less stressed out. I think he probably knew deep down it was something he should do, he just needed it explained to him. I also managed to get him a shed load of money (which he was actually due) to pay off a lot of debts. Which was nice.

Didnt know you're a business advisor, thought you were just a manker clone out to cause irritation to the ambitious and successful.

Your comment above doesn't apply to me, my business had a turnover of just under £900,000 last year (about 80% of which was profit). This hasn't as yet made me into a millionaire (in cash terms) but i'm on the way there.

Its taken a great deal of hard work, but the efforts will hopefully pay off in a big way once i get the required VC investment.

I'm also seeking 2 welsh assembly grants (AIG & RSA) to help with the employment and training costs.

The margins of my business are relatively high and so will see competitors appearing in the near future. To be honest i'm looking forward to the planned IPO to give me the security i desire. The big flashy house and cars will have to wait till then.

[JPaul]

Absolutely spot on, I would never offer business advice to a cretin. It's a waste of my time and theirs.

The best bit of business advice I ever gave someone was to close the business down and to get full time employment as they were not suited to running their own small business.

Thankfully he took this advice and thanked me for it later. He, his wife and family were much happier and less stressed out. I think he probably knew deep down it was something he should do, he just needed it explained to him. I also managed to get him a shed load of money (which he was actually due) to pay off a lot of debts. Which was nice.

Didnt know you're a business advisor, thought you were just a manker clone out to cause irritation to the ambitious and successful.

Your comment above doesn't apply to me, my business had a turnover of just under £900,000 last year (about 80% of which was profit). This hasn't as yet made me into a millionaire (in cash terms) but i'm on the way there.

Its taken a great deal of hard work, but the efforts will hopefully pay off in a big way once i get the required VC investment.

I'm also seeking 2 welsh assembly grants (AIG & RSA) to help with the employment and training costs.

The margins of my business are relatively high and so will see competitors appearing in the near future. To be honest i'm looking forward to the planned IPO to give me the security i desire. The big flashy house and cars will have to wait till then.

Yet you are still a semi-literate letch who has not the slightest idea of how business works. What's the chances of that well.

Your business had a turnover of c£900,000 last year. You made a profit of £720,000. Which means costs of £180,000. Depending on what you do and how the costs break down you have a really nice mark up there.

Please enlighten me, what particular field are you working in. Oh, wait, you've been asked before and couldn't answer.

Quelle surprise.

[Robert00000]

Yet you are still a semi-literate letch who has not the slightest idea of how business works

If every business in the UK was run by "semi-literate letch's" like me it would be a richer place.:lol:



Please enlighten me, what particular field are you working in. Oh, wait, you've been asked before and couldn't answer.

You need to rephrase that as "didn't answer". There is good reason for that. All i will tell you is it involves oursourcing (the reason for the high margins) and european grants.

[Barbarossa]

Found it! :) :schnauz:


I'm actually still trying to make my first million, should get there in a few months time :D

Just in case you're wondering my company develops software (not POS/EPOS) for the restaurant and fast food sector. It's a completely new service and has great interest from clients.

At the moment i'm busy (when not posting here) creating a package for a chain of restaurants in cardiff.

We've signed up 16 clients already in my home town, each paying £500 ($900) for the system, and the chain of 9 restaurants in cardiff (each paying £450 = $810). So far we have over £12,000 of orders in the first two weeks of trading with very little effort.

Once we have tested out this new system we will launch nationwide, and then world wide. We are recruiting agents to sell our systems through out the country.

Its a revolutionary service we provide, so should take off very quickly :D . I'll be applying for some venture capital later this week to finance the expansion.

I also have another business ready to launch, but it will have to wait till i have more time.

So keep your fingers crossed that all goes well ;)

So are you Nationwide yet? By my estimates, with a £900,000 turnover, selling systems at £500 a pop, you must have around 1800 "clients" by now... Why haven't we heard of you? :mellow:

[DanB]

and how many agents do you have now?

[DarthInsinuate]

this time next year, we'll be mwillionaires

[Barbarossa]

this time next year, we'll be mwillionaires

Rodney you plonker! :P

[manker]

This is really funny.

£720k profit from a £900k turnover in a first year of trading. That doesn't happen, unless the accountant is an idiot. Imagine the tax bill :lol:

What's probably happened is that Rob the letch has added a zero onto his figures and is, in fact, talking about gross profit rather than net because he doesn't really understand the difference between the two. That would make a bit of sense and be realistic - particularly when he thinks oursourcing is a reasonable explanation for an 80% profit margin.

Outsourcing - Robert spelled it incorrectly - doesn't mean higher profit margins. It means that you buy finished products, or services, from other firms.

This usually means lower profit levels (particularly when talking about software because that mostly takes the EOS [economies of scale] factor out of the equation) than when you're able to produce products, or services, for yourself as you have to incorporate the supplier's profit margin into your own costs.

In this particular case, it seems that software is the only thing that can be outsourced. If you are unable to code software for your business and have to buy it in then it would DEFINITELY make your business less profitable. Your own time costs nowt.


Added to this is that Robert was working from his bedroom until late October last year. When he informed us that he had, at last, got an office and would be setting up his new business from there. As I recall it was some time before he could afford a broadband interweb connection.

I think it's really funny when people show off on the interweb - particularly when it's blatant pish.

[GepperRankins]

what does the company do again?

[Barbarossa]

what does the company do again?

Prints money I think... :unsure:

[Robert00000]

@ Bararossa. The business i mentioned there was the one i abandond. We have changed our focus from restaurants and fast food outlets into a more profitable area, but are using the same facilites we created for that business.



This is really funny.

£720k profit from a £900k turnover in a first year of trading. That doesn't happen, unless the accountant is an idiot. Imagine the tax bill :lol:

What's probably happened is that Rob the letch has added a zero onto his figures and is, in fact, talking about gross profit rather than net because he doesn't really understand the difference between the two. That would make a bit of sense and be realistic - particularly when he thinks oursourcing is a reasonable explanation for an 80% profit margin.

This is why i think manker is a retard. He is suggesting he understands my business more than myself.

I have never said it was gross profit. When calculating profit for investors or anyone else interested in how well the business is doing its better to mention gross profit, as this gives a better idea of the business's performance. But of course to minimise tax you find ways to re-invest the money.

I don't know why he thinks he understands outsourcing better than myself. Our outsourcing is the reason for our high margins because rather than employ high cost UK staff we have chosen to outsource the work abroad for about a tenth of the cost. In addition we have deployed efficiency measures which saves our clients further.




Added to this is that Robert was working from his bedroom until late October last year. When he informed us that he had, at last, got an office and would be setting up his new business from there. As I recall it was some time before he could afford a broadband interweb connection.



I was not working from my bedroom:lol: , and the reason why it took so long to get broadband at work was a problem with BT. But I was far more concerned that they were having problems installing the phone line.

In the end they paid me some (meager) compensation.

[GepperRankins]

how much net profit have you earned this year and what do you reckon to next year?

[DanB]

knobber peado letch fake businessman :01:

[manker]

Robert, you haven't the slightest clue.

I wonder if you could explain why you think gross profit gives a better idea of the business' performance. The reason I ask is because no-one in the whole wide world who can understand a P&L would agree with you.

Also, I do understand outsourcing better than you. In fact I'd go as far as to say that it falls within my area of expertise. FYI, outsourcing isn't a synonym for farming out work to a foreign country. It's merely an example - which is why your blanket statement earlier that 'I outsource so my margins are high' was pish.

If you have to get foreigners to develop software for you, then you're paying them money which you wouldn't have to pay if you could code it yourself. Therefore outsourcing has cut your profit margin. Sure, you can say that otherwise you'd have to get UK coders to do - but that's still outsourcing.

It just means that this particular type of oursourcing has cut your profit margins by less than another type of outsourcing.

Further, if the idea that Barbarosa posted was subsequently rejected by you in favour of a different venture - how then have you got a full year of accounts. You posted it on the 21st August 2004.

You won't know this but once a million pound company gets to its year end, it will take at least a month to produce a set of accounts with which one can derive a profit figure.

You're full of shit. I'm surprised, really.

[JPaul]

I have dabbled a wee bit with the old reading a set of accounts me'self. I am by no means an expert however I do not consider it a black or arcane art.

Reading Robert's contentions it would appear to me that he is someone with a minimal grasp on how businesses, accounts etc work. He then uses this to try to impress the Ladies on the interweb.

I particularly liked "I have never said it was gross profit. When calculating profit for investors or anyone else interested in how well the business is doing its better to mention gross profit, as this gives a better idea of the business's performance. But of course to minimise tax you find ways to re-invest the money."

Now forgive me for being simplistic here, however Gross profit is really just sales minus cost of sales. That is before taking off other expenses like rents, rates, salaries, loan repayments, taxes, depreciation of assets other expenses.

Net profit is the figure after having deducted these other expenses. To put it simply, how much the business makes.

Now I would have thought this would have been of some interest to potential investors. There could be a large gross profit and net loss, if for example the business had over borrowed (see manutd).

The "But of course to minimise tax you find ways to re-invest the money", is particularly nice, as it doean't mean feck all. It could only be improved by adding "and stuff" at the end.

[clocker]

I would like to note that JP just outsourced part of his post.

"And stuff" was coded by me.

[JPaul]

I would like to note that JP just outsourced part of his post.

"And stuff" was coded by me.
Hoi, you sold me the interlectural rights to that.

It were the best part too, sucker.

[brotherdoobie]

Robbie... you are a nob. Your lies just bore me now.
That is all.

P.S. Goodbye.

Peace bd

[Robert00000]

OK I confess i dont own a business, i actually live on mars and do daily battle with emperor zog for control of his jelly lake :lol:

As always any discussion with manker and his clone always go round and round in circles, and this thread will go the same way.

It simply isnt worth my time to explain every aspect of my business to people here, i honestly have better things to do.

But i will clarify a few things, the core of the argument is with manker regarding outsourcing. I want to reiterate "He does not understand how my business works".

What we develop are systems (not going to say what) for each client. This work cannot be done by myself because as it would be too time consuming, so we need to employ other people. For each client it takes between a few days to weeks to create this system.

If we employed UK staff it would cost far more than employing the services of outsourcing companies abroad.

So to reiterate, "outsourcing is the reason for our high margins" because our costs are much lower than if we employed UK staff. If we employed UK based staff our profits would be negligible.

As for the gross profit, net profit etc. here are the definitions:-
net profit
Gross sales (http://www.investorwords.com/2251/Gross_sales.html) minus taxes (http://www.investorwords.com/4879/taxes.html), interest, depreciation (http://www.investorwords.com/1416/depreciation.html), and other expenses. also called net earnings or net income or bottom line.

gross profit
Pre-tax net sales (http://www.investorwords.com/3262/net_sales.html) minus cost of sales. also called gross income.

In between "gross Profit" and the "net profit" we have the accountant who would suggest we make capital investments so the profit appears much lower than it actually is when submitting the accounts. But these capital investments are "one off" expenditures that add to the assets. The capital investments we have made "appreciate" in value over the long term i.e. property for the business.

As for the other expenses i.e. salaries, again you need to understand how my business works. As we OUTSOURCE the work abroad and we pay agents commission to obtain clients, these are included under "cost of sales". So in effect our "gross profit" has most of the costs stripped out. Our "net profit" essentially is what we have left over after my salary, the running cost of the office, any captal investments we have made and ,of course, the taxes.

Manker and others should not be giving advice without understanding how a particular business operates, but advice or serious opinions are not their intention, it is rather to be a nuisance.

This thread has been taking too much of my time, anyone serious about understanding the world of business from someone with actual experience of owning and running a business feel free to ask me a relevant question, just as long as it is brief. But those wanting to be an annoyance should find other threads.

[GepperRankins]

i just want one aspect. what the feck does it do?

[manker]

In between "gross Profit" and the "net profit" we have the accountant who would suggest we make capital investments so the profit appears much lower than it actually is when submitting the accounts. But these capital investments are "one off" expenditures that add to the assets. The capital investments we have made "appreciate" in value over the long term i.e. property for the business.Is your Mum your accountant.

If you've got a qualified accountant, I bet you my posh house that she didn't say that.

You do know that capital aquistions have no place in the P&L, only revenue aquistions - if you don't I'm sure your accountant will ... or will she.

Seriously, I could spend a good 5 or 6 minutes writing why the above and the rest is rubbish but I think I've shown you up enough.

Btw, nice googling for the definitions of net and gross profit - can't believe you didn't know before, mr entrepreneur :lol:

[JPaul]

This thread has been taking too much of my time, anyone serious about understanding the world of business from someone with actual experience of owning and running a business feel free to ask me a relevant question, just as long as it is brief. But those wanting to be an annoyance should find other threads.
:lol:

My favourite bit is where he offers business advice, just as long as the question is brief.

Are your outsourcing costs tax-deductable as a business expense, when the supply is made outside of the UK. Can you also reclaim VAT on the cost.

Sorry that's two questions, but they are quite short.

[Barbarossa]

OK I confess i dont own a business, i actually live on mars and do daily battle with emperor zog for control of his jelly lake :lol:



At last, some honesty... :P

[Robert00000]

You do know that capital aquistions have no place in the P&L, only revenue aquistions - if you don't I'm sure your accountant will ... or will she.


Why do you have an obsession with the "profit and loss" accounts? To value a business you must look at it in its entirety, I'm begining to think your understanding of accountancy is limited to this one area. Anyone with any intelligence would also look at the assets the business has added with the profits it has made.

Anyone who has even the slightest understanding of the business tax system will know you can write off expenses like a pair of shoes, a car or even a building for your company. But unlike most, the important purchases we have made (on the advice of our accountant) actually appreciate in value and not depreciate.



Seriously, I could spend a good 5 or 6 minutes writing why the above and the rest is rubbish but I think I've shown you up enough.

The rest of the what i wrote is your embarrassment. You claim to be an expert on "outsourcing" yet you seem to be missing the greatest benefit of it, the reason so many british and other companies choose to outsource abroad i.e the cost savings.

If whomever you work for is employing you in the capacity of an advisor on "outsourcing" I would be seriously concerned.



Btw, nice googling for the definitions of net and gross profit - can't believe you didn't know before, mr entrepreneur :lol:

This illustrates how your mind works, I knew the definitions beforehand, I have an accountant who advises me on these matters. I used the google defintion so people here could use it as a reference, and not just rely on what i tell them.

I think manker is not only insulting the intelligence of people here but is also having an adverse effect on those who are serious about learning the ways of real business.

I would advise anyone considering starting their own business to seek expert advice from professional business advisors.

[missie]

wah wah wah de blah de crap el spew


Tanks for that informative view on buisness.
I look forward to next weeks installment of pure pish.


Helps with the sleeping, ya see.

[Robert00000]

wah wah wah de blah de crap el spew


Tanks for that informative view on buisness.
I look forward to next weeks installment of pure pish.


Helps with the sleeping, ya see.


Happy to missie :naughty:

[GepperRankins]

Tanks for that informative view on buisness.
I look forward to next weeks installment of pure pish.


Helps with the sleeping, ya see.


Happy to missie :naughty:
wtf?


don't :naughty: her. i think it's quite clear she wants you to get hit by a train :snooty:

[missie]

Happy (something) to you also.

I run a buisness too, but mine is a non profit org.
Tank hell there is funding and advice to help us knobs out, eh? :happy:

[missie]

wtf?
don't :naughty: her. i think it's quite clear she wants you to get hit by a train

:lol: I seriously think I just pished myself. :lol:

[JPaul]

Anyone who has even the slightest understanding of the business tax system will know you can write off expenses like a pair of shoes, a car or even a building for your company. But unlike most, the important purchases we have made (on the advice of our accountant) actually appreciate in value and not depreciate.



See it's not just what you plagiarise that gives you away, it's the way you write it that shows you don't atually know what it means. Demonstrating that you are the very person you describe as having " ....even the slightest understanding of the business tax system ...."

You're a fantasist and a pest, eveyone knows that.

[DanB]

Anyone who has even the slightest understanding of the business tax system will know you can write off expenses like a pair of shoes, a car or even a building for your companyYou can't - cars and buildings are capital expenses. It's impossible to write them off to decrease your tax.

You can claim up to 25% of a cars value and sometimes you get a 2% industrial buildings allowance but you can't write it all off in the same tax year.

Rob doesn't understand shit.

[Santa]

i write of cd's, dvd's, going to movies, vacations, taxi's plus all the other usual stuff

[Robert00000]

Anyone who has even the slightest understanding of the business tax system will know you can write off expenses like a pair of shoes, a car or even a building for your companyYou can't - cars and buildings are capital expenses. It's impossible to write them off to decrease your tax.

You can claim up to 25% of a cars value and sometimes you get a 2% industrial buildings allowance but you can't write it all off in the same tax year.

Rob doesn't understand shit.

WTF, you're just comfirming what i've been saying. The point is you can reduce your tax liabilities by re-investing the profit within the business and you just confirmed that. But i wont claim to be an expert on tax, thats why i employ the services of people who are.

@Gepperrankings, I doubt she wants that, she would gain more pleasure if she hacked me to death with an axe :ph34r:

@ Missie
I run a buisness too, but mine is a non profit org Better you than me. I like to make money :01: maybe when i have enough one day i'll give some to charity :naughty:

[JPaul]

You can't - cars and buildings are capital expenses. It's impossible to write them off to decrease your tax.

You can claim up to 25% of a cars value and sometimes you get a 2% industrial buildings allowance but you can't write it all off in the same tax year.

Rob doesn't understand shit.

WTF, you're just comfirming what i've been saying. The point is you can reduce your tax liabilities by re-investing the profit within the business and you just confirmed that.
That's not what you said tho', you mentioned specific things which Dan has now said that you can't write off against your tax.

You are googling stuff about business, misunderstanding it, posting here, making an arse of yourself, retracting what you said and generally being a twat.

The really sad thing is that you are keeping it up, in spite of the fact that everyone else knows it is a fantasy character you created for the interweb.

What's the point, have you no pride.

Maybe one day you will have the business you dream of, best of luck. However until then it would be better to put your efforts into achieving it, rather than trying to impress people with what you may one day become.

That's a bit of business advice by the way, take it or leave it. It's no skin of my .... etc.

[Robert00000]

WTF, you're just comfirming what i've been saying. The point is you can reduce your tax liabilities by re-investing the profit within the business and you just confirmed that.
That's not what you said tho', you mentioned specific things which Dan has now said that you can't write off against your tax.

You are googling stuff about business, misunderstanding it, posting here, making an arse of yourself, retracting what you said and generally being a twat.

The really sad thing is that you are keeping it up, in spite of the fact that everyone else knows it is a fantasy character you created for the interweb.

What's the point, have you no pride.

Maybe one day you will have the business you dream of, best of luck. However until then it would be better to put your efforts into achieving it, rather than trying to impress people with what you may one day become.

That's a bit of business advice by the way, take it or leave it. It's no skin of my .... etc.

As I have said before you can believe what i say here or not, its completely your choice, i frankly couldnt care less.

The character here is not fantasy, its me. Maybe i sometimes dont take the time to explain things here as much as i should and some people start making presumptions (namely manker), but i honestly have better things to do than answer every question everyone asks.

The only thing I "googled" was the definitions for gross and net profits, and reason for that was so they werent my own, and people had elsewhere for reference.

To clarify what we have been discussing here, 1 - Outsourcing. I stated it was the reason for our high margins because we employed the services of lower cost workers outside the UK. Manker said outsourcing" costs more money


Will be back later to complete this

[JPaul]

That's not what you said tho', you mentioned specific things which Dan has now said that you can't write off against your tax.

You are googling stuff about business, misunderstanding it, posting here, making an arse of yourself, retracting what you said and generally being a twat.

The really sad thing is that you are keeping it up, in spite of the fact that everyone else knows it is a fantasy character you created for the interweb.

What's the point, have you no pride.

Maybe one day you will have the business you dream of, best of luck. However until then it would be better to put your efforts into achieving it, rather than trying to impress people with what you may one day become.

That's a bit of business advice by the way, take it or leave it. It's no skin of my .... etc.

As I have said before you can believe what i say here or not, its completely your choice, i frankly couldnt care less.



Obviously.

[Biggles]

Anyone who has even the slightest understanding of the business tax system will know you can write off expenses like a pair of shoes, a car or even a building for your companyYou can't - cars and buildings are capital expenses. It's impossible to write them off to decrease your tax.

You can claim up to 25% of a cars value and sometimes you get a 2% industrial buildings allowance but you can't write it all off in the same tax year.

Rob doesn't understand shit.

These are called Capital Allowances and are what are allowable against taxable profit. A business can depreciate its assets anyway it likes, over 1 year or over 20, reducing balance or straight depreciation. However, it matters not one jot to Gordon Brown, as for tax purposes one must use the Treasury CAs and the set rates provided. Investing in Capital Assests purely to soak surplus cash and prevent it being taxed is ok but it will play havoc with your "return on capital employed" ratios.

Sometimes assets are sold, such as a company car, If, on disposable, the value of the realised asset is greater than the written down CAs value then a taxation balance is charged.

The only things that one is allowed a 100% write off in year are computers - and this for only small businesses (Treasury defintion of business size only).

Of course operating expenses are deductable from Gross Profit ... shoes (safety, for the use of) being a good example.

One also has to be careful with investments in items classed as Goods and Chatels (i.e. the missus) as these will be subject to Capital Gains tax on their disposal if a profit is realised.

There are all sorts of other things going on such as rollover, 1980s tax rebasing (twice), change of use etc., which we should all just walk away from and pretend they don't exist.

I hope this makes everything as clear as a pint of Guiness. :)

[manker]

I hope this makes everything as clear as a pint of Guiness. Indeed it does.

Maybe I should take your lead and go on to post a wee epistle about deferred taxation as it follows on nicely from there :happy:

That quote from Dan; I wrote it at his house and had absolutely no recollection of it whatsoever until now. It's cheering to know that I can clerk with the best of 'em even when slightly inebriated :01:

[Biggles]

I hope this makes everything as clear as a pint of Guiness. Indeed it does.

Maybe I should take your lead and go on to post a wee epistle about deferred taxation as it follows on nicely from there :happy:

That quote from Dan; I wrote it at his house and had absolutely no recollection of it whatsoever until now. It's cheering to know that I can clerk with the best of 'em even when slightly inebriated :01:

As long as you don't mention VAT.

I did once but I think I got away with it. :shifty:

[manker]

Indeed it does.

Maybe I should take your lead and go on to post a wee epistle about deferred taxation as it follows on nicely from there :happy:

That quote from Dan; I wrote it at his house and had absolutely no recollection of it whatsoever until now. It's cheering to know that I can clerk with the best of 'em even when slightly inebriated :01:

As long as you don't mention VAT.

I did once but I think I got away with it. :shifty:I won't if you don't :ph34r:

You could help perpetuate the rumour I started recently - that they did away with it in the recent tax+hmce merge.

I think it's working :naughty:

[JPaul]

I like VAT as a concept, as opposed to direct taxes.

Always have done.

[manker]

I like VAT as a concept, as opposed to direct taxes.

Always have done.It sucks having to charge it to non-VAT registered companies or individuals.

It like the govt has decided to make my services taxable to pensioners (for example) but not to multi-million pound companies.

[JPaul]

I like VAT as a concept, as opposed to direct taxes.

Always have done.It sucks having to charge it to non-VAT registered companies or individuals.

It like the govt has decided to make my services taxable to pensioners (for example) but not to multi-million pound companies.
Tell the companies to register then.

As to the individuals, do it cash in hand. There's no VAT on cash in hand work.

[manker]

It sucks having to charge it to non-VAT registered companies or individuals.

It like the govt has decided to make my services taxable to pensioners (for example) but not to multi-million pound companies.
Tell the companies to register then.

As to the individuals, do it cash in hand. There's no VAT on cash in hand work.An accountancy rod! :lol:

Feck arf, VAT luva.

[JPaul]

Tell the companies to register then.

As to the individuals, do it cash in hand. There's no VAT on cash in hand work.An accountancy rod! :lol:

Feck arf, VAT luva.
Are you telling me that when I got the work done on the house and the builder chappie took cash, that he then paid VAT on it. Arse de moi.

[manker]

An accountancy rod! :lol:

Feck arf, VAT luva.
Are you telling me that when I got the work done on the house and the builder chappie took cash, that he then paid VAT on it. Arse de moi.Only in bony Schottland would such disingenous defraudation of the hmceinlandrevenue, or whatever the feck it is now, take place :snooty:

[JPaul]

We are a pragmatic people.

[brotherdoobie]

We are a pragmatic people.

I work half of the year "under the table".
My knees are just fine.

Peace bd

[Robert00000]

You can't - cars and buildings are capital expenses. It's impossible to write them off to decrease your tax.

You can claim up to 25% of a cars value and sometimes you get a 2% industrial buildings allowance but you can't write it all off in the same tax year.

Rob doesn't understand shit.

These are called Capital Allowances and are what are allowable against taxable profit. A business can depreciate its assets anyway it likes, over 1 year or over 20, reducing balance or straight depreciation. However, it matters not one jot to Gordon Brown, as for tax purposes one must use the Treasury CAs and the set rates provided. Investing in Capital Assests purely to soak surplus cash and prevent it being taxed is ok but it will play havoc with your "return on capital employed" ratios.

Sometimes assets are sold, such as a company car, If, on disposable, the value of the realised asset is greater than the written down CAs value then a taxation balance is charged.

The only things that one is allowed a 100% write off in year are computers - and this for only small businesses (Treasury defintion of business size only).

Of course operating expenses are deductable from Gross Profit ... shoes (safety, for the use of) being a good example.

One also has to be careful with investments in items classed as Goods and Chatels (i.e. the missus) as these will be subject to Capital Gains tax on their disposal if a profit is realised.

There are all sorts of other things going on such as rollover, 1980s tax rebasing (twice), change of use etc., which we should all just walk away from and pretend they don't exist.

I hope this makes everything as clear as a pint of Guiness. :)

Finally someone who knows what he is talking about. It corresponds with the advice i obtained.

[manker]

These are called Capital Allowances and are what are allowable against taxable profit. A business can depreciate its assets anyway it likes, over 1 year or over 20, reducing balance or straight depreciation. However, it matters not one jot to Gordon Brown, as for tax purposes one must use the Treasury CAs and the set rates provided. Investing in Capital Assests purely to soak surplus cash and prevent it being taxed is ok but it will play havoc with your "return on capital employed" ratios.

Sometimes assets are sold, such as a company car, If, on disposable, the value of the realised asset is greater than the written down CAs value then a taxation balance is charged.

The only things that one is allowed a 100% write off in year are computers - and this for only small businesses (Treasury defintion of business size only).

Of course operating expenses are deductable from Gross Profit ... shoes (safety, for the use of) being a good example.

One also has to be careful with investments in items classed as Goods and Chatels (i.e. the missus) as these will be subject to Capital Gains tax on their disposal if a profit is realised.

There are all sorts of other things going on such as rollover, 1980s tax rebasing (twice), change of use etc., which we should all just walk away from and pretend they don't exist.

I hope this makes everything as clear as a pint of Guiness. :)

Finally someone who knows what he is talking about. It corresponds with the advice i obtained.
Yeah, it corresponds with the 'advice' Dan (me, pished) wrote while drunk.

Muppet :dry:

[Barbarossa]

Dragons Den is back! ftw :01:

They had a little subtle dig at Rachel Elnaugh about previous business success right at the end, which also ftw :01:


Rachel Elnaugh is allegedly using her "substantial personal fortune" to finance any investments she might want to make during the course of the series :ermm:

:blink: