Problem, possibly memory related?

[Mr. Mulder]

I’ve spent the better part of the day putting together a computer for the g/f and keep coming to a halt, which I’m pretty sure, is due to the same recurring problem.



Everything is pieced together and running, I start to install Windows (Xp, Pro, Home, Hax0red and legit copies), the HDD formats without a problem, then setup starts listing/installing files but gets to a point where it can’t install some of the files (none specific, no recurring pattern). I skip the files and obviously it doesn’t work, instead I get the blue screen and a message saying something like “IRQL input same as output” or something like that, and “Memory Management”.



When I first switched it on there was a bios message saying CMOS Settings Wrong and CMOS Memory Size Wrong, I just pressed F2 and loaded the default values or something :unsure: when I didin't boot from disk there was an ntldr error, but that only happened once :ermm:



Here’s the specs for all this:



Mobo - PcChips M848ALU SKT A SIS 748 400 DDR AGPx8 ATA133

AMD Sempron 2200

2 sticks of Ebuyer 256MB DDR PC2700 333MHz 184pin Extra Value Ram

Western Digital Caviar 80Gb 7200rpm

Hightech ATI Radeon 7000 64MB DDR Memory

Liteon SOHC-5235 52x32x52x16x Internal IDE Combo

[Snee]

I've never gotten that error, so I dunno' what's wrong.

Try setting "PnP OS installed" (or something similar) to "no" or "disabled", and see what happens. If it's already set to that, try turning it on :unsure:

EDit: also, try with just one stick of ram installed and see what happens.





Wild stabs in the dark here :unsure:

[threelions00]

i see two options...

No.1 do as snny said...

No.2 Get your gf to do it herself and go down the pub with her money.

Not sure if any of that helps...

Just messin

[Mr. Mulder]

The only things with "PnP" are DMA and IRQ Channels which can only be changed to ISA/EISA? :unsure:

Doesn't seem to be a "PnP OS installed" option :cry:

edit: tried it with one stick, still no luck :ermm:


No.2 Get your gf to do it herself and go down the pub with her money.

Hmmm, interesting :unsure:

[Snee]

Meh, pretty sure it hadn't helped.

All it does is let your bios handle the IRQ assignments on it's own, I think. Which might possibly help with weird hardware conflicts, if you are lucky.

It's also good for linux.


Try with just the one stick of ram since it says something about memory though.
I'll check some stuff and see if I can find anything.

EDit: meanwhile, try putting in as little stuff as you can, ie mobo, cpu, ram and graphics, and see if this does any difference.

[Mr. Mulder]

EDit: meanwhile, try putting in as little stuff as you can, ie mobo, cpu, ram and graphics, and see if this does any difference.

just tried it out, got the same fecking message :frusty:

CMOS Settings Wrong
CMOS Memory Size Wrong

:pinch:

[Mr. Mulder]

we're guessing it's the ebuyer extra value ram, maybe the wrong sort? :ermm:

[Snee]

CMOS Settings Wrong
CMOS Memory Size Wrong

Not to alarm you or anything, but if that error persists like it appears to do, it might be your bios/cmos chip/bios battery that's buggered. I thought it happened just when you started it up the first time.

I just remembered that when the caps blew on my kid brother's mobo we'd get that error or something like it a lot.

Does your bios keep any settings you save? :unsure:

[clocker]

Clear your CMOS.
Unplug the power cord, remove the battery and set the jumper to "clear".
Wait.

Perhaps now would be a good time to hit the pub.

Stumble home.

Replace jumper to running position, insert battery and power up machine.
Enter BIOS and "Load optimised settings".

If it works, you get laid.
If not, return to pub.

[Mr. Mulder]

now you mention it the very first time i switched it on i got a low battery warning but then it went away :ermm: yeah it's saving stuff though :unsure:

[Mr. Mulder]

i changed the jumper earlier, will take the battery out and wait a bit, maybe go to the pub :ermm:

[Snee]

When it comes to these things Clocker>me, so go with his suggestion.

[Mr. Mulder]

cheers fellas i'll leave it all unplugged a few hours and let you know :01:

[clocker]

How very kind of you, Snny, however misguided your trust.

I'm hoping he gets hammered at the pub and forgets who recommended this fix if it doesn't work out.

That leaves Mulder bemused, my reputation unbesmirched and his g/f still pissed.

Which is pretty much where we started out, eh?

[Mr. Mulder]

yous guys :fist:

set it all back just now, switched on and got CMOS Battery Low and CMOS Memory Size Wrong

would a new battery cancel out this memory problem too? :unsure:

[Mr. Mulder]

could be a memory problem, ebuyer evr is renound for having bad sectors on it, i would get a new battery which wouldnt be expensive, but most of all i would flash the bios, use a m8s pc to download the bios for the mobo and put it on floppy, that shoud work, it seems your bios may be corrupted, as far as the windows errors see if you can use a different copy

some bloke just said that on another forum, what do you make of it? :ermm:

[Virtualbody1234]

could be a memory problem, ebuyer evr is renound for having bad sectors on it, i would get a new battery which wouldnt be expensive, but most of all i would flash the bios, use a m8s pc to download the bios for the mobo and put it on floppy, that shoud work, it seems your bios may be corrupted, as far as the windows errors see if you can use a different copy

some bloke just said that on another forum, what do you make of it? :ermm:
I would try a new battery without flashing the BIOS.

[Snee]

yous guys :fist:

set it all back just now, switched on and got CMOS Battery Low and CMOS Memory Size Wrong

would a new battery cancel out this memory problem too? :unsure:
If it says something about CMOS like that, it's referring to the CMOS-chip. And since you did get that warning about the battery being low, it's a likely culprit.

I don't think it has anything to do with your ram.

Those errors come later in the process.

[Mr. Mulder]

alright then, im going down to PCWorld for a battery, or a watch shop, whatever's nearest :unsure:

[clocker]

Our breath is bated.






I'm feeling lightheaded and faintly nauseous.

Hurry up, please.

[Mr. Mulder]

(plz forgive the lateness of my reply)

Alright, after a trip to PCWorld (and McDonalds :shifty: ) I've gotten back, put in the new battery and have gotten the same fecking messages :frusty: Also just noticed that it says there's an Athlon 900MHz in, instead of the 2.2 Sempron I put in :blink:

it's the BIOS, right? :dry:

[Snee]

Something dodgy with your bios/cmos, prolly, yeah.

Where'd you get the mobo from?

[Mr. Mulder]

Something dodgy with your bios/cmos, prolly, yeah.

Where'd you get the mobo from?

ebuyer :ph34r:
I'm looking at the BIOS page for teh mobo and it's got options for USA, China and Taiwan - Can't tell if they're for the actual BIOS or just read me's ect? Don't want to get the wrong one and feck with the voltage settings etc :ermm:



Linkage (http://www.pcchips.com.tw/PCCWeb/Downloads/ProductsDetail_Download.aspx?DetailID=251&DetailName=BIOS&DetailDesc=M848ALU%28V2.1%29&MenuID=35&LanID=0)

[Snee]

Don't play around with flashing your bios, if the chip is borked it won't help.


You still have warranty left, right?



(You might want to make sure they can't see you have swapped batteries, if you return it, btw)

[Mr. Mulder]

So you're saying just return the mether fecker and be done with it? :ermm:

Now you mention it, it does sound like the safer option. I'd hate to flash it and find that the chip is broken, and learn that we couldn't return it due to the flashing breaching the warranty? :unsure:


but they'll be hell to pay in the mean time :cry:

[Snee]

Yep, 'fraid so.

No point in losing the warranty if you flash it and it doesn't work, as you say.



Blame me for it, I live half a continent away, so she can't hurt me.

[Mr. Mulder]

She begs to differ :fear: :lol:

I'll do that then, expect an update sometime in August :ermm:

thnx for the help, everyone :01:

[Snee]

Do they have a hotline or something you can call before you send it back?

I reckon they'll say what I said, but that way you can point to what they told you if they give you trouble further along the road with the rma.

[Mr. Mulder]

Good thinking Batman, I'll take a look and maybe phone them :01:

Returned a case to them not long ago and everything seemed to go smoothly, just took ages for the actual RMA number, so I'm optimistic :ermm:

[Snee]

Right O.

And just to cover all bases, in case I was off on the ram issue, try a stick of ram you know works, in both slots. Or try the same ebuyer stick you used when you tested this mobo with another mobo. (In fact, do both if possible.)

And have a look at the BIOS chip, so you know you haven't unseated it somehow.

That way you can be absolutely certain you've tried everything.



(The initial "battery low"-warning definitely points in another direction, but just in case.)

[clocker]

Just out of left field...
Try using a different CD-ROM to load Windows.

[Snee]

How long do you think we can keep him going? :unsure:


EDit:
Seriously though, I hope we covered everything, and it'd be brilliant if one of these last suggestions worked and you didn't have to send it back, arky.

[lynx]

Feck, the bios page tells you that you need to upgrade to support the Sempron chip. Flashing the bios will NOT void your warranty, in fact you should be complaining that it has come with an out of date bios.

However, from my own personal experience, if someone mentions the word PCChips, run like hell.

[Snee]

That's it, I'm out of hardwareworld for good, before something catches on fire :ermm:

[Mr. Mulder]

there's a lot of different suggestions now :unsure:

I've tried two different CD's, one which has 8 different versions of Windows on it

I can't put any other sticks in other than the two ebuyer sticks as I don't have any others, though I've tried each stick on it' own in different slots

What Lynx said sounds spot on, but if i try to flash the BIOS and it fecks up, then it can't be sent back ...but, if they send another board with the same out-of-date bios, then it would have been a waste of time? :unsure:

[Chewie]

My advice:
Flash the BIOS.
If you have trouble with returning the board, refer them to the PCChips site and their page stating the BIOS must be flashed to recognise the Sempron.
If ebuyer sold you the CPU, board and RAM, they're hardly in a position to deny warranty when you were following manufacturer's directions in order to get them to work together.

[clocker]

I've tried two different CD's, one which has 8 different versions of Windows on it


I meant the CD reader itself...you know, the thing with the tray that comes out?
If the drive is bad it can throw errors when loading the files.

We've never had to flash a board's BIOS to get a Sempron to load Windows.

[Snee]

I've tried two different CD's, one which has 8 different versions of Windows on it


I meant the CD reader itself...you know, the thing with the tray that comes out?
If the drive is bad it can throw errors when loading the files.

We've never had to flash a board's BIOS to get a Sempron to load Windows.
After lynx posted about it, I remembered having seen a couple of blokes posting about allegedly trying to install semprons on older socket A mobos and failing until they'd flashed bios.

Mostly sempron support with a new bios just means that it doesn't say you have an unknown processor during post, I think.

But I googled around and found a bunch of fairly recent mobos that supposedly can't work with a sempron, at least not without a new bios.

And Arky did say it reported his cpu speed wrong.



I stared myself blind at the "battery low"-thing and those error messages (which I'd have thought would have been different if it had to do with the processor, btw), didn't even consider that it might be a cpu compability-thing.

Like I said, I think I'll be staying out of hardware-world so I don't jinx anyone else's efforts to fix something.

[clocker]

Like I said, I think I'll be staying out of hardware-world so I don't jinx anyone else's efforts to fix something.
Oh don't be silly.
Jinxing people is my job, anyway.

[Snee]

I can stay around to jinx you, I guess.

No fun doing it to yourself, is it? :unsure:

[Mr. Mulder]

Right, I flashed the BIOS, all is well on the BIOS reading front, I can format and install all the windows files, but, after it gets to 100%, the screen goes black, then the blue error screen appears :dry: :dry: :dry:

This time it's telling me that the HDD might have viruses and to run check disk :ermm:

[Snee]

If it was me, I might try repartitioning it, and I'd also have a look in bios to see that it's detected correctly and all that.

Take a look at the LBA mode thing http://filesharingtalk.com/vb3/showthread.php?t=94797&highlight=LBA+mode

But seeing as how I was so much help before, the answer is prolly something else :P

[Mr. Mulder]

Right, tried installing again (this time will a smaller partition) and this time, our old friend Mr. Blue Screen said "Check With Your Vender For Any Hardware Updates, Disable BIOS Memory Options Such As Caching or shadowing. If you need to use safe mode to..." and so on :frusty:

been at this for awhile now, I'll be back tomorrow morning if anyone would like to leave a suitable solution :naughty: ebuyer, btw, have already RMA'd it and asked for it to be sent :01:


SnnY, just saw your post, I'll look into that in the morning thnx :01:

[Mr. Mulder]

Morning Gents http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v661/mrmulder/hat3mk.gif

Just looked through all of the BIOS and didn't see an option for LBA anywhere :unsure:

[Mr. Mulder]

I seriously think it's the BIOS chip, somehow :unsure: The blue screen messages are varied and suggest options that can only be done with Windows installed (Like running in Safe Mode).

But, on the POST screen, everything checks out since flashing the BIOS, but that's not to say the chip still isn't damaged right?

(I've only got today left to work on this :ermm: )

[Snee]

If possible you should really test the drive (and maybe the sticks) in another machine.

It's frikkin hard to rule things out when you don't know if the stuff worked to begin with.

I don't suppose you have a knoppix-disk lying around, btw? If so you could boot from that and see if you get any hardware errors.

[Mr. Mulder]

there's no other machine that the sticks could be tested in :no: someones bringing over an old base unit later on, so the CD/HDD can be tested.

Linux you say? haven't got any distros to hand, but i'll d/l a copy of Kanotix and give it ago :01:

[Snee]

http://www.knoppix.org/

^my favourite.


I've used it before on buggered machines.

If the hd is working, and the partition is good it'll pop up in knoppix.

If you get any errors during bootup those could tell you something about your hardware. It's worth trying imo.

[Mr. Mulder]

Bah, I'm calling it a day - it's too fecking hot :no: It'll be two or three weeks till I can fit the new mobo, so until then... :ermm:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v661/mrmulder/quality.jpg

for no reason other than there was a webcam near by, and it looks fecking hawt, a pic of the current set-up :01:

[Mr. Mulder]

Well the new motherboard came, I installed it and big fucking suprise it doesn't fucking work! :angry:

Everything but the CPU has been tested, from all this, does it sound like the CPU could cause it all? :ermm:

[Snee]

Did you flash the new one too?

[Mr. Mulder]

yeah i flashed it real nice :dry:

[Snee]

And I suppose you've still got no other processor to try? :unsure:


Sucky situation you've got there.

[Mr. Mulder]

could it be the processor? :mellow:

[Mr. Mulder]

do you really think it's worth sending the processor back? i've got limited experience with processor problems and wouldn't know what the symptoms would be :unsure:

[Snee]

Feck knows, I've never had one fail on me.

In fact I've never had a machine work as badly as hers does, from the get-go.
Ones I put together usually (always, really) work, at least until I get experimental.

(see other thread for examples of me getting experimental)


It had to be something other than the mobo as it keeps doing it, that much is certain.
Unless those PCchips mobos are so crap that they can't handle what they are supposed to. You could call the people you ordered it from and ask them what they think.

Also, I'd have thought they tested the mobo before they sent you a new one. That's how my supplier does regarding RMAs.

[Mr. Mulder]

“Beware that the SiS748 chipset does not support AGP 1x and 2x graphics cards which require 3.3V. Only the 1.5V cards can be used. I only discovered this after I bought a motherboard with this chipset and then discovered my graphics card runs at 3.3V, although this information is not easy to find.”

Just saw this review for teh mobo, could the graphics card be messing everything up?

We have Radeon 7000 64MB AGP DDR TV-Out, can't find teh voltage anywhere :unsure:

[Snee]

http://www.ertyu.org/~steven_nikkel/agpcompatibility.html
^re: agp cards.


That tells you the voltage, but the best way to make sure that it has nothing to do with your graphics card is to try another one, of course.

[clocker]

Your card....

Radeon® 7000 / Radeon® VE
Specifications
System requirements
Pentium® 4/III/II/Celeron™, AMD® K6/Duron/Athlon®/Athlon XP or compatible with AGP 2.0 Compliant BUS- AGP 2X (3.3V), AGP 4X (1.5V), or AGP2X/4X based systems
Pentium® 4/III/II/Celeron™, AMD® K6/Duron/Athlon®/Athlon XP or compatible with PCI universal slot
We recently dealt with a new build that exhibited behaviour similar to yours.
After replacing the board AND processor, the tech finally swapped out the vid card (which had already POSTed in a different PC) and the problem was solved.
My first NF3 DFI LanParty motherboard refused to POST with a ATI 9600XT installed...a card which still lives on in my father's machine.

The point being that yes, video cards can seriously screw up your diagnostics.
Your best and easiest next move might be to install an old PCI vid card and see what happens.
That way you have bypassed the AGP bus altogether and can go from there.

[Mr. Mulder]

The graphics card is sounding more and more like the culprit, the blue screens occur in safe mode just before the logon screen, after the text commands have gone, and in normal mode, almost instantly, which is right before the graphic windows boot screen appears

sounds about right, does it not? Cos all the blue screen messages have never once mentioned teh graphics?

[lynx]

Oh, if only I had remembered this earlier.

Now that you've mentioned the potential graphics card compatibility problem I remember having almost exactly the same problems just about 2½ years ago.

I spent about 2 weeks taking motherboards back to my supplier, and eventually got a different mobo. About a week later they announced an incompatibility between the mobo and the graphics card. I think that particular card was an 8500, but the incompatibility they announced was different. I think just about any Radeon card caused problems with that mobo, so you may find the same thing.

[Mr. Mulder]

Clocker and Lynx's stories have got me convinced it's the graphics card, We've just ordered a Inno3D GF2 MX400 64mb to replace the 7000 AGP, it will work :)

[clocker]

it will work :)
I admire your optimism.

Hope it is warrented.

[Mr. Mulder]

didn't work :)

[clocker]

Bummer, dude.

What now?

[Mr. Mulder]

i'm going to scoop out Scully's insides and use them :sadwalk:

[Mr. Mulder]

It was the graphics card(s), I had gotten two broken cards in a row :)

[tesco]

:lol: Shit luck.

So everything is finally up and running? :)

[Mr. Mulder]

Yeah all original parts plus the new card are up and running, i had to take it into a shop to find this out, came to £20 which I suppose isn't too bad compared to most places :ermm: bought a card of them for £40 too, so it's all sorted :01:

[tesco]

Yeah all original parts plus the new card are up and running, i had to take it into a shop to find this out, came to £20 which I suppose isn't too bad compared to most places :ermm: bought a card of them for £40 too, so it's all sorted :01:
SOmetimes that is easier, since they have extra parts to test with. ;)

[clocker]

SOmetimes that is easier, since they have extra parts to test with. ;)
Oh yes.
People calling for (free) telephone tech support always get pissed when I tell them to "swap out the PSU (or whatever the suspect part may be)" to see if that solves the problem.
"But...but, I don't have a spare power supply to stick in there!?"

"Gee.
Sucks to be you, hey?"