"Prophet Mohammed Lovers"

:lol: Indeed.

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Originally Posted by S3v3N

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Indeed, you have an open mind.

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open minded doesn't mean that i have to approve every thing that is said .

what he said was totally wrong , and i read the article he referred to and it doesn't say nothing or prove anything and there is no evidence that it's true .
i hope the German scientist publish what he finds and tell us the differences between the copy he found and the known Koran if it's true .

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For what I said to be "totally wrong" the work on the Yemen documents would have to show an exact match to modern copies. The article and others I have seen suggest otherwise. It may be that the differences are not large. In works on Christian texts the general argument is that the message is not substantially different and therefore variations do not matter. I am reasonably confident that if earlier versions of the Koran are shown to be a little different there will be

1) shock
2) re-appraisal of the new texts
3) a realisation that nothing much has changed
4) Islam will just carry on pretty much as before
5) Some Moslems might go traditional and say they like the older one better.

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Originally Posted by Biggles

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Originally Posted by S3v3N

open minded doesn't mean that i have to approve every thing that is said .

what he said was totally wrong , and i read the article he referred to and it doesn't say nothing or prove anything and there is no evidence that it's true .
i hope the German scientist publish what he finds and tell us the differences between the copy he found and the known Koran if it's true .

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For what I said to be "totally wrong" the work on the Yemen documents would have to show an exact match to modern copies. The article and others I have seen suggest otherwise. It may be that the differences are not large. In works on Christian texts the general argument is that the message is not substantially different and therefore variations do not matter. I am reasonably confident that if earlier versions of the Koran are shown to be a little different there will be

1) shock
2) re-appraisal of the new texts
3) a realisation that nothing much has changed
4) Islam will just carry on pretty much as before
5) Some Moslems might go traditional and say they like the older one better.

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Doesn't work with absolutes, mate. Even for the open-minded.

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Originally Posted by Mr JP Fugley

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Originally Posted by Biggles

For what I said to be "totally wrong" the work on the Yemen documents would have to show an exact match to modern copies. The article and others I have seen suggest otherwise. It may be that the differences are not large. In works on Christian texts the general argument is that the message is not substantially different and therefore variations do not matter. I am reasonably confident that if earlier versions of the Koran are shown to be a little different there will be

1) shock
2) re-appraisal of the new texts
3) a realisation that nothing much has changed
4) Islam will just carry on pretty much as before
5) Some Moslems might go traditional and say they like the older one better.

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Doesn't work with absolutes, mate. Even for the open-minded.

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I may be wrong but I suspect absolute may be relative if faced with an incontrovertible fact. The Church fathers thought Galileo a liability and his ideas faith shattering. However, the paradigm changed and the Church adapted effortlessly and even set up its own observatory. I predict that if earlier copies of the Koran are shown to have variations the Islamic scholars will take ownership and use them to teach with. After an initial wobble the wheel will continue to turn. Yes I know it is a shocking concept now but once absorbed people won't even think about it.

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Originally Posted by Biggles

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Originally Posted by Mr JP Fugley

Doesn't work with absolutes, mate. Even for the open-minded.

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I may be wrong but I suspect absolute may be relative if faced with an incontrovertible fact. The Church fathers thought Galileo a liability and his ideas faith shattering. However, the paradigm changed and the Church adapted effortlessly and even set up its own observatory. I predict that if earlier copies of the Koran are shown to have variations the Islamic scholars will take ownership and use them to teach with. After an initial wobble the wheel will continue to turn. Yes I know it is a shocking concept now but once absorbed people won't even think about it.

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In short, you feel that Islam may be going through it's "Galileo" moment and adapting itself to the modern World. If you are right we are witnesses to a seminal moment for a major religion. That would be pretty awesome.

Do you think the hierarchy are discussing this behind figurative closed doors and will only let the masses know when they have considered the full ramifications.

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Originally Posted by Mr JP Fugley

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Originally Posted by Biggles

I may be wrong but I suspect absolute may be relative if faced with an incontrovertible fact. The Church fathers thought Galileo a liability and his ideas faith shattering. However, the paradigm changed and the Church adapted effortlessly and even set up its own observatory. I predict that if earlier copies of the Koran are shown to have variations the Islamic scholars will take ownership and use them to teach with. After an initial wobble the wheel will continue to turn. Yes I know it is a shocking concept now but once absorbed people won't even think about it.

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In short, you feel that Islam may be going through it's "Galileo" moment and adapting itself to the modern World. If you are right we are witnesses to a seminal moment for a major religion. That would be pretty awesome.

Do you think the hierarchy are discussing this behind figurative closed doors and will only let the masses know when they have considered the full ramifications.

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Islamic scholars have the original copies of the documents discovered and are quietly working through them too and I think are in contact with the German University involved. It will undoubtedly be a slow process as the current view of the Koran doesn't allow for this sort of revision. However, in a world where everyone has access to the interwebs such information cannot be ignored lest others take ownership of the exposition of what reasonably they consider their texts - a far more intolerable outcome.

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Originally Posted by Biggles

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Originally Posted by Mr JP Fugley

In short, you feel that Islam may be going through it's "Galileo" moment and adapting itself to the modern World. If you are right we are witnesses to a seminal moment for a major religion. That would be pretty awesome.

Do you think the hierarchy are discussing this behind figurative closed doors and will only let the masses know when they have considered the full ramifications.

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Islamic scholars have the original copies of the documents discovered and are quietly working through them too and I think are in contact with the German University involved. It will undoubtedly be a slow process as the current view of the Koran doesn't allow for this sort of revision. However, in a world where everyone has access to the interwebs such information cannot be ignored lest others take ownership of the exposition of what reasonably they consider their texts - a far more intolerable outcome.

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So, if there is any dubiety they must claim it as their own, rather than leave it in the hand of the infidel. That makes sense, for pragmatic reasons if nothing else.

I believe we have done the same thing with the origins of the Bible and in particular the Gospels.

For religion to deny science is ludicrous.

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Originally Posted by Mr JP Fugley

For religion to deny science is ludicrous.

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what about science denying religion

science never denied religion , our religion encourage us to search in all matters of science , besides that there r many scientific discoveries in koran as:
1- god told us that the moon was split into haves equally from 1400 year and from short time USA discovered that the moon was split into two parts and who wants to know may visit nasa site

Do what? :blink: