Why is everyone against traders?

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Originally Posted by AkaiDoresu

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Originally Posted by Cheeseman1208

So your calling the people who would rather make friends than sell their soul to trading "loosers"? Am I not getting something? Trading is not only a threat to the site's security, but it's a slap in the face to the community as well.

If you think about it, the concept of invitations has been perverted beyond what it started out as. It is meant to be a means of inviting friends, people you know and trust, not somebody who's bribing you with his own invites. For all you know, that person could be a cheater, scammer, or MPAA agent. You never know. And if you decided to trade your own accounts or invites, your putting your good name on the line in the process. If somebody you traded with, under your usual account name cheats, it'll be your head on the chopping-block. Same thing goes for invites. Call me what you will, but if you respect the nature of P2P communities in general, then you should be against trading.

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If there were no traders, MPAA would just come here, appear to be "good" and get your giveaways... If we come to the security matter than my friend the only safe way is inviting people that you know from real life... So dont blame traders, just don't..

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Wait a minute....

So trading prevents the MPAA from getting into sites? Ok, it's official. You've just won the "WTF" quote of the month. Please forward me a mailing address so I can send you your trophy.

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Originally Posted by psxcite

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Originally Posted by AkaiDoresu

If there were no traders, MPAA would just come here, appear to be "good" and get your giveaways... If we come to the security matter than my friend the only safe way is inviting people that you know from real life... So dont blame traders, just don't..

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Wait a minute....

So trading prevents the MPAA from getting into sites? Ok, it's official. You've just won the "WTF" quote of the month. Please forward me a mailing address so I can send you your trophy.

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ok can u say ur point nicely plz thanx:)

i am loving this thread lolz

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Originally Posted by psxcite

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Originally Posted by AkaiDoresu

If there were no traders, MPAA would just come here, appear to be "good" and get your giveaways... If we come to the security matter than my friend the only safe way is inviting people that you know from real life... So dont blame traders, just don't..

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Wait a minute....

So trading prevents the MPAA from getting into sites? Ok, it's official. You've just won the "WTF" quote of the month. Please forward me a mailing address so I can send you your trophy.

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lol. what i think he meant to say was that he thinks giveaways hurts just as much as trading so banning trading wouldn't do any good... correct me if i am wrong :)

well that is twisted logic if I ever heard it, why do the trackers, that you wish to join have rules against the trading of site invites or accounts? or is this just another thing that you do not factor into your view of the world Akaidoresu ?
There are many members here who are not here for the invites at all but the community, to make friends and to help people with their time or invites, I myself do not make giveaways, but invite people I think are worthy in private without any fanfare, and that is not even close to being my primary reason for participating here.
By treating the invites/accounts you hold as a marketable commodity you are going against the spirit of the communities that you belong to, just to get the next 'level' .
Why are so many invite systems closed now, with only the staff issuing invites ? because of the trading of a/c's and invites on the site which they are absolutely against, so trading is making it harder to belong to some communities. If you took the time to get to know people and become a valued member of the communities you belong to instead of treating each of them as a bargaining chip then you would become a member of the communities you wish to belong to with ease.
As to the general question as to why people are against traders, people who trade, either openly as traders or in private while pretending not to as 'anti-traders' bring about far more scamming and hit & running in the community because once you have traded off that well buffered tracker for the next one the next person inline who didnt really work to get that ratio or participate in the tracker is just going to leech the hell out of the buffer, suck it dry or suck what he wants out of it then flick it on, you treat the private communities like baseball cards THIS IS WRONG and against all the effort that the staff put in and the people who genuinely want to be a part of the community on that tracker.
It is the treating the tracker communities as a commodity which is wrong, which is against the spirit of sharing, and against all the hard work of the people that make an effort as staff or active members to make them a community.

never mind

trading will encourage hit and running ?
trading is a security risk ( seriously wtf )

people have traded a lot of TL accounts and invites here , did the quality of the site go down ? no

did they got shutdown by MPAA . no

its just hip to say trading sucks . thats all

just like some folks who think its hip to be high

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Originally Posted by Artemis

well that is twisted logic if I ever heard it, why do the trackers, that you wish to join have rules against the trading of site invites or accounts? or is this just another thing that you do not factor into your view of the world Akaidoresu ?
There are many members here who are not here for the invites at all but the community, to make friends and to help people with their time or invites, I myself do not make giveaways, but invite people I think are worthy in private without any fanfare, and that is not even close to being my primary reason for participating here.
By treating the invites/accounts you hold as a marketable commodity you are going against the spirit of the communities that you belong to, just to get the next 'level' .
Why are so many invite systems closed now, with only the staff issuing invites ? because of the trading of a/c's and invites on the site which they are absolutely against, so trading is making it harder to belong to some communities. If you took the time to get to know people and become a valued member of the communities you belong to instead of treating each of them as a bargaining chip then you would become a member of the communities you wish to belong to with ease.
As to the general question as to why people are against traders, people who trade, either openly as traders or in private while pretending not to as 'anti-traders' bring about far more scamming and hit & running in the community because once you have traded off that well buffered tracker for the next one the next person inline who didnt really work to get that ratio or participate in the tracker is just going to leech the hell out of the buffer, suck it dry or suck what he wants out of it then flick it on, you treat the private communities like baseball cards THIS IS WRONG and against all the effort that the staff put in and the people who genuinely want to be a part of the community on that tracker.
It is the treating the tracker communities as a commodity which is wrong, which is against the spirit of sharing, and against all the hard work of the people that make an effort as staff or active members to make them a community.

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Very well stated.

Absolutely agree!

Simple answer - tracker rules forbid account trading, some allow invite trading.

Respect the tracker, respect your inviter, the person who invited YOU to the tracker, not some joe down the road 2 months later because you don't like nor care for the tracker anymore, if you do not want it due to it not meeting your needs anymore (or as many say here "I have a better tracker" - like define better?? - higher up the ranking thread you mean?), then let it expire in accordance with the tracker rules, it is rude, damned rude, to pass that tracker on to someone else, especially someone who the inviter may have a severe dislike to anyway and wouldn't have given him an invite if he was the last person on earth!

How about I invited you to a tracker, and 2 months later dropped you a PM to see how you were getting on:

"Hi John, how are you, how are you liking the tracker so far, good isn't it?"

The reply:

"Wtf are you, my name is is not John and gtf out of my inbox and leave me alone while I buffer this account to hand it over to someone else for something bigger & better on that rankings list"

I think I would be rather pissed off with that, wouldn't you??

SgtMajor LOL u scared the crap out of me but I recognize there is a good reason to be scared.

I notice that most of the responses here like yours masterbat concentrate on one small area of argument yet do not approach the fundamental whole of the argument as in my one, you just pick and choose the parts to debate , without looking at the complete argument.
To reply to the small part of the debate that you picked on, once you have traded your buffered a/c can you guarantee it will not be used to hit & run, do you even care what happens to the a/c once it passes out of your hands?
And yes a/c trading has degraded the quality of TL since that is the site you have chosen to select, right now there is a huge purge going on on the site because of an active invite selling ring, selling being the next step to trading.........

SgtMajor- I've been part of several torrent sites, but I've never seen one that allowed any kind of trading whatsoever.

Giveaways are kind of okay though since you're not getting anything in return, but people are still banned from trackers because of giving away invites. So don't say that trading isn't allowed but giving them away in giveaways is. Tracker invites are meant for your close, trusted friends (supposedly), not random strangers on the internet whose closest thing you have to trust usually is their word, ratio proofs, and speed tests.

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Originally Posted by virtus134

SgtMajor- I've been part of several torrent sites, but I've never seen one that allowed any kind of trading whatsoever.

Giveaways are kind of okay though since you're not getting anything in return, but people are still banned from trackers because of giving away invites. So don't say that trading isn't allowed but giving them away in giveaways is. Tracker invites are meant for your close, trusted friends (supposedly), not random strangers on the internet whose closest thing you have to trust usually is their word, ratio proofs, and speed tests.

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There's a thread in the invites section where it lists a host of trackers that allow invite trading, or just don't care either way, the classic always off the top of my head is Oink - it encouraged invite trading of its own and other sites, so maybe they got what was coming?

I'm not too worried about invites, but I really, really detest account trading, and I never mentioned giveaways, but those that know me know I look out for those actually wanting a tracker for a reason, and some sites rules are against giveaways of their invites anyway (SCT, SCC etc), so the bottom line is always respect the tracker rules, give them the respect they deserve and you will get the respect back by doing so, and those invites that come with respect will do you proud, much more so than by trading your way in.

virtus134, elektronik allows account/invite trade (was stated by a elektronik community rep here at FST)

most of the tracker do not ban users for invite giveaway neither they have rules stating invites are meant for "trusted friend"...yet, there are plenty of bittorrent communities /tracker where invite giveaway isn't allowed either.

The whole point should not be "trader vs anti-trader" rather as already stated...it's about respecting tracker rules.

edit: sarge beat me again =/

ok noob question why trackers in the beginning open sign up to every one its could be cheater or scammer or even agient and the tracker staff even dont care about that and when the tracker starting doing well and find out there is demand thay just looking for the security and be careful of tradeing invites or accounts or selling them or what ever as i said i just need to know why its noob question

Okay that's probably the only thing that I can agree with.

Giving away invites abides more with tracker rules then trading them. At least that gives me some insight.

Oh and when I made this thread I wanted it to tell me why most people are against trading, for it to be over 5 pages long, and start an argument. It has done all 3. Yes. That's awesome.

@ supper, lol it isn't noob question.

At beginning for most new tracker # of registered user plays significant role. However, when their demand increases...they can always purge inactive account, hunt down cheater and scammer. BTW, i do believe cheater and scammer (not plenty though) are needed for a tracker...perhaps to alert the staff and make improvement in their security and stuff.

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Originally Posted by squirr3l

@ supper, lol it isn't noob question.

At beginning for most new tracker # of registered user plays significant role. However, when their demand increases...they can always purge inactive account, hunt down cheater and scammer. BTW, i do believe cheater and scammer (not plenty though) are needed for a tracker...perhaps to alert the staff and make improvement in their security and stuff.

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:Dthank you squirr3l all clear now:happy:

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Originally Posted by virtus134

Okay that's probably the only thing that I can agree with.

Giving away invites abides more with tracker rules then trading them. At least that gives me some insight.

Oh and when I made this thread I wanted it to tell me why most people are against trading, for it to be over 5 pages long, and start an argument. It has done all 3. Yes. That's awesome.

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lol what do you expect these threads always do that...:01:

Yea i agree with SgtMAjor cannot stand account traders. They make it bad for everyone, alot of sites moved to invite only due to that and the ultimate effect that could come. A crackdown. You may have better offers to give but have you really earned your way or respect at that?

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Originally Posted by SgtMajor

Simple answer - tracker rules forbid account trading, some allow invite trading.

Respect the tracker, respect your inviter, the person who invited YOU to the tracker, not some joe down the road 2 months later because you don't like nor care for the tracker anymore, if you do not want it due to it not meeting your needs anymore (or as many say here "I have a better tracker" - like define better?? - higher up the ranking thread you mean?), then let it expire in accordance with the tracker rules, it is rude, damned rude, to pass that tracker on to someone else, especially someone who the inviter may have a severe dislike to anyway and wouldn't have given him an invite if he was the last person on earth!

How about I invited you to a tracker, and 2 months later dropped you a PM to see how you were getting on:

"Hi John, how are you, how are you liking the tracker so far, good isn't it?"

The reply:

"Wtf are you, my name is is not John and gtf out of my inbox and leave me alone while I buffer this account to hand it over to someone else for something bigger & better on that rankings list"

I think I would be rather pissed off with that, wouldn't you??

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:cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry:

oh noes!! im devastated!!

I dont trade at all, Mostly due to the sites asking people not to :-\ I dont want a ban from a site.

most people here have summed it up nicely. i thought the guy who said the people who dont trade do it because they dont have anything was rather funny.

Mate if I throw a party and there's room for 200 people and I invite you, it's not nice from you to talk to the first person you cross on the street and tell him "I got this invite for XXX party, give me 10 bucks and you are in" Because of the fact that I invited YOU not someone you want. (and the matter of inviting an stranger is worse). bye

ps : definitely my english sucks

If anyone here was truly worried about the welfare of a tracker, why would you participate in forums like this. Half of the trackers I have, I never heard of till I read about it at a forum just like this one. You guys with your "its against the rules" , "respect the tracker". Lmao wtf!!! Stop bitching here and go to the tracker that you so treasure and participate in their forums and stop advertising to the world every detail of every tracker on the internet.

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Originally Posted by virtus134

So if I'm going to become a "second class citizen" just because I traded and I'm never going to be respected / participate in really good giveaways, I'm not even going to try and bother to do anything good here. I'm just going to trade, get what I need, and log out.

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Not sure why but had to quote this.

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Originally Posted by sear

Bullshit...first off they're not giveaway points they are rep points. which means they in practice have little to do with giveaways and much more to do with whether you're a "trusted trader" or not.

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They were changed to BT Rep since most rep comes from giveaways and not from trades so this isnt accurate.

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Originally Posted by Dr_Green_Thumb

Some trader probably traded with an agent giving them access to the site to gather information.

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Lets not go there.

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Originally Posted by pro267

Now we're at the next stage where people go around with a "first make friends then ask for level X" sort of thing

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These things change and as time goes on things balance themselves.

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Originally Posted by squirr3l

FST itself has hidden group for hardcore traders. Meanwhile they do also have hidden group for extreme anti-trader.

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The intent is to create a balance.

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But then i suppose everyone has FREE WILL and right to SPEAK WHATEVER THEY WANT

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Well generally at FST this true.

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Originally Posted by squirr3l

The ONLY reason trading should be discouraged is because the site does not allow it. IF the site allows it (there are plenty who do) then go for it!

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This is rather straight forward isnt it.

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Originally Posted by MrLazy

Im personally not against it, but i certainly do not like it .. since most trackers don't allow their invites/ accounts to be traded. I'm just respecting the tracker and their policies, thats all.

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If your referring to invites might be argued most dont have issue what you do with them. If a tracker has invites and gives them to you perhaps they should trust what you do with them. If they dont then perhaps they shouldnt have them.

Most trackers give invites as reward for ratios and similar and are well aware enough of their members will trade them. To some of the tracker staff this isnt an issue as it grows the site which is why they have invites to begin with...

Trading should be held as moral and honest when without scammers because of the implication of trading invites value-for-value.

To be against traders is to be against the free market. :angry:

i sometimes find it very amusing, when traders realize, that they reached the end of their blind alley.
they tried so hard, got scammed, banned and broke every tracker's rule just to find out that they won't get into the tracker they want by trading.

that must be so frustrating.


so here's a message to all newcomers who read this thread:

-wanna get into the greatest and best sites in the whole bittorrent world?
-wanna be a member of sites that every stupid trader dreams about?

here's the solution:

don't trade!

even those trackers and communities you think are impossible to get in are looking for good and trustworthy new members all the time.

if you trade and break rules you will never get there - never!

I thought I would leave this thread after my earlier posts but here is a perfect example of what I was explaining helpfully colored in red to highlight it, how exactly did tracker invites become a commodity to be traded in a 'free market' ?

That is truly pathetic......

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Originally Posted by Ænima

Trading should be held as moral and honest when without scammers because of the implication of trading invites value-for-value.

To be against traders is to be against the free market. :angry:

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dont trade . its against the tracker rules , simple as that .. just follow the rules , consider that as a way to say "thank you" to the trackers that let you download stuff for free

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Originally Posted by blackbird

dont trade . its against the tracker rules , simple as that .. just follow the rules , consider that as a way to say "thank you" to the trackers that let you download stuff for free

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well actually we should say thank you to the uploaders (or the scene:happy:) as well as the tracker, but the uploaders are giving us the free stuff

When I don't need acc because of not use I give it sb who want for free so is this trade ?

When I don't need acc because of not use I give it sb who want for free so is this trade ?

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Originally Posted by Artemis

I thought I would leave this thread after my earlier posts but here is a perfect example of what I was explaining helpfully colored in red to highlight it, how exactly did tracker invites become a commodity to be traded in a 'free market' ?

That is truly pathetic......

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Originally Posted by Ænima

Trading should be held as moral and honest when without scammers because of the implication of trading invites value-for-value.

To be against traders is to be against the free market. :angry:

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Lol.....

So you think torrent sites are commodities that are bought, sold, and traded on a free market?

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Originally Posted by kyrcer

When I don't need acc because of not use I give it sb who want for free so is this trade ?

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why dont u just delete your account. or let it be disabled because of inactivity. these days even if you give away an account to someone its will get disabled anyway. why risk getting your inviter into trouble?

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Originally Posted by Ænima

Trading should be held as moral and honest when without scammers because of the implication of trading invites value-for-value.

To be against traders is to be against the free market. :angry:

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Originally Posted by squirr3l

When you sign up for a tracker, you tick the checkbox saying “I agree with rules and agreement” and one of the rule is not to trade invite/account (for most of the tracker)

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1o I don't see ANY morality in breaking rules of something you are feeding upon.

2o And honesty? Tracker give you invite to invite people, not to trade 'em.

When you say "free market" You realize that you are comparing internet to real life? And...you realize it's not really free because tracker staff are chasing after you?

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Originally Posted by squirr3l

And if you are to pull that out into “real” world it’s like trading cocaine and guns illegally. Okay, i hyped it a bit :D

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wow this thread is really raging like a fire. i really dont see the point. i seriously doubt if any traders are gonna stop trading or any anti-traders are gonna become traders. everybody is gonna stay the same, but only be more bitter with each other. i have my own set of views but i rather not add fuel to the fire. it would be really wise to close this thread.
besides no one here has their lives depending on torrents :D

Nobody like traders cause invites are meant to be free and in the end, all account will be disabled.

People take the "level" of trackers way too literally, and it really gets ridiculous, to the point of threads in the invite sections where the OP says something like "I have level 4, I need any level 5" wtf is this?!

These "levels" have given trackers some kind of (fake) value, and people think they're in the stock market in here, signing up on "lower levels", buffering them so they gain some value, then trade for the next level and repeat the process... it's sad really.

People forget that these are communities. You can find almost every file everywhere, so why are people trading to get these "high level" trackers? just so they can put a new nice little user bar in their sig, and feel above others (again, just sad).

They don't care for the community (and that's obvious, since they will be using the account of another person, which is extremely bizarre if you're interested in participating in a community), and they continue the stock market game breaking trackers' rules.

Invites are meant to be given for free, to someone you trust and consider will be an asset to the community where you're already a member. Traders just don't care about that, they think about invites and accounts as pokemon cards, to collect and feel special.. they compromise the security of trackers.

(oh, and for those who say that every non-trader is against trading because they don't have anything to trade, or they traded in the past and now don't have the need to trade, or trade with another account... well, I will just say that that is a very pathetic way of justifying what you do)

Remember: these are communities. make friends, participate in the forums/irc, follow trackers' rules and you will never have to trade for anything.

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Originally Posted by Polarbear

i sometimes find it very amusing, when traders realize, that they reached the end of their blind alley.
they tried so hard, got scammed, banned and broke every tracker's rule just to find out that they won't get into the tracker they want by trading.

that must be so frustrating.


so here's a message to all newcomers who read this thread:

-wanna get into the greatest and best sites in the whole bittorrent world?
-wanna be a member of sites that every stupid trader dreams about?

here's the solution:

don't trade!

even those trackers and communities you think are impossible to get in are looking for good and trustworthy new members all the time.

if you trade and break rules you will never get there - never!

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If you have a fast connection and can buffer enough accounts it is easy to get all the trackers you want through trading.
I stopped trading not because I reached the end of a blind alley or because I couldn't get the accounts I wanted.
My problem with trading in the end was that I never really felt comfortable with the accounts themselves. If I had a traded account I was stuck with whatever username it came with and for me 'Fuckdiebitch' wasn't a name I wanted people to know me by.
If the account came from an invite then 6 months down the line, when I have happily built up a nice buffer, the account gets banned because the guy who gave me the invite gets caught trading. Then there is the previous owner of the account who decides he wants it back etc.