Busy, seriously, stop pretending you don't get it.
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Busy, seriously, stop pretending you don't get it.
Well, duh.Quote:
Originally Posted by Busyman
You asked what an American ego film was - so I explained that it was a film that appealed to the average American's sense of national pride.
You asked how they did that, so I said they glorify American heros, steal other countries heros or make them up.
Now you're asking if it's the same for other countries --- YES!!
Is this the ask stupid questions thread or what.
If a film portrays British soldiers in a good light, doing something glorious - then it appealing to the British sense of national pride, it's a British ego movie.
Holy Chebus. Just how obvious are the answers to the questions that you're asking.
Why? There's nothing bad in it - unless it's done inaccurately. Covering an actual hero in glory using the medium of film is great. I've no problems whatsoever, I don't even mind a bit of creative licence. Even making heros up is fine; superheros, for example. Great entertainment.Quote:
Originally Posted by Busyman
Excepting U571, I'm not saying it's a bad thing, I'm just answering your dumbass questions.
manker, sometimes there's another thing, which I reckon is what really would annoy some people:
When they do everything you say, and at the same time manage to portray the rest of the world as a bunch of helpless lamers or something.
I don't care about so much about americans being portrayed as supermen, if it's that stupid I just won't watch it, but when they make the rest of the world look like a bunch of helpless losers in need of saving, it can be a bit annoying.
Like in ID4 for instance.
Having some character in a movie hold some peptalk, or speech, about how great america is without it really being necessary for the plot is kinda' silly too.
Sure, I guess that adds up to being an American ego movie too.Quote:
Originally Posted by SnnY
I've never watched Independence Day or ID4 - tbh, I've never watched a film that does that but I'm sure they exist.
I really don't watch that many films :D
Quote:
Originally Posted by Busyman
Excepting U571, I'm not saying it's a bad thing, I'm just answering your dumbass questions.[/QUOTE]Quote:
Originally Posted by manker
Really?
If you haven't noticed smartguyansweringquestions, people from other countries seem to have a problem with it.
Point is fuck off then. :dry:
They seem to have a problem when an American is portrayed as a superhero and their country didn't find way kill an alien or some shit.
So well duh doesn't cut it seeing that we don't look at a movie protraying their conutrymen in a somewhat good light as a insertcountryhere glorification movie...an actual genre.
Chebus, are you that stupid or what?
:lol: :lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by SnnY
@manker- Case in point above
Since you haven't seen ID4 mank....America happens to figure out how to destry the ships and relays the information to the other countries.
A fella commits suicide by ramming the ship in vulnerable spot...oh and we upload a Windows virus into an alien computer. :lol: :lol: :dry:
So 'cause we so-called, figured it out, BAMMMM, American ego movie...
Oh wait while we're fighting the President says something about God and country to rally the troops....not really necessary fighting a war. I think I heard a peptalk in National Lampoon's Van Wilder too.
That makes a whole genre and shit.
Do me a favour, arse.Quote:
Originally Posted by Busyman
Just answer me with respect to what I post. I can't be held accountable for what others think.
I already said I don't have a problem with American ego movies unless they're stealing heros from other countries.
I answered your dumbass questions with answers even a child could comprehend.
Am I mistaken when I presume that you understand them.
I found ID4 to be jingoistic but that was not the film's only problem, it required a large dose of suspended disbelief for it to make sense, Jeff Goldblum and Will Smith suck. The special effects were crappy and overused as well imo.
Would have been funny if the French had saved the world (and America) at the end.
Teh fook, I've just imdb'd it.Quote:
Originally Posted by manker
ID4 = Independence day.
Fecking elitist bar-stewards, stop trying to confuse me :D
Look, we all know ID4 is (bad) sci-fi, but that is just crazy-talk. :dry:Quote:
Originally Posted by Withcheese
Nuh uh :1eye:Quote:
Originally Posted by manker
And damnit at least insult me with an insult that's insulting. Arse? :lol: :lol:
The fuck off comment was meant for others mmk? I should have said "they should fuck off then".
Besides that, fuck your respect since want to go there....
Ya don't like Weebl and you are ok with American glorification movies....
Your European card is revoked.
Arse just seemed fitting, insults are not my strong point.
Being right is. I'm damn good at that ... oh, you already know :schnauz:
Now come on man...Quote:
Originally Posted by Withcheese
We can upload a Windows viruses into an alien computer.
Fly a crop duster into a spaceship to destroy it.
Aliens can give the President their plans to kill human kind...by a flash of psychicness.
A dog can avoid nuclear destruction by jumping through a door and teh nuclearness goes past himnotenterthedoor.
Come on man...really come on.
Me three, I mean me too. :unsure:Quote:
Originally Posted by manker
Insults are a strong point of mine especially when you must deal with hecklers in a crowded room with all eyes on you.
They get to sit in the dark spouting insults.
I understand arse is an insult over in the UK but to most (I'm guessing)Americans it amounts to being called "a big ole doodyhead".
I have very thick skin so please do better. :dry:
How is that case in point for you?Quote:
Originally Posted by Busyman
That movie was one big America>everyone else statement.
"You" didn't just call it, in fact, the only time the rest of the world mattered in that movie was when America spread its wisdom to all the others. And everyone was oh so grateful.
It was pretty fooking lame, 'k? And the president did the silly speech thing too.
The movie was lame besides the very beginning when everything was destroyed.Quote:
Originally Posted by SnnY
Other than that, you must have an inferiority complex.
Besides the very beginning, where did the movie take place?
America?
America "spread it's wisdom" (funny you look at it that way) when it found out how to destroy the spaceships. Basically you got a problem with America telling everyone else or simply that we found out, mostly likely first. :(
It sound like some countries must have thanked us in the movie since you said they were so grateful. :ohmy:
Oh yeah the President did a speech when talking to his higher ups and fucking troops before going into a fucked up battle. That was totally unwarranted. :1eye:
Why didn't he STFU it was only the human race they were fighting for. :wacko:
Busyman why you representing america?Dont you know this country hates "us"
Well, I don't have to insult you with silly names. I'll stick to being really fucking sarcastic and/or condescending, if that's okay.Quote:
Originally Posted by Busyman
I don't know, I just think it's more effective.
Btw, I laugh out loud every time you allude to being a stand up comic IRL. Unfortunately that's about the only time I do when reading what you write.
Upload one of your acts, if you don't I'll be forced to conclude that either your act is shit - or that you're full of it :D
@busy: Actually, I don't think you get what I'm saying, or that you are being dense on purpose.
The scenes from the rest of the world were only there to show how helpless the rest of the world was. The entire thing is written to make Americans feel good about america.
And the speech, it's stupid, pointless, and ultra-patriotic.
Now, I don't fucking care if you thought it was good, or if you like other unlikely nonsense, I'm not even making a value statement about what I think about american patriotism in movies (I do have a problem if it's done at the expense of the rest of the world, tho').
What I'm saying is that ID4 is ultra-patriotic, and that it glorifies America, it even goes so far as to turn america into some kind of savior for all of mankind.
Oh yeah, and it's very obvious in this, and that it's badly written.
I don't have an inferiority complex, but I think you might. Trying to make this about America (trying to tell people what to do, or whatever), and not crappy patriotic movies :rolleyes:
'k, thanks, now shut the hell up.
Uh...I don't care. :dry:Quote:
Originally Posted by manker
I'll never reveal who I am or what I look like.
I just can't. I'm on here 'cause of boredom at work or between thoughts while on the keys and that's all. :dry:
Btw I like condescending too but when you say shit like "arse" it's like being called a newspaper. I keep forgetting that you guys don't actually pronounce it "arse" but "oss" which actually sounds more like our insult of "ass". We see it though and pronounce it how it's actually spelled and it is rather funny.
edit: I may upload a vid but it would be as anonymous spam. Mmk? :lol: :lol:
I'd love to see that vid - no shit :D
Btw, I pronounce arse like this: r-sss
r = the letter 'r' or the word 'are'
ss = like wot a snake does.
Not 'oss' :blink:
worst movie ever
Here's the thing (oh damn, forgot to STHU :pinch: ).Quote:
Originally Posted by SnnY
ID4 does suck. I said it did (besides the beginning).
You do have an inferiority complex.
The scenes of rest of world are just like one's in America....aliens blowing LANDMARKS up and not about making foreign countries look bad ya nutjob.
America is fighting a war smartguy. There's like a whole military thing going on and what not.
The entire movie was written to make money. I didn't walk away feeling good about America.
I was glad that they kicked the aliens ass with a Windows virus, a crop duster, and I could leave the theater. :dry:
also heard this movie wasting quite a bit of millions of dollars
Oh my bad. Maybe when I was hearing 'oss' they were saying 'ass' then. :unsure:Quote:
Originally Posted by manker
Ahhh....accents accents.
:lol:
Ah, to live in busyland where everything that doesn't fit in with your opinions doesn't exist.
I don't know how you could happen to miss out on that movie being ultra-patriotic, or how you can avoid seeing how the scenes involving the rest of the world at the end of the movie was a plot device to make america look good. But I do know that the only one who has a problem is you.
FFS, this entire argument came into existance 'cos some kid said he thought the movie stealth was patriotic/glorifying america. You didn't have to take it personally or as a comment about your country per se, nor did you need to do the same about any of the posts saying that one movie or another is patriotic, yet you do. Paranoia or inferiority complex, I dunno' what is your problem, but you are damned sensitive, finding arguments everywhere.
It ain't the first time I heard similar "patriotic" stuff about American movies or the fact that "their" country wasn't in it or how everyone has an American accent.Quote:
Originally Posted by SnnY
It's weird that American don't have the same issues with foreign films.
WhyTF isn't James Bond American? Why is that Brit the one always saving the world?
Also...
of course it has patriotism..it's a movie involving the military and the President ffs. :lol: :lol:
Now go watch
Patriot Games
Clear and Present Danger
Full Metal Jacket
Air Force One
or even Starship Troopers.... :lol: :lol:
You don't speak for America though, only yourself. Besides, Hollywood is more likely to remake a foreign film than actually allow another culture's film at their cinemas/on DVD. That or heavily edit it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Busyman
The Britishishness of James Bond is very much tongue in cheek. As opposed to the cloying patriotism extolled in films like ID4.Quote:
WhyTF isn't James Bond American? Why is that Brit the one always saving the world?
yea, I can't stand James Bond. Highly doubt a Brit can do that :dry:
ID4 involves war and soldiers though. My reference to JB was tongue and cheek.Quote:
Originally Posted by Withcheese
Why do you think Hollywood remakes some foreign films? Do actually think it's about "not allowing another culture" into our cinemas?
Do you actually think we don't like subtitled movies in our cinemas 'cause we have a reading problem?
Hollywood is out to make money plain and simple.
I remember the movie Fatal Attraction had this shit ending for European cinemas (or was it just France) where instead of having the actionesque fight where Glen Close gets shot, they have this boring scene where she commits suicide alone in her bathroom.
I personally don't like the cinema for dramas. I like comdedies, horror, action, and sci-fi. Many folks that I know want to be wowed when at the cinema. I don't the cinema and surround sound to be "culturally enriched".
Tbh, for the most part. Independence Day was entertaining when I saw it, although it was a downhill ride. Now though, if I ever watch it, it is to the destruction of all those landmarks....basically a video clip.
An entertaining movie through and through would be Aliens but that has patriotism too. Hell it does have the Marines fighting in it.
We just look at it as the Marines in the future and not "the US is the best and PWNS!!111OMG lOL!11!".
I like James Bond.Quote:
Originally Posted by maebach
My favorite was Roger Moore though. Alot of other I know liked Sean Connery the best.
It's kinda messed up that Pierce Brosnan doesn't want to do it anymore. Wtf else does he have to do?
I would like to have seen Clive Owen but alas they seem to have someone else in mind.
It wouldn't be if it's common, now would it?Quote:
Originally Posted by Busyman
'sides, I don't have a problem with my country not being in the movie :blink:
What I am saying is that the writer only put people from the rest of the world in there to show how it was saved by America, there really wasn't another reason for it.
All of those people just sat there when the phone rang and the americans had solved it.
It's obvious and fairly pointless.
Like cheebus said, a lot of movies and tv-series are remade into american versions.Quote:
It's weird that American don't have the same issues with foreign films.
It's like "coupling", the original version was already in English, but the accents were wrong or something, so there had to be an american version.
I think, but this is just a personal opinion, that Americans seem to have a lot of trouble with foreign movies.
What has that have to do with whether stealth, or ID4 are what they are or not?Quote:
WhyTF isn't James Bond American? Why is that Brit the one always saving the world?
And he usually works with people from all over, so he usually has help from a couple of other nationalities, and he's just one bloke doing it, it's not really exclusively about Britain or anything.
I daresay Bond-movies, even the old ones are a lot less patriotic/egocentric than ID4, for one thing there's not really any silly speeches about the greatness of britain :blink:
Yes, so it is patriotic :blink:Quote:
Also...
of course it has patriotism..it's a movie involving the military and the President ffs. :lol: :lol:
The point was that it's patriotic in such a way that it's stupid. Stupid american ego movie, and etc.
Why? :blink:Quote:
Now go watch
Patriot Games
Clear and Present Danger
Full Metal Jacket
Air Force One
or even Starship Troopers.... :lol: :lol:
Think I've seen them all, and while some kinda' suck, I don't really see what you are trying to accomplish with that suggestion.
EDit:
Didn't see them waving any flags or hold any speeches about how great america is.Quote:
We just look at it as the Marines in the future and not "the US is the best and PWNS!!111OMG lOL!11!".
Heck, I don't think they are supposed to be american :unsure:
It's not supposed to be based on a true story, you idiot.Quote:
Originally Posted by maebach
I barely even remember seeing another country except when everyone's landmarks were getting blown to shit.Quote:
Originally Posted by SnnY
Other than that after a crop duster destroyed a ship I think they showed ships going down all over the world.
The writer put the rest of the world in there 'cause the aliens were fighting the whole planet and to show landmarks. I can recall a nice backdrop of a downed ship in the desert for instance. You got it so twisted that you only see "Oh yeah, so America came up with teh solution :dry: ".
The movie takes place in America. It would be weird to have them just get a call from Japan telling them the solution. You gotta have them go through adversity and have the suicidal pilot figure it out. :lol: :lol: If it was based it France I would want the same thing since it takes place there.
Quote:
It's weird that Americans don't have the same issues with foreign films.
I've said that as well. With also said (like with Weebl) it's a cultural thing. White Americans are the most identifiable and make up most of our population. British accents are not easy to understand sometimes and subtitles tend to take away from an overall "wow" experience. Don't get me wrong. I've seen good movies with subtitles (like the Returner) but would I have preferred it in English (not dubbed)? Absolutely. Besides that, the Returner wasn't THAT good anyway. I've seen many more American sci-fi movies that trounce it.Quote:
Originally Posted by SnnY
Regarding the Coupling, Hollywood gets it wrong too. I mean the show, when brought here, might have done shit ratings, British or not. I've never cared to watch it personally.
Quote:
WhyTF isn't James Bond American? Why is that Brit the one always saving the world?
My mention of JB was bullshitting. However, movies cited you and others are usually involving military troops or an attack of one's country.Quote:
Originally Posted by SnnY
Quote:
Also...
of course it has patriotism..it's a movie involving the military and the President ffs. :lol:
Riiight. As I said the President shouldn't say shit to his troops. :huh:Quote:
Originally Posted by SnnY
Quote:
Now go watch
Patriot Games
Clear and Present Danger
Full Metal Jacket
Air Force One
or even Starship Troopers.... :lol: :lol:
Fun with PatriotismQuote:
Originally Posted by SnnY
Quote:
We just look at it as the Marines in the future and not "the US is the best and PWNS!!111OMG lOL!11!".
Maybe not. I thought the black sarge said "United States Marine Corps" and made a little speech about it being great to be in it. Maybe I got it wrong.Quote:
Originally Posted by SnnY
I remember a thread where someone mentioned the American flag falling down in Jurassic Park when the T-Rex roars near the end. They had something to say about America in that too. Jeez.
....and why can't a Brit do it anyway. :blink:Quote:
Originally Posted by manker
Do Brits have some type of bone marrow problem?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Busyman
Stop arguing with other people in different threads, it makes you sound mental :angry: :lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by Busyman
The only bits in the movie that featured actual people from other nations that did something, were the ones were they got the call, the whole thing gave the impression that everyone was helpless until america came and saved the day.Quote:
Originally Posted by Busyman
If it had been more than an excuse to show how america saved the world there would probably have been a few scenes showing what happened to people in the rest of the world, not just scenes of pyramids and whatnot being contrasted against spaceships for effect.
Like I said, it was pretty damned obvious those scenes were only there to show how america saved the world. And, yeah then you had a couple of downed saucers showing that the solution worked, but all in all it was a pretty pointless exercise, except for showing how america saved the world".
As for the speech, as far as I know it's entirely possible to rally the troops without spending a couple minutes talking about how great the yare as americans or something..
But then again, maybe it's impossible for americans to act without listening to some junk about how great their nation is for like five minutes first. I really wouldn't know about that.
EDit: actually, WRT the speech, I must have been thinking about some other part of the movie, or maybe another movie, 'cos the bit where he's trying to inspire the pilots is more cheesy than patriotic, or at least the part of the speech I can find online :blushing:
How come large parts of the world can handle subtitles just fine?Quote:
I've said that as well. With also said (like with Weebl) it's a cultural thing. White Americans are the most identifiable and make up most of our population. British accents are not easy to understand sometimes and subtitles tend to take away from an overall "wow" experience. Don't get me wrong.
I've never found them distracting, and the general consensus here, for adults anyway, is that movies in other languages should be subtitled rather than dubbed or remade.
In fact, a lot of people, me included, would prolly laugh their asses off if some muppet would do a remake of the ring in our language.
Remaking a movie to fit your culture or language is more than just a little bit pointless as you take away part of what makes it unique.
EDit: And it's pretty amazing how british accents can be hard to understand for people who live in a nation with more accents altogether than the whole of britain (I think :unsure: ).
If you can grasp texan, brooklyn accents and bostonian (or whatever it's called) the accents in coupling for instance should be a snap.
I don't think they are american, I think they are supposed to be troops for some future nation or possibly corporation. Weyland-Yulani, or is that in a later movie?Quote:
Maybe not. I thought the black sarge said "United States Marine Corps" and made a little speech about it being great to be in it. Maybe I got it wrong.
At any rate Alien is definietly not made in the same, stupidly patriotic, vein as ID4.
That's how you see it 'cause you have an inferiority complex. Many of us saw it and just saw it the desert as a backdrop. This is further pointed out as they rather exotic or recognizable locales...even the one's in America. :dry:Quote:
Originally Posted by SnnY
Americans in the military tend to hear that or the average joe might here it after a terrorist attack. Maybe the higher ups could trim down the rallying cry a bit. :mellow:Quote:
Originally Posted by SnnY
Quote:
I've said that as well. With also said (like with Weebl) it's a cultural thing. White Americans are the most identifiable and make up most of our population. British accents are not easy to understand sometimes and subtitles tend to take away from an overall "wow" experience. Don't get me wrong.
It's not a matter of handling it. To add to that...we don't have to handle it.Quote:
Originally Posted by SnnY
Some of them are hard to understand too. :angry:Quote:
Originally Posted by SnnY
Bostonian - "Get in da cah."
Quote:
Maybe not. I thought the black sarge said "United States Marine Corps" and made a little speech about it being great to be in it. Maybe I got it wrong.
They are the Marine Corps. Nuff said.Quote:
Originally Posted by SnnY
1. I don't have an inferiority complex. I haven't said they were saying or not saying anything about me personally, I was saying it was crappy writing.
I can't have an inferiority complex just because I'm saying a movie was stupid :huh:
It was just made in such a way that the rest of the world was used to show how great the heroes'/america's achievement look better, they didn't just save america, they saved everyone else.
Who otherwise didn't have a place in the plot.
Feck, it didn't hurt me none, it was just pointless as writing scenes go.
I never took it personally or anything, I just thought it was daft.
2. WRT the speech, I just edited in this:
I dunno' if that was another part of the movie or something, I've been surfing around and people (americans even) seem to think there was a patriotic speech in there, but I can't find it now.Quote:
EDit: actually, WRT the speech, I must have been thinking about some other part of the movie, or maybe another movie, 'cos the bit where he's trying to inspire the pilots is more cheesy than patriotic, or at least the part of the speech I can find online :blushing:
3. Btw, you aren't saying bostonians should be subtitled too are you? :unsure:
I can't help thinking people in the US would have a better ear for accents out of necessity as they have a lot of them, I'm a bit surprised by what you say, truth be told. (No criticism intended there.)
4. I'm pretty sure a lot of nations have troops based on naval vessels or whatever distinguishes marines from the regular infantry. Up until now I never really thought about Marines as uniquely american (what the word means, not the word in itself).
EDit: 5. "Handle" as in not having a problem with them. It really isn't an effort.
well unlike u guys, i have a life, and i don't spend 8 hours a day arguing in some forum about some stupid americanized movie...the point is...even tho the movie portray america in such a colorful, and dominating, might i add, way, the pilots in the movie showed good morals when they were ordered to destroy the nuclear warheads by disobeying a direct order from their commander. When the AI steal plane went out of control, they want to destroy it to protect mankind. It's all good storyingline, however, the other side of the movie showed just how patronizing americans can be, how powerful they are and struting around the world making fallacious claims that they are protecting world peace when in fact they are really not.
so fuck off when u americans see somebody making the alleged "racists" claims about american, there's always some truth in those claims. And you are just too american to see it.