*official Matrix Chat* Reloaded & Revolution Chat

another summary explanation, i like this one too, seems to fit close to my thoughts on the whole movie, etc.

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Another Explanation (by jw010)

"Basically the machines which represented by the ARCHITECH wrote the Matrix program in order to keep people (their crop) alive in sort of a dream state. (the presumption is that human can't live on without some sort of brain activity.) the first version written was a perfect world (mathetically perfect according to the Arch.) but was rejected by humans, because of the 'flaws' in human thinking/behavior, and creats too many 'anomalies'. and to improve the Matrix, two other programs was written/created, one was THE ORACLE, and the other one was THE ONE. they both work for THE MACHINE. the ORACLE, which the Arch. refers to as 'the mother of Matrix', her responsibility is to help humans be more acceptable to the Matrix. The ONE, i believe, is a program 'hardwired' into a real human being's brain. in this case, Neo. he should be a 1/2 human 1/2 program.

According to the Arch., the 'anomalies' (the human who rejects the Matrix) can cause the Matrix to crash. therefore the Machine build a place called ZION (that's my guessing), which is simply a place to hold the anomalies. (i believe ZION is a real place built by the Machine, instead of another layer of Matrix which many ppl on this board suggested.) the responsiblity of THE ONE is to 'report back' to the SOURCE about the anomalies, and select 20 NEW human anomalies from THE MATRIX (not from Zion, many people missted that point) to go back to ZION to rebuild, after it's destroyed by the Machine (my guessing is the machine/sentinals kills everyone in Zion, but won't physically destroy the infraustructure). that's where the ONE ends!!! and a new version of Matrix then it's loaded and the whole cycle starts again. remember what the Oracle told Neo in the courtyard,'all programs go back to the Source when they are deleted, that's where the path of the ONE ends....'. now let's talk about Neo. as i said, i believe he's 1/2 program 1/2 human. cuz the Arch. said something about him still retain many feelings/characteristics of a human, but there were 5 VERSIONS of the ONE before him, which suggest that Neo is a real human, but his mind is written by the Machine as the ONE. according to the Arch., all his 5 predecessors were detached from human emotions and were all making the 'right' choices, logically and mathematically, and he expected Neo to make the same kind of choices. but this time Neo made decision out of the machine's expectation, because he was MORE HUMAN then his predecessors. he has more HOPE this time, which is a flaw according to the Machine. therefore instead of going into the RIGHT door, which he'll return to the Souce and replug back to the machine, and pick 20 new humans to rebuild Zion, he chosed to go into the LEFT door. according to the machine, the consequnce of that is that he'll be destroyed together with Zion, and there will be no THE ONE to wake up 20 new humans to rebuild Zion, hence all the anomalies in the Matrix will not be 'rescued' (more like filtered out), and they will cause the Matrix to crash and kill every human being that's plugged into the Matrix, and that will be the end of humanity. the 'Prophecy' which Mopheus believes in so much from the Oracle, is the end of the war, but not in the sense that Mophuers would like it to be, which is tht humans defeat the machine through the ONE. the end of the war that Oracle means is the destroy of Zion and another version (a better version) of Matrix reloads which will produce less # of anomalies. that's why Neo told Mopheus the Prophecy is a LIE. well this is just my 2c of what's going on."

Have fun. Im tired.

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Another theory, in the face of the previous one...

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I believe that perhaps the whole "Architect" thing was just another form of control. I think it was all made up by the matrix to trick Neo into thinking that they would fail and that he doesn't have as much power as he really has, thereby controlling him. I think that Morpheus was right when he says "I dont believe that" in response to Neo telling him that they will fall. If you think about it, it fits the theme of the matrix quite nicely, in that control is everything, so it would make sense that the architect is just another way to control Neo.

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read more of my fellow counter strikers opinions here... on a gotfrag thread

Man Schmiggy, youve really done your homework on this. Keep up the good work; this is easily the best damn thread in the forums right now. :D

thx.... while i wouldnt consider myself a matrix uber fan geek, i like the stuff... but at the end of reloaded, i knew there was so much to talk about, and possibilities, and this place is a perfect place to do just that.

and with so much stupid banter on this thread, bout time we liven it up some more with some intellectual/philisophical questions, of a movie most of us enjoyed, :)

This information is from the 19th , not sure if you all know about it yet but its not too surprising now is it?

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As expected by many, The Matrix Reloaded shattered a number of records this weekend. The sequel came in at #1 at the U.S. box office, with $91.8 million over the weekend and $134 million since its opening Wednesday night. Some of the records the film broke include: biggest opening by an R-rated film (previously held by Hannibal at $58 million); biggest first four days of release (besting Spider-Man's $125.9 million); largest preview gross, for Wednesday night's showings starting at 10 PM, coming in around $5 million; the biggest Thursday opening of all time (shooting past Star Wars: Episode II); and Warner Brothers' best 3-day opening (their previous best was Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone, at $90.3 million).  - IGN

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THE OFFICIAL MATRIX RELOADED ON KAZAA LITE IS:

[pio]matrix.reloaded.(esoteric).ts.divx.(1of2) - 127 362 kb
[pio]matrix.reloaded.(esoteric).ts.divx.(2of2) - 137 890 kb

PLEASE START DOWNLOADING, WE NEED SHARERS

THESE FILES ARE NOT FAKES! THEY ARE GOOD QUALITY~!!!

Ok, I think I like the "Zion=Recycle Bin" theory. It answers most of my questions about the Matrix itself and makes sense.

Are there any thoughts about who is really in control outside the Matrix (machine world), man or machine?

I ask this question because I find it difficult to understand why the machines feel compelled to appease the 1% that reject the programing. It seems the machines would just chop them up and recycle them as food for the other 99%. Based on this fact I believe that humans are really in control.

Another puzzling question, what are the machines doing in reality? Do they live in little houses? Do they go to work everyday? Do they have a society? Are they explorers and have a space program, like NASA? What purpose do the machines feel they serve in the real world?

Alot of theories on Zion being a Recycle Bin, qurantine centre, isolation place for anomalies (human who rejects the matrix, accounted for 1%).

Lets start from the beginning. Like all system, there must have fix sets of rules. Each individual within the system has to comply with the rules and there will be no doubt monitoring system to ensure that. Take for example, all members/guests from this forum must follow certain rules, if one of the member abuse the rules, the moderators will go after him, worst come to worst ban him from the forum. All unplugged individuals in the matrix are in fact human in some life-supporting tanks in real life. Agents in certain sense can be considering as monitoring system. They go after Neo when being tip off by the traitor (forget his name), arrested him in his office, giving him warning, and being force (not too appropriate choice of word) to take drastic measure by implanting tracking system in Neo's body when he refuse to heed their warning/accept their offer. In this context, lets assume the agents are taking up monitoring work.

When Neo met up with Morpheus and make his choice by taking the red pill, he wake up from the life-supporting tank and being cast down the draining system (Theres this sentinels-like thing looking at Neo b4 he was drained away). How does a human being unplugged from the system? The 'natural way' would be when the individual was dead inside the matrix. His dead body in the life-supporting tank will then be drained to a processing centre to be processed as the nutrient for other living unplugged beings. Another possible way is when the individual realised his living world is in fact virtual reality (not proven in the 2 movies). So, how does Neo being unplugged? Does the red pill he took is like the special programmed cake to serve special purpose, like trick the matrix into thinking Neo is dead in the matrix which in fact he is not, thereby releasing him from the life-support unit and drain him to the processing pool where he was being picked up by Morpheus?

So lets assume the only possible way for matrix to 'ban' individual who violet the rules of the system/matrix is by killing him (through agents).

Please bear with me, I'll took another approach to look at the quarantine/isolation isssue. When Malaysia / England / Hong Kong discoverd their pigs / cows / chickens were infected by contagious disease, all infected and suspected animals were slaughted or killed to prevent further outbreak. However, the recent world-wide outbreak of SARS forced governments to issue home qurantine order to suspected individuals. Human are qurantine while animals are killed. When we received / downloaded files that are infected by virus, our Antivirus software inform us and present to us a choice to quarantine the file or delete it if the virus cannot be cleared. Why not delete the file straight? As the file may be important to the user. In other words, we used quarantine / isolation in times of outbreak/crisis only when the subject is inexpendable or too important.

Now back to Matrix. Is human important to the machine? Definitely, human are their source of power. But are human that important that require special attention to quarantine / isolate them when some of them becomes anomalies? Accounting to Architect, the answer is no. He go even the way to express the extinct of human (lost of major power source) is a cost the machine are prepare to bear when situation required it. Of course, he may say that to confuse / threaten Neo, but no doubt I don't understand the rationale behind the concept of Zion being a quarantine / isolation / confine centre for the 1% anomalies. Who is the biggest anomalies in the matrix? Neo , no doubt. Does Neo cause catastrophe effect on the matrix? Apparently not, in fact he is a regular in the matrix, who keep abusing the system and performing forbidden superman act. Why is the moderators, err... agents not doing their job by banning him from the forum, err... matrix? As mentioned above, the agents may only ban him by killing him, which to the agents, is an near impossible act. Ok, Neo is very special, but what about the others anomalies (those that still unplugged)? Can't the matrix just sent agents over to finished them, at the most suffer a power drop of 1%? Now, just said these anomalies are dangeruos, they are contagious, when one become aware of the virtual reality, he will unplugged himself from the matrix and he may infect others, causing more anomalies to emerge. Can they survive outside? 99% they will die outside the matrix. The only possible way for them to survive is Zion.

Following this argument, why does matrix wants this 1% human to stay alive? One possible reason is curiosity. The machine were built by human, we can trust human to design the machine in a way more or less resemble us. Does the machine AI reaches a state where it start questioning its purpose and destination in life (very common among human)? They deemed the only way to find the answer is through observing human, thereby the 1% power drop is nothing compare to the studying of human behaviour including anomalies?

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Originally posted by tyk@21 May 2003 - 15:01
Following this argument, why does matrix wants this 1% human to stay alive? One possible reason is curiosity. The machine were built by human, we can trust human to design the machine in a way more or less resemble us. Does the machine AI reaches a state where it start questioning its purpose and destination in life (very common among human)? They deemed the only way to find the answer is through observing human, thereby the 1% power drop is nothing compare to the studying of human behaviour including anomalies?

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Tyk, that's a very interesting outlook.

I wasn't quite clear about your thoughts as to whether Zion is reality or not?
I got the impression you thought it was reality, if so how do the machines study the real world Zion people. If Zion is real and children are born within Zion how would the machines know of their existance and the day to day interactions of the Zion people? Do the machines have probes in Zion?

I've often found myself thinking about the conversation between the leader of Zion and Neo when they were looking at the machines in Zion. The leader of Zion says to Neo "We depend on the machines and they depend on us".

Lets assume when Morph told Neo in the first Matrix movie about how the current state of afairs came about, he was in error on some of his facts. Morpheous even mentioned the details were very sketchy as to what started the matrix.

Now let's assume something catastrophic did happen on the planet, meteor, war or natural disater, rendering the planet unfit for human existance. The only way man could survive and still evolve would be to build the matrix and put machines in charge of maintaining it. The machines were programed to adapt as the people of the matrix evolved over time. The program had a strong set of rules governing the machines to insure the up most care was given to all humans, but also it had a fail safe to protect the majority from the minority in the event the minority couldn't be accomodated. The humans provided the power to run the machines. It was designed to be a self sustaining complex that would insure mans existance and give the planet time to heal.

It maybe a stretch... but it answers a lot of my questions.

somthing said and quoted from another forum that's going around, not sure if i believe it or not.(dont really want to)
what do you guys think? ;)

"Ok, here's a spoiler from someone at another forum who claims to have a copy of the script from Matrix revolutions"


"in Matrix revolutions we learn Zion is part of a larger Matrix. we also learn the machines put humans into pods to save them from nuclear winter, not to enslave them. eventually the machines just turned the consciousness of humans into programs and eliminated the need for human bodies. Neo, Trinity and everyone else are just programs who think they are humans. Zion was created by the ruling machines to give hope to a certain kind of human who needed to control their own fate. that is why Agent smith and Neo has powers now in the real world at the end of Reloaded, because they aren't out of the Matrix yet.

At the end of Reloaded Neo and his friends agree to leave the real Matrix and see what is really like on the outside world, but at the cost of never being able to return to the Matrix. Agent Smith stays behind to continue the fight against the dominating machines. The oracle transcends into a higher consciousness. And another One is born who will lead a new group of rebels and create a new Zion eventually.

That's how the movie script ended"


"and some hints:"


"pay attention to the first film and you will see important clues for the two sequels. For instance the Architect is watching Neo as he is arrested by agent Smith in the first movie. the oracle gives Neo an upgrade that changes this version of the one shortly after she first meets him, that's what the cookie is for just like Morpheus giving Neo the choice between the red pill and the blue pill. The candy the Oracle gives Neo is another upgrade.

Wait until you see the battle for Zion and in the Matrix in the third movie, you aint seen nothing yet :blink: "