Obama Administration to File Suit Over Arizona Immigration Law

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Originally Posted by l33tpirata13

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Originally Posted by j2k4

Okay, here's my answer to your question:

You believe what has grown out of the situation in Arizona is going to cause you in Chicago to be periodically detained in order to ascertain whether you are a bona fide
citizen of the United States.

So?

If I somehow draw attention to myself, that's what happens to me, so (now, here's the tricky part where you have to think) is there something special about you that you feel should render you immune to the pitfalls we all face?

Now it's your turn.

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all my family is there. ive lived there periodically and am in the process of moving there as soon as summers over.

so by that logic. youre white, 99% of all serial killers are white, you by default look like a serial killer. lets just put you in a cop car every opportunity we can just to make sure youre not a serial killer. after all, theyre all white!!!! its not that far of a jump.

ANd YOU STILL HAVENT ANSWERED ANYTHING. YOU SEEM MORE LIKE A DANCING FAIRY!!!!! BIOMETICS!!! i dont even know why im arguing with you. youre kind of mindset will go down in history as one of the most delusional and furthest from reality. white hysteria is a sick phenomena. makes people do and say extremely stupid things.......

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So by your logic, I have a gripe every time we have a serial killer, and biometrics...is now a question?

Btw-

Capitalized text is a prime example of hysteria.

Chill, dude.

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Originally Posted by j2k4

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Originally Posted by l33tpirata13

all my family is there. ive lived there periodically and am in the process of moving there as soon as summers over.

so by that logic. youre white, 99% of all serial killers are white, you by default look like a serial killer. lets just put you in a cop car every opportunity we can just to make sure youre not a serial killer. after all, theyre all white!!!! its not that far of a jump.

ANd YOU STILL HAVENT ANSWERED ANYTHING. YOU SEEM MORE LIKE A DANCING FAIRY!!!!! BIOMETICS!!! i dont even know why im arguing with you. youre kind of mindset will go down in history as one of the most delusional and furthest from reality. white hysteria is a sick phenomena. makes people do and say extremely stupid things.......

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So by your logic, I have a gripe every time we have a serial killer, and biometrics...is now a question?

Btw-

Capitalized text is a prime example of hysteria.

Chill, dude.

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youre a prime example of a right wing lunatic.

im not the one posing answers as questions and pretending they did their homework. pure republican retard games. play em.

you do know there is no real way to prove citizenship right? not unless you use biometrics. the rest is fodder for you to eat.

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Originally Posted by l33tpirata13

you do know there is no real way to prove citizenship right? not unless you use biometrics. the rest is fodder for you to eat.

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Uh-uh.

Not eating that.

Perhaps one of your co-...believers?

go ahead....explain how a piece of paper is going to prove citizenship? yeah i thought so, dancing like nancy.

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Originally Posted by l33tpirata13

go ahead....explain how a piece of paper is going to prove citizenship? yeah i thought so, dancing like nancy.

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It works for me...no reason it shouldn't work for you/yours.

Btw-

What's your deal with dancing?

Do you know what the word means?

Who is Nancy?

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Originally Posted by j2k4

It works for me...no reason it shouldn't work for you/yours.

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just because you say it works doesnt make it so. give reason or shut the fuck up.
Why do you say it works? how can anyone prove they are genuine? and youll continue to dance around the question, i bet. fucking nancy.

Just hope the officer isn't a birther.

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Originally Posted by l33tpirata13

fucking nancy.

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Only if she's your mom, pal.

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Originally Posted by devilsadvocate

Just hope the officer isn't a birther.

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Yes.

The ranks of law enforcement are rife with them, I hear.

By the way, devil-person - I am not one of those who bang on about Barry's birthplace, but why on earth do you think he doesn't prove them wrong?

I ask this only because of the current subject, you see.

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Originally Posted by j2k4

By the way, devil-person - I am not one of those who bang on about Barry's birthplace, but why on earth do you think he doesn't prove them wrong?

I ask this only because of the current subject, you see.

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You may not bang on about it but you sound awfully like a birther.

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Originally Posted by devilsadvocate

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Originally Posted by j2k4

By the way, devil-person - I am not one of those who bang on about Barry's birthplace, but why on earth do you think he doesn't prove them wrong?

I ask this only because of the current subject, you see.

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You may not bang on about it but you sound awfully like a birther.

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That, thankfully, is subject to interpretations other than your own, defective as it is.

You still won't answer the question, but that is nothing new, either..

What is there to answer? He has released his birth certificate and it's authenticity has been confirmed.

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Originally Posted by devilsadvocate

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Originally Posted by j2k4

By the way, devil-person - I am not one of those who bang on about Barry's birthplace, but why on earth do you think he doesn't prove them wrong?

I ask this only because of the current subject, you see.

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You may not bang on about it but you sound awfully like a birther.

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That, thankfully, is subject to interpretations other than your own, defective as it is.

You still won't answer the question, but that is nothing new, either...

I mean that - it is why I repeated the post.

Where did my post disappear to?

What is there to answer? He released his birth certificate and it has been confirmed as authentic.

Only birthers don't understand or accept this fact

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Originally Posted by devilsadvocate

What is there to answer? He has released his birth certificate and it's authenticity has been confirmed.

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By whom...Rahm Emmanuel?

C'mon, c'mon.

I have people to do; places to meet...

Going...going...

gone!

See, you are a birther

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Originally Posted by j2k4

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Originally Posted by devilsadvocate

You may not bang on about it but you sound awfully like a birther.

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That, thankfully, is subject to interpretations other than your own, defective as it is.

You still won't answer the question, but that is nothing new, either..

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please you dance around questions like a girl. you have yet to give me a reason why you think showing papers will prove im genuinely American.

you may not be an idiot but you seem more like one everytime you ignore the question.


in all likelyhood jk2whatever is a truckerhat wearing redneck. how stupid can one be to believe orly tates? extremely extremely stupid.

but see the hypocrisy? he acknowledges with one hand that a birth certificate can be fake, but they are good enough to prove citizenship for millions of people, who have been known to produce really good fake papers. its idiocy and racism at its finest. fucking slimey shit dude, real slimey. Pick a side and stick to it.

Your so obviously RACIST. you have issues being under a black president. its a southern white republican thing and i thank GOD they dont much voting power. Can you imagine if they did? Mental cases like J2kblahblah would have palin in office.

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Originally Posted by devilsadvocate

See, you are a birther

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Whattya got, like two tools in your arsenal?

You and the pirate fella - maybe 7 braincells between the two of you.

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Originally Posted by j2k4

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Originally Posted by devilsadvocate

See, you are a birther

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Whattya got, like two tools in your arsenal?

You and the pirate fella - maybe 7 braincells between the two of you.

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youre a tool. youre probably reading orly tates right now, while you rub yourself in cooking oil. youre nuts dude. its kinda scary to think there are a whole bunch of you down south.

And what do have in your arsenal? You havent made ANY points except for that your a racist bigot. You'd be the the jagoff yelling profanities at the little black girl for going to school. You'd be the P.O.S that spit on MLK at Marquette Park. All the stupid shit youre spewing, without giving RATIONAL THOUGHT, or REASON, is making it completely obvious. so prove me wrong, ASS!!!

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Originally Posted by j2k4

C'mon, c'mon.

I have people to do; places to meet...

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Im willing to bet you copulate with an inflatable. :yup:

You are aware others read what you say, I take i?
They read what I say, then they read what you say, and they adjourn, the quality of effort easily decided.

Enjoy your Fourth of July, and have a thought for those who came before you, and why, if you even know.

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Originally Posted by j2k4

You are aware others read what you say, I take i?
They read what I say, then they read what you say, and they adjourn, the quality of effort easily decided.

Enjoy your Fourth of July, and have a thought for those who came before you, and why, if you even know.

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yeah, ill go light up a bottlerocket, while you go light up a cross. have a good one!!!!!

Why has this discussion ( description used in only the most generous of terms) focused on the validity (or not) of the papers being asked for instead of the asking itself?

Obviously, any document can be (and probably has been) counterfeited and it's safe to assume that even pirate-person's beloved "biometrics" will be circumvented as the technology becomes more widespread.

Seems to me that the flaw in j2's argument lies in the casual acceptance of randomly being asked to provide ID in the first place.
Isn't it bedrock conservative policy to minimize the intrusion of government into a citizens daily life?
It's damn near socialist for the government to meddle in your health insurance or to limit access/use of a gun but perfectly fine for any random cop to stop you and ask for ID?

Kev has stated repeatedly that he has no problem with this and places the "buy-out" for compliance at $100, although dollars to donuts, he's never had to go through it himself.

Although not directly comparable, my experience with "papers" and having to show them is that it's at best mildly inconvenient, at worst, painful.
I traveled extensively in Europe pre- EU, and border crossings were always a crap shoot.
One bored/incompetent/hateful drone could delay you for hours and any sign of belligerence made the scrutiny even more intense.

If it's OK for any random Arizona Barney Fife to stop and question your identity, wouldn't also be OK- in fact, logical- for Arizona to set up checkpoints on all four of their borders and be able to question everyone who enters or leaves the state?

BTW, pirata:
I can assure you that Orly Taite does nothing for j2.
Rand Paul probably gets him moist though.

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Originally Posted by clocker

Why has this discussion ( description used in only the most generous of terms) focused on the validity (or not) of the papers being asked for instead of the asking itself?

Obviously, any document can be (and probably has been) counterfeited and it's safe to assume that even pirate-person's beloved "biometrics" will be circumvented as the technology becomes more widespread.

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I have no idea how this concern arose; any fool knows we're not there yet, in any case...

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Originally Posted by clocker

Seems to me that the flaw in j2's argument lies in the casual acceptance of randomly being asked to provide ID in the first place.
Isn't it bedrock conservative policy to minimize the intrusion of government into a citizens daily life?
It's damn near socialist for the government to meddle in your health insurance or to limit access/use of a gun but perfectly fine for any random cop to stop you and ask for ID?
Kev has stated repeatedly that he has no problem with this and places the "buy-out" for compliance at $100, although dollars to donuts, he's never had to go through it himself.

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When and if I ever actually see a believable "trend" of this type of thing, I will entertain the question, "Is it worth it?" at that time.

As you liberals are fond of saying, At least we would be trying...something! .

Another thing:

Just what constitutes "being hassled" to the point of fear for one's survival (as it is presented)?

If you mean, 'have I ever gone through a significant period of my life being pulled over regularly", I would say that, between the ages of 15 and perhaps 24 or 25, it happened perhaps 50 or 60 times.

By the same people.

For the same bullshit.

Every time I produced identification and cooperated fully.

I wasn't scarred by anything that happened, and let me tell you, plenty happened.

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Originally Posted by clocker

Although not directly comparable, my experience with "papers" and having to show them is that it's at best mildly inconvenient, at worst, painful.
I traveled extensively in Europe pre- EU, and border crossings were always a crap shoot.
One bored/incompetent/hateful drone could delay you for hours and any sign of belligerence made the scrutiny even more intense.

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How much of it was related to skin color, white-bread?

What was the worst you dealt with, beyond ridiculous inconvenience?

Were you ever beaten?

Given a cavity search?

Sexually assaulted?

Divested of goods (beyond the "touch" of the on-site personnel)?

Those types of things are kind of objectionable.

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Originally Posted by clocker

If it's OK for any random Arizona Barney Fife to stop and question your identity, wouldn't also be OK- in fact, logical- for Arizona to set up checkpoints on all four of their borders and be able to question everyone who enters or leaves the state?

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Oh, yeah...Barney was white - but he was also incompetent, and a minor irritant at best.

So - what about him?

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Originally Posted by clocker

BTW, pirata:
I can assure you that Orly Taite does nothing for j2.
Rand Paul probably gets him moist though.

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Rand Paul is his father's son.

Something is awry.

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Why has this discussion ( description used in only the most generous of terms) focused on the validity (or not) of the papers being asked for instead of the asking itself?

Obviously, any document can be (and probably has been) counterfeited and it's safe to assume that even pirate-person's beloved "biometrics" will be circumvented as the technology becomes more widespread.

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I have no idea how this concern arose; any fool knows we're not there yet, in any case...

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http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...031703115.html

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Originally Posted by j2k4

When and if I ever actually see a believable "trend" of this type of thing, I will entertain the question, "Is it worth it?" at that time.

As you liberals are fond of saying, At least we would be trying...something! .

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How very laid back of you, a "believable trend" of abuse must be visible to you before outrage ensues.
Why wasn't this your attitude about health care reform, which had you frothing at the mouth before it even passed?
At least the Dems were trying "something" then, right?

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Originally Posted by j2k4

Another thing:

Just what constitutes "being hassled" to the point of fear for one's survival (as it is presented)?

If you mean, 'have I ever gone through a significant period of my life being pulled over regularly", I would say that, between the ages of 15 and perhaps 24 or 25, it happened perhaps 50 or 60 times.

By the same people.

For the same bullshit.

Every time I produced identification and cooperated fully.

I wasn't scarred by anything that happened, and let me tell you, plenty happened.

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50-60 times?
And that had no effect on you as an adult?
It's OK for the same people who harassed you to harass everyone else because you decided it was no big deal?

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Originally Posted by j2k4

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Originally Posted by clocker

Although not directly comparable, my experience with "papers" and having to show them is that it's at best mildly inconvenient, at worst, painful.
I traveled extensively in Europe pre- EU, and border crossings were always a crap shoot.
One bored/incompetent/hateful drone could delay you for hours and any sign of belligerence made the scrutiny even more intense.

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How much of it was related to skin color, white-bread?How would I know?

What was the worst you dealt with, beyond ridiculous inconvenience?

Were you ever beaten?No.

Given a cavity search?Yes.

Sexually assaulted?No.

Divested of goods (beyond the "touch" of the on-site personnel)?Yes.

Those types of things are kind of objectionable.

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Does two out of six rise to the "objectionable" level or no?
Have I your leave to feel hassled yet?

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Originally Posted by j2k4

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Originally Posted by clocker

If it's OK for any random Arizona Barney Fife to stop and question your identity, wouldn't also be OK- in fact, logical- for Arizona to set up checkpoints on all four of their borders and be able to question everyone who enters or leaves the state?

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Oh, yeah...Barney was white - but he was also incompetent, and a minor irritant at best.

So - what about him?

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Are the Fifes of Arizona allowed bullets for their guns and granted the authority to use them?

Given that Mayberry was not only fictional but also 100% white, it'd be interesting to see Barney's reaction should a pack of Juans saunter down Main Street toward Aunt Bee's place...

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Originally Posted by clocker

a pack of Juans saunter down Main Street toward Aunt Bee's place...

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I can't respond fully because I'm at work, but I will note that, had I typed that passage, I would now be suffering an charge of "outrageous" racism.

Not from me, you wouldn't.

Shouldn't that be "a charge" instead of "an charge"?
Being a screaming racist is no excuse for poor grammar.

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Originally Posted by clocker

Not from me, you wouldn't.

Shouldn't that be "a charge" instead of "an charge"?
Being a screaming racist is no excuse for poor grammar.

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Ah, once in nine years...

So, wow, hey, you got a cavity search, eh?

I always made it a point to eat chile when I was sure I was gonna get pulled over - I figured I could get any cop in the fucking world off the subject with a few well-timed freeps.

Okay, back to the race thing again - you (white boy) were inhumanely treated by another white (primarily, right? I mean, correct me if I am wrong), so, under what sub-heading of racism were you violated?

Or would you say it was merely an exercise of power, with no racial component whatsoever?

In other words, would you have been treated any differently at the Polish border as an Italian, an Irishman, a Spaniard, or an American?

Did you ever cross a border uneventfully?

Indulge me, please.

Sure, most of our border crossings were uneventful.
I never pegged any of our less pleasant encounters as racial, more casual bureaucratic fucking than anything else.
Try explaining to a bored Italian border guard why you have two 55 gallon drums of special blend fuel in your trailer (also full of bikes/tools, etc.) without any of the paperwork they consider necessary.
(The drums of gas were the items that were confiscated. We picked them up as we left Italy 5 days later.
Apparently, actually having the gas in our possession wasn't the problem, not having the "proper" waybills was.)

Look, I said initially that my experience was not directly comparable and I totally understand why we would have been hassled...a big rig full of longhairs and exotic equipment, it's bait for a border guard...I get it.
What is semi-comparable is being in a situation where we were subject to the petty and random whims of whoever felt like exercising their authority at the time.

If I was subject to the same random power plays while simply walking around my hometown I'd be pissed off instead of exasperated.

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Originally Posted by clocker

Sure, most of our border crossings were uneventful.
I never pegged any of our less pleasant encounters as racial, more casual bureaucratic fucking than anything else.
Try explaining to a bored Italian border guard why you have two 55 gallon drums of special blend fuel in your trailer (also full of bikes/tools, etc.) without any of the paperwork they consider necessary.
(The drums of gas were the items that were confiscated. We picked them up as we left Italy 5 days later.
Apparently, actually having the gas in our possession wasn't the problem, not having the "proper" waybills was.)

Look, I said initially that my experience was not directly comparable and I totally understand why we would have been hassled...a big rig full of longhairs and exotic equipment, it's bait for a border guard...I get it.
What is semi-comparable is being in a situation where we were subject to the petty and random whims of whoever felt like exercising their authority at the time.

IF I was subject to the same random power plays while simply walking around my hometown I'd be pissed off instead of exasperated.

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That's a big if.

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Originally Posted by j2k4

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Originally Posted by clocker

Sure, most of our border crossings were uneventful.
I never pegged any of our less pleasant encounters as racial, more casual bureaucratic fucking than anything else.
Try explaining to a bored Italian border guard why you have two 55 gallon drums of special blend fuel in your trailer (also full of bikes/tools, etc.) without any of the paperwork they consider necessary.
(The drums of gas were the items that were confiscated. We picked them up as we left Italy 5 days later.
Apparently, actually having the gas in our possession wasn't the problem, not having the "proper" waybills was.)

Look, I said initially that my experience was not directly comparable and I totally understand why we would have been hassled...a big rig full of longhairs and exotic equipment, it's bait for a border guard...I get it.
What is semi-comparable is being in a situation where we were subject to the petty and random whims of whoever felt like exercising their authority at the time.

IF I was subject to the same random power plays while simply walking around my hometown I'd be pissed off instead of exasperated.

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That's a big if.

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Well, i HAVE. But you seem to think its trivial since its the group you wanna be biased against.

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I always made it a point to eat chile when I was sure I was gonna get pulled over - I figured I could get any cop in the fucking world off the subject with a few well-timed freeps.

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what kind of moron thinks of such a stupid and idiotic answer to a real problem? Someone who cant answer because their real answer would probably be "well, did you look like a mexican?"

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Originally Posted by j2k4

That's a big if.

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I am again struck by your laid back, "Let's wait and see" response to this issue compared to your hyper agitated "Health care reform is going to drive me out of business!" stance.

So much for "compassionate conservatives".

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Originally Posted by l33tpirata13

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Originally Posted by clocker

I am again struck by your laid back, "Let's wait and see" response to this issue compared to your hyper agitated "Health care reform is going to drive me out of business!" stance.

So much for "compassionate conservatives".

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isnt it obvious ,by now, that he's a racist hypocrite?
Nothing makes em froth at the mouth more that the words Mexican, Black, and Obama.

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I'm a racist because you say so?

Heaven forbid.

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Originally Posted by j2k4

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Originally Posted by l33tpirata13

isnt it obvious ,by now, that he's a racist hypocrite?
Nothing makes em froth at the mouth more that the words Mexican, Black, and Obama.

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I'm a racist because you say so?

Heaven forbid.

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no youre a racist because YOU said so. You shared you views didnt you?

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Originally Posted by l33tpirata13

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Originally Posted by j2k4

I'm a racist because you say so?

Heaven forbid.

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no youre a racist because YOU said so. You shared you views didnt you?

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Is there a shred of logic in this ^ , someone tell me, and by that I mean someone other than pirate-person.

Anyone?

Anyone at all?

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Originally Posted by l33tpirata13

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The case is United States of America v. State of Arizona et al; Case No. 10-cv-1413 in U.S. District Court for the District of Arizona

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ill guess we'll see what happens. I have no idea what will transpire. but, i tell you what wont change........J2kaca will still be complacent to bigotry.

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So this would make you, what...non-complacent?