I know there is a least 20 million plus Americans think different..Quote:
Originally Posted by OlegL
I am against Obama now. I heard Obamacare sucks.Quote:
Originally Posted by OlegL
It doesn't suck, it needs some revamping, that's all..
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I know there is a least 20 million plus Americans think different..Quote:
Originally Posted by OlegLI am against Obama now. I heard Obamacare sucks.Quote:
Originally Posted by OlegL
It doesn't suck, it needs some revamping, that's all..
Single-payer and mandatory enrollment for all should solve it.
No. It sucks. It beyond sucks. Why do you think it needs revamping? Because it sucks.Quote:
Originally Posted by shainaI know there is a least 20 million plus Americans think different..Quote:
Originally Posted by OlegL
It doesn't suck, it needs some revamping, that's all..
It's incredibly expensive and almost no health care providers will accept it bc it doesn't pay the provider but a small fraction of what they're billing. So they naturally say, 'Nah, we're good. We'll just keep accepting all these other providers that pay us more.'
I have a friend on FB who just posted a couple of weeks ago that she pays $1200/m for Obamacare under the "Affordable Healthcare Act" and literally no doctors will take it.
EDIT: here's the post:
Spoiler: Show
Well there's that pesky thing called The Constitution so.... no.Quote:
Originally Posted by Caballero
If the state can make me get car insurance, then why should the state not be able to make me get health insurance? Explain the difference, please.
As for your friend, maybe she should try to understand how the system works. Make her google "charge master", and read the Time article "Bitter Pill: Why Medical Bills Are Killing Us" from 2013. Here's a clue: official hospital rates are inflated and insurance companies negotiate prices down to real-world levels (usually set within the Medicare system). To say that insurance companies only "pay the provider but a small fraction of what they're billing" is like saying I got a great deal because I only paid 50% for something whose price doubled the week before -- that discount is irrelevant. And make her understand that if she goes to an out-of-network doctor/hospital, of course the insurance company is not going to pay for anything. But that's got nothing to do with Obamacare; that's the way any health insurance company operates.
Medical costs in this country are high because nobody reigns in the drug companies. And insurance companies charge higher rates because the covered base is not as large as it could/should be. Increase the pool of insured with the young and healthy, and the monthly rate per person will go down. And get rid of all the paperwork the system currently requires, and you'll save even more.
So I say again, single-payer and mandatory enrollment for all should solve it. or at least be a very big step in the right direction.
To add to my car insurance example: the county I live in has a large number of uninsured drivers (let's not even talk about underinsured drivers), so the insurance rate I am paying is higher than it should be if everyone had coverage. Check your own policy for the "uninsured/underinsured" part of your premium and you see how much money you could save right away...
Simple. You choose to drive or not drive. If you choose to drive, you are required to maintain liability insurance while driving on public roads. As per The Constitution, The govt cannot require you pay for insurance. Don't want to pay for it? That's fine. Walk. Bike. Take the bus. Uber. Ride share. Whatever. Single payer health insurance would require everyone pay into the system. There is no opt out, otherwise the system doesn't work. That's why it was quickly dropped back in 2010-ish when The ACA was being pushed through.
I'm on the mobile so can't bother quoting properly.
She should try to understand how the system works? Out of network? It's Obamacare. The whole point of it was to give people in all areas of the country affordable options. She lives in suburban Houston with thousands of options and still can't get the care she needs simply because doctors don't accept it. The margins are just too small.
832.632.8437
Tell your friend to ask for Shelby. She'll help her evaluate her options.
If she really pays $1200/month, Shelby should be able to get her an off-exchange plan that's cheaper and that's accepted by the doctors.
You're welcome.
All i can say is you are right and wrong at the same time..Quote:
Originally Posted by Caballero
If you think about why health care kind of works here in Canada??
-Government controls and uses Gas Tax and allocates it to Health Care
-Government controls our Liquor Tax and that allocates to Health Care
-Government controls Lottery Tax (and our winnings are tax free but you guys wright off way more shit on your taxes like lottery losses and mortgages we can not), that is allocated to Health Care
and there is a lot more as well, and i can tell you from experience, there is flaws with our system as well, and without drug plans here you get robbed as well(if you take a lot), and as far as i was told, you can not be refused care in a Public hospital in the US, is that wrong??
Skiz...
First off Trump is full of shit!!
The only way Obamacare will work is if the majority of people are on it(the way it is designed), it then offsets nut bags that run to the hospital/doctor because they have a paper-cut instead of putting a band-aid on it, and others don't. And the insurance companies are not the underwriters of the policies and the Government or appointed committee controls the pricing..
The Funds have to come from somewhere Skiz, plus the Government has to control it...
I am thinking a Single Payer would look good for future generations:idunno:
Ask yourself this?? Have you herd of a Public (Shareholders) Insurance company losing money?? Yet they raise the premiums and say it offsets any future loses..
Even if Trumps idea to negotiate with these Insurance companies and not subsidize it somehow it can't work..
I can tell you again from seeing it with my own eyes !! I take my Mother-in law to the doctor in Florida, and all over the walls the Doctor has posted he has no insurance, and you sign a waiver that you can't sue him...
How many times do you hear a Doctor is sued for Malpractice in Canada?? Pretty much never!! In the US you sue for hot coffee in McDonald's :D
Do you think that has something to do with cost??
Rates doctors charge and companies that supply hospitals need to be controlled and that would be a start.
Again Obama Care does work but it needs some changes and modifications to fix it, starting from scratch and relying on Insurance companies that also have to report to Shareholders profits will never work.
Right now Trump won your election and he won on a lot of false promises(like all politicians), and last i herd they are going to take at least 3 years til they have a solution for this, and we will have to see if Trump is still the President :)
PS. Blaming Drug Companies excuse doesn't work in Canada, they get cost down with most of the popular drugs being made or known as "Generic Drugs", those are given first.
The reason why it didn't work, because the Seniors lobbied and didn't want to pay there share in increased taxes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Skiz
But in the end are they not hurting there children and grandchildren future healthcare??
Is there more involved on this cost premium??Quote:
Originally Posted by Caballero
Doctors don't accept it, Why??Quote:
Originally Posted by Skiz
A doctor here gets $20-40(approx) per visit that lasts maybe 15 minutes, as far as i have read, Obamacare gets $50 for 15 minute visit
Where is the problem here??
They don't accept it bc they aren't reimbursed at a high enough rate by the exchanges plan to make it worth their time. It's just a matter of dollars and cents.Quote:
Originally Posted by shainaDoctors don't accept it, Why??Quote:
Originally Posted by Skiz
A doctor here gets $20-40(approx) per visit that lasts maybe 15 minutes, as far as i have read, Obamacare gets $50 for 15 minute visit
Where is the problem here??
And the amount reimbursed cannot be simplified like that. ($50 for 15 minute visit). Different exchanges offer different pros and cons. Each paying out different amounts. And the basic office visit may not be (and likely isnt) the only factor. It's the overall margins that matter. A comes in for the flu, B comes in for a physical, C comes in for blood work, etc. All of these may pay the flat rate for an office consultation but if Obamacare isn't paying out much if anything on the lab work, etc etc etc then the margins just may not be there. Or, clearly aren't there if so many doctors offices are turning away patients.
Umm... what's the context here?Quote:
Originally Posted by Caballero
I'm definitely not calling a friend I haven't spoken to in a while and saying I was posting her personal story on the internets and to call that person for reasons unknown. :huh:
Context is that that is the number of an insurance broker in Houston that can help her find better/cheaper health insurance. $1200/month pays for a policy covering a family of three (Aetna or United healthcare, I forget) in 2016, with money left over, so if she's paying that much just for her own coverage, she's definitely paying too much. And that policy was off-exchange, so doctors would accept it. And then there are enough hospitals in Houston that offer their own HMO-style insurance policies. Hermann Memorial, for example.
Yes, choices will be even more limited in 2017 since some insurance companies have announced that they will leave the Texas market, but that's why you let the professionals deal with the details and let them research alternatives for you. If all your friend did is go on the website and sign up for the first plan she saw, then I am not surprised...
I am not really sure on the total breakdown Skiz, you may be right, but the $50 is just for a standard visit, if you prescribe meds you get more etc. And i am just talking GP not specialist, they always get more..Quote:
Originally Posted by Skiz
And really i think it has to do with the Mal-practice insurance and other expenses to run there office causes problems, like i said here in Canada that is not the case..
You never really hear of lawsuits for Mal-practice here, and the Doctors stick together here. Again there are flaws here as well but for general care it is not that bad..
But i do know for anything to really work in the US, there will be financial hits for a few years that Americans will have to expect for any type of good system health care, and Trump saying he can fix anything without that will be really interesting to see...
I really hope he can do something that works for all Americans, it really will be interesting how he does it, but if Publicly owned Insurance companies are involved and not Government controlled, he will have to be a magician..
Single payer health insurance works, but it has to be built up..
PS. Skiz.. There is another problem here, when it comes to GP's here it works on a cattle system and then it is capped per doctor, meaning, you need patience my friend:D, not overcharge less people and be a lazy fuck!! Doctors here do have to put in hours, or they make shit!!
They also open clinics and feed off the other doctors (part time and get paid a salary, and take the rest from government)..
Now i am also assuming that Obama Care was set up to be competitive to the payouts of the Insurance companies or HMO or employee company coverage. But if the doctors want to be greedy fucks and not work as hard, well that is a different story Skiz:)
What i am not getting about this conversation, Most people that have good steady jobs in the US are covered for all of this correct??Quote:
Originally Posted by Caballero
It would be the same in Canada only it is not for health care but for Medications..
And with HMO and Insurance companies, the big problem is if there is long term illnesses involved that is a killer in premiums..
Example... When i travel to the US i buy insurance (Not covered under the Canadian health care), i pay just over $100 for the year, and that covers everything except per-existing conditions. Now if you are 65 and on some meds, any coverage sky-rockets!! ($3000 and up)..
But with Single payer health insurance like you say it does even out but it does take time to build or the US government will have to find the funds, be it taxes all around, not just personal but Business. Again Trump and his bright ideas of cutting taxes for the rich and business that is impossible, as far as i am concerned:idunno:
It will be really interesting to see what happens in the future, just like seeing Trump take credit for businesses that he claims are staying in the US and have announced it long before they were not leaving completely, or making up figures (New Planes), to scare the public that are not even in existence yet..
That is the Republican way. But really the bloody guy is not in office yet so speculation means shit, until he is sworn in and takes office, then the fun will begin:D
Well, we can see that Trump and the Republicans are really f'ing things up. No surprise there. More debt and more spending. Eventually a Democrat will have to come in and fix shit (raise taxes, renew regulations, repair foreign relations, etc.). I'm not a fan of either party, but Republican politicians first priority is themselves (job, power, money), then corporations (fossil fuels, NRA, religion, insurance), then family & friends, and lastly American people. The rich will get richer, the middle-class and poor will get poorer, the environment will suffer, and the USA will have no credibility with the rest of the world.
A single payer system IS probably the best way to go for healthcare. If you take profit out of healthcare, it would be much more affordable. The same thing with education. The people in charge know that when something is needed, they can charge whatever they want, especially when it comes to life or death situations.
American exceptionalism...ain't it great?
I am embarrassed that I wrote that. Despite his many shortcomings, Trump did some positive things when he was President.Quote:
Originally Posted by OlegL
Pray tell.
Trump renegotiated trade deals and brought some jobs back to the US. He didn't start any new wars, and he worked to unwind foreign entanglements. He deescalated tensions in Korea. He stood up to BLM and Antifa.
Obama brought more than double the jobs back to the U.S. War is often more a result of the unavoidable events than a conscious decision. Like the Republican Party, at it's essential core, neither BLM or Antifa are a bad thing.
To be fair, I'm sure that Jefferson Davis also did some good things.
Are you sure Obama brought a considerable number of jobs back to the U.S.?.. BLM and Antifa are leftist ideologies and they are harmful ideologies, but Obama, as far as I know, didn't oppose them.Trump was in opposition to illegal immigration, but Obama, as far as I know, didn't care much about this issue... I don't know much about Jefferson Davis except that he was President of the Confederacy. I assume you grew up in Canada and were taught American history there.
So apparently you're pro-fascist and think that black lives don't matter. I'll keep that in mind when planning my next dinner party.
I have no idea if you are joking or not, but blacks are not oppressed in the U.S; that's why the idea black lives sometimes don't matter is meaningless. The only reason for the BLM ideology's existence is to perpetuate a myth.
Tell that to George Floyd. Oh wait, you can't.
The police definitely mistreated him, but he wouldn't have been in this predicament in the first place if he hadn't committed an actual crime. He was just one person; what happened to him doesn't prove anything. As I said before, I don't know if you are even being serious.
https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/list-p...-usa-1.4438618
What do most of these have in common? Excessive force was used against an unarmed black man by a white policeman and the killer wasn't prosecuted. I'm sure that police walk around scared all the time so I don't see how "being scared" in one particular incident is any excuse. Btw is only a small smattering of unprovoked cop on black violence. It's so prevalent that mothers have to tell their children to be compliant as possible if ever encountering police. Didn't help the black guy who was merely reaching for his license when the cop took that to be a threatening action and shot him half a dozen times but we live in hope.
This website mentions only 14 cases. For example, it mentions Michael Brown's case. He committed a crime by stealing something, and he initiated violence toward a police officer. What about the remaining 13 cases? Are you sure none of these 13 remaining people were guilty of criminal behavior? What point are you trying to make? As I said, I have a suspicion you are simply joking.
IdolEyes, please keep the conversation alive. After all, I am an old-timer on this board. We started speaking to each other in 2009... I just don't know if you seriously believe some of the things that you said on the BLM topic.
Both of you should watch The Fall of Minneapolis.
You will be relieved of all relevant ignorance.
https://www.reddit.com/r/Minneapolis..._debunkingits/
Thanks but I don't want anything endorsed by White Supremists. Call it a quirk.
I've moved on. Raccoons are the new black.Quote:
Originally Posted by OlegL
;)Quote:
Originally Posted by IdolEyes787I've moved on. Raccoons are the new black.Quote:
Originally Posted by OlegL
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You shouldn't have posted that. I had to put you on my list.
I don't think I am ignorant as far as this topic is concerned. The police officers definitely mistreated Floyd, but it's also true he was a scumbag who was elevated to sainthood after his death.Quote:
Originally Posted by j2k4
Watch the documentary and take note of the officers' training, as well as the fall-out from their having used the methods of restraint they were taught.Quote:
Originally Posted by OlegLThe police officers definitely mistreated Floyd.Quote:
Originally Posted by j2k4
I promise, you will be enlightened, and definitely NOT bored.
So you're saying that there are explosions and boobs? Probably should have lead with that.Quote:
Originally Posted by j2k4
Quote:
Originally Posted by IdolEyes787So you're saying that there are explosions and boobs? Probably should have lead with that.Quote:
Originally Posted by j2k4
Much as I love explosions, boobs, explosions of boobs and all similar variants, I meant that the intellectually curious would "not be bored". ;)