Scottish MPs at Westminster.
Should they be allowed to vote on matters which are devolved to Scotland.
Example - Education.
There is going to be a vote on reforms to the secondary education system. These changes would not effect Scotland, as education is devolved to the Scottish Executive.
Should Scottish MPs (ie from Scottish constituencies) be allowed to vote on matters like this. They will be effecting how education works in all other parts of the UK, whilst the rest of the UK cannot effect Scottish education.
Should the English and Welsh be annoyed about this. (I don't know the situation in Ireland). Or have they every right to vote as they are MPs.
My opinion is that they shouldn't, but I can see the counter argument.
Re: Scottish MPs at Westminster.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JPaul
Should they be allowed to vote on matters which are devolved to Scotland.
Example - Education.
There is going to be a vote on reforms to the secondary education system. These changes would not effect Scotland, as education is devolved to the Scottish Executive.
Should Scottish MPs (ie from Scottish constituencies) be allowed to vote on matters like this. They will be effecting how education works in all other parts of the UK, whilst the rest of the UK cannot effect Scottish education.
Should the English and Welsh be annoyed about this. (I don't know the situation in Ireland). Or have they every right to vote as they are MPs.
My opinion is that they shouldn't, but I can see the counter argument.
The vote may be questioned, or questionable, but they oughtn't be left from any debate, I don't think; surely they have good input?
Re: Scottish MPs at Westminster.
Quote:
Originally Posted by j2k4
Quote:
Originally Posted by JPaul
Should they be allowed to vote on matters which are devolved to Scotland.
Example - Education.
There is going to be a vote on reforms to the secondary education system. These changes would not effect Scotland, as education is devolved to the Scottish Executive.
Should Scottish MPs (ie from Scottish constituencies) be allowed to vote on matters like this. They will be effecting how education works in all other parts of the UK, whilst the rest of the UK cannot effect Scottish education.
Should the English and Welsh be annoyed about this. (I don't know the situation in Ireland). Or have they every right to vote as they are MPs.
My opinion is that they shouldn't, but I can see the counter argument.
The vote may be questioned, or questionable, but they oughtn't be left from any debate, I don't think; surely they have good input?
Good point, I hadn't thought of that.
Let them contribute to the debate, however preclude them from the decision making process.
That makes sense to me.
Re: Scottish MPs at Westminster.
Case in point is the recent vote on smoking. This was an issue which affected England alone, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland had already made their decisions. I don't know the breakdown, but the total number of votes exceeded the number of English MPs by about 50, so at least 50 non-English MPs voted on a matter which should not have concerned them. The fact that their participation did not affect the outcome is irrelevant.
Is it a problem which is being highlighted by all non-English MPs, or simply those in the Labour party? The latter certainly seem to have lost the concept of democracy.
Re: Scottish MPs at Westminster.
I can't see a case for them casting a vote if it doesn't affect Scotland. They can, by all means contribute to the debate though - especially if it is something we have already implemented here and there is relevant information to contribute.
Re: Scottish MPs at Westminster.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Biggles
I can't see a case for them casting a vote if it doesn't affect Scotland.
I don't quite agree there, but almost.
I don't see a case for them voting on issues which are devolved to the Scottish Executive. As they would then be voting on something which does not effect Scotland and on which other MPs don't have a vote on our Scottish position. Smoking is an excellent example.
However they should be allowed to vote on other (non devolved) matters which do not directly affect Scotland. They are after all MPs for the whole of the UK.
Re: Scottish MPs at Westminster.
Of course they should...Britain is unified. Just consider the different countries as counties..
Next question will be, should Asians have the vote in England...
Re: Scottish MPs at Westminster.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JPaul
Should they be allowed to vote on matters which are devolved to Scotland.
Example - Education.
There is going to be a vote on reforms to the secondary education system. These changes would not effect Scotland, as education is devolved to the Scottish Executive.
Should Scottish MPs (ie from Scottish constituencies) be allowed to vote on matters like this. They will be effecting how education works in all other parts of the UK, whilst the rest of the UK cannot effect Scottish education.
Should the English and Welsh be annoyed about this. (I don't know the situation in Ireland). Or have they every right to vote as they are MPs.
My opinion is that they shouldn't, but I can see the counter argument.
See, now thats my quandry...
I see the Justice of them not voting on "English" issues, and i believe most do this on a matter of principle anyway.
However... that would mean that "English Issues" would just about be controlled by the Conservatives. Granted, there is little difference between the Conservative Party and New Labour in England... it would still really piss most people off in the Labour Heartlands to see that the Party it elected couldnt control its own legislation.
I wouldnt be at all surprised if there was "Unofficial" pressure for the Scottish & Welsh MP's to vote in all these sessions...
The sooner the Scottish Parliament re-negotiates the Border as that marked out by Hadrian and THEN goes for full independance the better.... however if that Border isnt agreed, you can stay with those English Bastards in charge.
Re: Scottish MPs at Westminster.
Excellent point RF, re the majority in the house sans the Scottish Labour MPs. I hadn't thought of it in that way.
Do you think the political affiliation outweighs the argument. Bearing in mind that this is only for those things which have been devolved to the Scottish Executive.
Re: Scottish MPs at Westminster.
Did the English MPs vote on whether Scotland should have it's own Parliament?
Re: Scottish MPs at Westminster.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ava Estelle
Did the English MPs vote on whether Scotland should have it's own Parliament?
They did indeed. However that was before the Scottish executive existed and as such before there were any powers devolved to it.
I think the situation is different now. As Scottish MPs have the ability to vote on issues affecting the rest of the UK, whereas other MPs cannot vote on the same issue, as it effects Scotland. Education is a perfect example.
Re: Scottish MPs at Westminster.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JPaul
Excellent point RF, re the majority in the house sans the Scottish Labour MPs. I hadn't thought of it in that way.
Do you think the political affiliation outweighs the argument. Bearing in mind that this is only for those things which have been devolved to the Scottish Executive.
Morally... no, they should not.
Labour has no Mandate to govern in "England", just for the whole of the UK.
Practically though, thank god they are there sometimes...
What i DO object to, is when they vote to support the Government for something in England, which has already been rejected in Scotland or vis-versa.
I support some of the things that the Scottish Executive have done which goes against what the Labour Government wants.
Example:
Mr. Blair was only able to drive up university top-up fees through the House of Commons because of the votes of MPs from Scotland. Those top-up fees applied to England, not Scotland. Yet Scottish Students dont pay a Contribution to their Fees if they study in Scotland..... so voting to bring the Fees into play in England was Hypocracy of the worst kind by those Scottish MPs.
I used that particular example as Welsh Students studying in Wales dont pay the Top Up fee, so it was also Hypocritical of Welsh MPs.
Result: The English people didnt want them, the English MPs voted against them... but we got lumbered with them anyway, which is the result Blair (spit) wanted.
Re: Scottish MPs at Westminster.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rat Faced
Quote:
Originally Posted by JPaul
Excellent point RF, re the majority in the house sans the Scottish Labour MPs. I hadn't thought of it in that way.
Do you think the political affiliation outweighs the argument. Bearing in mind that this is only for those things which have been devolved to the Scottish Executive.
What i DO object to, is when they vote to support the Government for something in England, which has already been rejected in Scotland or vis-versa.
I support some of the things that the Scottish Executive have done which goes against what the Labour Government wants.
Example:
Mr. Blair was only able to drive up university top-up fees through the House of Commons because of the votes of MPs from Scotland. Those top-up fees applied to England, not Scotland. Yet Scottish Students dont pay a Contribution to their Fees if they study in Scotland..... so voting to bring the Fees into play in England was Hypocracy of the worst kind by those Scottish MPs.
Exactly my point. It's morally reprehensible of them to reject something in Scotland, but toe the party line in England.
Re: Scottish MPs at Westminster.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr JP Fugley
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rat Faced
What i DO object to, is when they vote to support the Government for something in England, which has already been rejected in Scotland or vis-versa.
I support some of the things that the Scottish Executive have done which goes against what the Labour Government wants.
Example:
Mr. Blair was only able to drive up university top-up fees through the House of Commons because of the votes of MPs from Scotland. Those top-up fees applied to England, not Scotland. Yet Scottish Students dont pay a Contribution to their Fees if they study in Scotland..... so voting to bring the Fees into play in England was Hypocracy of the worst kind by those Scottish MPs.
Exactly my point. It's morally reprehensible of them to reject something in Scotland, but toe the party line in England.
One would almost think they were looking after their own personal best interests in both jurisdictions. :O
