Dutch court rejects ban of paedophile party

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Dutch court rejects ban of paedophile party -ANP
Reuters Monday July 17, 11:43 AM

AMSTERDAM (Reuters) - A Dutch court said on Monday a political party formed by paedophiles could not be banned as it had the same right to exist as any other party, the ANP news agency ANP said.

The Brotherly Love, Freedom and Diversity party (PNVD) was launched in May and campaigns for a cut in the age of consent from 16 to 12 and the legalisation of child pornography and sex with animals.

A court in The Hague rejected a bid by a group campaigning against paedophiles to ban the party.

The judge said the Solace group had not made convincing arguments for an injunction: "They only want to express their moral concern. That is by no means sufficient to ban a party," ANP quoted the judge as saying.

The PNVD says it wants to lift the taboo on paedophilia which it said had intensified since the 1996 Marc Dutroux child abuse scandal in neighbouring Belgium.

The Netherlands, which already has liberal policies on soft drugs, prostitution and gay marriage, has been shocked by the plan. An opinion poll showed that 82 percent wanted the government to do something to stop the new party.

The party wants to allow possession of child pornography and supports broadcasting pornography on daytime television, with only violent pornography limited to the late evening.

Young children should be given sex education and youths aged 16 and up should be allowed to appear in pornographic films and prostitute themselves. Sex with animals should be allowed although abuse of animals should remain illegal, it says.

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I'm kind of shocked that they're letting this sort of organisation exist. I suppose if you know where they are, they're easier to keep tabs on... :unsure:

I just hope they never get elected. :no:

Any Dutch people care to comment?

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Originally Posted by Barbarossa

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Dutch court rejects ban of paedophile party -ANP
Reuters Monday July 17, 11:43 AM

AMSTERDAM (Reuters) - A Dutch court said on Monday a political party formed by paedophiles could not be banned as it had the same right to exist as any other party, the ANP news agency ANP said.

The Brotherly Love, Freedom and Diversity party (PNVD) was launched in May and campaigns for a cut in the age of consent from 16 to 12 and the legalisation of child pornography and sex with animals.

A court in The Hague rejected a bid by a group campaigning against paedophiles to ban the party.

The judge said the Solace group had not made convincing arguments for an injunction: "They only want to express their moral concern. That is by no means sufficient to ban a party," ANP quoted the judge as saying.

The PNVD says it wants to lift the taboo on paedophilia which it said had intensified since the 1996 Marc Dutroux child abuse scandal in neighbouring Belgium.

The Netherlands, which already has liberal policies on soft drugs, prostitution and gay marriage, has been shocked by the plan. An opinion poll showed that 82 percent wanted the government to do something to stop the new party.

The party wants to allow possession of child pornography and supports broadcasting pornography on daytime television, with only violent pornography limited to the late evening.

Young children should be given sex education and youths aged 16 and up should be allowed to appear in pornographic films and prostitute themselves. Sex with animals should be allowed although abuse of animals should remain illegal, it says.

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I'm kind of shocked that they're letting this sort of organisation exist. I suppose if you know where they are, they're easier to keep tabs on... :unsure:

I just hope they never get elected. :no:

Any Dutch people care to comment?

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I'm not Dutch (actually, I am), but hey, speech and expression are supposed to be free, right?

Who better to remind us what sick fucks these people are than they themselves? ;)

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Originally Posted by j2k4

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Originally Posted by Barbarossa

I'm kind of shocked that they're letting this sort of organisation exist. I suppose if you know where they are, they're easier to keep tabs on... :unsure:

I just hope they never get elected. :no:

Any Dutch people care to comment?

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I'm not Dutch (actually, I am), but hey, speech and expression are supposed to be free, right?

Who better to remind us what sick fucks these people are than they themselves? ;)

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Very good point.

I rather the sick fucks be out in the open, all rounded up together in a nice little political party.

Hopefuly their memebership will grow. That won't mean there'd be new pedophiles but pedophiles letting everyone know they are pedophiles.

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Originally Posted by Busyman™

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Originally Posted by j2k4

I'm not Dutch (actually, I am), but hey, speech and expression are supposed to be free, right?

Who better to remind us what sick fucks these people are than they themselves? ;)

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Very good point.

I rather the sick fucks be out in the open, all rounded up together in a nice little political party.

Hopefuly their memebership will grow. That won't mean there'd be new pedophiles but pedophiles letting everyone know they are pedophiles.

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I wonder if the Islamic contingent will give them the "Van Gogh" treatment?

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Originally Posted by j2k4

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Originally Posted by Busyman™

Very good point.

I rather the sick fucks be out in the open, all rounded up together in a nice little political party.

Hopefuly their memebership will grow. That won't mean there'd be new pedophiles but pedophiles letting everyone know they are pedophiles.

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I wonder if the Islamic contingent will give them the "Van Gogh" treatment?

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I hope not. It might deter them from "coming out".

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Originally Posted by Busyman™

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Originally Posted by j2k4

I wonder if the Islamic contingent will give them the "Van Gogh" treatment?

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I hope not. It might deter them from "coming out".

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Aye, true.

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Originally Posted by j2k4

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Originally Posted by Barbarossa

I'm kind of shocked that they're letting this sort of organisation exist. I suppose if you know where they are, they're easier to keep tabs on... :unsure:

I just hope they never get elected. :no:

Any Dutch people care to comment?

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I'm not Dutch (actually, I am), but hey, speech and expression are supposed to be free, right?

Who better to remind us what sick fucks these people are than they themselves? ;)

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/agreed


also if 82% want the party disbanded before it even properly exists, isn't it safe to say that they won't actually get any power, what with democracy and all :dabs:

ps. does this mean 12 year olds will get the vote?

The funny thing is... they're also campaining for basic animal rights o_O

Seriously though; I suppose it's the ultimate example of freedom of speech and democracy. It pretty much looks like the Dutch public isn't liking this at all so it'll take care of itself.

"lift the taboo on paedophilia"? "cut in the age of consent from 16 to 12"?

Let the sick fucks have their political party. Just tell me when and where the bastards are going to meet so I can be there.

I'm shocked that you'd think about joining.. :whistling




:P

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Originally Posted by Rat Faced

I'm shocked that you'd think about joining.. :whistling




:P

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No, I was thinking more along the lines of napalm. Any fucker who thinks it okay to have sex with a 12 year old deserves the pain of having all their skin burned off.

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Originally Posted by NikkiD

[ Any fucker who thinks it okay to have sex with a 12 year old deserves the pain of having all their skin burned off.

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That's my Nikkid. :wub:

Or slowly removed with a sharp cheese grater before being coated in vinegar.

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Originally Posted by CrabGirl

Or slowly removed with a sharp cheese grater before being coated in vinegar.

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That, too.

Good to see you about, BTW. :)

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Originally Posted by NikkiD

"lift the taboo on paedophilia"? "cut in the age of consent from 16 to 12"?

Let the sick fucks have their political party. Just tell me when and where the bastards are going to meet so I can be there.

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Me 2, though I'll stay out of Niks way. Ladies first. (never EVER get in a pissed off womans way when she's defending kids!) Though if you need to borrow some firepower let me know. I'll even donate some ammo....
Smoked pervs anyone?
Later taters,
bone

Again, I say leave them alone. Ridicule is enough.

It's not every day that pedophiles actually tell you they are pedophiles. That's a relief right there.

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Originally Posted by CrabGirl

Or slowly removed with a sharp cheese grater before being coated in vinegar.

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Aye, that's a good one.

@Busy - Ridicule is not enough. It won't keep them from harming a child. One wonders what privacy laws are like in Netherlands. Surely the fact that they have formed this group has raised eyebrows with the authorities. If someone is in favour of this type of activity, they probably do, or have at some point engaged it it. I don't think it's the sort of thing where you would blindly raise a hand in support and then say "it's not for me, but hey, to each his own".

I don't think it's that bad they actually profiled themselves.
86% of the population is against it, which basically means it's never ever going to pass.
Is it better for these people to stay within their own private groups, nurturing their obsessions and making themselves believe that what they want is ok? At least now they have an entire population to gauge themselves with.

It's finally been brought into the open now. People will be able to talk about it more freely and I believe, by doing that, dramatically increasing the chances of any child to defend itself against such people. After all... isn't anyone susceptible to peer pressure in the end?

I say let them voice their opinion and let them take the abuse of anyone else in the country.

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Originally Posted by Skweeky

I don't think it's that bad they actually profiled themselves.
86% of the population is against it, which basically means it's never ever going to pass.
Is it better for these people to stay within their own private groups, nurturing their obsessions and making themselves believe that what they want is ok? At least now they have an entire population to gauge themselves with.

It's finally been brought into the open now. People will be able to talk about it more freely and I believe, by doing that, dramatically increasing the chances of any child to defend itself against such people. After all... isn't anyone susceptible to peer pressure in the end?

I say let them voice their opinion and let them take the abuse of anyone else in the country.

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I understand what you're saying, and I do agree with part of it as far as it being discussed and raising awareness. However, this type of behaviour in most cases is a sickess, a compulsion if you will, not a lifestyle choice. Whether they believe what they're doing is wrong or not, they usually can't stop themselves from doing it, and no amount of public disdain is going to change that or curb it.

True, it would be like saying to yourself fancying men is wrong and it might not change their minds about whether it's right or wrong.
However, the more of these people that come out for who and what they are, the easier it will be to identify them. Let's hope every single one of them stands up and admits it so everyone can keep their kids away from them.

Rather have them out in the open than sneaking around some suburbian neighbourhood prowling on innocent children.

well freedom of speech and opinion is a great right. So these people have their rights to. I'm not judging if their ideas are good or bad.
Same as i wouldn't about a homosexual party or a moslim or christrian party or democratic party. There is hardly a chance this party will get enough votes for entering parliament.

However, the porn on daytime on public channels will gain a lot of voters :shifty:

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The Netherlands, which already has liberal policies on soft drugs, prostitution and gay marriage, has been shocked by the plan. An opinion poll showed that 82 percent wanted the government to do something to stop the new party.

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They forgot to mention our liberal rights/laws on abortion and euthanasia :pinch:

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Originally Posted by jetje

Same as i wouldn't about a homosexual party or a moslim or christrian party or democratic party. There is hardly a chance this party will get enough votes for entering parliament.

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The difference of course being that none of the above are illegal, whereas paedophilia ... ummm ... is. :blink:

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Originally Posted by Barbarossa

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Originally Posted by jetje

Same as i wouldn't about a homosexual party or a moslim or christrian party or democratic party. There is hardly a chance this party will get enough votes for entering parliament.

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The difference of course being that none of the above are illegal, whereas paedophilia ... ummm ... is. :blink:

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Well you hit the nail on it's head, doing is illegat atm, so that's exactly why they started this party. To discuss if that's a good law and if possible change the law over here.

And talking about that isn't forbidden, that's why the judge don't forbid a politicall party that has new 'bright' ideas on issues. If there are enough people that think their ideas should be heared in parliamant they will be elected.

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Originally Posted by Barbarossa

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Originally Posted by jetje

Same as i wouldn't about a homosexual party or a moslim or christrian party or democratic party. There is hardly a chance this party will get enough votes for entering parliament.

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The difference of course being that none of the above are illegal, whereas paedophilia ... ummm ... is. :blink:

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Yes, but freedom of speech and thought dictates that these people be allowed to stand before their fellow citizens and create an argument out of whole cloth that it is normal and healthy for toddlers to be used as sex toys, and society should be happy to sanction this behavior.

After all, here in America, the ACLU (a well-known and respected civil-rights organization) is "fighting the good fight" on behalf of pedophiles so that they might enjoy children as only pedophiles can, and everyone knows the ACLU is always on the "right" side of whatever cause it takes up.

Right? :dry:

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Originally Posted by j2k4

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Originally Posted by Barbarossa

The difference of course being that none of the above are illegal, whereas paedophilia ... ummm ... is. :blink:

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Yes, but freedom of speech and thought dictates that these people be allowed to stand before their fellow citizens and create an argument out of whole cloth that it is normal and healthy for toddlers to be used as sex toys, and society should be happy to sanction this behavior.

After all, here in America, the ACLU (a well-known and respected civil-rights organization) is "fighting the good fight" on behalf of pedophiles so that they might enjoy children as only pedophiles can, and everyone knows the ACLU is always on the "right" side of whatever cause it takes up.

Right? :dry:

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Do I detect a bit of sarcasm? :lol:

@Skweeky, I absolutely agree with your last. I only wish to add that not only do parents and children need to be vigilant, but the authorities need to be vigilant as well. If they want to do it, they will. In my opinion the only safe pedophile is one who is locked up.

If you cut of any debate that you think is wrong you never get anywhere in these kind of debates.

How long ago was it that they said you were mentally ill when you were a homosexual?
If you think about rape... Are you a Rapist? If you think about killing, Are you a killer? If you think about having sex with children? Are you a child abuser?

I don't know, none of it is my cup of tea. But i won't bring one of them to trial, cause they didnt wrong imho.

I rather have people with ideas that are way of what 'general public' finds 'normal' debate about it then seeing them forced to go underground and hide it. So we all can say "we don't see it, so it isn't out there"

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Originally Posted by NikkiD

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Originally Posted by j2k4

Yes, but freedom of speech and thought dictates that these people be allowed to stand before their fellow citizens and create an argument out of whole cloth that it is normal and healthy for toddlers to be used as sex toys, and society should be happy to sanction this behavior.

After all, here in America, the ACLU (a well-known and respected civil-rights organization) is "fighting the good fight" on behalf of pedophiles so that they might enjoy children as only pedophiles can, and everyone knows the ACLU is always on the "right" side of whatever cause it takes up.

Right? :dry:

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Do I detect a bit of sarcasm? :lol:

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Yes, yes, you do.

My apologies for malfeasance with respect to the use of the word "right". ;)

To not ban it was probably the right decision. It is not illegal to campaign for all speed restrictions in towns to be lifted for cars. It is illegal to speed at 150 through a housing estate.

It is probably a vain hope but if the matter is discussed in the open there is always a possibility that it will crystalise in the minds of those who might think otherwise that current laws are sensible and correct and should stay after all. If such people merely network with each other there is a danger that their own propaganda is not subject to the full rigour of open examination they will believe it without question. Equally I would argue that it is right for people like the BNP to have access to air their views - so people can see exactly how suspect their arguments are too.

There is also the advantage that if such people are prepared to stand-up then they are unlikely to be actively participating in what they are arguing for. In that respect the fewer secret paedophiles the better.

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Originally Posted by Biggles

To not ban it was probably the right decision. It is not illegal to campaign for all speed restrictions in towns to be lifted for cars. It is illegal to speed at 150 through a housing estate.

It is probably a vain hope but if the matter is discussed in the open there is always a possibility that it will crystalise in the minds of those who might think otherwise that current laws are sensible and correct and should stay after all. If such people merely network with each other there is a danger that their own propaganda is not subject to the full rigour of open examination they will believe it without question. Equally I would argue that it is right for people like the BNP to have access to air their views - so people can see exactly how suspect their arguments are too.

There is also the advantage that if such people are prepared to stand-up then they are unlikely to be actively participating in what they are arguing for. In that respect the fewer secret paedophiles the better.

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Tough to have a silly thread about serious stuff with you around, Les. :D

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Originally Posted by Skweeky

True, it would be like saying to yourself fancying men is wrong and it might not change their minds about whether it's right or wrong.
However, the more of these people that come out for who and what they are, the easier it will be to identify them. Let's hope every single one of them stands up and admits it so everyone can keep their kids away from them.

Rather have them out in the open than sneaking around some suburbian neighbourhood prowling on innocent children.

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;)

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Originally Posted by NikkiD

However, this type of behaviour in most cases is a sickess, a compulsion if you will, not a lifestyle choice. Whether they believe what they're doing is wrong or not, they usually can't stop themselves from doing it, and no amount of public disdain is going to change that or curb it.

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Anorexia nervosa?:unsure:

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Originally Posted by Busyman™

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Originally Posted by NikkiD

However, this type of behaviour in most cases is a sickess, a compulsion if you will, not a lifestyle choice. Whether they believe what they're doing is wrong or not, they usually can't stop themselves from doing it, and no amount of public disdain is going to change that or curb it.

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Anorexia nervosa?:unsure:

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Not me... I like food. :D

What's all this freedom of speech pish you are all talking about. That is not an absolute right, it has limits placed on it. For a very good reason. Society also has rights to protect itself.

In this country it is illegal to incite people to acts of terrorism. Surely to fuck it should be illegal to incite pedophile acts or to promote them being legitimised. When did it become OK for a group of people to hold meetings, or to lobby parliament for pedophile activity to be made legitimate.

So it's OK to have them all in the same place and know who they are. That's worth the cost of a step towards them being more acceptable, because that's what the Dutch Court has said. Changes often happen in small steps, not huge leaps. The Dutch Court has given pedophiles a wee bit of respectability, or acceptability if you prefer, thanks for that.

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Originally Posted by NikkiD

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Originally Posted by Rat Faced

I'm shocked that you'd think about joining.. :whistling




:P

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No, I was thinking more along the lines of napalm. Any fucker who thinks it okay to have sex with a 12 year old deserves the pain of having all their skin burned off.

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Thhe age of consent is 12 in spain... so do do you still want burn spaniards?

according to this table its 13 in spain, but its a valid point, there are lots of countries where the age of consent is 13/14, and to a certain extent it makes biological sense as most people are well into puberty by that stage.

btw whats the age of consent in south carolina the table says 14/16 with a question mark against it :huh:

edit: saw this and thought it was sensible:
In Germany intercourse is legal from the age of 14 provided both partners are aged under 18 (or 21 in some circumstances).

Cutting people's hands off for stealing is legal in some countries, so it must be OK. Female castration, that's common in some countries, let's adopt that as well.

Here's the new plan, if it's OK somewhere in the World, then it's OK.

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Originally Posted by JPaul

Cutting people's hands off for stealing is legal in some countries, so it must be OK. Female castration, that's common in some countries, let's adopt that as well.

Here's the new plan, if it's OK somewhere in the World, then it's OK.

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Hmmm.

Brings to mind the nascent but burgeoning (and annoying) compulsion of our U.S. Supreme Court to inform it's own decisions with those of the "World" community. :dry:

There are many here who disagree, but I think the tendency is intellectual laziness disguised as utter stupidity.

It seems my esteemed colleague JPaul is of similar opinion...though I am sure he will let me know if I am wrong. :P

I kinda of agree with there being no specific age of consent.

I was 14 the first time I had sex and after 9 years I don't feel that was the wrong thing to do, I was ready for it at the time.
Others might not be until a later age and then there's people who are mature a lot earlier.

I also think that it would just naturally fluctuate throughout the different generations. Who's the law to decide whether or not you're ready to make that commitment?

After all, despite us giving sex a lot of emotional value, it is mainly a biological act we've been acting out ever since man existed...

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Originally Posted by j2k4

U.S. Supreme Court to inform it's own decisions with those of the "World" community. :dry:

There are many here who disagree, but I think the tendency is intellectual laziness disguised as utter stupidity.

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I assume you don't mean "inform its decisions", but rather something like "align its decisions" otherwise what you've written is just plain daft...