Why are people paying for BT?

This is a serious question.
Why would anyone donate any reasonable amount of money to a torrent site?

I know there is server expenses, but so what? If the site can't sustain it's self in some other way than having a few foolish people throw money at the operators shouldn't the do everyone a favor and just shut down? I know there is people giving literally hundred of dollars a month away to torrent sites just so that they can have an extra star under their user name and keep the place running -and I just think "idiots".


I mean, if people are going to pay to download or help with server expenses shouldn't they just get a Usenet (newsgroups) account and leech all they want as fast as they can? Torrent sites aren't supporting the releasers, while some are just making their operators rich.

Why would anyone pay for BT other than pure ignorance?

My view is this:

I download 1 movie just about every day and as much music as i can find that i like.

Take yesterday for example, I downloaded;
* 35-40 music albums
* 2 DVD-r movies.

Now lets put that into money value as if i would buy it from a store;

£10 - £15 per album. (Some where afew years old and in england, The older ones cost more in a store because not everywhere will have them.)

So, Lets just say £10 to make it easy to work out, and lets make the number a clean 40 albums.

Thats £400 worth of music alone, Then add £13 per movie giving a total of £426 worth of content (In the industries eyes at least) for nothing.

To me, Giving a site probably $20 is worth it just to help to make sure it stays online and i can download what catches my eye.

If i could afford to buy the stuff, I would, But for a low income household with 3 kids under 5 to feed, cloth etc, Money doesnt stretch far enough as it is.

Suppose we have different perspectives though :)

the best torrent sites are run purely on donations. id rather give 10 dollars a month than pay to rent movies pay for cable buy cds or deal with ads.

It's a very good question... why would you pay them...
that's why i only gave 0.05 $ to tracker once because they were really honnest n' shit
:lol:

But ,nah seriously we don't need to pay those guys...
like in most warez places they get all for free :P
so if people are honnest they can just have ads n' stuff on their sites, but no need to pay them !!!

What I'm saying is why pay for something that other people are supply to you for free? The only guys getting paid are the middlemen that contribute nothing to the equation.

The people actually doing the releases, the people acctually doing the seeding, even the mods are not getting cash from these places. What donors are doing is giving cash to someone for doing almost nothing. It sounds like a pretty sweet scam once they make enough to cover hosting. They don't even have to run the site, mods will do it for them... and for free!

What is it these people using BT are paying for? They aren't paying for bandwidth, they aren't paying for customer support, they aren't paying for security... I'm just not understanding. Why not newsgroups if these guys (donors) have the cash to spend?

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Originally Posted by Broken

What I'm saying is why pay for something that other people are supply to you for free? The only guys getting paid are the middlemen that contribute nothing to the equation.

The people actually doing the releases, the people acctually doing the seeding, even the mods are not getting cash from these places. What donors are doing is giving cash to someone for doing almost nothing. It sounds like a pretty sweet scam once they make enough to cover hosting. They don't even have to run the site, mods will do it for them... and for free!

What is it these people using BT are paying for? They aren't paying for bandwidth, they aren't paying for customer support, they aren't paying for security... I'm just not understanding. Why not newsgroups if these guys (donors) have the cash to spend?

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1. Donating to p2l trackers is meaningless

2. Some of the best trackers barely scrape through, and staff have to pitch in. they are providing the best community and losing money over it, whereas sites liek torrentspy earn big money hosting files with viruses. :-/

3. A lot of releases comes from the scene, and a lot of the best trackers pay for scene access, for the releases. i.e. they pay uploaders. Its only that material that rolls downhill to the smaller trackers. Take aXXo releases. Its re encoded from the scene releases. LOL

4. User rips and releases : most of the user rips and releases come from users who want to improve their ratio. But there are some dedicated uploaders who want to share their content to the community. and they dont want money.

so instead of giving your money to artists, give them to BT tracker owners? Donating is the dumbest thing I've ever heard of. Only idiots donate.

Well I donate once in a while when I have some extra cash and I assure you I'm not an idiot. I do it because I like the communities and I would hate to see them go under. Site staff put in long ass hours and money of their own for what?? To be hated by members who feel they were wronged? Sure some barely scrape by but some do wind up making it I mean look @ SCT before they became P2L they had a surplus and people complained about that saying they were spending on themselves. It was proven that they had saved the money for "leaner" times. Also I have been hearing rumors about sites getting greedier and greedier with donations, but thats human nature I guess. The point is this, who are you guys to call people "Idiots" for wanting to help out others in need? Sure NG's would be cheaper but thats not the point, for me it's all about the community weather it's FST or SCT or Revolt or any of the other communities I am a part of I like it there I'm not just in it for the downloads. As Im sure alot of people aren't and IMO you guys sound like thats the only reason you're here and if you weren't so cheap you would have a server and go with NG's.

When I did use torrent sites (back at the start of BT), I can say I never visited a site for the community.
That's like saying you only read penthouse for the articles. lol
Looking in the worng place.

For community there is much better places to look.

I do think that about 90% of the people using torrents would be much happier with NG's but are just to cheap/unable to pay.
And the ones that are giving cash out... well I still don't get it. Is that star under your usernames really that big of a turn on?

Broken is just speaking out the truth .. lol

i dont mind donating to a site if i have some extra cash .like i donate a few bucks and download 100 times worth stuff .. thats ok for me . but renting a server just for seeding purpose is just stupid . i would rather pay that money for usenet and leech the hell out of it !

and as for community , i have never found a community better than FST

Well if people have enough money to donate hundreds of dollars to each month, its their choice to do it. Remember that for a lot of people this is their hobby. They enjoy doing it, and probably spend hours on a site every day reading posts chatting on irc, and downloading files. And its the same with any hobby, if you have a hobby you enjoy you do not mind spending some money on it. It goes for everything form collecting stamps to going to the gym, what ever your hobby is you usually spend money on it.

And if no one ever donated there will not have been many torrentsites thats for sure. And why is it ok pay for newsgroup access and not willingly donate to a torrent site?
And i really doubt news groups have the kind of pretimes that some of the torrentsite does.

For some people might do it for the star, but for others do it because they enjoy and appreciate the time and effort the mods and uploaders put into the site, and what to make sure that owner of the site is sitting alone with the bill for thousands of dollars just to keep the site running at a decent speed.

Edit; and for the record im not affiliated with any torrentsites nor have a ever donated any money to them. But i bow down and respect the people are a making sure my favorite site is here the next month.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Broken

When I did use torrent sites (back at the start of BT), I can say I never visited a site for the community.
That's like saying you only read penthouse for the articles. lol
Looking in the worng place.

For community there is much better places to look.

I do think that about 90% of the people using torrents would be much happier with NG's but are just to cheap/unable to pay.
And the ones that are giving cash out... well I still don't get it. Is that star under your usernames really that big of a turn on?

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Well I am on torrent sites for thier community ... thier IRC communitys ... and there is only 1 torrent site i would ever donate too - F*C -its the only one i trust ...

if u pay every month NG's are the way to go ... a one time donation every once in a while (like very 3-4 months) would be cheaper then NG's

I just want to, no more questions :)

I have donated to one tracker two separate times. I did so because they have served me very well for over a year now and I'm pleased with the service I have been receiving. A donation was just my way of thanking them.

Now, would I donate to a company from which I purchased.. say... a music cd? Of course not, they've already received compensation for their work. More people should donate if they enjoy these free services.

I think it ironic that this thread even exists, when you consider that the thread starter is so biased in the first place.

Remember that people have a choice.

On looking at the opening post, I see that Broken is actually loading his questions in favour of NGs. He is not simply asking, but weighing the question against torrent communities.

This sort of leading on, is a perversion...

You may have your opinions, but when you raise a question like...

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Why would anyone pay for BT other than pure ignorance?

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you load the question. How can anyone even answer that question? How can someone justify donating without admitting ignorance, according to your question?

Another loaded question...

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If the site can't sustain it's self in some other way than having a few foolish people throw money at the operators shouldn't the do everyone a favor and just shut down?

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Donators are stupid?

You fail to ask the question properly, or may be you aimed to raise the hackles of people who do donate.

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What I'm saying is why pay for something that other people are supply to you for free? The only guys getting paid are the middlemen that contribute nothing to the equation.

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Talk about loading a question. Can you post absolute proof that the people receiving donations are indeed middlemen who contribute absolutely nothing?

I doubt it.


More leading questions...

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For community there is much better places to look.

I do think that about 90% of the people using torrents would be much happier with NG's but are just to cheap/unable to pay.
And the ones that are giving cash out... well I still don't get it. Is that star under your usernames really that big of a turn on?

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There are much better places to look, in your own personal opinion, and how can you be certain that 90% of people would be much happier with News Groups? Again, you lead the question and you make unfounded assumptions.

If your going to raise questions, you need to be neutral, and if your biased, as indeed you obviously appear to be (towards NGs), then I question whether you are the right individual to even raise these questions.


Most people who simply ask why someone would donate to a torrent community, but the way you have worded your statements actually insults the people who donate to a torrent community. Whether you think it right or wrong, what gives you the right to be derogatory towards other peoples opinions and perceptions?

Damn brainy fox! Well said

yup nobody forces u to pay its a individuals decision whether he want to pay or not and if a poll is created to see how many users donate i dont think more 20% people donate

There are a lot of reasons why people pay for downloading .torrents.
The most important is that they do it because they want to.
The second, because they can.
And after that there are many reasons too... not everybody has 10mbits/10mbits connections and keeping ratio may become something really hard. Two years ago I had the best ISP and the most expensive connection in my country: 1536kbps/128kbps, so I couldn´t maintain any decent ratio at any site, I had two choices: a) go to public trackers, with my connection you can guess the rest b) pay a small amount, always very much less that what I´d pay for buying the same thing.
Besides, I think that people who run trackers deserve some kind of help for giving us free stuff, and in the meanwhile they work for us, spend a lot of time and resources. If they obtain benefits, good for them!!!! they deserve it... as long as making money is not their primary goal.
And, at last, if I´m comfortable in a community, if I get stuff, I´m well treated... why can´t I collaborate with an amount that makes me not richer nor poorer?. It´s so easy to get, to ask... even to demand, and doing absolutely nothing in change.
And in all these years nobody forced me, nowhere, to donate (not to pay... donate is the right word), so... it was, it is and it will be my choice.



By the way:
Chapeau!!! TheFox.

I wouldnt mind donating to trackers if it was a way of giving p2p legitimacy. ie If that money went to the artist's and to the torrent site.

I dont know why the RIAA and such like dont look at this as a way of "gaining control". how many people would mind paying £20 a month for waffles or somthing if that meant they werent breaking the law and could still enjoy the music they love. the artist would be happy the tracker staff would be minted, And the consumer would be pleased.

What do people think?

Grate post TheFox.

And munkyboy04, well i dont see this happening anytime soon.

And you also have to take into consideration that the RIAA and MPAA dont really want filesharing to stop.
Becouse if they managed to find a way to block everything or make it legal it would mean they they are actually handing in their own resignation.

Paying for filesharing is stupid especially when it comes to paying for scene releases, rewarding the leaders of great communities is not.

i haven't payed yet n i don't plan to do so in near future ;)

In my opinion, people donate because they can :P

Seriously, i have heard people say "because i love the community and want it to stay there forever" but then i kinda find it awkward when a tracker is TOTALLY dependent in "donations" (i.e. they don't spend money from their own pocket at all) but enforces it's strict rule upon it's member. What for? i mean all they have is .torrent file upped BY members...they don't have anything of their own...except those scripts...which pretty much anyone can buy nowadays. That is one reason i love tracker as THC where they put their OWN money to run the site...and i dislike site as S*** who freaking pm/ mail me every week for donation...or even worse some foreign tracker (can't remember the name) take their server offline when there isn't enough donation....TL is a different story now :P

On the other hand, i think many people donate to stay out of trouble. Say, you donate in site as OiNK...where as many say staff are strict. If you make mistakes while upping torrent, forum post etc...mod/admin tend to forgive you because of that shiny lil star you got by ur name. In addition to that, for some unknown reason, which i never understood i have found donaters tend to get along with staff...or is it staff getting alone with donaters?

I enjoy paying for BT! it makes me feel proud!

I enjoy donating but I enjoy p2l more...

Helping Trackers is something that all of you have to try!

People have different reasons for giving donations. I'm personally against p2l and p4i. However I would donate if I care for the community. People saying that BT sites don't have great communities didn't look harder (yes there are many with very poor communities, focused purely on the tracker, but there are a few with amazing members, helpful and with vast knowledge.

Look at FTN and FSC for example. People donate to these amazing communities just because they love them and want to support them, not because the files they get from them. And it's the same with other BT communities where you just want to show your appreciation for a great site that you belong. The reasons are completely different when paying for NG.

imo, donating to sites with p2l is not the best idea, especially if you're doing it only for the extra gigs you get. In that case, I would rather pay for NGs.

I kind of remember a site called Phoenix-Torrents.
Some of the guys that have been with BT since near the beginning will remember this one. At the time I think this place was still the K-lite forum (Kazaa based).

They had a great community, even I thought it was a great community and that's saying something. Thousands of users, hundreds of post every hour. It was one busy place.
Right after the original Supranova was taken offline, they decided that it was just too dangerous to run a tracker anymore. Because they had such a great community they didn't want to risk loosing it - heck the whole site was forum based anyways.

After a week they found out that the community they were so proud of was made up of about a dozen people. Soon after the site was taken offline.

Moral of the story....

(edit: I believe there is a new BT site called Phoenix-Torrents, an imitation and unrelated to the original in anything but name.)

i am donor on my favorite tracker and i am not idiot lol
i do it because i love the site, communitie, and what they do for us (when i donate its for the site not for mods or admine)
and to have good site without ads or pub ect...

That's why they called it communities, each one should have the community spirit, not only to chat in their IRC or post in their forums or seed their stuff, staffer's are working hard to operate their trackers, and provide their members with the scene releases even if they puts them selfs in risk to do that, so we should be thankful, and donate as much as we can, at least donate once for each respected tracker when u feel they r in need.

We are leeching many stuffs, which actually worth hundred of bucks out there, and we r getting them for free, so why we won't donate with only few bucks to them for god sake !!

People donate (people like me) because we really enjoy the tracker(s) that we're on. They're not demanding that you give them money, but if you truly appreciate the site you have the option to help out, even if it is only $5.

The only difference between a torrent site that allows donations and some other charitable event is, free stuff vs. a tax writeoff. Personally, I like free stuff. I'm not buying it either, because I never said I donated for upload credits or invites.

Two points worth mentioning now, and that is many online friends are friends at many communities. There are people I know here that I also know at other places. We tend to respond to each other likewise because we know of each other at each community.

It's a bit like the guy who frequents his usual public house, versus the guy who chooses a different venue each weekend. Some people stick with one community, while the majority of us will spread ourselves over several communities.

With reference to the Pheonix-Torrents demise, I remember the demise of UK-Fileshare, and how busy the IRC was. We also had a seperate forum running, and I know how many members disappeared after the demise. Simply put, the common bond between members is file sharing, and if you take that away, the bond will evapourate. Even on this forum, the underlying reason for people to be here is file sharing (esp. trading). Take that away and FST would fade away.

Believe me, though, when I formed my next community, I could draw on a wealth of members who wanted to join, simply because who had created it.

The other point I should raise is about donations and torrent commuities versus subscription news servers. The donation is purely that, a donation, and no one HAS to pay anything. When subscribing to a non free news group service (which usually has the best retention), you have to pay each month regardless of content you access. The free services often don't retain the material long enough, and in many cases will remove offending material a lot quicker than a paid for service.

On the subject of communities, what does make them desirable over using news groups? Is it because they are like private clubs where only members can access? Are smaller communities more desirable than larger ones? Is it because requests are filled much more quickly than a via a news group?

Why more people don't use news groups is the answer you wish to seek. News groups have been around longer than almost every other file sharing method (long before BT), yet it's popularity is not as great as BT. Why?

That is the question that should have been asked in the opening thread.

i happily donate money to my favourite trackers, its the least i can do to show my appreciation.

I'd pay to be on this site:fst: