Are ratio trackers becoming a bittorrent wrecking ball?

Hi all. Just wondered what people's opinions are on enforced ratio trackers, vs. the traditional tracker.

My experience with one of them has been more like taking on a second job, than just using a tracker.

I like the general idea of 'encouraging' users to seed, but I don't like my experience thus far.

Like some out there, I'm typically seeding something 24/7, and I give it the full pipe when I can. I have no problem sharing, but the nature of ratio enforcement has made it very hard for me to get anywhere.

Those who have spent time on ratio enforced trackers no doubt are aware of the downsides, but they may still disagree that it is a hassle, depending on how they use it.

So, I'm curious what percentage of torrent fans favor ratio trackers, vs. traditional. I'd post a poll if it was available.

I think you should rephrase your question

Sorry what's a enforced ratio tracker? Could you give an example of one?

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Originally Posted by sez

I think you should rephrase your question

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I don't understand. Either people like them or they don't, and some are bound to be better than others.

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Originally Posted by IdolEyes787

Sorry what's a enforced ratio tracker? Could you give an example of one?

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Sure, Ten Yard Torrents is one. Ratio enforced means that they require a minimum upload percentage in order to be a member and to be allowed download privledges. If you fall below the ratio, you can be suspended or banned.

I have heard that there are some 'ratio' trackers that don't enforce it. It's just a suggestion and a reminder, but TYT bans for 'bad' ratios.

The problem is, it's a lot easier to get a 'bad' ratio than you might think, even if you're a dedicated seeder like myself.

A traditional tracker and a ratio enforcing tracker are one and the same thing so..

Op, do you mean non ratio trackers being a wrecking ball or whatever to strict ratio trackers? :idunno:

If its 1:1 it's fairly easy IMO

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Originally Posted by sez

A traditional tracker and a ratio enforcing tracker are one and the same thing so..

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Mmm, well, maybe the actual code is, but the difference is that with an enforced ratio tracker
, they actively ban for bad ratios. So, regardless of any code differences, it's the policy that I'm ultimately referring to.

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Originally Posted by pone44

Op, do you mean non ratio trackers being a wrecking ball or whatever to strict ratio trackers? :idunno:

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No, I mean enforced ratio trackers (or clubs) kind of drying up the well of non-ratio trackers. Iow, are ratio trackers making it harder to find what you want on the non-ratio trackers?

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Originally Posted by va3156

If its 1:1 it's fairly easy IMO

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Well, this is where some of the details have made it so much harder for me than on traditional trackers.

I can do 100:1, even 1000:1...no limit really, on non-ratio trackers. Just leave it up there, and people leech.

But with ratio enforcement and the fear of being banned (which I was once), strict throttling and monitoring of your torrents is required, and a slip up and can hose your ratio.

One curious thing you see on ratio trackers are a huge number of torrents with all of the leeches, 10, 20, 30 of them, all trickling along at the same percentage.

This is NOT because the seeders can't serve it, it's because everyone has their download throttled so their ratios don't get hosed!

In an ironic twist, I am forced to download new files that I don't want, tweak the throttling to get it just right, and monitor it frequently, just to balance out the files that I do want, which typically have either all seeds, or leeches who are throttled!

Like I said, it's like a 2nd job to keep my ratio up! hehe.

The problem in my case, is that TYT seems to have a virtual lock down on the NFL torrents. I am unable to find any other good source of them.

So ThePirateBay = no ratio tracker ?

Yes it's easier to seed on no-ratio trackers (aka public trackers), and that's because there's no ratio rules so many people DON'T seed back and the people with the fat pipes do the brunt of the work. On private trackers that keep track of download and upload you will normally get better speeds because people who use them have faster upload and download, they have more knowledge (port forwarding) and they tend to hit and run less than on public trackers.

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Originally Posted by TrueSounds

So ThePirateBay = no ratio tracker ?

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Right.

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Yes it's easier to seed on no-ratio trackers (aka public trackers), and that's because there's no ratio rules so many people DON'T seed back and the people with the fat pipes do the brunt of the work. On private trackers that keep track of download and upload you will normally get better speeds because people who use them have faster upload and download, they have more knowledge (port forwarding) and they tend to hit and run less than on public trackers.

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Right, there are pros and cons both ways. I can understand why ratio based trackers have popped up.

My case is probably a niche case; 99% of the NFL stuff I can only find on TYT.

Ironically, once the TYT torrent has reached its' 'critical mass', continuing to seed yields almost zero gain. For example, you may have 30-50 seeders, and only one single leech per day pop on, which 50 seeds then try desperately to serve!

So, what I'm going to try doing is nabbing stuff off TYT, squeeze what I can out of it for my ratio, and then seed it to TPB or Mininova or something.

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Originally Posted by spaceboy909

So, what I'm going to try doing is nabbing stuff off TYT, squeeze what I can out of it for my ratio, and then seed it to TPB or Mininova or something.

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Why would you do that? Just to share the NFL torrents?

Does not seem to make sense. what good with that do, killing your ratio just to put files on another site? one that does not care about ratio. You would already have the files yourself.?

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Originally Posted by pone44

Does not seem to make sense. what good with that do, killing your ratio just to put files on another site? one that does not care about ratio. You would already have the files yourself.?

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Caring = sharing? :ermm:

This site that you are talking about should have a seeding bonus system,but if you think that this aint gonna happen then do exactly what the site is indirectly telling you to do.Get a seedbox,make that terabyte buffer and when you are done,enjoy the fruits of your labor.You can choose to hit and run or delete torrents the moment the minimum seed time is reached coz as far as ratio goes you are well beyond the site's requirements.

I am very confused...

I don't get it either, if you are finding a hard time with ratios why don't you find trackers with freeleech? (if there isnt any on the one you're on) but using up your download creds on TYT to seed on TBP doesnt make sense, I would think you would try to do the opposite?? :huh:

You people are incredible. You got so deep in the "business" of torrenting that you can't understand genuine people anymore. He is just one guy who likes NFL and would love to be able to download it without the fear of getting banned. And because he feels that ratio restrictions restrain people from getting what they truly want, he wants now to share the material he loves on a public tracker. Simple as that.

I like that answer, and tbh I was hoping that would be his reply.

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Originally Posted by Mugur

You people are incredible. You got so deep in the "business" of torrenting that you can't understand genuine people anymore. He is just one guy who likes NFL and would love to be able to download it without the fear of getting banned. And because he feels that ratio restrictions restrain people from getting what they truly want, he wants now to share the material he loves on a public tracker. Simple as that.

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Spot on! :)

With public trackers, nearly everything you try and download is either mislabelled (a scam) or is really slow to download. You find yourself spending hours downloading a new movie release only to find when you've got it that its got some password scam that really is just designed to get you to go to advertising sites (people who upload torrents like this actually make money from successful links). With private trackers (typically ratio based ones) you have a community of registered members who can download torrents that they know they can trust to be what they say they are and at exceptionally fast speeds. The ratio system was devised to ensure that people seed when they have downloaded so that other uses can enjoy that same fast speed. The more seeds the faster the torrent! Most sites, like my site for example work on this basis, but also generally offer incentives (like free leech periods so you can build on your ratio, or donation incentives, and credit systems) to make it more of an enjoyable experience for all. The credit system works based on how much you bother to seed your torrents. So even if you dont have a fast upload bandwidth, you can still accrue credits. The credits can then be used for various things, (depending on the tracker) most specifically for 'buying' upload ratio. All any private tracker generally asks is that you (a)seed back what you've taken, or (b) at the very least, seed back for a reasonable amount of time. I hope this has been imformative guys, I feel it really needs to be said just how much safer and more rewarding private trackers are.

Regards, Xodianbarr

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Originally Posted by Xodianbarr

With public trackers, nearly everything you try and download is either mislabelled (a scam) or is really slow to download. You find yourself spending hours downloading a new movie release only to find when you've got it that its got some password scam that really is just designed to get you to go to advertising sites

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There is a lot of that out there, but in 6 years of heavy bittorrent use, I've only been burned once! And it's rare that it takes me more than a day to get a large file.

A lot of people get burned simply because they will click any link that looks cool, and visit any old index that pops up. A little bit of caution and a pinch of 'street smarts' and you can easily avoid 99% of it.

Of course, I'm speaking from experience only in certain categories, such as actual DVD movie releases, tv shows and music.

I have no interest in warez or box office stuff like CAMS. Those may be bigger problem areas.

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With private trackers (typically ratio based ones) you have a community of registered members who can download torrents that they know they can trust to be what they say they are and at exceptionally fast speeds. The ratio system was devised to ensure that people seed when they have downloaded so that other uses can enjoy that same fast speed. The more seeds the faster the torrent! Most sites, like my site for example work on this basis, but also generally offer incentives (like free leech periods so you can build on your ratio, or donation incentives, and credit systems) to make it more of an enjoyable experience for all. The credit system works based on how much you bother to seed your torrents. So even if you dont have a fast upload bandwidth, you can still accrue credits. The credits can then be used for various things, (depending on the tracker) most specifically for 'buying' upload ratio. All any private tracker generally asks is that you (a)seed back what you've taken, or (b) at the very least, seed back for a reasonable amount of time. I hope this has been imformative guys, I feel it really needs to be said just how much safer and more rewarding private trackers are.

Regards, Xodianbarr

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Private/Ratio based trackers do have the best speed. I won't argue with that.

But it's just a huge PITA when a normally heavy seeder like myself has to constantly battle the system just to barely stay above the ban line.

And I'm not in a position to have 300 multi-gig torrents constantly on seed. 5-10 is my normal range. I like to help people complete files rather than serve them the 'trickle of death' across my entire collection.

Based on your info, it sounds like there may be better systems out there than the one that banned me. I may give one of them a whirl, but overall, I personally would rather deal with the very rare dead torrent at 99%, than to have to constantly stress out over ratios and ban threats.

My experience in the last 6 years has seen extremely few files that I was unable to get off of public trackers.

Private (ratio enforced) trackers often have new and hard to find stuff and download speeds are usually above average. The only downer is you have to seed back till you hit a certain ratio or risk getting cut off. this might be though to keep tabs on when you are seeding like 40 torrents in 1 go. Private trackers are also more secure since you have to get an invite and register before you can snoop around.

Public trackers are usually slower since there are allot more leeches for the seeders to take care of since no one has to seed back. They are also less secure.

Personally I prefer public trackers since I am in no rush to get anything. I also binge download allot (1 or 2 days a month of whording) so my downloads are collectively going at full speed.