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Accepted as reality or more conspiracy theory fodder?
Praise should go to the men and women who put their lives on the line to get him.
I'm just wondering, with thepresidential campaignmind-blowingly stupid season upon us, how this will be spun against the president.
I assume that definitive proof will be offered soon but proof never hindered conspiracy theorists, so expect the usual...Orly Taitz will chime in momentarily.
Obama succeeded in two years where Bush failed for seven, so obviously yeah, Obama fucked up somehow.
I'm sure The Donald will be happy to explain.
Is it wrong to hear this story and just think meh?
President Bush didn't fail and President Obama didn't succeed. I give the credit to the agents, be they military or intelligence operatives that did the work. Not just in this operation, I include all that went on before.Quote:
Originally Posted by clocker
http://insidetv.ew.com/2011/05/01/osama-bin-laden-dead/Quote:
Originally Posted by clocker
Attachment 73850
I find this to be complete horse shit. Can anyone actually see any member of a SEAL team or Special Forces team doing anything but high-fiving themselves standing over Bin Laden's body. There is no way they "washed" his body in accordance with Islamic traditions. I'd wager they put him in a body bag with a cinder block and pushed him over.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bloomberg.com
Someone was executed yesterday.
It sure took a long time to find him and (august 'til now) to actually 'get' him, I'm sure they're all majorly happy for it. But could you imagine how many guys Bin Laden has trained in the last 9 years with CIA tricks and tactics?
Here's hoping we see news of the U.S twarting the upcoming counter-attack huh?
The snippet you posted only says the body was taken out of Pakistan by the special forces team. It doesn't say who dealt with it from that point.Quote:
Originally Posted by Skiz
That said, while the team doubtlessly did celebrate a successful mission, they are also professionals who would have followed orders as to how to behave with the body.
Yes like shooting it several times .:ermm:Quote:
Originally Posted by devilsadvocateThe snippet you posted only says the body was taken out of Pakistan by the special forces team. It doesn't say who dealt with it from that point.Quote:
Originally Posted by Skiz
That said, while the team doubtlessly did celebrate a successful mission, they are also professionals who would have followed orders as to how to behave with the body.
Anyway I agree that whatever personal feelings might be involved and even discounting to the professional part , considering the complete scrutiny everyone involved was/will be under no one would be stupid enough not to dot every i and cross every t procedurally.
Does anyone else find it odd that killing terrorists is alright, but waterboarding them isn't? :mellow:
Bin Laden admitted the atrocities committed in his name. A lot of the wateboarding(torture) was applied to people who have since been proved innocent. Plus the fact that torturing prisoners is against the Geneva Convention.
I'm not talking about people in general; I'm discussing terrorists. To my knowledge, the only ones who ever claimed to have been waterboarded have been found guilty of everything under the Sun, or are still awaiting trial.Quote:
Originally Posted by bigboab
Also, at the time of the accusations, I don't believe waterboarding was considered torture as the subjects head is not submersed. Not sure if it is now either. Just going from memory though...
"Some" tried to redefine it, but it always was and still is torture. The methods used are pretty much identical to the methods used by the Japanese during WW2, for which they were executed for war crimes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Skiz
Presumption of innocence out the window then? Don't get me wrong. If I had my way people caught carrying out these atrocities would be shot on the spot. I would also apply the same treatment to anyone throwing a petrol bomb. Just imagine what a soldier or policeman doing his job has to suffer if he is caught in a petrol bomb explosioin.Quote:
Originally Posted by SkizI'm not talking about people in general; I'm discussing terrorists. To my knowledge, the only ones who ever claimed to have been waterboarded have been found guilty of everything under the Sun, or are still awaiting trial.Quote:
Originally Posted by bigboab
Also, at the time of the accusations, I don't believe waterboarding was considered torture as the subjects head is not submersed. Not sure if it is now either. Just going from memory though...
The worst terrorist of the recent times is dead now! I am satisfied.
That face that they did get bin laden in obama's presidencey helps him tremendously towards another 4 years. Also that there is really no competition out there. It's pretty sad state that we cant get good people in the office. Let's be honest Bush only wanted to make money for himself and his buddies.
I didn't really like Bush, but I disagree with you if you are implying that Bush didn't care about America. He wanted America to be a better place.
And I really hope Obama will be President for 4 more years.
oh he cared about America and the money it provided him and his friends. Do you realize all the unaccounted for money in iraq? BIllions of dollars. Just another one of his screw ups.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-south-asia-10774002
Granting all due credit to the multitudes involved, the fact still remains that intelligence agencies respond to the agenda of the White House and Bush flat out ignored OBL from the time he climbed off the rubble at Ground Zero till about mid 2006.Quote:
Originally Posted by devilsadvocate
The Bush administration was far more interested in ginning up a war with Iraq than pursuing a lone fugitive and by the time his capture was deemed politically desirable again, OBL had become very adept at hiding.
The emerging financial crisis distracted Bush yet again (he's an obviously poor multi-tasker) and ultimately, no matter how you sugar coat it, Bush failed to capture Bin Laden.
Obama made it an issue while campaigning, a priority after taking office and OBL is now dead.
Seems pretty cut-n-dried to me...Bush failed, Obama didn't.
@Clocker.
I think Obama has a good reality based policy when it comes to dealing with the terrorist threats we face. I think he takes a far more level headed approach, focusing on the issue and dealing with it rather than wasting time trying to scare everyone into supporting his approach. Obama has been proven right with so many of the things he said and the likes of Palin (actually just insert names here) have been shown to have little grasp of reality. I give the president all deserved credit for the job he has done and the calls he has had to make.
I give the president all credit for what I see as a very humble attitude to what quite frankly is the best news we've heard in a long time. IMO if this happened when Bush was president he would be wrapping himself in glory off the backs of those that actually put their lives on the line. Bush rode on the backs of the troops for most of his presidency.
I give Obama credit for risking what would have been a politically disastrous call had the mission failed, think Carter, but I do not give the glory for the success to Obama at all.
President Obama doesn't appear to be taking credit for killing Bin Laden, rightly so.
My opinion of his ideology since his election hasn't changed, my opinion of the man has become positive.I can't say I share his ideology, but I will state that president Obama isn't just the president in title, he really is presidential.
I can understand and appreciate- and for the most part, agree- with all you say, sir.
Your mention of Carter is timely, I had just been thinking of him and the fact that he bore the brunt of the blame for the extraction debacle.
When politically expedient, the Republicans will happily ignore the military's complicity in failure and blame the White House, very unlike today when the military (and via SP, George Bush)
get the credit and Obama's part is marginalized.
I have yet to hear how Bachmann or Trump will claim credit but have no doubt my wait will be short.
Tbh, I don't really see him being alive and at large with that announcement having been made.
The somewhat mysterious burial at sea could mean several things though.
*Might be someone really went to town on him while he was still alive, and they didn't dare drop him off with someone else because of it.
*Or someone did the same to his body, after they killed him.
*Or he's alive somewhere, in US custody. Fun times would be had, if so.
I suppose it could be some sort of witless protection scheme, but naaaah.
Other than that, yes he was a bad man, and whoever trained him, and whoever made him into what he was, he made some terrible choices in more senses than one, and deserved to be punished for it. However, like Zed says, someone died, actually more than one someone as it wasn't without collateral damage.
Hard to feel pity for him, but some of the people celebrating it around message boards and whatnot are such douchebags it's quite astounding, and disgraceful. But not necessarily in this particular thread or on this particular board, thankfully.
Well I think enough time has passed by to consider this answered
The usual suspects didn't disappoint and I doubt we've heard the dumbest of it yet.Quote:
Originally Posted by devilsadvocate
If the idea was to dispel doubts of his demise I find the choice of words strange . "You will not see bin Laden walking on this earth again."Quote:
Originally Posted by Snee
Hopefully, this "burial-at-sea" constituted whatever "washing of the body" took place.
I would've let out that he was buried somewhere in the sand, without disclosing any information whatsoever about the 'where' of things.
Where else would you expect a seal to get rid of a dead body but in the sea?:rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by j2k4
Bob...they weren't real seals, ffs.Quote:
Originally Posted by bigboabWhere else would you expect a seal to get rid of a dead body but in the sea?:rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by j2k4
And they did have shovels available.
Ffs.
Think about the element of surprise if they were.Quote:
Originally Posted by j2k4
Surprise, sure.Quote:
Originally Posted by devilsadvocateThink about the element of surprise if they were.Quote:
Originally Posted by j2k4
Never seen a real seal that could handle a firearm, though.
The pay back started
One makes it more likely for The 'Bama to get re-elected, so it's okay.Quote:
Originally Posted by Skiz
Have you a point or are you being vaguely anti-Obama here?Quote:
Originally Posted by 999969999One makes it more likely for The 'Bama to get re-elected, so it's okay.Quote:
Originally Posted by Skiz