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I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
Hi everyone, how you all doing? :)
I would like to make a discussion out of this: People worried about traveling to Israel.
As you all know, Israel has been under attack from the Palestinians for nearly 4 years now. This has cause major events not to take place in Israel (Maccabi Haifa had to play their Champions League clashes in Cyprus.. and that's only 1 example out of many).
Now, following the terrorist attack on London, my home city, I would like to ask ya'll: Why are you worried to come to Israel?
What's so different here than anywhere else in the world? 9/11, Baali bombings, Madrid, London...... nowhere is safe nowadays, so why not come and visit Israel?
The last suicide attack in Israel was over 6 months ago (which is a long time considering that during the first 6 months of the Intifadah there were around 2 attacks every week..).
I would like to argue the fact that sports organizations and culural organizations over the world are "affraid to come to Israel because of the ongoing war".
And I ask: Is it THAT much safer in New-York? London? Paris?
It's just a matter of time until the next one.
Israel, and this is a fact, has the safest airline in the world, the safest airport in the world, and generally is the safest place in the world considering the ammount of attacks that are attempted every year (hundreds are attempted, and the most you could get nowadays is 2 in the worst case, leaving 10-20 dead in the worst worst worst case).
So, do you now have any different feelings about the safety in Israel? I think it's sad that people brag about the safety of their country, when they don't even have 1 security guard at the entrance to the malls, a thing that could easily allow a mad terrorist to enter and blow up the place leaving tens dead and hundreds wounded... I think it's time the world woke up - using security guards can only help the country, and even the economy!!
Just think - more security guards = extra safety, AND LESS UNEMPLOYMENT.
Think about it - that's thousands of extra jobs for unemployed people who can get some cash in their hands and actually live a proper life.
What are your thoughts on this issue?
Rafi
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Re: I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
I wouldn't be afraid to take a trip to Isreal, in fact, I once considered transfering with my job there. But common sense would tell me that there are some areas that I definitaly shouldn't go into. But that isn't anything Isreal specific. Same as if I took a vacation in Jamaica.
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Re: I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
Sure there are places in Israel you keep away from.
Just a couple of examples:
The Muslim Quarter in the Old City of Jerusalem
Hebron
Anywhere too close to the Gaza strip and/or the West Bank
Anywhere too close to the Syrian/Lebanese border
There are plenty other places, but all of them together are only a minor percentage of Israel.... Israel is safe to visit and live in..!!!!!
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Re: I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
For many non-Jewish Americans, I'd imagine Israel ain't a blip on the Ihavtavisitthere radar.
Then add the fact of there being an ongoing war where a suicide bomber may walk into a cafe and reduce to rubble then there you have it.
Israel isn't known as a big tourist attraction besides Jerusalem.
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Re: I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
Maybe not, but please remember that the country that unfortunately suffered the biggest and most horrific attack ever was... the USA.
I visited the US on a Jewish delegation to Pittsburgh, and once again was amazed at the fact that there are NO guards at the entrances to simple places like cafe's and cheap shops.. even some malls.....
This fact could lead an Islamic nutjob who has US citizenship to create his own explosive device, and kill some 20 people tomorrow.
I'm shocked that after 4 major attacks on the world by Al-Quaeda all countries attacked have barely changed.
The US made adjustments to airports, but I think they overdid it - Israel's airport aint got half the devices that the US one has and is considered the safest airport in the world (and also has the biggest Duty Free :D).
London I bet you will carry on as if nothing happened to try prove to the terrorists that they are unbeatable. In another 2 years another attack will take place if Britain does not change it's security status.
The same regarding Madrid.
I hope I've made myself clear.
P.S: I never meant that people have to visit Israel... What I meant was that if people want to visit Israel and are scared, then they are completely out of order in my view, because as the world has seen - many other countries are extremely vulnerable to terrorist attacks.
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Re: I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
That is what terrorists want to do, spread fear and disrupt life.
If these countries that have been attacked have to put guards at these locations, terrorist have won.
But if you visited Busy's part of the land, I am sure he can tell you of having security everywhere. Tho that isn't against terrorists. More due to certain demographics.
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Re: I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
I think I agree with busyman on this one, certainly with regard to the travelling yank. There just aren't that many of them (proportionatelly) who leave the ewe essay to go anywhere.
If they do it's more likely to be a whistle stop tour of Europe.
Israel doesn't really have that much to entertain your average travelling phillistine.
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Re: I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
Well, if you're looking for amusement parks and stuff like that then no.
Israel has many cultural places to visit, even for non-jews: Nazareth, the Jordan river, Jerusalem, Eilat, the deserrt and many more.
@Tikibonbon: Fine, lets not put up guards, say we won, and live in the fear that the next person coming in might just be the one who will blast the place down.. is that what you want?
As I said - more guards = more safety, less enemployment.
I don't see why people should object to this.
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Re: I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
Heavy handed techniques to combat terrorists don't work. Israel are the country which retaliate the hardest against terrorist strikes and they have the worst problem. An eye for an eye only precipitates the problem.
You say that nothing will change in London. Good. I hope we continue with the same freedom of movement and expression as we always have. Yes we will be vigilant but we cannot offer our citizens 100% security against this sort of thing. The people understand this.
I believe that we were targeted because of our affiliation with the US' aggressive foreign policy. I hope that our government takes heed of this and distances itself. Apart from increased vigilance by our police and other institutions - that is the only reaction I want to see.
As to visiting Israel; I would not. There are a few cities that I would like to visit because of their historical significance but until the trouble at those places ceases significantly then I will not put myself or my family at risk ... added to that, while on holiday I don't wish to be herded like cattle because of draconian security measures implemented because it's simply not safe to do otherwise.
Thanks anyway.
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Re: I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
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Originally Posted by JPaul
I think I agree with busyman on this one, certainly with regard to the travelling yank. There just aren't that many of them (proportionatelly) who leave the ewe essay to go anywhere.
If they do it's more likely to be a whistle stop tour of Europe.
Israel doesn't really have that much to entertain your average travelling phillistine.
hmm, I wonder how the 117 travel agencies in this town stay open then.....
Isreal is actually a major destination, we do have a few Jews after all. :)
JPaul, you seem to dismiss all the humanitarian groups that travel the world over on a continual basis. For example, my gf makes two trips to honduras annually.
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Re: I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
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Originally Posted by tralalala
I visited the US on a Jewish delegation to Pittsburgh, and once again was amazed at the fact that there are NO guards at the entrances to simple places like cafe's and cheap shops.. even some malls.....
This fact could lead an Islamic nutjob who has US citizenship to create his own explosive device, and kill some 20 people tomorrow.
Why do you assume that the sort of nutjob who could do this would be Islamic? Before 9/11, the biggest terrorist attack on American soil was the Oklahoma City bomb, courtesy of one Timothy McVeigh (non-Islamic). After 9/11, there were the snipers in Washington, also non-Islamic, and then the Anthrax letters. Also, perpetrated by a non-Islamic.
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Originally Posted by tralalala
London I bet you will carry on as if nothing happened to try prove to the terrorists that they are unbeatable. In another 2 years another attack will take place if Britain does not change it's security status.
The same regarding Madrid.
I would hate it if my freedom of movement and other civil liberties were curtailed because of the actions of terrorists. It's a credit to all the cities and countries involved to show the strength of character to stand firm against these atrocities, and go about business as usual.
Security has been stepped up a hundredfold since 9/11, and the threat level is constantly being reviewed, but if someone is that organised and that determined to blow something up, there is not alot else that can be done.
Excepting of course if we lived in a Police State. Thankfully, the number of people who are twisted enough to do this is a tiny tiny minority.
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Originally Posted by tralalala
I hope I've made myself clear.
Unfortunately you have, and I feel a bit sorry for you now, you seem very frightened.
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Originally Posted by tralalala
P.S: I never meant that people have to visit Israel... What I meant was that if people want to visit Israel and are scared, then they are completely out of order in my view, because as the world has seen - many other countries are extremely vulnerable to terrorist attacks.
The only part of Israel that would interest me is the Dead Sea, but I'd probably find it all a bit too hot for my liking, terrorists or not. ;)
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Re: I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
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Originally Posted by tralalala
As I said - more guards = more safety, less enemployment.
Bush is doing is best to turn us into a police state, let's not give him more opportunities. :lol:
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Re: I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
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Originally Posted by Tikibonbon
That is what terrorists want to do, spread fear and disrupt life.
If these countries that have been attacked have to put guards at these locations, terrorist have won.
But if you visited Busy's part of the land, I am sure he can tell you of having security everywhere. Tho that isn't against terrorists. More due to certain demographics.
Washington DC and Maryland?
No actually.
There are concierges/guards in multi-tenant buildings and the number increase in those folks are due to a terrorism threat. I know this specifically from going into Barry Farms projects and also going places like the Treasury building, FBI, Secret Service, and hell I even have to go back to Reuters News (I was there yesterday).
We have absolutely no increase in security due to demoGraphics...and what demographic would that be anyway? :huh:
Congress , The White House and AAFB being nearby? :huh:
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Re: I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
Not having guards outside every mall and shop is something we're pretty proud of here, and I'd think our American neighbours are too. It means we're not living in fear. We have emergency responses set up if it happens, but we don't live in fear of when it's going to happen. I hope I'm never reduced to living in the kind of fear that drove me to want armed guards searching me every time I wanted to go shopping.
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Re: I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
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Originally Posted by Busyman
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tikibonbon
That is what terrorists want to do, spread fear and disrupt life.
If these countries that have been attacked have to put guards at these locations, terrorist have won.
But if you visited Busy's part of the land, I am sure he can tell you of having security everywhere. Tho that isn't against terrorists. More due to certain demographics.
Washington DC and Maryland?
No actually?
There are concierges/guards in multi-tenant buildings and the number increase in the folks are due to a terrorism threat.
We have absolutely no increase in security due to demobraphics...and what demographic what that be anyway? :huh:
Congress , The White House and AAFB being nearby? :huh:
Last time I was in DC, went to a Safeway, and what do I see? About 10 security guards.
I am rather sure they weren't there due to terrorists. :lol:
It was in a predominatly non-white we will call it area.
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Re: I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tikibonbon
Quote:
Originally Posted by Busyman
Washington DC and Maryland?
No actually?
There are concierges/guards in multi-tenant buildings and the number increase in the folks are due to a terrorism threat.
We have absolutely no increase in security due to demobraphics...and what demographic what that be anyway? :huh:
Congress , The White House and AAFB being nearby? :huh:
Last time I was in DC, went to a Safeway, and what do I see? About 10 security guards.
I am rather sure they weren't there due to terrorists. :lol:
It was in a predominatly non-white we will call it area.
You are lying. There aren't 10 security guards at the front of any government building and I've been to every single Safeway in DC.
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Re: I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
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Originally Posted by Tikibonbon
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Originally Posted by JPaul
I think I agree with busyman on this one, certainly with regard to the travelling yank. There just aren't that many of them (proportionatelly) who leave the ewe essay to go anywhere.
If they do it's more likely to be a whistle stop tour of Europe.
Israel doesn't really have that much to entertain your average travelling phillistine.
hmm, I wonder how the 117 travel agencies in this town stay open then.....
Isreal is actually a major destination, we do have a few Jews after all. :)
JPaul, you seem to dismiss all the humanitarian groups that travel the world over on a continual basis. For example, my gf makes two trips to honduras annually.
He did say proportionatly, he wasnt getting at you ;)
There are plenty of Americans that get around a bit, however per head of population its quite low.
This is probably because you have just about every climate/terraine etc within your own country somewhere, so why go through the hassel of getting a passport.
As to visiting Israel... the chances of being blown up by a bomb even when the terrorist threat was at its hight was very small. It wouldnt have noticably affected any plans i'd have.
I agree with those before me, if we let our lives change because of the terrorists, then they have won.
I dont wish to live in a police state, i'd rather take my chances with a Terrorist threat, thanks.
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Re: I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tikibonbon
Quote:
Originally Posted by JPaul
I think I agree with busyman on this one, certainly with regard to the travelling yank. There just aren't that many of them (proportionatelly) who leave the ewe essay to go anywhere.
If they do it's more likely to be a whistle stop tour of Europe.
Israel doesn't really have that much to entertain your average travelling phillistine.
hmm, I wonder how the 117 travel agencies in this town stay open then.....
Isreal is actually a major destination, we do have a few Jews after all. :)
JPaul, you seem to dismiss all the humanitarian groups that travel the world over on a continual basis. For example, my gf makes two trips to honduras annually.
Sorry if I wasn't clear, as I said I was referring to the average travelling phillistine.
That is entirely different from people who travel for religious or humanitarian reason. People in those groups would be less interested in the security situation than tourists would be.
Given the talk of sporting events and touristy type stuff I thought that's what the thread was about. Rather than pilgrims or aid workers.
Sorry for any confusion. I must remember not to agree with busyman again, it leads to no good.
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Re: I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JPaul
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tikibonbon
hmm, I wonder how the 117 travel agencies in this town stay open then.....
Isreal is actually a major destination, we do have a few Jews after all. :)
JPaul, you seem to dismiss all the humanitarian groups that travel the world over on a continual basis. For example, my gf makes two trips to honduras annually.
Sorry if I wasn't clear, as I said I was referring to the average travelling phillistine.
That is entirely different from people who travel for religious or humanitarian reason. People in those groups would be less interested in the security situation than tourists would be.
Given the talk of sporting events and touristy type stuff I thought that's what the thread was about. Rather than pilgrims or aid workers.
Sorry for any confusion. I must remember not to agree with busyman again, it leads to no good.
Fuck were you thinkin'?
You like standin' in front of a dart board? :ermm:
(I could have sworn I saw "average travelling phillistine" like at the end of yaw pawst but maybe people missed it, schucks :pinch: )
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Re: I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
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Originally Posted by Busyman
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tikibonbon
Last time I was in DC, went to a Safeway, and what do I see? About 10 security guards.
I am rather sure they weren't there due to terrorists. :lol:
It was in a predominatly non-white we will call it area.
You are lying. There aren't 10 security guards at the front of any government building and I've been to every single Safeway in DC.
well, there were 2 cops on duty at the Holiday Inn Express we stayed in Morningside last weekend ( you know the one across the street from the main gate of Andrews Air Force base Busyman )
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Re: I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
@Manker: what's better: 50% secure with freedome and all, or 80-90% secure with minor changes (simply opening your bag for the guard to check, and a 1 second scan with his/her hand held metal detector)?
I would vote for the second. I do not want to live indefinately, I want to live safe like I do today.
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Re: I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
We have more than ten security guards on duty at any time in most large department stores in Cardiff. Always have as far as I know, some are hidden away watching shoppers on little screens, but they're there.
What's all the fuss about :unsure:
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Re: I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
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Originally Posted by tralalala
@Manker: what's better: 50% secure with freedome and all, or 80-90% secure with minor changes (simply opening your bag for the guard to check, and a 1 second scan with his/her hand held metal detector)?
I would vote for the second. I do not want to live indefinately, I want to live safe like I do today.
All hand luggage is checked by metal detectors and x-ray machines when flying anywhere from Britain.
Whatcha talking about.
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Re: I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
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Originally Posted by RPerry
Quote:
Originally Posted by Busyman
You are lying. There aren't 10 security guards at the front of any government building and I've been to every single Safeway in DC.
well, there were 2 cops on duty at the Holiday Inn Express we stayed in Morningside last weekend ( you know the one across the street from the main gate of Andrews Air Force base Busyman )
Yup I sure do. That's a popular spot for AAFB visitors who don't stay on base and a nice fuck spot for folks that from a club called Classics a quarter mile down the street (Allentown Rd).
The reason for the cops, it's a busy intersection near AAFB. There are also fuck spots (pun intented) near other entrances to AAFB like the Comfort Inn and Econo Lodge that have no police presence at all.
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Re: I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
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Originally Posted by manker
We have more than ten security guards on duty at any time in most large department stores in Cardiff. Always have as far as I know, some are hidden away watching shoppers on little screens, but they're there.
What's all the fuss about :unsure:
....but we don't have 10 security guards walking around grocery stores like Safeway. :dry:
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Re: I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
Everyone and every bag travelling on a plane in the UK goes thro either x-ray machines or metal detectors or both.
I am now quite used to walking thro' the archway metal detector, then also having a rub-down search carried out. It happens more often than not now, probably just the way I look.
I have no problem with this. However I would not like things to escalate too much. Just the sight of the armed Policemen at Heathrow makes me both uncomfortable and comforted at the same time.
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Re: I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
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Originally Posted by Busyman
Quote:
Originally Posted by manker
We have more than ten security guards on duty at any time in most large department stores in Cardiff. Always have as far as I know, some are hidden away watching shoppers on little screens, but they're there.
What's all the fuss about :unsure:
....but
we don't have 10 security guards walking around
grocery stores like Safeway. :dry:
Hmm. I don't go shopping much but reckon that at Asda or Tesco, over here, there would be about that number of security personel.
Just for dealing with shoplifters and weirdos. I've never been in a Safeways but the big grocery stores here also sell stuff like DVDs, clothes and things. Ten isn't an unreasonable number.
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Re: I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
Quote:
Originally Posted by manker
Quote:
Originally Posted by Busyman
....but we don't have 10 security guards walking around grocery stores like Safeway. :dry:
Hmm. I don't go shopping much but reckon that at Asda or Tesco, over here, there would be about that number of security personel.
Just for dealing with shoplifters and weirdos. I've never been in a Safeways but the big grocery stores here also sell stuff like DVDs, clothes and things. Ten isn't an unreasonable number.
It's highly irregular here. Last time I went to a DC Safeway, there was a whole one guard at the front of the store.
Tikonbon was outright lying. It's as simple as that.
There weren't 10 security guards walking around at my local Target (similar to WalMart) and I was there to personally breakdown the floor model of this gazebo http://images.amazon.com/images/P/B0...CLZZZZZZZ_.jpg
during and after store hours. :dry:
edit: as far the Safeways, I've been everywhere including the bowels of the stores in DC.
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Re: I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
Well, regarding JPauls wording of being uncomfortable with armed policemen at Heathrow - we have people walking above with shotguns (armymen) all over the country... My neighbour recently left the army and used to bring his gun back every night...
As amazing as it sounds, here in Israel people are actually so used to seeing people with guns/other weapons, that being in a place like London after the blast wouldn't concerne them too much......
The difference is amazing..
Once again - in the shopping "compund" near my home there are security personel checking out the cars as they arrive, PLUS there are security guards at the entrance to each and every shop/store/food place with a handheld gun and a metal detector..
I must say the last time I was in Scotland (last November), I was amazed at not getting scanned at the entrance to a mall in Glasgow (it felt pretty weird.. :lol:)...
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Re: I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
Quote:
Originally Posted by manker
Quote:
Originally Posted by tralalala
@Manker: what's better: 50% secure with freedome and all, or 80-90% secure with minor changes (simply opening your bag for the guard to check, and a 1 second scan with his/her hand held metal detector)?
I would vote for the second. I do not want to live indefinately, I want to live safe like I do today.
All hand luggage is checked by metal detectors and x-ray machines when flying anywhere from Britain.
Whatcha talking about.
I was taling about simple little places such as cafe's and little fish n' chip shops... that's where most blasts would take place. Or on a bus...
Nowadays in Israel you have a security person on buses when approaching stations to go through the bus a inspect people. Most of the Arab-Israelis get stared at mostly, and I must say that I think the feeling must be horrible if you're a simple person going to work, but hey, it's for our safety.
Another thing people don't know - On most El-Al flights (Israels airline), there is a security person with a gun in civilian clothing... And I feel totally comfortable with it, as I know I am safe from people wanting to attack Jews/Christians or any other people.
And in response to the person who wrote that attacks prior to 9/11 were not Muslim attacks: Yes, you are right, but in modern times in the 21st century attackers are all Muslim, and the Muslims them selves do not do anything to condemn the terrorists acts, and I think they should do something about it...
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Re: I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
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Originally Posted by tralalala
I must say the last time I was in Scotland (last November), I was amazed at not getting scanned at the entrance to a mall in Glasgow (it felt pretty weird.. :lol:)...
Where the feck is a "mall" in Glasgow.
We will not live in fear.
I must not fear.
Fear is the mind-killer.
Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration.
I will face my fear.
I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path.
Where the fear has gone there will be nothing.
Only I will remain.
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Re: I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tralalala
Quote:
Originally Posted by manker
All hand luggage is checked by metal detectors and x-ray machines when flying anywhere from Britain.
Whatcha talking about.
I was taling about simple little places such as cafe's and little fish n' chip shops... that's where most blasts would take place. Or on a bus...
Nowadays in Israel you have a security person on buses when approaching stations to go through the bus a inspect people. Most of the Arab-Israelis get stared at mostly, and I must say that I think the feeling must be horrible if you're a simple person going to work, but hey, it's for our safety.
Another thing people don't know - On most El-Al flights (Israels airline), there is a security person with a gun in civilian clothing... And I feel totally comfortable with it, as I know I am safe from people wanting to attack Jews/Christians or any other people.
And in response to the person who wrote that attacks prior to 9/11 were not Muslim attacks: Yes, you are right, but in modern times in the 21st century attackers are all Muslim, and the Muslims them selves do not do anything to condemn the terrorists acts, and I think they should do something about it...
Well I think we just revealed why many tourists don't visit Israel.
I would personally feel less safe being "policed" by armed forces and having to submit to violations of personal freedoms than I do in the trusting society I live in.
Here's a thought... and it's just me mulling things around in my head so I don't really have any proof to back it up other than my own logic.
Is it possible that by creating a police state, and forcing people to live in fear, and others to live under oppression, scorn and disdain, that you actually escalate terror attacks? I would be interested to know if attacks happen more frequently in so called "secure" societies, or in ones where freedom is more important.
By the way, you have insulted all Muslims. They HAVE condemned the terrorist attacks, and are no more responsible for the extremists who perpetrated them than you are. They share a faith, and I say that loosely.
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Re: I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
And last i heard, Basques weren't Muslims, neither were P9 or the Orange County Skinheads.. they're white supremisists :blink:
And theres always the arguement that Israel itself, together with most coalition forces have all comitted "Terrorist" acts.
Just because the perpetrator is in uniform doesnt change the crime.
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Re: I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
You can't measure safety in security guards.
The fact that they are there indicates that shit has a tendency to happen.
'sides, I reckon that if some loon with a bomb doesn't get me, some Israeli nutjob soldier with rubber bullets will.
And there's really nothing to see there for me I can't find elsewhere ('cept maybe for that weird dana-bloke that won the eurovision song contest, those don't grow on trees), what with me not being a person of faith and all.
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Re: I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Busyman
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tikibonbon
Last time I was in DC, went to a Safeway, and what do I see? About 10 security guards.
I am rather sure they weren't there due to terrorists. :lol:
It was in a predominatly non-white we will call it area.
You are lying. There aren't 10 security guards at the front of any government building and I've been to every single Safeway in DC.
Well, just returned home to see this. Busy, nowhere did I mention security guards in front of government buildings. Not once. Keep your words out of my mouth.
I will admit, I did the common exageration thing on the number of guards (more like 6 or 7), and nowhere did I imply it was due to terroist threats.
The "demographic" I was speaking of was younger black teens/twenties folks.
You may have been to every single Safeway in DC, so what? It is not that uncommon for places like this to hire off duty police officers to walk around stores and keep an eye out for shoplifters. Go to NYC, Dallas, LA, it's a common practice.
In ending, you are not Bush, please don't try to control what I see. :lol:
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Re: I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
Quote:
Nowadays in Israel you have a security person on buses when approaching stations to go through the bus a inspect people. Most of the Arab-Israelis get stared at mostly, and I must say that I think the feeling must be horrible if you're a simple person going to work, but hey, it's for our safety.
Wow...
I live in Germany and regularly go in an out of American posts, often on buses. The only time you have people searching you on a bus is when the alert is high (like the few months right after 9/11). Only when they feel we are under a direct threat.
Even though they changed alerts in the US we have not experienced any changes.
When I visited Egypt a few years back I experienced the kind of security you are talking about... There were almost as many armed police/security around as civilians. That scared me more then all the things I had heard before going (generaly things like fair hair/fair skinned people and children getting kidnapped as I had my young childrenwith me).
I could not imagine living in those conditions or paying to go and vacation in them again.
TD
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Re: I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
The image of the country would stop me coming. If you're asked to name an area in the world where your most likley to die not from natural causes im sure alot of people would say the middle eastern area, just because of how the media has reported on the area and such.
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Re: I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
I'd go to Israel anyday, in fact I plan on doing so (Jerusalem) after I graduate from High School, always wanted to go to a place of history, even if it was mostly violent (and yes I'm taking into account the Crusades as well).
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Re: I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
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Originally Posted by JPaul
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Originally Posted by tralalala
I must say the last time I was in Scotland (last November), I was amazed at not getting scanned at the entrance to a mall in Glasgow (it felt pretty weird.. :lol:)...
Where the feck is a "mall" in Glasgow.
We will not live in fear.
I must not fear.
Fear is the mind-killer.
Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration.
I will face my fear.
I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path.
Where the fear has gone there will be nothing.
Only I will remain.
Please to be keeping youself up to date.:) The Argyle Arcade is now The Argyle Arcade Shopping Mall.:lol: Does not tell you that you need a fortune to buy anything in there though.:)
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Re: I would like to argue something pretty important to me.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cpt_azad
I'd go to Israel anyday, in fact I plan on doing so (Jerusalem) after I graduate from High School, always wanted to go to a place of history, even if it was mostly violent (and yes I'm taking into account the Crusades as well).
Would you be taking your guns along :unsure: and in the hope of making peace in the middle east with them :rolleyes:
