Hurricane Katrina...

[Everose]

Well Evey, you engulf the entire thing into Emergency Prepardness. I did not.
It IS Emergency Prepardness but I choose to separate natural disaster relief from anti-terrorism. They are different. The way I worded my post made that CaptainObvious.

Which is it? Is Bush a security minded cowboy as you seem to say a lot of people think, or does he not care about national security? Yesterday you claimed he didn't give a shit. Now he is way too security minded because he allocates money for terrorism emergencies.

Bush puts forth the notion yet is shit at follow through. Mmk? Putting forth the money means shit if the proper oversight isn't in place to make sure it is spent properly.

So have patience with me here.... Bush allocates the spending to the states, etc., and elected officials in these states should be seeing that it is spent properly? Or Bush should allocate and follow every state, city, ward, parish and see that it is spent properly?

What is he good at? Apparently remaining President of the United States. You have to hand it to him....that isn't easy for any man these days.

He's good at playing Bible card to the poor and religious right and the money card to the rich. Some of those are the same people of course.
If your poor and religious - "Hey I'm not good for your job situation but I don't like gays."
If your rich - "I'll put money in your pocket."

Yes, he is definitely a politician.

Guess I don't understand your 'They can afford to now' statement, Busy. First you were running with the 'we can't afford to because of Iraq.' Now you are saying we all of a sudden can afford to.

I never said we can't afford to because of Iraq. Wtf?!!!

I very well could have misunderstood your comments, Busy. If so, please accept my apology.

Please explain to me exactly what you think the federal government should have done here. Sent the National Guard and the US Coast Guard in before the levee broke? Who would have rescued them? As it was, the Coast Guard had to retrieve a lot of it's own people before it could rescue others. I am thankful someone had the sense not to send the National Guard in before they did. Then we would have had even longer delays, no?

Sent rescuers in a day. I wish the US Coastal Guard and the National Guard could have been there within the hour, but twelve hours is what they say it took.

A lot of effort has been put forth here to explain responsibilities of self, city, parish and state in this situation, also. I really feel the federal government met its responsibilities as quickly as possible. But the local effort failed miserably. Why did they not prepare for this, knowing a lot of their citizens didn't have the means to get out by themselves. And also knowing a lot of them would choose not to, even given that choice? I look around in my own city and I am aware who would need assistance out of here. For me to expect the federal government to know is absurd. Are you suggesting the Department of Defense should have had time to be in these areas, on the ground with buses, food and supplies before the levee broke? Just in case of?

No

You are angry about some baseball stadium when the schools in your area need work; you should be and have a right to that anger. Was the stadium put up for a bond issue/public vote? Have the schools attempted bond issues to repair and rebuild? Has the public voted these bond issues down?

The stadium was being built with taxpayer money and extra tax on area businesses. One councilwoman did step in and got part private financing in the 11th hour.

First you say that our borders are going to shit and imply nothing is being done. Then you say it is not our problem. Which is it, Busyman?

The problems of illegal immigrants are not ours besides the fact they shouldn't be here. Oh damn...I said that already. I disagree.

I am getting dizzy trying to follow you. No oversight on what? By whom?

Oversight on how federal money is being spent. If there is oversight, it's shit oversight.

yes, well, Bush doesn't oversee how states and cities spend their federal funds, although many times they come with their own little stipulations. You don't want him to, do you?

[Busyman]

Well Evey, you engulf the entire thing into Emergency Prepardness. I did not.
It IS Emergency Prepardness but I choose to separate natural disaster relief from anti-terrorism. They are different. The way I worded my post made that CaptainObvious.


Bush puts forth the notion yet is shit at follow through. Mmk? Putting forth the money means shit if the proper oversight isn't in place to make sure it is spent properly.

So have patience with me here.... Bush allocates the spending to the states, etc., and elected officials in these states should be seeing that it is spent properly? Or Bush should allocate and follow every state, city, ward, parish and see that it is spent properly?
Since it isn't being spent properly, maybe the President that's so fcoused on terrorism should change a coupla things, eh?

What is he good at? Apparently remaining President of the United States. You have to hand it to him....that isn't easy for any man these days.

He's good at playing Bible card to the poor and religious right and the money card to the rich. Some of those are the same people of course.
If your poor and religious - "Hey I'm not good for your job situation but I don't like gays."
If your rich - "I'll put money in your pocket."

Yes, he is definitely a politician.

Guess I don't understand your 'They can afford to now' statement, Busy. First you were running with the 'we can't afford to because of Iraq.' Now you are saying we all of a sudden can afford to.

I never said we can't afford to because of Iraq. Wtf?!!!

I very well could have misunderstood your comments, Busy. If so, please accept my apology.
Cool. I did see where another member said what you referenced.

Please explain to me exactly what you think the federal government should have done here. Sent the National Guard and the US Coast Guard in before the levee broke? Who would have rescued them? As it was, the Coast Guard had to retrieve a lot of it's own people before it could rescue others. I am thankful someone had the sense not to send the National Guard in before they did. Then we would have had even longer delays, no?

Sent rescuers in a day. I wish the US Coastal Guard and the National Guard could have been there within the hour, but twelve hours is what they say it took.
What, to the Louisiana state line?

A lot of effort has been put forth here to explain responsibilities of self, city, parish and state in this situation, also. I really feel the federal government met its responsibilities as quickly as possible. But the local effort failed miserably. Why did they not prepare for this, knowing a lot of their citizens didn't have the means to get out by themselves. And also knowing a lot of them would choose not to, even given that choice? I look around in my own city and I am aware who would need assistance out of here. For me to expect the federal government to know is absurd. Are you suggesting the Department of Defense should have had time to be in these areas, on the ground with buses, food and supplies before the levee broke? Just in case of?

No

You are angry about some baseball stadium when the schools in your area need work; you should be and have a right to that anger. Was the stadium put up for a bond issue/public vote? Have the schools attempted bond issues to repair and rebuild? Has the public voted these bond issues down?

The stadium was being built with taxpayer money and extra tax on area businesses. One councilwoman did step in and got part private financing in the 11th hour.

First you say that our borders are going to shit and imply nothing is being done. Then you say it is not our problem. Which is it, Busyman?

The problems of illegal immigrants are not ours besides the fact they shouldn't be here. Oh damn...I said that already. I disagree.
No, I did say that. Twice now.

I am getting dizzy trying to follow you. No oversight on what? By whom?

Oversight on how federal money is being spent. If there is oversight, it's shit oversight.

yes, well, Bush doesn't oversee how states and cities spend their federal funds, although many times they come with their own little stipulations. You don't want him to, do you?

You generalized "federal funds" all you want. Just like you can do with "Emergency Prepardness". The fact is these federal funds were earmarked with proper specificity and so as not to be used any old whichaway. Some places were trying to "figure out" what to do with the money and bought bull . They were almost no guideines from the the new HLS. Money needed to earmarked specifically by threat and risk assessment of ANY disaster. Being serious about terrorism doesn't mean "Well hell I gave you money."

Bush is the head of this country and he needs to stand up and be a leader and not a muppet with dollars in his hand. Hold states accountable. As it sits now, states have to spend the money just to get more (I know that's how it's worked before but it's fucking stupid).

[BigBank_Hank]

We’ve been bickering so much in this thread that it’s about time for some good news.

The good news is that both levees breaches have been fixed and the city’s water level is beginning to recede. The water level has gone down a foot in some areas of the city, which is great news. This is happening even though the largest pump in the city isn’t up and running yet and when that thing starts pumping it won’t be long before the water is all gone. I don’t think that it will take the originally estimated 30 days to pump the water out of there. I think that we may be looking at a week or so to do it if they can get all of the pumps up. So far there are two running and there are a total of 6 in the city.

[Busyman]

We’ve been bickering so much in this thread that it’s about time for some good news.

The good news is that both levees breaches have been fixed and the city’s water level is beginning to recede. The water level has gone down a foot in some areas of the city, which is great news. This is happening even though the largest pump in the city isn’t up and running yet and when that thing starts pumping it won’t be long before the water is all gone. I don’t think that it will take the originally estimated 30 days to pump the water out of there. I think that we may be looking at a week or so to do it if they can get all of the pumps up. So far there are two running and there are a total of 6 in the city.

Good news Hank. I saw where they kept dropping sandbags (or something) into the water by helicopter. Now I see it's piled up nicely.

[GepperRankins]

i think bush is gonna get off the hook on this one. he's leading the inquiry into what went wrong.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/4220246.stm


well now i'm just angry

[Rat Faced]

Good news at last.


Edit: that was aimed at the water level lowering, not the fact that Bush is going to whitewash everything again.


Now, can anyone tell me why Bush refused the Aid that was offered him, until he was forced to accept it by political pressure?

Especially the French Aid, which was available immediately from the Carribean.

Notice to that Cuba and Venezuela were amongst the 1st to offer Aid, despite everything Bush has said about them... and he still hasnt even had the decency to acknowledge the Cuban offer, despite publicy saying he would accept any aid offered from abroad.

Russian Aid was also refused at 1st..

The FEMA water convoys were filled in Texas and waiting to go before the Hurricane hit, and they were told to stay where they were for 3 days, why?

The Drivers were really pissed about that..


This is not the way to fight a natural disaster.

And a report from 31st August:

On tonight's news, CTV (Canadian TV) said that support was offered from Canada. Planes are ready to load with food and medical supplies and a system called "DART" which can provide fresh water and medical supplies is standing by. Department of Homeland Security as well as other U.S. agencies were contacted by the Canadian government requesting permission to provide help. Despite this contact, Canada has not been allowed to fly supplies and personnel to the areas hit by Katrina. So, everything here is grounded. Prime Minister Paul Martin is reportedly trying to speak to President Bush tonight or tomorrow to ask him why the U.S. federal government will not allow aid from Canada into Louisiana and Mississippi.

Hell, Canadians dont even need a passport to fly to the US usually, do they?

[Everose]

Dang it Busy, I am about half punch drunk from fatigue tonight, and have grown weary of all the finger pointing...even my own....so I am going to answer only one of your statements. (not that I couldn't do darn good with the rest)

First you say that our borders are going to shit and imply nothing is being done. Then you say it is not our problem. Which is it, Busyman?

The problems of illegal immigrants are not ours besides the fact they shouldn't be here. Oh damn...I said that already. I disagree.
No, I did say that. Twice now.


Smart Aleck!!!!

[GepperRankins]

check #174 for my theory. can't think of any other reasons.

well apart from the embarrassment of USA accepting help from france, russia, cuba and venezuala

[Busyman]

Good news at last.


Edit: that was aimed at the water level lowering, not the fact that Bush is going to whitewash everything again.


Now, can anyone tell me why Bush refused the Aid that was offered him, until he was forced to accept it by political pressure?

Especially the French Aid, which was available immediately from the Carribean.

Notice to that Cuba and Venezuela were amongst the 1st to offer Aid, despite everything Bush has said about them... and he still hasnt even had the decency to acknowledge the Cuban offer, despite publicy saying he would accept any aid offered from abroad.

Russian Aid was also refused at 1st..

The FEMA water convoys were filled in Texas and waiting to go before the Hurricane hit, and they were told to stay where they were for 3 days, why?

The Drivers were really pissed about that..


This is not the way to fight a natural disaster.

And a report from 31st August:

On tonight's news, CTV (Canadian TV) said that support was offered from Canada. Planes are ready to load with food and medical supplies and a system called "DART" which can provide fresh water and medical supplies is standing by. Department of Homeland Security as well as other U.S. agencies were contacted by the Canadian government requesting permission to provide help. Despite this contact, Canada has not been allowed to fly supplies and personnel to the areas hit by Katrina. So, everything here is grounded. Prime Minister Paul Martin is reportedly trying to speak to President Bush tonight or tomorrow to ask him why the U.S. federal government will not allow aid from Canada into Louisiana and Mississippi.

Hell, Canadians dont even need a passport to fly to the US usually, do they?

I fucking knew it even from the timing of our own shit...

'cause now I know help was a rearing to go and the major help, it seems, was put into a fucking holding pattern and until the savior Jebus Bush came to have fucking photo ops even during a conversation with a grieving woman!!!

(The above is from post #156 btw)

That's pretty slick of him leading an investigation into much his own fuck up.

The timing of him coming "with the food" is even more obvious and despicable as the timing of Clinton all of a sudden having to go to war in Iraq when he was in hot water.

Clinton was wagging the dog.
Bush is manufacturing a savior.

[Busyman]

Dang it Busy, I am about half punch drunk from fatigue tonight, and have grown weary of all the finger pointing...even my own....so I am going to answer only one of your statements. (not that I couldn't do darn good with the rest)

First you say that our borders are going to shit and imply nothing is being done. Then you say it is not our problem. Which is it, Busyman?

The problems of illegal immigrants are not ours besides the fact they shouldn't be here. Oh damn...I said that already. I disagree.
No, I did say that. Twice now.


Smart Aleck!!!!