New Evolution spat in U.S. schools goes to court

[GepperRankins]

so we're lab rats in another race's experiment?

[lynx]

For JP.



Note the extra long handle for those very deep holes.

[Busyman]

For JP.



Note the extra long handle for those very deep holes.

[clocker]

The physics I believe suggests that the Universe we live in is but one of many. Part of a multiverse if you will.

This explains how you cannot accept my argument that the (alleged) designer of this Universe would not also have to be God.

Uh uh.
I cannot accept your argument because it is illogical and semantically impossible.

[whypikonme]

The physics I believe suggests that the Universe we live in is but one of many. Part of a multiverse if you will.

Which physics would that be? l'm not aware of any mainstream claim to that effect.

[JPaul]

The physics I believe suggests that the Universe we live in is but one of many. Part of a multiverse if you will.

This explains how you cannot accept my argument that the (alleged) designer of this Universe would not also have to be God.

Uh uh.
I cannot accept your argument because it is illogical and semantically impossible.

Please explain how it is semantically impossible.

[clocker]

From Dictionary.com...
u·ni·verse ( P ) Pronunciation Key (yn-vûrs)
n.
All matter and energy, including the earth, the galaxies, and the contents of intergalactic space, regarded as a whole.

"All matter and energy" would include your hypothetical "meta-universe" too, would it not?
Just because we have yet to detect another layer of existence/matter/being does not exclude it from the universe as already defined.
"Universe" is, well...universal...the definition logically expandable to include new aspects as they are discovered.

What's next JP?
A debate over the number of angels on a pinhead?

In essence, you want your cake and mine as well.
Either your God created everything or not.
If so, the Intelligent Designer=God.
If not, then indeed, maybe one day as I was building clocks I created the universe.

You still owe me for Scotland, BTW.
Everyone else has paid up but you guys.

[JPaul]

Fair enough, points well made. If we take the universe as meaning everything, everywhere and not just a finite "universe" in which we live then you are indeed correct.

I agree that the Intelligent Designer must logically be God.

I had more taken the view that there was more than one "universe", meaning that a being from another, older one may have designed ours.

I had also taken the view that ultimately it was God who had created this "multiverse".

[j2k4]

Fair enough, points well made. If we take the universe as meaning everything, everywhere and not just a finite "universe" in which we live then you are indeed correct.

I agree that the Intelligent Designer must logically be God.

I had more taken the view that there was more than one "universe", meaning that a being from another, older one may have designed ours.

I had also taken the view that ultimately it was God who had created this "multiverse".

I think you fellows are missing the point.

I.D. is being offered anew as a "third" way, so to speak; the strict view of evolutionists presents I.D. as an allusion to Religion (even worse, Christian religion!) and Godly oversight.

For (most) Christians-the choir, in this case-the very idea of I.D. represents an idea they've never needed to be sold.

It is not beyond the realm of possibility (nor could any truly open-minded person deny) that there might be a third way.

I mean, such a being would only have to be vested with slightly more power than man currently is as viewed by the "Global-Warming is Man's Fault" theorists, and they pretty much get a free ride when other more easily-credible (read: obviously non-religious) ideas get the full-on skeptic treatment from the media and other know-nothings like us.

Funny what this all-pervading and undifferentiated fear can make people do and say.

As to whether or not such should be part of school curricula, wither those who feel youngsters should be trusted in matters of life-and-death (abortion/soldiering, etc.), but would also keep them from the perilous decisions anent Intelligent Design, Evolution and/or Religion.

Smacks of inconsistancy.

[clocker]

I think you fellows are missing the point.

I.D. is being offered anew as a "third" way, so to speak;

No, I think you ( and all proponents of this nonsense) are trying to obfuscate it.
The "point" of ID as it is being packaged for sale is to get religion taught as science.
Period.

Day One, third period...Science class.
"Today we will be exploring the theory of Intelligent Design."
"Who is the Intelligent Designer?"
"Ummmm...we don't know, but it's NOT God!"
"Right then, what do we talk about tomorrow?"