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Thread: Some "surprising" polling information about...

  1. #1
    j2k4's Avatar en(un)lightened
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    ...American attitudes regarding abortion; this from a periodical I recently read.

    ...on the May 11 Nightly News, NBC anchor Brian Williams claimed that-

    "Most Americans believe a woman has a right to an abortion.

    Most Republicans do not."


    While it's true most Americans don't want abortion banned under all circumstances, the vast majority favor restrictions on abortion, and only 16%, according to a February '07 Washington Post poll, want abortion to be "legal in all cases."

    Further, a May 4-6 poll CNN/Opinion Research found that 50% identified themselves as "pro-life" while a minority of 45% called themselves "pro-choice."

    NBC's own April poll documented that Americans, 53% to 34%, agreed with the Supreme Court's decision to uphold a federal law banning partial-birth abortions.


    For your information.
    “Think about how stupid the average person is, and then realize that half of 'em are stupider than that.” -George Carlin

  2. The Drawing Room   -   #2
    Busyman™'s Avatar Use Logic Or STFU!
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    Quote Originally Posted by j2k4 View Post
    ...American attitudes regarding abortion; this from a periodical I recently read.

    ...on the May 11 Nightly News, NBC anchor Brian Williams claimed that-

    "Most Americans believe a woman has a right to an abortion.

    Most Republicans do not."


    While it's true most Americans don't want abortion banned under all circumstances, the vast majority favor restrictions on abortion, and only 16%, according to a February '07 Washington Post poll, want abortion to be "legal in all cases."

    Further, a May 4-6 poll CNN/Opinion Research found that 50% identified themselves as "pro-life" while a minority of 45% called themselves "pro-choice."

    NBC's own April poll documented that Americans, 53% to 34%, agreed with the Supreme Court's decision to uphold a federal law banning partial-birth abortions.


    For your information.
    Uh...great. Thanks....I guess.

  3. The Drawing Room   -   #3
    phrenzy's Avatar Baked BT Rep: +10BT Rep +10
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    ummmmm ok.......

  4. The Drawing Room   -   #4
    lynx's Avatar .
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    The problem with the periodicals posting poll extracts like this is that there's no frame of reference. In this case the polls are about abortion, but the same applies no matter what the subject.

    From the information given we can't tell the background to the Washington Post poll in Feb '07, we don't know the questions asked in the May 4-6 poll conducted by CNN/Opinion Research, and we have no idea of the circumstances surrounding NBC's April poll.

    If we had access to the full polls in each case, we might find that the overall impression was far different than the one the periodical is portraying. On the other hand we might find that the periodical has played down its conclusions, although that would seem to be unlikely. Which ever is the case, cherry picking various bits from different polls is not statistically sound, no matter what the subject.

    Consequently the only sensible reaction is "so what"?
    .
    Political correctness is based on the principle that it's possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.

  5. The Drawing Room   -   #5
    j2k4's Avatar en(un)lightened
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    Well, one might safely assume that the main-stream media is just a wee bit off in their almost daily intimations that the U.S. public is "overwhelmingly in favor of unrestricted access to abortion" in all circumstances.

    Also that the anti-abortion crowd is not even "mainly" composed of "right-wing religionists".

    One might even wonder why such results are not reported by the institutions which commissioned them.

    A reasonable person might be curious about these things, even though respondents here are inclined to dismiss them.
    “Think about how stupid the average person is, and then realize that half of 'em are stupider than that.” -George Carlin

  6. The Drawing Room   -   #6
    vidcc's Avatar there is no god
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    Quote Originally Posted by j2k4 View Post
    Well, one might safely assume that the main-stream media is just a wee bit off in their almost daily intimations that the U.S. public is "overwhelmingly in favor of unrestricted access to abortion" in all circumstances.

    Also that the anti-abortion crowd is not even "mainly" composed of "right-wing religionists".

    One might even wonder why such results are not reported by the institutions which commissioned them.

    A reasonable person might be curious about these things, even though respondents here are inclined to dismiss them.
    Where has the mainstream media ever said that the U.S. public is "overwhelmingly in favor of unrestricted access to abortion" in all circumstances?

    Every report I have ever read, seen or heard said that most favored legal terminations with some restrictions. I have never seen one that suggested most are in favor of unrestricted access.
    What I have seen is that most do not believe it should be illegal "in all circumstances".

    In fact the ONLY time I have ever seen or heard anyone suggest that anyone (read Liberals) wants unrestricted abortions up to the second before the mother goes into labor is from the disingenuous, misleading, spinning mouths of right wing talk radio, people like hannity on faux or from right wing anti choice groups and blogs.

    it’s an election with no Democrats, in one of the whitest states in the union, where rich candidates pay $35 for your votes. Or, as Republicans call it, their vision for the future.

  7. The Drawing Room   -   #7
    lynx's Avatar .
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    Quote Originally Posted by j2k4 View Post
    Well, one might safely assume that the main-stream media is just a wee bit off in their almost daily intimations that the U.S. public is "overwhelmingly in favor of unrestricted access to abortion" in all circumstances.

    Also that the anti-abortion crowd is not even "mainly" composed of "right-wing religionists".

    One might even wonder why such results are not reported by the institutions which commissioned them.

    A reasonable person might be curious about these things, even though respondents here are inclined to dismiss them.
    You've made the assumption that the periodical presumably wanted you to make, and that's where the problem lies.

    Taking snippets of "information" from different polls is scientifically and statistically unsound. We aren't told the question or the context. Any comment made without those basic pieces of background is worthless, no matter what the subject matter.

    However, lets look at the way you've misinterpreted even the small amount information given.

    Well, one might safely assume that the main-stream media is just a wee bit off in their almost daily intimations that the U.S. public is "overwhelmingly in favor of unrestricted access to abortion" in all circumstances.
    It doesn't say anywhere (at least in the parts you showed us) that the main-stream media intimates that the U.S. public is "overwhelmingly in favor of unrestricted access to abortion" in all circumstances. That's your interpretation, and isn't supported by the original article.

    Also that the anti-abortion crowd is not even "mainly" composed of "right-wing religionists".
    It doesn't say that either, I don't even see any mention of religion. Again, your interpretation, not supported by the original article.

    One might even wonder why such results are not reported by the institutions which commissioned them.
    If these results were not reported, how did the unnamed periodical quote the origins of the snippets they extracted? More unsupported misinterpretation.

    A reasonable person might be curious about these things, even though respondents here are inclined to dismiss them.
    Given that there isn't enough information to make an unbiased judgement, the only justified comment is the one I made earlier - so what?
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    Political correctness is based on the principle that it's possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.

  8. The Drawing Room   -   #8
    j2k4's Avatar en(un)lightened
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    Do you feel "so what" if you read something like this?

    CNN Caught Falsifying Results of Abortion Poll

    By Gudrun Schultz

    UNITED STATES, May 15, 2007 (LifeSiteNews.com) - CNN covered up poll results showing a majority of respondents were pro-life, blogger Joel Johannesen accused in a posting on ProudToBeCanadian.ca.

    CNN conducted the massive poll, released on May 9th, which covered wide-ranging issues with an anti-conservative bent. Question 43 addressed abortion, asking respondents, “With respect to the abortion issue, would you consider yourself to be pro-choice or pro-life?”

    The largest percentage--50 percent--of respondents indicated they considered themselves to be pro-life, compared to 45 percent who said they considered themselves to be pro-choice.

    That question was not discussed in CNN’s coverage of the poll. Despite citing response percentages for questions dealing with issues such as the Iraq war, national health insurance and economics, CNN glossed over the abortion response by stating that “Americans are divided over abortion rights” and “abortion-rights opponents have intensity on their side.”

    “People who describe themselves as pro-life are twice as likely to say the issue will be extremely important to them than people who call themselves pro-choice,” CNN stated.

    The news source also failed to report that 66 percent of those questioned said the government should make partial birth abortion illegal, compared to just 28 percent who said the procedure should be legal.

    Those results confirmed the findings from an April poll conducted by NBC/News Wall Street Journal, which found 53 percent of respondents were in favour of the Supreme Court decision to uphold a ban on partial birth abortion. Thirty-four percent of respondents were opposed to the ban.

    A NewsBusters report on pro-abortion bias in the media pointed to NBC’s Brian Williams statement that “most Americans believe a woman has a right to an abortion,” as a clear example of misleading media coverage. A Washington Post poll conducted in February found only 16 percent of Americans support legal abortion in all circumstances.

    The CNN poll questioned 1,028 adults in telephone interviews conducted May 4-6. The margin of error was plus or minus 3 percentage points.


    You stated I've "misinterpreted" what I've read.

    Seems like you've taken an oppositional stance by rote...if you feel comfortable stating I've mis-stated or mis-interpreted anything, whence comes your smug security in making what amounts to pure supposition about my postage?

    I've always been curious about your penchant for such devices (not really).
    “Think about how stupid the average person is, and then realize that half of 'em are stupider than that.” -George Carlin

  9. The Drawing Room   -   #9
    whats a partial birth abortion? it sounds like you're aborting a baby just as its being born, but i'd bet its something much more innocuous and that its terminology inculcated by pro-lifers. i'm also betting that if you'd asked those people who took part in the poll i bet most of them wouldn't have known either

    would i have made money on my bets?

  10. The Drawing Room   -   #10
    lynx's Avatar .
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    Sorry J2, you just haven't got it.

    It isn't about the issue, it's about picking the bits you (or whoever) want to emphasise. Just for you, I'll repeat it again: IT ISN'T SCIENTIFICALLY OR STATICALLY SOUND.

    So blogger Joel Johannesen accused CNN of falsifying poll results. Does that make it true? I don't know, because I haven't studied the poll and I suspect neither you nor Joel Johannesen have. I'm open enough to admit I haven't studied it, while you seem over-eager to accept an unknown blogger's word. Does he know enough about the statistics of polling even to make a rational comment? I suspect that if he did he would have stated it.

    Yes, you misinterpreted what you read. The article didn't say anything about religion, it didn't say that the majority of anti-abortionists were not right wing (nor did it didn't say they were) and it didn't say that the main-stream media intimates that the U.S. public is "overwhelmingly in favor of unrestricted access to abortion" in all circumstances. Consequently your comments concerning such matters can only have arisen from your own preconceptions, and not from the article in question.

    If you feel I've missed anything in the article that you claim it says, please point out where.
    Last edited by lynx; 07-23-2007 at 12:31 AM.
    .
    Political correctness is based on the principle that it's possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.

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