Has George Bush

**j2k4** · 07-08-2003, 04:51 AM

Rat-

As I have admitted my ignorance in this case, enlighten me:

What is the status of the detainees with regard to U.K. law pending an exchange of custody?

**Rat Faced** · 07-08-2003, 04:59 PM

Simply put...the UK citizens could be tried for Treason...

However in the circumstances, it is not a forgone conclusion that the State would win.

In fact, it would probably be part of the defense that the UK troops were there illegaly under international law....and the LAST thing the UK government wants is to be formally told by the Criminal Court that there is no case to answer, as the UK was acting illegaly.

They are already fending off enough Civil cases trying to pin them down...the one thing that they have demonstrated above all else so far, is their unwillingness to go to court...even if it is the Government that is prosecuting.

This goes for the Iraq conflict too..

For example....

A VERY high percentage of TA soldiers that were "called up" refused to go...not one of them is being prosecuted.

A few British Soldiers that were out there refused to fire on some occasions (mutiny, and if found guilty a possible death penalty) not one of them is being prosecuted.

As far as i can see, the only other UK law that they have broken is membership of Al Queda (if they were), and as they were not in the UK, then there is a jurisdiction problem.

This doesnt mean they cant be tried for other things....there are an awful lot of Laws that most people (including myself) dont know about, and the State does hold a lot of power there.. (Just like Al Capone got hit with Tax Evasion)..it just takes an imagination to look it all up. If they did that though, then what are the "political" consequences with the electorate?

I havent a clue as to what "international" laws have been broken.

I suspect that the UK Government would immediately pass the buck, and hand them over to the ICC..and i certainly havent been hearing cries from the UK Government to turn the UK citizens over.

One thing that IS certain, if they are turned over...the USA will not get them back. Under the rules, they cant be extradited to face a possible Death Penalty or if they can show reasonable grounds that they will not receive a fair trial. I think they can demonstrate the latter certainly, and probably the former.

**j2k4** · 07-08-2003, 05:06 PM

Originally posted by Rat Faced@8 July 2003 - 11:59
One thing that IS certain, if they are turned over...the USA will not get them back. Under the rules, they cant be extradited to face a possible Death Penalty or if they can show reasonable grounds that they will not receive a fair trial. I think they can demonstrate the latter certainly, and probably the former.

I have a notion this last might be the hidden intent.

If the ICC ends up with jurisdiction and passes on prosecution, would the U.K. re-assume custody?

If they get a pass all the way around, where would they go? Do you think they could safely stay in the U.K.?

**Rat Faced** · 07-08-2003, 07:26 PM

If they get a pass all the way around, where would they go? Do you think they could safely stay in the U.K.?

Yes, they could stay here.

"Safely" will largely depend on where in the UK they go, i would have thought.

There are many parts of the UK, where some portions of the population will class them as hero's. (Parts of West Yorkshire for example)

Other areas where they would go out one night and just stop living....(Salisbury area for example)

Most of the UK they would just blend in, and most people would not know nor care who they are, as long as they stay out of trouble there.

**j2k4** · 07-09-2003, 04:33 AM

I'll have to stay tuned.

Thanks, Rat.

**Neil__** · 07-09-2003, 11:14 AM

Tont Blaire has just stated on live T.V. that he wants our citezens back so they can face a "FAIR TRIAL" on "TERRORIST" charges, and the British parlament is behind him.

and terrorism is a charge that carries A maximum jail term of Natural Life

Don't forget j2k4 if they are guilty then any future British government releasing them would have us to answer to.

I hope we don't have to demand them back as a whole country.
As that would gain America a lot of enemies in Britain.

Neil

**Neil__** · 07-09-2003, 11:20 AM

Originally posted by clocker@7 July 2003 - 02:35

A Brit.
a citizen under Queen Elizabeth II
demand the return of my countrymen.
NOW.

Neil

I thought that in another thread you said you were disgusted with Britian and hoped to move to Holland.
Is this vociforous display just a parting gift?

I have said that I am disgusted with tony blaire over the Ass kissing up to America
But how does that affect my status
and if you had cared to read further you would have found I said I would still be patriotic to Britain even if I gained Dutch Citezenship

SO if your going to quote, QUOTE
Don't MISSQUOTE
as it makes you look foolish

Neil

**Neil__** · 07-09-2003, 11:28 AM

Originally posted by Rat Faced@7 July 2003 - 19:55

But would you extradite a british citezen to the electric chair
when we can jail them forever here?

The simple answer is YES.

In the example i gave, i would.

You visit a country, then its YOUR responsibility to abide by ITS laws, or suffer the consequences....and no, that is not saying im either in favour of the Death Penalty or not.

I would also expect them to lose a hand for theft in Saudie, as long as it could be shown that they had a fair trial.

I dissagree that we should extrodite Britains to be executedand
if the crime was commited in the US and they were detained there then tough you deal with the laws of the country you are in but thats a far cry from sending a brit back to saudi to have a limb hacked off in public.

but I agree whole heartedly with the rest

Neil