Your Ad Here Your Ad Here
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 20

Thread: WTF is P2L?

  1. #1
    I Run It
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    New Jersey
    Age
    39
    Posts
    249

    Arrow

    WTF IS P2L?

    Have read quite a few threads, and it seems almost 99% of FileSharingTalk.coms BT Section is confused about this. I have seen some hate threads about sites which they believe are P2L, but are in fact not. The truth of the matter is, there is no BitTorrent tracker in existence today which is Pay2Leech. A few years ago, there was one, but it was spammed, d dosed and hacked out of existence. Anyway Most of you think, ScT, CT, ST, TL, RevTT, etc are Pay2Leech, well let me make it simple, THEY ARE NOT! It doesn't matter who says what, if a user with a grudge says it, or another siteop with a grudge says it. YOU ARE WRONG.

    Pay2Leech requires a person to Pay Money to get access to the content. ScT, CT, ST, etc are NOT Pay2Leech. Pay2Leech is like Newsgroups providers and Topsite Access providers, they require money to get access to the content and to be able to download. Just because a site sells GBs like CT or ST doesn't mean they are Pay2Leech. Its strictly an incentive and a thanks to users who donate.

    Some of you feel this is wrong, so let me explain to you why it is not. For example: I have a p2p blocked provider which limits my seeding alot less then i would want it to be. I seed for the required minimum time to cancel out Hit & Run but am not able to reach 1:1 on the torrents which i snatch. Well there is good news, my favorite tracker ST is now giving away GBs for my donation to the site funding, the same site funding which lets them bring me new releases at top speeds and at great pres and also keeps the site going for another month. So i donate 20 bucks, my ratio gets to 1:1 and continue download and following the rules of the tracker.. is it still wrong now?

    that was a rhetorical question


    I know what you are going to say, what about the users that just hit and run and get bad ratio, but then purchase GBs and get their ratio back to normal. The answer to that is, Ban hit and runners then... if you run a tracker and don't even have a hit and run script, what was going through your mind when you opened a tracker?

    that was also a rhetorical question

    Another thing, i know many of you users are thinking about, what about all the funds that this site gets from these donations incentives, how do i know its going to the right place? Answer, you truly don't know, even if a tracker is not P2L, donations can still be misused, it depends on a trackers ethics, FTN isnt P2L but they dont even tell us how much donations they need, all they have is a percentage counter, and some have no counter, but sites like ScT are quite respectable, after all the accusations from a certain ex-siteop, they came out and explained where every last cent of the site funds went, even brought out the bill they get from nForce Hosting every month, but if a tracker is Donate for Incentive and the site seems to be failing (example: load errors, <2000 torrents, torrent speeds are slow, inactive staff, etc) then its time to start worrying, if this happens, then its quite obvious where the site has gone.

    So discuss with me why you hate your supposed "P2L" trackers, and if you don't and I am gonna randomly call our your names, don't think i wont Or hell explain why if you agree.

    I love user input.


    | Darkness |

  2. BitTorrent   -   #2
    Tokeman's Avatar Ron Paul 2012 BT Rep: +30BT Rep +30BT Rep +30BT Rep +30BT Rep +30BT Rep +30
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Posts
    2,260
    um, newsgroups are not p2l, they are free. You mearly pay to get longer retention from other providers (premium) vs the very short retention of free providers.
    Ron Paul: Hope for America

  3. BitTorrent   -   #3
    stoi's Avatar BCG Owner BT Rep: +45BT Rep +45BT Rep +45BT Rep +45BT Rep +45BT Rep +45BT Rep +45BT Rep +45BT Rep +45
    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Posts
    4,288
    well im a site owner, and i have to say we have done this in the past, and might do it occasionally in the future for special occasions.

    I wont write and essay like i usually would though as im far to tired.

    Reason we stopped it was, we had members hit and running all the time, but we only accept paypal for donations, and as everyone knows, paypal are gits, they will close your account for anything, without even asking ???

    so someone donates 25 for VIP (its down to 10 now and you get bonuses on the SP system we have, not gigs for money) they then leech a hell of a lot of torrents without giving back (and yes, we do have a hit and run mod on) we ban them, and countless others like them, they get onto paypal complaining, they get their money back anyway, and after a few paypal close the account, so no more tracker.

    Thats the main reason we moved away from it, and we only done 1gig per 1.

    other trackers can do what the hell they like for me, im not a member of anywhere else apart from mine. but from my personal standpoint, i believe giving lots of gig away for VIP is wrong, and why?

    because its not my BW they are raping, its the uploaders bw they are raping, and whats the point of giving them so much, if you do have a hit and run mod on, whats the point in getting 100`s of gig as a buffer, if you still have to seed everything back to 1:1.

    well it turned into a half essay, but thats my view. im not saying that any of them is pay to leech. but i dont see the point in it if you have a strict hit and run policy like we do, for us if we offer it, it will proabably be used to buy a higher class.

    PU is 1.5 ratio
    SPU is 2.05 ratio and you can upload requests.

  4. BitTorrent   -   #4
    I Run It
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    New Jersey
    Age
    39
    Posts
    249
    Quote Originally Posted by Tokeman View Post
    um, newsgroups are not p2l, they are free. You mearly pay to get longer retention from other providers (premium) vs the very short retention of free providers.
    majority of users pay since its not provided by there isp, there are a few which give it to their users, but not a significant amount.

  5. BitTorrent   -   #5
    Tokeman's Avatar Ron Paul 2012 BT Rep: +30BT Rep +30BT Rep +30BT Rep +30BT Rep +30BT Rep +30
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Posts
    2,260
    there are still free providers out there, they just suck because no one wants crappy retention. Back in the day, there were more quality free providers. Just because retention is what people want doesn't mean its all p2l, users wanted more retention, and that costs $$$ for storage space.

    Edit: i'm not against what you've said, just clarifying my point on newsgroups.
    Last edited by Tokeman; 10-05-2007 at 10:28 PM.
    Ron Paul: Hope for America

  6. BitTorrent   -   #6
    I Run It
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    New Jersey
    Age
    39
    Posts
    249
    Quote Originally Posted by stoi View Post
    well im a site owner, and i have to say we have done this in the past, and might do it occasionally in the future for special occasions.

    I wont write and essay like i usually would though as im far to tired.

    Reason we stopped it was, we had members hit and running all the time, but we only accept paypal for donations, and as everyone knows, paypal are gits, they will close your account for anything, without even asking ???

    so someone donates 25 for VIP (its down to 10 now and you get bonuses on the SP system we have, not gigs for money) they then leech a hell of a lot of torrents without giving back (and yes, we do have a hit and run mod on) we ban them, and countless others like them, they get onto paypal complaining, they get their money back anyway, and after a few paypal close the account, so no more tracker.

    Thats the main reason we moved away from it, and we only done 1gig per 1.

    other trackers can do what the hell they like for me, im not a member of anywhere else apart from mine. but from my personal standpoint, i believe giving lots of gig away for VIP is wrong, and why?

    because its not my BW they are raping, its the uploaders bw they are raping, and whats the point of giving them so much, if you do have a hit and run mod on, whats the point in getting 100`s of gig as a buffer, if you still have to seed everything back to 1:1.

    well it turned into a half essay, but thats my view. im not saying that any of them is pay to leech. but i dont see the point in it if you have a strict hit and run policy like we do, for us if we offer it, it will proabably be used to buy a higher class.

    PU is 1.5 ratio
    SPU is 2.05 ratio and you can upload requests.
    I dont know about VIP, it depends on if VIPs get special treatment like gbs, freeleech etc.

    And there are ways to avoid paypal disputes such as including a terms on your donation page and making the user click it (Agree to it) before they get their incentives.

    And like you said, i feel for the uploaders who spend the money on b/w but its its better to get them out then keep em in allowing more b/w for other users.

    It matters to a limit, a 100Gb buffer is nothing considering ive had over 15TBs of buffers on various sites, but i still made it my duty to seed the minimum amount of time if i did not reach 1:1 on the torrent.

  7. BitTorrent   -   #7
    First of all, let me say you formatted your opinion nicely and phrased it nicely as well; It's good to see quality posts from time to time. Secondly, I do not necessarily hate P2L systems, but i, like you, have the same problem of traffic shaping from my ISP, which makes building up a ratio an utter pain. Of course countless sites have the P2L system which is "Fix your ratio by paying", and i stated before, i have no problem with that. But sometimes i would rather keep my money for something personal, making me not leech from some specific sites until my financial problems are solved, which is quite annoying.

    I heard about FTN's new approach towards ratio (Which is basically abolishing ratios.), and i must say i promote systems like that, as they are highly user friendly. I guess all in all it's a choice, as an Admin, between user satisfaction or keeping your site alive. I could elaborate much more on this issue, but that would be quite unnecessary. All i can say is that i like to stay neutral in this issue, but i am being pulled towards FTN's idea of Ratio/Donation system.

  8. BitTorrent   -   #8
    I Run It
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    New Jersey
    Age
    39
    Posts
    249
    Quote Originally Posted by Tokeman View Post
    there are still free providers out there, they just suck because no one wants crappy retention. Back in the day, there were more quality free providers. Just because retention is what people want doesn't mean its all p2l, users wanted more retention, and that costs $$$ for storage space.

    Edit: i'm not against what you've said, just clarifying my point on newsgroups.

    Noted and i agree to an extent, but it comes down to the fact, that you are paying to download, you have the option of sticking to a free provider but you are choosing to pay for something better.

  9. BitTorrent   -   #9
    Polarbear's Avatar deep funk BT Rep: +5
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    behind the turntables
    Age
    46
    Posts
    3,658
    Quote Originally Posted by stoi View Post
    whats the point in getting 100`s of gig as a buffer, if you still have to seed everything back to 1:1.
    very true. this is what some buffer seedbox wankers really don't understand

  10. BitTorrent   -   #10
    I Run It
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    New Jersey
    Age
    39
    Posts
    249
    Quote Originally Posted by Trexx View Post
    First of all, let me say you formatted your opinion nicely and phrased it nicely as well; It's good to see quality posts from time to time. Secondly, I do not necessarily hate P2L systems, but i, like you, have the same problem of traffic shaping from my ISP, which makes building up a ratio an utter pain. Of course countless sites have the P2L system which is "Fix your ratio by paying", and i stated before, i have no problem with that. But sometimes i would rather keep my money for something personal, making me not leech from some specific sites until my financial problems are solved, which is quite annoying.

    I heard about FTN's new approach towards ratio (Which is basically abolishing ratios.), and i must say i promote systems like that, as they are highly user friendly. I guess all in all it's a choice, as an Admin, between user satisfaction or keeping your site alive. I could elaborate much more on this issue, but that would be quite unnecessary. All i can say is that i like to stay neutral in this issue, but i am being pulled towards FTN's idea of Ratio/Donation system.

    Thank you

    but with when you say "But sometimes i would rather keep my money for something personal, making me not leech from some specific sites until my financial problems are solved, which is quite annoying." no torrent site forces you to pay, you have the option to get your ratio back to a respectable one but thats it, they dont require you to pay to keep your account and to keep downloading. And i agree FTN has implimented a fantastic and unique idea. Its not something i would personally do, but it seems to be working wondering for them.

    Quote Originally Posted by Polarbear View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by stoi View Post
    whats the point in getting 100`s of gig as a buffer, if you still have to seed everything back to 1:1.
    very true. this is what some buffer seedbox wankers really don't understand
    You right, but the point comes down to what the site rules are, if they require you to seed a minimum amount of time or to a minimum ratio, then you must follow. "love it or leave it"
    Last edited by XS75; 10-05-2007 at 10:36 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •