Refugee Problem

[Ron]

Maybe so Neil, but help them at what cost?
Any?
Social security systems are crumbling all over Europe under the weight of the flood of (economical)refugees. Next year, there will be 12 countries added to the EEC.
Turkey is on the list after that.
Turkey has 65 million people with no economical future.
As you said, we will be sucked down until we drown, and when that happens even legit refugees won't have a place to turn to.
The way I see it, refugees are entitled to get help from us for the duration of the threat. After that, they - just like the economical 'refugees' - should have to prove they have some added value for this country in order to be allowed to stay.
But then we'll probably be accused of stealing talents from countries that they so badly need.

[Neil__]

Ron as always we find ourselves in a no win situation here in the west
do nothing and your a bastard
Do something and you haven't appreciated the scale of the problem and should do more.
Like I said we have to help but not at our own economic downfall.
we cannot allow the world to become an average we have to try and encourage the the lowest up to our level.

Does that mean capitalism for all. well if it's that or starve then I'd rather work for Mcdonnalds than scavenge a refuse tip.

Neil.

[Ron]

Maybe the help we're giving to economical refugees, IS the problem?


Wasn't there a saying like: Don't give a man a fish, give him a fishing rod, and teach him how to fish", or something?

[Neil__]

exactly ron
Give people bricks and mortar and a teacher then they have a school.
the teacher can then train his/her replacement then move on to the next
before you know it you have an education system.

Neil

[thewizeard]

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Put an end to their wandering

Europe should do more to support refugees in their regions of origin

Ruud Lubbers
Friday June 20, 2003
The Guardian

Asylum has become a hot political topic in some European countries. There are two reasons for this. First, there are genuine concerns about the way the system is being managed, about the role of people smugglers, and about those who misuse the system by falsely portraying themselves as asylum seekers. These factors feed off each other.
Second, there is another abusive group at work - including some politicians, pressure groups and newspaper editors - who are wilfully distorting the issue. I am appalled at the exaggerations, statistical manipulation and scaremongering that have proliferated recently. This is a dangerous path for society to go down. As a former prime minister, I know how hard it is to draw up far-sighted policy when you are buffeted by a political whirlwind whipped up by distortion and exaggeration.

The UNHCR, the UN refugee agency that I head, is proposing a three-pronged approach to improve the global asylum system. One prong is devoted to the regions from which refugees originate; one is geared to the gradual transformation of the EU into a single asylum space; and one to sharpening individual states' domestic asylum systems.

This is not a menu of options but an organic whole. Unilateral actions by a single state, or even a small club of states, will not bear fruit unless they are acceptable to other countries, particularly developing countries that host huge refugee populations, sometimes for decades. These countries will need to be convinced that the richer states will share the economic, social and political burdens imposed by large movements of refugees. If they feel the rich states are only interested in passing the buck back to them, they will not cooperate.

The amount spent on supporting refugees in their regions of origin is woefully inadequate. Little wonder that refugees - genuine refugees - lose hope and head towards Europe. Their original hosts, with inadequate financial support, are unlikely to encourage them to stay. Nor are they likely to welcome them back just because Europe doesn't want them either.

So, under the "regional prong", the UNHCR is proposing a more coherent, wide-ranging effort by donor states to support refugees in their host countries. But all this requires development assistance that would increase the self-reliance of refugees and benefit the countries that host them, thereby reducing the pressures to seek asylum farther afield. The regional prong would include special arrangements tailored for specific refugee groups, an initiative I call "Convention Plus" since it builds on and complements the 1951 refugee convention.

Under the "EU prong", the UNHCR proposes separating out groups that are misusing the system, namely asylum seekers from countries that produce hardly any genuine refugees. These asylum seekers would be sent to one or more reception centres somewhere within the EU, where their claims would be rapidly examined by joint EU teams. Those judged not to have any sort of refugee claim would be sent straight home.

The limited number of recognised refugees among them would be shared between the EU states. There should be a strict time limit for the entire process. Readmission agreements between the EU and the rejected asylum seekers' home countries must be reached in advance so that people are not detained for months or years simply because they cannot be deported.

It is essential that such an initiative takes place within the EU's borders. Reception centres then would be bound by EU legal standards. That is important not only to safeguard the human rights of people being assessed but also because it would reduce the legal obstacles states would face if the centres were located outside the EU. The accusation of burden-shifting would not arise.

If the regional and EU prongs of this approach are implemented effectively, we will quickly see benefits within each EU state's domestic asylum system. Nevertheless, efforts need to continue in parallel to streamline domestic systems - to make them faster, fairer and more efficient.

I am pleased that these proposals have found an echo in a recent communication published by the European Commission at the request of member states. The dialogue is continuing at the EU summit in Thessaloniki. We should not miss this opportunity to put in place a more balanced and equitable approach that safeguards the protection of refugees, promotes solutions and restores public confidence in asylum systems. This is one of the most urgent policy challenges confronting Europe today.

· Ruud Lubbers is the UN high commissioner for refugees

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This is what Ruud has to say.

[Neil__]

Finally someone has a direction that might yeald a solution that is in the interests of the reugees. Abd being a man of such influence he has a better chance than most of getting it done
Deal with the cause of the exodus at it's source.

Neil.

[4play]

I am still left wondering why do we not send back all the illegal's that arrived in britain from france which is a safe country.

They will then reject them and then fuck it. they are out of or country what do we care.

I have no problem with this i am not alone people. The human species has never though about the future. Why else would we kill are planet like we do and have no regard for it.

p.s
we do have a points system so we where on the waiting list for housing for 6 years before we found a home. while illegals wait about 24 hours. anyone else spot why i hate these people.

[4play]

@darkblizzard sorry mate your a bit of a nutter.

If black people do not mind us living in africa why are white farm owner being thrown out in zimbabwe. Why do we not do the same? well because we was mean bastards to create the largest empire on earth but well we have a pussy for a leader now.

[thewizeard]

Originally posted by 4play@13 July 2003 - 21:21


p.s
we do have a points system so we where on the waiting list for housing for 6 years before we found a home. while illegals wait about 24 hours. anyone else spot why i hate these people.

Hello 4play,

I feel you are confusing the refugee with the system.

Surely you mean to say you are against a system that is obviously not working as it was meant to?

Nigel

[4play]

Hello 4play,

I feel you are confusing the refugee with the system.

Surely you mean to say you are against a system that is obviously not working as it was meant to?

Nigel

Nope im not confused. What i mean to say is that im pissed off at the scum that abuse the system. it does not work because it never will so kill it off now.

I do not care if people have to suffer because at the end of the day i still get to eat my mc donalds and get pissed so screw them.

many will say that is a bad attitude but hey welcome to the real world people.