G.o.d (((((((((athiest))))))))))

[Billy_Dean]

Originally posted by JPaul@22 September 2003 - 17:14
Astonishing, all this talk of the works of Prof Hawking. You are of course aware that he is on record stating that he does in fact believe in God. No question mark there btw, it has been noted by others that I rarely use them. Wouldn't want to let a bit of peurile mud-slinging pass now would I.

You are aware, of course, that Hawking has since refuted that claim.

I refer you to Carl Sagan's words in the introduction to A Brief History of Time ...

"This is also a book about God...or perhaps about the absence of God. The word God fills these pages. Hawking embarks on a quest to answer Einstein's famous question about whether God had any choice in creating the universe. Hawking is attempting, as he explicitly states, to understand the mind of God. And this makes all the more unexpected the conclusion of the effort, at least so far: a universe with no edge in space, no beginning or end of time, and nothing for a creator to do."

[J'Pol]

I wasn't aware that he had refuted the belief. Thanks for the point out. I am obviously not up to speed.

Do you have a source for this, I would genuinely be interested to read his thoughts on the matter.

[Biggles]

A number of leading physicists subscribe to the possibility of an intelligent design. However, it is debatable as to whether this concept translates easily into what adherents of specific religions would consider a deity.

I think something akin to Blake's "architect" or "draughtsman" would be a more apposite comparison. As I said above, there is one gigantic leap from a mathematical coherence in the perceived universe to strange dictats concerning dietry laws or bulldozing your house if it has mildew.

I think, actually, the moment religion is deductable through equation it probably ceases to be religion.

Although I am no adherent to any specific religion (notwithstanding a totally irrational soft spot for old Celtic myths) I have no objection to others getting the utmost from their own particular faiths. It just ceases to be fun when it is used as a basis to discriminate against others who have different beliefs.

As an aside, theoretical physics is not a happy hunting ground. Long division stumps many, so putting trust in a blackboard covered in pure algebra that proves there are in fact 14 dimensions and not 13 as previously supposed is just as much a leap of faith for the average man as believing there are gods living on Mount Olympus. Sincere and genuine apologies to any average men (or women ) out there that love long algebraic equations.

[jbrockz]

A number of leading physicists subscribe to the possibility of an intelligent design. However, it is debatable as to whether this concept translates easily into what adherents of specific religions would consider a deity.

I think something akin to Blake's "architect" or "draughtsman" would be a more apposite comparison. As I said above, there is one gigantic leap from a mathematical coherence in the perceived universe to strange dictats concerning dietry laws or bulldozing your house if it has mildew.

I think, actually, the moment religion is deductable through equation it probably ceases to be religion.

Although I am no adherent to any specific religion (notwithstanding a totally irrational soft spot for old Celtic myths) I have no objection to others getting the utmost from their own particular faiths. It just ceases to be fun when it is used as a basis to discriminate against others who have different beliefs

Amen , brother!

Since English is not my first language, if i had set out to explain this, i can't imagine what i would have done with it....the nitpickers would have had a field-day...lol. Perfect choice of words!!

As an aside, theoretical physics is not a happy hunting ground. Long division stumps many, so putting trust in a blackboard covered in pure algebra that proves there are in fact 14 dimensions and not 13 as previously supposed is just as much a leap of faith for the average man as believing there are gods living on Mount Olympus. Sincere and genuine apologies to any average men (or women ) out there that love long algebraic equations.

Amen again. Taking theoretical physics as an example, I think the world can suddenly become a whole lot tolerant if only we would appreciate the amount of things about this universe [religious and physical] that we don't know. Forget about dimensions, even planets haven't been happy hunting grounds. Read this

http://seds.lpl.arizona.edu/nineplanets/ni...anets/hypo.html

Imperfection [and i use this term loosely] is the essence of life. In the discovery cahnnel series Human Body, the host [?] explains that the biggest hurdle to eternal life is the way the body regenerates itself. Every part from bone matter to skin regenerates, just not as obviously as a snake's skin. And everytime it does, it gets replaced by something that is a little less perfect, a little more away from ideal. If the body could replace every cell or tissue by an exact replica, we would never grow old.

Same way, thinking of one's religion to be the all and only truth, one's concept of God as the only real one and calling everyone else 'stupid' or evil is, at least to me, living in denial of this inherent imperfection.

This imperfection is important and very necessary. Why? A quote from six feet under [season one finale i think] comes to mind,

''why do people have to die?''
''to make life intresting.''

Imagine what fun it would be if everyone living on this planet was, say, catholic - no protestants, no hindus, no jews, no buddhists, no tribals. The biggest problem with people is expecting eveyone to be like them, and then justifying horrible deeds saying we are the only real people and they are not. Religion is a load of horseshit, God is a different issue altogether!

[ilw]

If you had to join a religion which one would you choose?

[J'Pol]

jbrockz

You use of the English language, particularly as a second language does you great credit. I know plenty of people who speak it as a first language who would not use the phrase inherent imperfection and certainly not in context.

That whole last post is very well put together. I may not always agree with the ideas you put across (particularly when you generalise) however I am really impressed by your ability to put them across. I would find it difficult to ask for some cheese and a glass of red wine in French for example.

Congrats to you and those who teach you, if you are teaching yourself even more impressive.

Do you mind me asking what your first language is.

[hobbes]

Originally posted by Billy_Dean@22 September 2003 - 08:16
I hate to nit-pick here Nigel, but shouldn't there be a question mark at the end of your post??

(My god, I'm sounding like JPaul, or was it Hobbes, or maybe ......)

Billy,

I'm getting a little bit embarrassed at all this effusive praise today. I wake up this a.m. to find a thread with my name on it. You tout that you have a quote "from the man himself". Who's the man, yea, I'm the man. I'm the man, himself! El numero uno, honcho!

Then again here. We all know that imitation is the most sincere form of flattery. Next thing you know you will be walking upright, demonstating humility and someday, hopefully, reading the posts. You're just growing up so fast! /me pinches Billys cheek.



As for this God thing, looks like we are on the 3rd time around the block with this subject.

[Billy_Dean]

Originally posted by hobbes+23 September 2003 - 04:22--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (hobbes @ 23 September 2003 - 04:22)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-Billy_Dean@22 September 2003 - 08:16
I hate to nit-pick here Nigel, but shouldn&#39;t there be a question mark at the end of your post??

(My god, I&#39;m sounding like JPaul, or was it Hobbes, or maybe ......)

Billy,

I&#39;m getting a little bit embarrassed at all this effusive praise today. I wake up this a.m. to find a thread with my name on it. You tout that you have a quote "from the man himself". Who&#39;s the man, yea, I&#39;m the man. I&#39;m the man, himself&#33; El numero uno, honcho&#33;

Then again here. We all know that imitation is the most sincere form of flattery. Next thing you know you will be walking upright, demonstating humility and someday, hopefully, reading the posts. You&#39;re just growing up so fast&#33; /me pinches Billys cheek.



As for this God thing, looks like we are on the 3rd time around the block with this subject. [/b][/quote]
I&#39;m just trying to make you famous like me Hobbesy, so you can get over this jealousy thing.

[internet.news]

ok, I did not know if there is any god there...

but what I think is, I could think of some kind of energy after
dying... probably some dead people, we cannot see these small amount of energy,
are sometimes close to us? If I would be dead and a kind of energy I would
still respect privacy... will try it ... really...

I explain people suffering and violence in world as so: human life also has
unfortunately negative parts. It is only sad to see people suffering...
e.g. each day in Israel - Palestinia... :(

thanks anyway, david.

[Calvarian2003]

The atheist physicist joke:

&#39;In the beginning there was nothing, which then exploded.&#39;

Well then, that sure answers all the questions I have about the creation of the universe&#33;