should tracker staff get paid?

**Nemrod** · 09-04-2008, 02:08 PM

I´ve seen three types of trackers: those that were created as a business, for profit -most of them don´t last more than few months-; those that were created moved by an ideal and for fun and stand loyal to that; and it´s the third type, a mix of the other two, began with noble intentions but once the owners saw that they were receiving much more than needed they became greedy.
It´s a very thin line easy to cross, even without realize it... take few dollars for a, perhaps, good and deserving reason but hen could be for not so good or reasonable cause, besides that will always a thing about who says what it´s good and reasonable. Perhaps buying a game console to fight stress caused by tracker, pay the power or internet bill or any other thing could be interpreted as fair, but they are not from the way I see this torrentworld.
From my point of view staff should not take a cent from donations for themselves nor for any anything else than site costs... whatever site costs and only site costs be. I know that´s a hard work, takes a lot time and most of times they don´t even are respected or treated as deserved, but those were and always have been known things and even so they decided to start, so, deal with it or quit.
That´s my thought, but as far as they don´t make donations mandatory, at the end of the day it´s not my business.
Anyway, few trackers cover their monthly costs, and about the others that do I seriously doubt, except in a very few and known cases, that this could be a real business, so it´s not my problem either.

**Swax** · 09-04-2008, 06:25 PM

Originally Posted by DV8type

As per the "it would complicate the issue since its illegal." Too late for that. Staff is a target and the site is already making money. You think they are gonna say, "ohhh you didnt make any profit, ill let you off the hook." Nope. If your being used and abused might as well get a dollar from it.

I really hope that's not a horrible misinterpretation of my words;

Originally Posted by Swax

Staff should not get paid, or a 'wage' as such as this would further complicate the already illegal activities going on within the tracker.

Staff are obviously at risk already. But for staff to receive money it would have to be direct (unless you're lucky enough to have fake bank accounts in another country).
Whereas if the tracker pays for goods on behalf of a person then they are not directly linked to the Paypal account.

An IP address is incriminating, yes. But a monetary transfer into one of your accounts is damning.

**Polarbear** · 09-04-2008, 06:34 PM

Originally Posted by Swax

But a monetary transfer into one of your accounts is damning.

that's right. making profit from selling pirated copyrighted material in large amounts to thousands of people isn't a picknick in legal terms.

unless you have the money for a good lawyer you're pretty much fucked. oink knew why he didn't sell gigs.

**stoi** · 09-04-2008, 06:48 PM

But we are not "selling" anything.

What is wrong is making a torrent site and telling people that in order to join you have to donate, or Buy an account.

that is wrong to the highest extremes imaginable, but i never hear many ppl having a go at trackers that do that, i wont name names but there are those that do it.

Donating to get a few gig here and there so you do not get banned, is not "selling" anything, next you will be saying we are selling the "star" members get.

We dont take donations, you have Porn ads instead, which would piss people off even more than donations, we have donations and no bonuses at all, no one donates. (i know i had the balls to try it).

You donate for a little help in the SP mod, timewise and more points, its not gigs for cash so no one donates, its their time so who cares if they wait 4 days or 2 days to get a 1 ratio.

Just taking donations is bloody risky in the eyes of the law and the media, but having a load of ads does not work, most members just block them anyway. when we had ads on we made £25 a month, we have a shop that sells T-Shirts and things, I have made $120 in 4 years of running it. and i cant get a cheque until i reach $250 lol

Honestly all this garbage about if you have this or that you must be making a fortune, its just not true at all.

I would say a tracker with 3000 good members, probably makes more money than a tracker with 50,000 that just want the files and nothing else, because the 50,000 do not care if the tracker goes down, the 3000 in the smaller tracker does.

**Polarbear** · 09-04-2008, 06:58 PM

Originally Posted by stoi

But we are not "selling" anything.

let's hope none of you (tracker staff) will ever have to debate this question with a highly paid prosecutor. i think he might beg to differ.

i didn't refer to bcg by the way. i don't even know wether you have a pay2leech system or not.

**stoi** · 09-04-2008, 07:04 PM

we dont but even if we did what exactly would we be selling?

because i cant see us selling anything.

If you joined and you had to pay 30p to download a torrent, thats selling, if you have to pay to get an account, thats selling, donating to a site is selling nothing at all.

**Polarbear** · 09-04-2008, 07:17 PM

Originally Posted by stoi

donating to a site is selling nothing at all.

in legal terms it is. as soon as you get a value (easier access to warez in our case) back, it's a transaction and not a donation anymore. the gigs of upload you donate for is nothing else than a voucher for more download.

companies get in trouble all the time, because they had a different understanding of the word "donation"

when you donate for freeware or donationware for example, it isn't a donation either. in legal terms you bought the software.

**stoi** · 09-04-2008, 07:28 PM

Well its not really a voucher for more download (ok sometimes it is if the tracker gives you 350gig for a tenner, and have no hit and run policy, i can see that) its more you donate so you do not get banned.

but on BCG you cant get banned for a low ratio, and you cant use a buffer to just "download" anything you want, you can even download 1TB and not upload byte and still not get banned on BCG. but i am seriously considering bringing Gigs for £ back, i have even halfed the donation amount from the other month, thinking make it lower, more may donate, but its basically just the same ones donating, but at half the price.

But the problem is with that, donations drop through the floor, like i said as long as i can pay the server/s every month great, thats all i care about, but when a site does get taken down and says the owner was making £30,000 a month and they spout all sorts of money out of their ass, its just not right, and if it convinces people that use torrents thats the case, what chance have we got against joe public when they hear that. (i am pretty sure when Oink got arrested they said something like £15,000-£30,000 a month he was taking in.)