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Thread: I Think...

  1. #1
    clocker's Avatar Shovel Ready
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    ...We're hopelessly fucked.

    Because of political pressures, neither candidate can afford to say what is really going to happen...the next President is not going to be able to lower taxes and get ANY of their grand plans implemented due to the scorched earth policy of the Bush administration.
    Between the Iraq war, New Orleans and now, Galveston and the bailout of Wall Street, where is the money supposed to come from?

    Jesus, this is depressing.
    "I am the one who knocks."- Heisenberg

  2. The Drawing Room   -   #2
    Barbarossa's Avatar mostly harmless
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    Maybe you should sell Alaska back to the Russians?

  3. The Drawing Room   -   #3
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    Pretty sure we cant- I think the Chinese hold the mortgage.
    "I am the one who knocks."- Heisenberg

  4. The Drawing Room   -   #4
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    I'm not happy about this bailout at all. I certainly don't think one cent should go to any company that is paying bonuses or until CEO termination packages are removed.

  5. The Drawing Room   -   #5
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    Op-Ed Contributor
    The Power of Negative Thinking



    By BARBARA EHRENREICH
    Published: September 23, 2008

    GREED — and its crafty sibling, speculation — are the designated culprits for the financial crisis. But another, much admired, habit of mind should get its share of the blame: the delusional optimism of mainstream, all-American, positive thinking.

    As promoted by Oprah Winfrey, scores of megachurch pastors and an endless flow of self-help best sellers, the idea is to firmly believe that you will get what you want, not only because it will make you feel better to do so, but because “visualizing” something — ardently and with concentration — actually makes it happen. You will be able to pay that adjustable-rate mortgage or, at the other end of the transaction, turn thousands of bad mortgages into giga-profits if only you believe that you can.

    Positive thinking is endemic to American culture — from weight loss programs to cancer support groups — and in the last two decades it has put down deep roots in the corporate world as well. Everyone knows that you won’t get a job paying more than $15 an hour unless you’re a “positive person,” and no one becomes a chief executive by issuing warnings of possible disaster.

    The tomes in airport bookstores’ business sections warn against “negativity” and advise the reader to be at all times upbeat, optimistic, brimming with confidence. It’s a message companies relentlessly reinforced — treating their white-collar employees to manic motivational speakers and revival-like motivational events, while sending the top guys off to exotic locales to get pumped by the likes of Tony Robbins and other success gurus. Those who failed to get with the program would be subjected to personal “coaching” or shown the door.

    The once-sober finance industry was not immune. On their Web sites, motivational speakers proudly list companies like Lehman Brothers and Merrill Lynch among their clients. What’s more, for those at the very top of the corporate hierarchy, all this positive thinking must not have seemed delusional at all. With the rise in executive compensation, bosses could have almost anything they wanted, just by expressing the desire. No one was psychologically prepared for hard times when they hit, because, according to the tenets of positive thinking, even to think of trouble is to bring it on.

    Americans did not start out as deluded optimists. The original ethos, at least of white Protestant settlers and their descendants, was a grim Calvinism that offered wealth only through hard work and savings, and even then made no promises at all. You might work hard and still fail; you certainly wouldn’t get anywhere by adjusting your attitude or dreamily “visualizing” success.

    Calvinists thought “negatively,” as we would say today, carrying a weight of guilt and foreboding that sometimes broke their spirits. It was in response to this harsh attitude that positive thinking arose — among mystics, lay healers and transcendentalists — in the 19th century, with its crowd-pleasing message that God, or the universe, is really on your side, that you can actually have whatever you want, if the wanting is focused enough.

    When it comes to how we think, “negative” is not the only alternative to “positive.” As the case histories of depressives show, consistent pessimism can be just as baseless and deluded as its opposite. The alternative to both is realism — seeing the risks, having the courage to bear bad news and being prepared for famine as well as plenty. We ought to give it a try.

    Barbara Ehrenreich is the author, most recently, of “This Land Is Their Land: Reports From a Divided Nation.”
    "I am the one who knocks."- Heisenberg

  6. The Drawing Room   -   #6
    IdolEyes787's Avatar Persona non grata
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    Quote Originally Posted by devilsadvocate View Post
    I'm not happy about this bailout at all. I certainly don't think one cent should go to any company that is paying bonuses or until CEO termination packages are removed.
    Unfortunately Bush is putting his foot down on that point.Got to make sure the idiots who caused the problem are well looked after.

  7. The Drawing Room   -   #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by IdolEyes787 View Post
    Got to make sure the idiots who caused the problem are well looked after.
    This doesn't even address the fact that we're expecting the same idiots who caused the problem to solve it.

    Actually, let me amend that...they are "hucksters" and we're the idiots.
    "I am the one who knocks."- Heisenberg

  8. The Drawing Room   -   #8
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    Seems truer every day. Sad...

    I think if they are going to be bailed out that those in charge of these businesses should be leveled with impressive punishments.

    No more huge golden parachute. That has to be re-earned. They should have to operate as a non profit until the debt is repaid. Failure and or deviation from set plans like quitting or transferring jobs is punishable by jail, not a fine. That should shake up these "hucksters". I know many don't like the idea of regulation and feel it is a slippery slope to socialism but look what these guys are doing on their own without any one to report to. If our country's economy is hung on this type of business, then yes, we are fucked.

    I'm all for fewer laws in our world, but they must be more responsible and it does not seem to be happening on their own. Our currency is not going to be worth anything if we just keep printing more up every year to fix mistakes and poor judgment.
    Last edited by Skizo; 09-25-2008 at 08:53 PM. Reason: typo



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  9. The Drawing Room   -   #9
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    I have two major problems with this bailout.

    The first is the extreme urgency- Bush is insisting on end of week to resolve the legislation.
    The same players who set up this morass suddenly know exactly how to fix it and will do so in five days?

    Secondly, what guarantees do we have that this $700 billion will actually solve the problem?
    Wall St., despite all the theories and formulae that it dresses in, is basically run on "feelings"- it operates more on intuition than Oprah does.
    A company can issue a profitable quarterly report and watch it's stock price fall because some analyst "thinks" it should have done better. Gas prices jump if people "think" a storm might disrupt supply...don't wait to see what actually happens- panic now!

    So what happens if we absorb all the idiotic debt and Wall St. doesn't "feel good" about it or "think" we did enough?
    I don't pretend to be any sort of financial savant- unlike the talking heads who just a few months ago were saying that everything was fine- but the undue haste and nebulous certainty of success seem troubling to me.
    "I am the one who knocks."- Heisenberg

  10. The Drawing Room   -   #10
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    Seeing as Mcmermaid man is back in Washington saving the country and doesn't want to debate an excellent opportunity has arisen.
    Bob Barr has finally sensed his opening. With Senator McCain calling for Friday's debate to be postponed, the former Georgia congressman and Libertarian Party nominee says he is eager to fill in as a replacement.
    "Given Senator McCain's political stunt to avoid the debate, I ask that Friday's debate moves forward without him, as I am more than willing to step in to participate," Mr. Barr said in a statement this morning.
    Mr. Barr, who is polling in the low single digits, was excluded from the three presidential debates and had been planning to host a separate, simultaneous event Friday night in which he responded to the candidates and the questions in real time.

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