FTN opened the doors!

[Burnsy]

That is exactly where you are wrong.

Seeding is doing a favor, because it helps people retrieve their files.
Just because seeding is expected doesn't devalue it's cost.

How can I be wrong when I have already acknowledged these exact points in my earlier posts?

I'm not saying seeders efforts are any lesser in value towards the site than those who donate financially to the running costs, I fully acknowledge seeders are effectively the life blood of the the tracker in so far as they NEED to be there to share files

Are you even reading what I'm posting?

My point is... there's nothing wrong with rewarding those who want to donate financially and offer a little extra, remember... they're seeding too from either seedboxes or the same home connection as you with their own ISP charges too...

And your comment about it not being a members problem... well I agree and disagree with you, as stated in my last post...

If all you're after is a tracker then there are thousand's to choose from and it's not your problem if the bills don't get paid...

If you feel as though you belong to the community there, and the tracker is only secondary to why you use the site, then I'm afraid not being able to pay the fee is everybody's problem. Sure it might not be your fault there's no money to pay... but the community's still going to disappear regardless

[Tv Controls you]

seeding is a requirement... you're not doing anyone any favours by doing what you're supposed to

I'll just let your own statement soak in as you don't seem to understand your own words.

You have acknowledged seeding is a favor by stating that it isn't a favor, but rather it is just expected.....

How can I be wrong when I have already acknowledged these exact points in my earlier posts?

Awaiting your response in which you misconstrue every single word in your statements to have an alternative meaning.

[Quarterquack]

Just to throw this in: There's a difference between seeding, and seeding. The latter involves being the last seed on a 500-day old torrent. Trackers can only become "amazing" when they have a stellar retention, and a good seeder is one who can provide his bandwidth regardless of the longevity of the torrent's luster.

I have never been a good seeder, I have never had a "Torrent finished: 1 year ago" message, but I do keep a 2-month long average seed time on all my trackers regardless. That's still nothing compared to me trying to grab a torrent from BMTV that was uploaded 3 years ago, and still getting 4 seeds on it. I felt like pointing that out.

A tracker like GFT is great, but it always suffers from retention (whether server crash/stability optimization or not). It's one of my main gripes with it.

That's the difference between seeding, and seeding.

[mrnobody]

0-day tracker isn't meant for retention though. Vast majority of scene releases are use and throw stuff.

[Quarterquack]

0-day tracker isn't meant for retention though. Vast majority of scene releases are use and throw stuff.

I perfectly understand that, but you have to admit that it gets annoying not finding content that was only pre'd 6 months prior to you searching.

Look for a certain pattern in all the trackers that are called "the best" in their line of releases. Their oldest torrents are 3+ years old, with seeders still on it. There's no doubt that a proper retention is required of any tracker, even the biggest scene ones like SCC/TL etc.

[Burnsy]

I'll just let your own statement soak in as you don't seem to understand your own words.

You have acknowledged seeding is a favor by stating that it isn't a favor, but rather it is just expected.....

What?!

I'm afraid we have very different definitions of a favour then. You seem to perceive that by doing simply what your supposed to do, and what everyone else is doing, as you actually doing someone a favour... I'd say that you are simply meeting an expectation, and by the very definition of being a seeder, you are meeting a requirement, are you not?

Going over and above what you were supposed to do... I would call THAT doing someone a favour... however, this convo has totally digressed now from the original point and starting to go off on a complete tangent.

I've not twisted or misconstrued any statement, I've agreed with you on some points, not on others, and have offered explanations as to why my opinions differed... I'm now at the stage where I have no idea what you're on about, and at this time of night I'm not really that fussed about that

Now twist, turn, rearrange and use those comments in whatever text you want to because at the end of the day your entitled to your opinion, just as I'm entitled to mine... we don't agree, fair enough... shit happens

[Tv Controls you]

What?!

I'm afraid we have very different definitions of a favour then. You seem to perceive that by doing simply what your supposed to do, and what everyone else is doing, as you actually doing someone a favour... I'd say that you are simply meeting an expectation, and by the very definition of being a seeder, you are meeting a requirement, are you not?

Going over and above what you were supposed to do... I would call THAT doing someone a favour... however, this convo has totally digressed now from the original point and starting to go off on a complete tangent.

I've not twisted or misconstrued any statement, I've agreed with you on some points, not on others, and have offered explanations as to why my opinions differed... I'm now at the stage where I have no idea what you're on about, and at this time of night I'm not really that fussed about that

Now twist, turn, rearrange and use those comments in whatever text you want to because at the end of the day your entitled to your opinion, just as I'm entitled to mine... we don't agree, fair enough... shit happens

My 2 main points I'm trying to convey to you are:

1) seeding is a form of donation
2) Seeding is a "favor"

Just an example for you:
I have nearly 400 waffles torrents seeding right now in my utorrent. Alot of them only have 1 other seeder, and many have me as the only seeder.
This is a favor, I have nearly a 9.0 ratio on waffles and could easily delete all my torrents. But I care more about people being able to get their music.

That is truly a favor I believe, as I have gone way past the requirements that the tracker requires.
Further more I want absolutely nothing in return for this other than knowing that the other user got his files.

[Burnsy]

My 2 main points I'm trying to convey to you are:

1) seeding is a form of donation
2) Seeding is a "favor"

Just an example for you:
I have nearly 400 waffles torrents seeding right now in my utorrent. Alot of them only have 1 other seeder, and many have me as the only seeder.

This is a favor, I have nearly a 9.0 ratio on waffles and could easily delete all my torrents. But I care more about people being able to get their music.

1) In a roundabout way, you're right, it is and I've acknowledged that without seeders a tracker couldn't run. My point in that respect was that everybody has to seed, donator or not, therefore I considered a donator as someone doing a little bit more than than was required/expected (or whatever turn of phrase you want to use).

That's why I said I didn't see anything wrong with some sort of extra incentive for doing what everyone else was doing and more...

2) I don't agree, sorry. Seeding is following the rules, meeting a requirement set down by the board staff, and if you don't meet them you are generally reprimanded in some way... a warning... download rights removed... warned, or something. Going by your logic, and by seeding what you're required to do, it sounds like you are doing them a favour just by following their rules

400 torrents on Waffles? Now that's something impressive... and imho something like that along with an account kept in good standing should be recognised and/or rewarded... whether by userclass or something else, invites or whatever... nice one... but I still think we should agree to disagree on the whole 'favour' issue, coz we're never gonna see eye to eye on it

[Quarterquack]

I still think we should agree to disagree on the whole 'favour' issue, coz we're never gonna see eye to eye on it

Simply because you both define "seeding" in a different way.

TV defines it as going the full way, and sharing to the extreme. In that regard, he is truly doing a favor by keeping the torrents alive when nobody else will.

You on the other hand are probably talking about seeding minimum requirements, which you do not see as a favor at all, because they really are not, and are required by just about everyone.

TV goes above and beyond the requirements, which is why he calls it a favor.

That's the way I see it.

[Tv Controls you]

but I still think we should agree to disagree on the whole 'favour' issue, coz we're never gonna see eye to eye on it

Lol it would appear so, But I'm really trying to get you to agree.
Let me put a more extreme scenario into view....

For my holy communion we had to do 12 hours of community service total. I went around helping the church and elderly people for 12 hours.
It was required, but at the same time was a doing a favor?

Bt world:
Its required to go 24 hours or 1:1 ratio, but is going beyond that a favor?
I believe it is a favor for both.