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Thread: Why don't music sites like what/waffles offer upload credit to donors?

  1. #1
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    Hello everyone,

    Why don't music sites like what/waffles offer upload credit to donors?
    I know each site has their own policy but what's the reason for not offering gigs?

    It's as if these music sites expect members to donate out of goodwill but we all know that torrenting is,for the most part, a business. You download a torrent and seed it back to the required ratio, no exceptions.
    So why do sites expect a favour in the form of money?

    Why not offer gigs to members who can get out of a ratio-hole by donating? The site can pay their server bills and the donor can increase his ratio. It's a win-win situation!

    Thoughts?
    Last edited by soulreaper; 10-23-2010 at 05:34 PM.

  2. BitTorrent   -   #2
    Quote Originally Posted by soulreaper View Post
    Why don't music sites like what/waffles offer upload credit to donors?
    I know each site has their own policy but what's the reason for not offering gigs?
    Retention concerns. It's not really possible to build a music "library" if you have the option of donating and getting upload credit without uploading data yourself.

    Otherwise, many people would just donate and then hit & run on their snatches, given both sites' seeding difficulty. Of course, you always have the option of renting a seedbox and auto-downloading everything just to buffer up.
    Last edited by anon; 10-23-2010 at 05:41 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
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  3. BitTorrent   -   #3
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    Fair point but a lot of torrents on both sites have 0 seeds and the inactive torrents are deleted so it's not essentially a library(KG doesn't delete inactive torrents).
    Maybe the concern is that people might stop uploading and prefer donating to up their ratios? But other sites like SCC,TL etc may have the same concern but they offer gigs and members haven't stopped uploading.

    I don't think offering gigs to donors would hurt what/waffles too much?
    Last edited by soulreaper; 10-23-2010 at 05:58 PM. Reason: grammar

  4. BitTorrent   -   #4
    Quote Originally Posted by soulreaper View Post
    a lot of torrents on both sites have 0 seeds and the inactive torrents are deleted so it's not essentially a library(KG doesn't delete inactive torrents).
    Good point, also. I suppose they see little point in keeping zero-seed torrents as they're almost useless, anyway.

    Maybe the concern is that people might stop uploading and prefer donating to up their ratios?
    Personally, I think this is the reason.

    But other sites like SCC,TL etc may have the same concern but they offer gigs and members haven't stopped uploading.
    True, although those sites are at least somewhat easier to seed on.
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  5. BitTorrent   -   #5
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    You don't really need to seed on 0day sites, retention isn't really a priority. If I owned a big 0day site, I'd personally rather make some cash at the cost of worse retention. The upload they sell gets equalized by the hardcore seedbox RSS-ers, who do most of the initial uploading and will never 'cash in' their huge buffers because they are just too huge.

  6. BitTorrent   -   #6
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    If retention is so critical to What/waffles then why don't they have strict hit n run rules?

    And if retention is so important to them then why don't they have a bonus point system ? Torrents would surely be seeded for a long duration and would benefit members from "points to gigs conversion", isn't it? Just wondering..
    Last edited by soulreaper; 10-23-2010 at 06:24 PM.

  7. BitTorrent   -   #7
    Quote Originally Posted by soulreaper View Post
    If retention is so critical to What/waffles then why don't they have strict hit n run rules?
    Because you'll eventually have to seed/upload if you don't want to lose your leeching privileges/get banned for low ratio, anyway.

    And if retention is so important to them then why don't they have a bonus point system ? Torrents would surely be seeded for a long duration and would benefit members from "points to gigs conversion", isn't it?
    Same reason they aren't ratio-free. Many/most people would just seed the minimum necessary to be in good standing, and then delete torrents altogether.
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  8. BitTorrent   -   #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by anon-sbi View Post
    Because you'll eventually have to seed/upload if you don't want to lose your leeching privileges/get banned for low ratio, anyway.

    And if retention is so important to them then why don't they have a bonus point system ? Torrents would surely be seeded for a long duration and would benefit members from "points to gigs conversion", isn't it?
    Same reason they aren't ratio-free. Many/most people would just seed the minimum necessary to be in good standing, and then delete torrents altogether.

  9. BitTorrent   -   #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by soulreaper View Post
    If retention is so critical to What/waffles then why don't they have strict hit n run rules?

    And if retention is so important to them then why don't they have a bonus point system ? Torrents would surely be seeded for a long duration and would benefit members from "points to gigs conversion", isn't it? Just wondering..

    Whatcd is hard to seed on, and that is the 'benefit' to its core members. There are only so many ways you can abuse such a simple ratio economy, and for your information Whatcd does have a seedtime based alternate to ratio, which works much better on a million small torrents than the 'cap your upload but seed for X hours and you'll get ratio points' you are referring to.

    The only big site that does 'points to gigs' successfully is blackcatsgames, and that is because their snatch count/torrent count ratio is huge in comparison to whatcd. If BCG had a million small torrents, some of which get snatched once in a blue moon, there's no way they could operate on their generous conversion system and maintain those million torrents.

  10. BitTorrent   -   #10
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    I guess uploading is the only way to go OR rent a seedbox(which I can't afford).

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