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Thread: Should We Be Surprised?

  1. #1
    http://www.reuters.com/newsArticle.jhtml?t...storyID=4727121

    Palestinians Passionate About Gibson Film
    Thu Apr 1, 2004 11:02 AM ET

    By Nidal al-Mughrabi
    GAZA (Reuters) - Mel Gibson's controversial film "The Passion of the Christ" is all the rage among Palestinians, curious about complaints by Jews that it is anti-Semitic.

    Meanwhile, local distributors in Israel are shunning the film, which Jewish groups say demonizes Jews by depicting them as pressuring the Romans into crucifying Jesus. "The Passion" has banked more than $315 million since its release in February.

    Only one percent of Palestinians in the West Bank and Gaza Strip are Christians while the other 99 percent are Muslims, who revere Jesus as a prophet but do not believe he was crucified.

    The portrayal of a prophet in a film is forbidden under Islam. But many Palestinians, locked in conflict against Israel, say they hope "The Passion" will rouse angry emotions against Jews by Christian audiences around the world.

    "People are calling me from everywhere in the West Bank -- from Bethlehem, Hebron, Ramallah and Nablus -- to ask for copies of the movie," said the owner of a Gaza city video shop, which sells pirated copies of new release movies.

    The shop owner, who declined to be identified, said he received a flood of telephone calls after placing an advertisement for the film in a leading Palestinian newspaper.

    "The Passion of the Christ" had outsold other Hollywood blockbusters in Gaza and the West Bank's pirated video market, including "Matrix Revolutions" and "The Last Samurai."

    In Israel, the local agent for the film's international distributor Icon Entertainment said it passed on its option to show "The Passion of the Christ," but declined to specify its reasons other than to say the movie was "sensitive." Industry insiders in Israel say local distributors are not interested in the film because of allegations it is anti-Semitic and concerns they are unlikely to recoup their investment as films about Jesus draw few movie-goers in the Jewish state.

    Jewish groups and some Roman Catholic clerics have expressed concern the film by Gibson could foment anti-Jewish attacks.

    Gibson has denied the movie is anti-Semitic. He is a traditionalist Catholic who rejects the Vatican's 1965 renunciation of the notion that the Jews were collectively responsible for the crucifixion of Jesus. In Gaza, some Palestinians exposed to daily bloodshed since a Palestinian uprising began in September 2000 complained that the film's graphic depiction of the crucifixion was too gruesome for their tastes. "It looked like more of a horror movie than a historical one," said one viewer, Mohammed Rezik Ahmed. Others thought it was not gory enough. "We believe Jesus suffered more in his life from the Jews than what we saw in the movie," said Hanna Anton.

    Palestinian President Yasser Arafat watched a preview of the film at his West Bank headquarters earlier this month. Aides said he found the film "moving."

    But not all Palestinians were passionate about the film.

    "It was nothing special but was simply something that will increase hatred against the Jews," said Ala, a librarian.
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    In other news....

    Israel is making up stories about child suicide bombers.

    NABLUS, March 29 (IslamOnline.net) - Israeli media has embarked on a new stage of distorting the Palestinian resistance image, accusing Palestinian resistance fighters of making use of children and minors to execute bombing operations; a matter categorically denied by Palestinian families and factions as being "an Israeli intelligence fabrication."

    http://www.islam-online.net/English/News/2...article08.shtml


  2. The Drawing Room   -   #2
    j2k4's Avatar en(un)lightened
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    I certainly don't wonder why Palestinians would fixate on The Passion...; though, as one who has seen it, I would aver that none of the factions represented in the film acquit themselves in any admirable way.
    “Think about how stupid the average person is, and then realize that half of 'em are stupider than that.” -George Carlin

  3. The Drawing Room   -   #3
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    Originally posted by j2k4@3 April 2004 - 22:03
    I certainly don't wonder why Palestinians would fixate on The Passion...; though, as one who has seen it, I would aver that none of the factions represented in the film acquit themselves in any admirable way.
    As you know I have not seen this movie. However it has always been my understanding that the Jewish leaders at the time of Jesus did in fact want rid of Him. Was He not seen as a threat to the Jewish state and more importantly their leadership.

    I think the fact that they wanted rid of him was more of a political than religious issue. Again, as I understand it Pilate offered the Jewish people the release of one person, either Jesus or Barabus, they chose Barabus.

    If these are the beliefs of Catholicism, it is hardly surprising that Mel Gibson included them in his version of the Passion. I personally do not see this as being anti-semitic, they were fulfilling scripture.

    Like I said, I have not seen the movie and there may be other issues. However my understanding of the part of the Jewish people in the Passion of Christ does not cause one iota of anti-Semitic feeling in me. I strongly suspect that Mr Gibson feels the same way. It is other people who are seeing his vision thro' their own eyes and interpreting what they thought he was saying.

    It would make as much sense to say that The Guns of Navarone was anti-German.

  4. The Drawing Room   -   #4
    Biggles's Avatar Looking for loopholes
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    J2

    I suspect it is the reaction of the Jewish critics of the film that have endeared it to the Palestinians. "Mine enemy's enemy is my friend" sort of thing.
    Cogito cogito ergo cogito sum


  5. The Drawing Room   -   #5
    j2k4's Avatar en(un)lightened
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    Originally posted by Biggles@3 April 2004 - 16:36
    J2

    I suspect it is the reaction of the Jewish critics of the film that have endeared it to the Palestinians. "Mine enemy's enemy is my friend" sort of thing.
    Exactly so, Biggles.

    J'Pol-

    In the movie, there are indeed political overtones to the intent of the group led by Caiaphas, to the exclusion of religious objection (although somewhat faux religious argument is bandied about to justify their aim to the onlooking hoi polloi).

    This circumstance (in my eyes) lends rather heavily to the sense of fate which imbues the entire event.

    It is a sense that the Lord's will be satisfied, which momentum cannot be stopped; one also has the idea that the players are somehow aware of the greater implication, yet are helpless to retreat once events have been set in motion.

    You can see the guilt in their eyes.

    EDIT: misspelled "Caiaphas"
    “Think about how stupid the average person is, and then realize that half of 'em are stupider than that.” -George Carlin

  6. The Drawing Room   -   #6
    Originally posted by Biggles@3 April 2004 - 22:36
    J2

    I suspect it is the reaction of the Jewish critics of the film that have endeared it to the Palestinians. "Mine enemy's enemy is my friend" sort of thing.
    I don't understand. I've been told all along that the Palestinian/Arab war has nothing to do with religion and everything to do with land.


  7. The Drawing Room   -   #7
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    Originally posted by Biggles@3 April 2004 - 22:36
    J2

    I suspect it is the reaction of the Jewish critics of the film that have endeared it to the Palestinians. "Mine enemy's enemy is my friend" sort of thing.
    Exactly

    The Jews brought it upon themselves by saying "it's anti-semitic" and will make christians hate jews bla bla.... If they only knew that it's not what the film portrays but it's fulfilling scriptures and spreading the Gospel. Because the Jews tried to make the film look like it was made against them, they have given the muslims the upper hand and the satisfaction of starting a holy war across the world and not just in the middle east.

    You will reap what you saw.

  8. The Drawing Room   -   #8
    Biggles's Avatar Looking for loopholes
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    Originally posted by putty+4 April 2004 - 03:35--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (putty &#064; 4 April 2004 - 03:35)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-Biggles@3 April 2004 - 22:36
    J2

    I suspect it is the reaction of the Jewish critics of the film that have endeared it to the Palestinians. "Mine enemy&#39;s enemy is my friend" sort of thing.
    I don&#39;t understand. I&#39;ve been told all along that the Palestinian/Arab war has nothing to do with religion and everything to do with land.

    [/b][/quote]
    Indeed.

    WW1 was about the assassination of Arch Duke Ferdinand. By 1917, in the trenches of Flanders, the soldiers would have said "Arch who"?

    The impasse in the conflict is such that anything that gives dismay to one side will be cause for rejoicing on the other. As Muslims, they will not be watching the film as some form of devotional aid, they are simply doing it because they know it teases ( to pinch from Lewis Carrol).
    Cogito cogito ergo cogito sum


  9. The Drawing Room   -   #9
    j2k4's Avatar en(un)lightened
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    Originally posted by Biggles+4 April 2004 - 05:19--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Biggles @ 4 April 2004 - 05:19)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>
    Originally posted by putty@4 April 2004 - 03:35
    <!--QuoteBegin-Biggles
    @3 April 2004 - 22:36
    J2

    I suspect it is the reaction of the Jewish critics of the film that have endeared it to the Palestinians. "Mine enemy&#39;s enemy is my friend" sort of thing.

    I don&#39;t understand. I&#39;ve been told all along that the Palestinian/Arab war has nothing to do with religion and everything to do with land.

    Indeed.

    WW1 was about the assassination of Arch Duke Ferdinand. By 1917, in the trenches of Flanders, the soldiers would have said "Arch who"?

    The impasse in the conflict is such that anything that gives dismay to one side will be cause for rejoicing on the other. As Muslims, they will not be watching the film as some form of devotional aid, they are simply doing it because they know it teases ( to pinch from Lewis Carrol). [/b][/quote]
    Once again, Biggles-

    Right on the money; neither side is particularly discriminating when come opportunities to propagandize.

    BTW-a bit OT:

    The onset of WWI has long been attributed to the assassination of the Archduke of Hapsburg, but actually, it was the German Kaiser who prodded the Hapsburg Empire into declaring war; he was aware extant alliances would bring Russia into the fray, giving Germany all the excuse it needed to also attack (as an ally of the Hapsburgers) and gain recognition for Germany as a great military power.

    His vanity was the catalyzing agent to Ferdinand&#39;s bad luck.
    “Think about how stupid the average person is, and then realize that half of 'em are stupider than that.” -George Carlin

  10. The Drawing Room   -   #10
    Biggles's Avatar Looking for loopholes
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    Agreed

    Although the Austrians were spoiling to attack the Serbs too. They caught Kaiser Bill out with their enthusiasm, he was on holiday on his boat at the time and had to cut short his vacation - much to his annoyance.

    I have always felt sorry for Ferdinand. He was ok as Dukes go and was disliked by the Austrian Emperor for marrying a commoner. He really did want to win over the Serbs. A man caught between the ice bergs of history.
    Cogito cogito ergo cogito sum


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