Senator Kerry

[Busyman]

Originally posted by BigBank_Hank@28 April 2004 - 19:04
Ok we'll leave the whole WMD's and war talk for another thread because were way far from the topic's description. I would love to continue the discussion in another thread.

@vidcc: Freedom fighters fight for just that freedom. Freedom fighters don't use women and children to hide behind when the shoot at Marines. They also don't hide huge piles of weapons (not WMD's )in mosques,schools, and hospitals. These people are called terrorist because they are trying to cause trouble and disrupt what we're trying to do.

If firefighters fight fire, what do freedom fighters fight?

On a serious note Hank, I must agree.

There would be an outcry if we stooped to their levels.

[BigBank_Hank]

Originally posted by Busyman@28 April 2004 - 18:17
On a serious note Hank, I must agree.

Busyman I'm taking a screen shot of that so I have proof that we agreed on at least one thing

[vidcc]

Originally posted by BigBank_Hank@28 April 2004 - 15:04

@vidcc: Freedom fighters fight for just that freedom. Freedom fighters don't use women and children to hide behind when the shoot at Marines. They also don't hide huge piles of weapons (not WMD's )in mosques,schools, and hospitals. These people are called terrorist because they are trying to cause trouble and disrupt what we're trying to do.

but the french restistance did just that. they hid their identity within the comunity and their weapons in all those types of places ( i am assuming that you aren't saying that they actually stand behind a child as they shoot, if you are then it is more a lack of morals and cowardice ) during WW2 neither side stopped fighting because civilians where in the way, in fact both sides dropped bombs on civilian occupied cities. The french resistances' goal was to cause as much disruption as possible to the occupying force and this is still a state of war.

Freedom fighters fight for just that freedom.

well what is freedom? is it freedom from saddam ? could it also be freedom from an occupying force such as we are ? Again it depends on which side of the fence you sit.
i don't agree with these people shooting at our troops, but then i don't think we have totally justified our being there in the first place

@ busyman...it wasn't a comment on your beliefs i am fully aware of them ...it was i am just so used to you using more "colourful" expressions

[BigBank_Hank]

I don't know if its just me but I see the invasion of France by the German army and what we're doing in Iraq to be on opposite sides of the spectrum.

The French used gorilla tactics to fight of the Nazi's but it didn't included strapping bombs to their chest and using human shields.

I fail to make the connection between the French fighting off a regime invading their country to rape and pillage, and a group of thugs trying to fight off an army who invaded the country to rid them of a tyrant and global menace.

[vidcc]

Originally posted by BigBank_Hank@28 April 2004 - 16:47
I don't know if its just me but I see the invasion of France by the German army and what we're doing in Iraq to be on opposite sides of the spectrum.

The French used gorilla tactics to fight of the Nazi's but it didn't included strapping bombs to their chest and using human shields.

I fail to make the connection between the French fighting off a regime invading their country to rape and pillage, and a group of thugs trying to fight off an army who invaded the country to rid them of a tyrant and global menace.

that's why i said it depends on which side of the fence one sits....to the rebels in iraq they are trying to repel an invading force..to us the invading force is repelling what we see as a tyrant. Who better to make a decision as to if he was a tyrant than the people of iraq themselves?
the difference you make is tactics.....what is the difference in end result of strapping a bomb to your chest and running into the enemy or standing under the cover of a wall and throwing a grenade...do you think that the latter shouted "look out" before they threw the grenade ?
of course i am just playing devils advocate here. I realise my point will never be considered valid becaue the "terrorists" are killing our troops.

just go along with this one....
The usa is invaded because bush is seen as a "danger to world peace" and just for the sake of arguement ...we got our butts kicked and a banner was raised saying "mission accomplished"
how would you view any american that strapped a bomb to his chest and blew up a checkpoint of the invading force?..he/she would be a hero in our eyes...a freedom fighter...not a terrorist.
i am not condoning the tactics...i wish this whole thing had never happened and man stopped trying to destroy each other...what i am doing is playing devils advocate and trying to show that there are other viewpoints in the world that even if wrong to us are right to others

[BigBank_Hank]

that's why i said it depends on which side of the fence one sits....to the rebels in iraq they are trying to repel an invading force..to us the invading force is repelling what we see as a tyrant. Who better to make a decision as to if he was a tyrant than the people of iraq themselves?
the difference you make is tactics.....what is the difference in end result of strapping a bomb to your chest and running into the enemy or standing under the cover of a wall and throwing a grenade...do you think that the latter shouted "look out" before they threw the grenade ?
of course i am just playing devils advocate here. I realise my point will never be considered valid becaue the "terrorists" are killing our troops.

The problem that I have with the suicide bombers is the method of delivery. What they're doing is calling out the troops and saying things like we need help or something to that effect, then when the soldiers go to see about them boom. There have even been scenarios where women have said that their baby was sick and needed attention and they did the same thing.

[Busyman]

Recently there were about 3 car bombs that went off.

They killed Iraqis as well as Americans. I think it was something like 61 dead. Mostly Iraqi.

Nice going.

@Hank- That says alot about "evil" America huh.
We go to help and boom.

[BigBank_Hank]

Bingo.

Its not just soldiers that are targeted its innocent civilians also.

[Rat Faced]

Originally posted by BigBank_Hank@29 April 2004 - 04:24

that's why i said it depends on which side of the fence one sits....to the rebels in iraq they are trying to repel an invading force..to us the invading force is repelling what we see as a tyrant. Who better to make a decision as to if he was a tyrant than the people of iraq themselves?
the difference you make is tactics.....what is the difference in end result of strapping a bomb to your chest and running into the enemy or standing under the cover of a wall and throwing a grenade...do you think that the latter shouted "look out" before they threw the grenade ?
of course i am just playing devils advocate here. I realise my point will never be considered valid becaue the "terrorists" are killing our troops.

The problem that I have with the suicide bombers is the method of delivery. What they're doing is calling out the troops and saying things like we need help or something to that effect, then when the soldiers go to see about them boom. There have even been scenarios where women have said that their baby was sick and needed attention and they did the same thing.

Well, if you dont like these tactics then give them some Helicopter gunships and Jets.

Im sure they'll appreciate this method of warfare over suicide missions for only a few dead enemy for one of them.


There are casualties in war.

The coalition have killed more Iraqi civilians in the last month than all the rebels have managed in a year..


As has been said, it depends upon what side of the fence your sitting on as to who is in the right..

[Rat Faced]

Would you indulge me please by stating precisely what it was that Bush "blatantly" lied about, to his own people or otherwise?

Which Lies are you after?


WMD?

After all he didnt just say Hussain had them, he knew where they were... and Mr Powell told the world this on his behalf..

Or on the home front... how about knowingly lying to Congress about the cost of Medicare?

Are Congress not the Representitives of the American people?


You really must elaborate which types of lies you wish to discuss in a thread....